First AFF failed really bad! need imput!

[dsteveanders86z 0]

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I guess I'm the resident "explainer" on this one, so here it goes again . . .

The JM's were Moley (MS) and Rocky (RS). Funny, but we just heard from Rocky last week. He's not jumping anymore and is now an NRA gun instructor! (This incident had nothing to do with his leaving jumping, and he ran his own DZ for awhile after this incident occurred.)

At pull time Lutz (the level one student) reached in and grabbed his cutaway handle instead of his BOC main ripcord handle. (This was when they were still using ripcords). Moley tried very hard to stop Lutz from pulling the cutaway handle but couldn't. He then deployed Lutz's main correctly figuring his main would depart activating his RSL and deploying the reserve.

And here's where it all really started going wrong.

When Lutz's main left the RSL extended but the snap shackle on the RSL popped open and did not activate the reserve. (We stopped using those snap shackles on student gear after that, but it was normal at the time). Up jumpers still use them on experienced gear so I suppose you could call it a one in a million event.

Then two other things occurred. Rocky, on the reserve side had his head buried and wasn't paying enough attention and didn't exactly ride completely through the opening like he should have.

The second thing is now Lutz has no AAD back up. At Perris, at the time, they were only using a pin puller type AAD on the mains. Yeah, I know. They were already doing that when I went to work there and I argued 'till I was blue in the face over it. They changed over to Cypres' on the reserves after this event.

Moley, god bless him, knew what the situation was and didn't turn and track away. It's up to debate whether Lutz would have ever woke up to the fact he needed to manually pull his reserve handle. As this wasn't exactly a situation that was covered in his FJC except in a when in doubt whip it out sort of way.

So Moley tried to get to him. but when they started getting low he began making pulling motions on his on reserve handle in Lutz's sight line and Lutz clicked on to that and finally pulled his own reserve handle.

I saw the reserve in the air and also the flash when Lutz hit the power lines just as I was landing, but I had my eyeballs on my own student and knew it wasn't him.

That was a day I'll never forget. And it was the kind of day that gives an instructor night sweats . . .

And yes, Lutz was a lawyer!

NickD

lutz was a lawyer? So did he file a suite or something?

Thanks for the explanation man! its really interesting to hear from that perspective!

[NickDG 23]

>>lutz was a lawyer? So did he file a suite or something?
Not that I ever heard about . . .

NickD

[Andy9o8 2]

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file a suite or something?

[timmyfitz 0]

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file a suite or something?

Be careful, your Ego is showing.

[Andy9o8 2]

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file a suite or something?

Be careful, your Ego is showing.

Impossible; I keep it well-camouflaged in humility.

[NickDG 23]

On the subject of "coddling" which someone mentioned upboard in relation to using the word "failed."

Point taken, it is a small thing. But it was (is?) something we taught new instructors to get them into a better mindset for becoming effective teachers.

If you want to talk "coddling" the biggest coddle in skydiving right now is tandem jumping. You all share the sky with mostly people who didn't have the "cods" to take a class and go it alone. The way hundreds of thousands did it before the early 80s and the advent of tandem. But don't get me started on that . . .

The biggest reason I've always advocated a warmer fuzzier approach to skydiving instruction is not for student retention, not for good business practice, and not just because I'm a very nice guy. It's because a lot of us who started in the 1970s where basically treated as dog shit as students. Training in those days still had a slight military edge to it where lots of yelling and screaming and being called stupid wasn't too uncommon.

But that wasn't the worse part. Sometimes today I read about new jumpers asking how to make friends on the DZ and saying how cold experienced jumpers seem to be. And I can't help but laugh. They don't know what "cold" is . . .

Students (in my day) weren't the life blood of a DZ as they are now. So we were bumped for ordinary RW loads. But the worst of it was, until you proved yourself as a competent jumper, someone who wouldn't screw up other people's jumps, you were just a non-person. And I mean to the point people wouldn't just not talk to you, they'd walk away to avoid even getting close to you. "Maybe it was just you, Nick." No, they did it to everyone.

To the skygods of the day, and that was pretty much anybody with more jumps than you, skydiving was a exclusive club and this "silent treatment" was part, they all thought, of the initiation. Two exceptions were being a woman, or connected by blood or strong friendship to an experienced jumper. There were some others too, some jumpers would engage you proving it's just not possible for everyone to be a prick, but more than not they were.

On the plus side it made us, students up through hundred jump wonders, (where the ice finally began thawing) very self sufficient. BTW, that's where the phrase, "hundred jump wonder" really comes from. We were treated so badly it was a "wonder" anybody stuck it out to reach a hundred jumps.

Out of desperation beginning jumpers formed strong bonds with each other, bonds that lasted a lifetime in some cases. I would have given anything for an internet in those days - somewhere to ask the questions I wasn't getting answers to on the DZ. I even tried other DZs in other states figuring this can't be how it is, but it was the same all over.

And then one day when I had about 150 jumps, mostly solos or with my fellow beginners, out of the blue I got the nod!

They needed someone to fill out a six way and I was the only one sitting around. I was so nervous I couldn't even speak. And you guessed it - I buggered up the exit, took the wrong slot, and then finally funneled the whole damn thing. The walk in was, to this day, the longest of my entire life. And then it began. The stink eye. I was getting it from Larry Fatinio, from Al Frisby, from Jerry Myers, from all the big guns of the day. (If you're guessing this is Elsinore around 1978 you'd be right.)

I started to pack but my heart wasn't in it. I wanted to go drown myself in the lake. And then someone came up behind me, another guy on the load I’d just hammered. I think it was Tom Start, but I'm not sure as I just stared down at his shoes and waited for another put down. "You know, guy," he began," you need more practice, why don't you go over the hill, you know, to Perris, and make another hundred jumps. And then you can come back here and maybe get on the hot loads." And he walked away.

The hot loads. That phrase was now burned into my brain. "I wasn't good enough for the hot loads."

For me there was no use hanging around Elsinore anymore. I was done. I'd never be asked on a jump again. I thought about quitting altogether, like I did a hundred times already, but that was out of the question. I wanted it too badly; I guess in a perverted way, although I hated them all, I wanted to be one of those guys.

So I sucked it up, loaded up my car, and went over the hill to Perris. I had to stop twice and ask directions as I didn’t even know where it was. When I got there I decided to be more forceful, to come on a bit stronger, to make them like me.

I pulled into the Perris parking lot. And “Gee, not much here,” is what I remember thinking. But I threw my kit bag over my shoulder and took a deep breath. There was a bunch of jumpers sitting around a picnic table so I put my head up straight and strode purposefully right up to them. One of them looked up, it was Alan Richter. I stuck out my hand and said, “Hi, my name is Nick.” And he said, “So what?”

I didn't know what to say so I mentioned coming over from Elsinore and got, “Great, another fucking turkey from ElllSeeNore!”

So I started all over again. But Tom was right, all I needed was more practice, and it took a while but I made good this time. Even before that time I already knew I wanted to be a skydiving instructor and nothing else. And I promised myself when I became one I’d do everything I could to change things in favor of treating beginners better. I didn’t change things alone, of course. But I think my student generation, the ones who would become the next generation of instructors, mostly experienced the same bad treatment, so collectively, and without any interaction, we all changed it.

And that is why, to this day, I get up when I see beginners being short changed in any way. And it’s why I offer students not only my knowledge, but my hand, and my heart too.

If you want to call that coddling you can go right ahead . . .

NickD

[ABerry83 1]

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Does anyone from this forum did go through and mind blank thing in their first jumps and was able to overcome the issue? Or should I just stop jumping.

The more you jump, the more you remember. Though pretty soon, you won't be able to use that "mind-blanking" excuse when you screw up down the road...say wrap your canopy around a flag or have a 30-second brainfart at the door.

[Andy9o8 2]

At the DZ where I started, the skygods would slice pieces of meat off our thighs and roast them in front of our eyes. (I always figure that's why they called us "turkeys".) Then they'd make us limp out and buy them beer to wash it down with. And we were thankful!

I'm just kidding. They didn't really make us buy beer if we limped. But being part of the same student generation as you, a lot of your story rings so true.

In all fairness, of the 4 Upstate NY DZs I frequented as a novice in the 70s, only the biggest one had up-jumpers that shat on novices like that (and a DZO who was a prick and encouraged that culture). The other 3 smaller ones all treated us very well.

[StangMan90 0]

***“Hi, my name is Nick.” And he said, “So what?”
And I promised myself when I became one I’d do everything I could to change things in favor of treating beginners better. I didn’t change things alone, of course.

And that is why, to this day, I get up when I see beginners being short changed in any way. And it’s why I offer students not only my knowledge, but my hand, and my heart too.

If you want to call that coddling you can go right ahead . . .

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NickD

No, that's not coddling. First, you are being a good person and second, you are practicing good business. The whole country could use a good dose of that right now.

Boy, am I glad things have changed (I came close to starting during the late 70s when I was in the Navy, but I couldn't quite come up with the necessary cash). Back then, I was immersed in a form of that culture in the military, so it wouldn't have bothered me as much then as it would now. As a student I really appreciate the respectful and friendly treatment I get at the DZ from my instructors, the owners and the overwhelming majority of experienced regulars. I think that most of them sense that I am there not only to learn how to skydive safely and have fun, but to make new friends and become a part of something that most people wouldn't.

Thank you for working to change those old ways. If I had been treated now like you were then, I most likely would have quit already out of sheer disgust and the desire to distance myself from people who think it's okay to act like assholes toward newbies.

Joe

simplify