Horse Shoe Malfunction

[Brumby 0]

Not sure whether this should go in the incident forum or safety/training but i will post it hear and iff need be it should be moved. Today i exited a Nomad at 13000AGL. Skydive went well but at approximately 4500-5000ft i felt something banging against the top of my leg. I turned round to see the bridle, line bag etc out of the container but p/c still stowed in pouch. I immediately released the p/c which in turn did not help. From what i can remember the p/c appeared to get tangled in the lines etc. I immediately cut away then fired my reserve which opened perfectly. I was doing a solo flat as i was using hired kit from my local DZ. For quite some time now people have been saying that the container is way too large for the canopy that is rigged up. When you stow the p/c and route the excess bridle it is always very slack and takes litteraly no effort to pull out the bridle. Looking back now i am stupid for jumping kit that in theory is dangerous. One thing is for certain, I will no longer jump centre kit as this frightened the hell out of me big style. Just thought i would share my not so nice experience!

[upndownshop 0]

Realisng your PC probably did more for you than you think. It cleared the horseshoe and allowed for a clean cutaway and clean air for the reserve. (If I understand you right). You did the right thing, (other than jumping that set up, like you said).

Good for you by keeping your head on straight.

Blue skies.

[JohnGraham 0]

Nice one on dealing with it, Andy!
What centre kit was it on?
(I assume you were flat for the whole freefall, not doing back-loops or back-flying or anything, right?)
Well done again, mate!

John G

[Kris 0]

Quote

Realisng your PC probably did more for you than you think. It cleared the horseshoe and allowed for a clean cutaway and clean air for the reserve. (If I understand you right). You did the right thing, (other than jumping that set up, like you said).

Heavily dittoed!

Of all malfunctions, Horseshoes are the only ones that really, really scare me besides violent openings.

Congrats on dealing with your malfunction. Now make sure your gear is properly sized for your canopies and watch that closing loop tension!

Sky, Muff Bro, Rodriguez Bro, and
Bastion of Purity and Innocence!™

[Brumby 0]

It was the Zerox container with contact 220 canopy. Cheers for that Kris. Gotta say like, had 1 previous malfunction but this 1 really frightened me. Not gonna stop me jumping tho! :-)

[tbrown 26]

First, good job handling a scary mess ! Well done !

Second, maybe NOW your local club will do something about that rig. The next time it happens might not turn out so well. Your cool head and prompt action was the greater part of it, but there's always a bit of luck involved with horseshoes.

Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity !

[el_chester 4]

back in '96 i had 72 jumps and had a very similar mess:

did a 4 way, turned 2 or 3 points (was very happy!) when
...
I feel the bag on the back of my upper legs
...
look back and see lines, bag, risers tangling behind me
...
look up and see my friends faces scared - very scared
...
signaled to pull as they backed away (not a difficult thing to do for low-timers...)
...
next I pulled out the Pilot chute (leg-mounted)
...
the thing developed into a bag-lock
...
while in a feet-down position i cutaway and pulled the reserve handle
...
and looked up to see a "beautiful" round reserve
...
I kept the handles (not a conscious effort - it happened)
...
i was descending faster than the heaviest-loaded guy on the plane (the instructror)
...
did not try to do a plf but instead tried to stand it up
...
and luckily didn't hurt myself with such a stupid decission
...
(almost stood it up)

so... I was very lucky to do the right thing... i had no idea what had happened to me until i spoke about it and realised it...

so... there and then i learnt that
- my training had been insufficient
- the equipment i was renting was shit (one could put the pin into the loop without much needing the help of a pull-up-cord!)
- i had to learn a lot if i wanted to keep myself alive in this sport (would never again count on my luck!)

so... im glad you did the right thing - now go learn about equipment, and demand safe equipment from your dz or change dzs - (I did change dz after that)

--
Be careful giving advice. Wise men don't need it, and fools won't heed it.

[achowe 0]

nice one Andy. Beers on you this Saturday

-------------------------------------------------
Woooaaaaaa!!! Woooaaaa!!! I'm gettin' off it!

[Brumby 0]

Normally i would say not to the beers as it aint my 1st mal but under the circumstances i may just buy them!

[Brumby 0]

Not so sure about that one mate. I have a sneaky feeling this particular rig will just go back on-line. Hope not though

[Scrumpot 1]

If it is truly THAT BAD, as you have portrayed here, then you (or SOMEONE) needs to ASSURE it does NOT!

Do not sit idly by, and "allow" this to happen to someone else. You did well. You survived. The "next one" might not, and if then ...how would you feel then.

You've shown the fortitude (stones) to post about this publically, so don't SQUANDER that! ...Again if all you say herein is true, now show the stones to also follow through. Seems as if you have enough mates even just on here who have responded in kind to (who should also) back you up.

Good job in your (so far) handling of a potentially nasty situation!

Blue Skies,
-Grant

coitus non circum - Moab Stone

[ACMESkydiver 0]

Quote

If it is truly THAT BAD, as you have portrayed here, then you (or SOMEONE) needs to ASSURE it does NOT!

Do not sit idly by, and "allow" this to happen to someone else. You did well. You survived. The "next one" might not, and if then ...how would you feel then.

You've shown the fortitude (stones) to post about this publically, so don't SQUANDER that! ...Again if all you say herein is true, now show the stones to also follow through. Seems as if you have enough mates even just on here who have responded in kind to (who should also) back you up.

Good job in your (so far) handling of a potentially nasty situation!

Blue Skies,
-Grant

Agree. I'd be pissed if my friend had a horseshoe on a rig and burned in, and I found out someone had the same mal earlier and it was not taken care of...unsafe rigs are everybody's problem. It might take out someone else in the group too. Consider all of this please and get the DZO to take some action on that unsafe gear.

~Jaye
Do not believe that possibly you can escape the reward of your action.

[debonair 0]

Congrats on being heads up with only 100+ jumps.

In 1987 a good friend with 86 jumps exited 4th from a cessna and had a premature container opening resulting in a horseshoe malfunction.

I watched as he dove down and flared out and saw the lines begin to wrap around his neck. He cleared his neck but panicked and fired his reserve without throwing out his pilot chute. Not surprisingly the reserve entangled with his floating bag and lines and never opened. I fell with him as long as I could before having to open myself. I then watched him fall alone the rest of the way.

It was over 2900 jumps ago for me and it is still the worse memory I have in skydiving. In my mind I can see it like it was yesterday.

Best wishes,
Deb

AZChallenger JFTC99/02 GOFAST300 STILLUV4WAY
"It's nothing 1000 jumps won't cure..."
- Jeff Gorlick, Seattle Sky Divers

[lizzieuk 0]

Well done for dealing with it Andy, could hear the stress in your voice after!

Just one question- Isn't that the kit that Pench (still a student) has been jumping...?


I'm sad I won't be there for the beers this weekend, have one for me!

[achowe 0]

ill have all of yours lizzie, dont you worry

-------------------------------------------------
Woooaaaaaa!!! Woooaaaa!!! I'm gettin' off it!

[Brumby 0]

Yes Lizzie, that is the kit Adam has been using and you may be aware of the odd problems he has experience previously. Thanx to all the ppl for all the feed back. Obviously, this incident has shook me up a fair bit and i have taken everyones comments in. I have spoke with the reserve packer about this rig and mentioned the problems. I will be speaking to the cci about the kit is available for hire as me and other do feel that it isnt safe. After this incident me and the cci have unfortunately, fallen out but i will still be speaking to him either way as i would certainly not want any incidents like this to occur on anyone else! Thanx again ppl....

[lizzieuk 0]

Quote

ill have all of yours lizzie, dont you worry

you're all heart Mr Howe

[zekejr7 0]

Glad to hear you escaped unhurt!

Great postings here by everyone as well...very educational. This type of malfunction seems to be almost everyone's biggest fear, so its always good to hear a refresher on how to deal with it. Props.

We need more of these....

[mdrejhon 8]

Quote

We need more of these....

No! No! No more horseshoe malfunctions!

Anyway, one of the confusions I have had with horseshoe was whether or not to cutaway before pulling reserve, and how an RSL would interfere with a horseshoe.

This post has provided some useful information, of which I'll confirm with instructor, since I'm going to be quizzed again on EP's this weekend. I also re-read some literature regarding horseshoes.

[Brumby 0]

The kit i have always jumped has had an RSL on it. One of the things that has worried me the most about this incident is that the RSL could have easerly fired the reserve into a bag of shite behind me! I am now considering not using an RSL anymore!

[Malta_Dog 0]

IMO, the RSL won't fire the reserve unless YOU cut away (or the RSL riser fails). The horsehoe or baglock situations don't change the way it works.

I think it not logical to ditch the RSL because of problems induced by poor maintenance/rigging of the container.

All your dropzone are belong to us!!!!111!

[Brumby 0]

I am not ditching the RSL due to rigging probs etc. Personal preferance if anything. E.g, if you have a spinning mal and you chop it whilst on your back you could have problems with the reserve. At least no RSL you have chance to get stable etc!

[achowe 0]

My thoughts too Andy, I totally agree, but look at the statistics. I wouldnt rush ahead and remove your RSL before weighing up all the pros and cons

-------------------------------------------------
Woooaaaaaa!!! Woooaaaa!!! I'm gettin' off it!

[Brumby 0]

I agree totally. Would be a good idea to sit down and talk about all aspects. As you say, need to know all the pros & cons before removing the RSL! May need it 1 day! Hope not like

[zekejr7 0]

Quote

Quote

We need more of these....

No! No! No more horseshoe malfunctions!

I didnt mean we need more horseshoe mals, I meant educational postings!!

• Quote