3 rings reversed???

[jf951 1]

so ive noticed a very small amount of people have their 3 rings/ risers reversed so that the 3 rings sit inside the main risers, closest to the actual harness and reserve risers.
im wondering why? practicality, looking cool, just how some rigs are designed, snag advantage???
does anyone here do it if so why?

ps if u dont get what im talking about ill try to post a pic

Jump more, Bitch less.

[Sangi 0]

I have them like this on my Atom Axis..

I'm not sure why they are like this though lol

"Dream as you'll live forever, live as you'll die today." James Dean

[dragon2 2]

AFAIK the histroy behind is that some of the first mini risers broke and a solution needed to be found. One way, which you see most often, is to reinforce the mini riser (look for the colored tape). The other way is to eliminate the hole in the riser by reversing the 3ring system, f.i. Parachutes de France rigs have reversed risers.

"Rules" about which risers you can use with which rig vary, usually you cannot use reversed risers on a rig not originally designed for them, or the manufacturer has to okay it, but you can generally use regular risers on a "reversed" rig, or not, if the manufacturer says you can't.

ciel bleu,
Saskia

[Halfpastniner 0]

I believe you are correct. Also known as "integrity risers", they dont have a hole cut in the middle which could cause a failure of the riser (especially mini risers).

They are seen pretty often in the BASE world, but that could be because they look cool, and you dont rub the little white loop on the ground when you drag your container.

But if I remember right, they are not a great idea for skydiving. (Due to the fact that during a horseshoe mal, there might not be enough tension on the risers to get them to release in that orientation.)

BASE 1384

[Beatnik 2]

Reverse 3-ring rigs have the main rig set higher up on the harness to allow the risers to release properly. On normal harnesses the main ring is near the collar bone. Putting a normal set of risers on a reverse 3-ring harness is not a problem but the other way the rings can get sandwiched between the main ring and the harness preventing the release. That is the main reason why they aren't supposed to be used in that configuration.

[gearless_chris 1]

There was an article on here somewhere from Bill Booth about how the reversed risers have other issues. The breakaway cable has more potential to get suckthrough the grommet on the riser, preventing the cable fro passing through. The white loop going over the ring and through the riser is actually a mechanical advantage that you lose with reversed risers, which makes for a hard pull. I used to have a set on my rig, I'm glad I don't anymore, but they did work correctly in my case, I had an open canopy and wasn't spinning.

"If it wasn't easy stupid people couldn't do it", Duane.

My momma said I could be anything I wanted when I grew up, so I became an a$$hole.

[diablopilot 2]

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They are seen pretty often in the BASE world, but that could be because they look cool, and you dont rub the little white loop on the ground when you drag your container.

Specifically, they are stronger.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[Halfpastniner 0]

Yeah sorry I just woke up and worded that wrong. I agree they are stronger.

BASE 1384

[format 1]

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Putting a normal set of risers on a reverse 3-ring harness is not a problem but the other way the rings can get sandwiched between the main ring and the harness preventing the release.

and yet, in spite my similar observation and rigger confirmation some people keep fly them so, vaguely insisting it's good.

What goes around, comes later.

[JohnMitchell 16]

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Specifically, they are stronger.

Not as strong as type 8 (the wide ones) risers. The only problem with those was style. It's also well known that the large three rings are more reliable than the mini rings, but better quality control has narrowed that gap.

I admit I gave in to the fashion police and got mini rings and skinny risers on my current rig, so I can't really talk.

[JohnMitchell 16]

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and yet, in spite my similar observation and rigger confirmation some people keep fly them so, vaguely insisting it's good.

If it looks cooler, it's better.

[likestojump 3]

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Specifically, they are stronger.

Not as strong as type 8 (the wide ones) risers. The only problem with those was style. It's also well known that the large three rings are more reliable than the mini rings, but better quality control has narrowed that gap.

I admit I gave in to the fashion police and got mini rings and skinny risers on my current rig, so I can't really talk.

let's not forget about practicality of mini risers where they allow you to pull the slider all the way down and allowing the lines to spread out allowing the canopy to fly better. Hardly a fashion statement, don't you think ?

[JohnMitchell 16]

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let's not forget about practicality of mini risers where they allow you to pull the slider all the way down and allowing the lines to spread out allowing the canopy to fly better. Hardly a fashion statement, don't you think ?

Very true, so I'll stand a little corrected, thanks. However, I have slider stops to prevent my slider from coming down over the risers. Like many others, I simply use a collapsible slider and leave it above the toggles. I'm into simplicity and safety, not high performance.

[likestojump 3]

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let's not forget about practicality of mini risers where they allow you to pull the slider all the way down and allowing the lines to spread out allowing the canopy to fly better. Hardly a fashion statement, don't you think ?

Very true, so I'll stand a little corrected, thanks. However, I have slider stops to prevent my slider from coming down over the risers. Like many others, I simply use a collapsible slider and leave it above the toggles. I'm into simplicity and safety, not high performance.

another correction : not HIGH performance, but BETTER/CLEANER performance.

[skybytch 273]

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another correction : not HIGH performance, but BETTER/CLEANER performance.

Another correction - Better performance that comes with additional risk.

[likestojump 3]

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another correction : not HIGH performance, but BETTER/CLEANER performance.

Another correction - Better performance that comes with additional risk.

Please do elaborate. How does letting your wing flatten out due to riser ends being spread more increase the risk ?

[tetra316 0]

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another correction : not HIGH performance, but BETTER/CLEANER performance.

Another correction - Better performance that comes with additional risk.

Please do elaborate. How does letting your wing flatten out due to riser ends being spread more increase the risk ?

The additional risk is not from a flatter wing but rather the act of pulling down the slider over your toggles. Could cause a brake fire, the slider could get trapped or stuck over the toggles. Wasn't there an incident in Florida within the last year where someone messed too long with trying to get their slider down and it contributed to an off landing and subsequent fatality.?

[jsaxton 0]

because wide risers are much stronger

[mjosparky 4]

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let's not forget about practicality of mini risers where they allow you to pull the slider all the way down and allowing the lines to spread out allowing the canopy to fly better. Hardly a fashion statement, don't you think ?

There was a method to allow your lines to open up long before there where mini risers. It’s called a split slider. You get the added performance while maintaining the original 3 ring system design. But I guess it is not viewed as “cool”.

Sparky

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[JerryBaumchen 1,377]

Hi Sparky,

Yup, the split slider gets it open as far as possible.

I jumped one for quite some time; every once in a while one of the 'locks' would come undone during deployment resulting in a 'firm' opening.

JerryBaumchen

[format 1]

There is esoteric matter of how wide one can/should spread risers, slider cut loose, chestless strap or whatever.
Designers (who get to decide where's the limit) deal with harness 'wideness' only.
They know why. That's a science I'd like to peek in

_____________________________
is there "chestless" anything?

What goes around, comes later.

[diablopilot 2]

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Specifically, they are stronger.

Not as strong as type 8 (the wide ones) risers. The only problem with those was style. It's also well known that the large three rings are more reliable than the mini rings, but better quality control has narrowed that gap.

I admit I gave in to the fashion police and got mini rings and skinny risers on my current rig, so I can't really talk.

BASE rigs usually have type 8 integrity(reverse) risers.

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You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[likestojump 3]

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let's not forget about practicality of mini risers where they allow you to pull the slider all the way down and allowing the lines to spread out allowing the canopy to fly better. Hardly a fashion statement, don't you think ?

There was a method to allow your lines to open up long before there where mini risers. It’s called a split slider. You get the added performance while maintaining the original 3 ring system design. But I guess it is not viewed as “cool”.

Sparky

and way before Bill Booth was even considering a career in parachutes there was already a method for cutting away a main canopy. But the 3rings work better and faster and are less prone to malfunction than the Capewells, R3s, etc.

Split sliders are great.
Unless you misrig them
unless you don't watch for the wear
unless you are rushing to make the next load
and of course - unless you don't care about fashion :)

[JohnMitchell 16]

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I jumped one for quite some time; every once in a while one of the 'locks' would come undone during deployment resulting in a 'firm' opening.

I have maybe a1000 jumps on a split slider, never a problem. It was a nice was to go. I still don't like pulling the slider down behind my head. And that old school velcro strap on the top of the rig? Nothing but Sport Death.

[jdfreefly 1]

Pulling that thing down and stowing it behind your head increases the risk that it could entangle with your helmet should you need to cutaway. This risk increases if you jump a camera.

I know of at least one death that was a direct result of this.

Methane Freefly - got stink?