wind drift indicators

[javelin1 0]

anyone still use them?

[MajorDad 0]

Sure.

We call them "Load 1"

Blue Ones

Major Dad
CSPA D-579

[davelepka 4]

What for? Unless you're jumping a round, you don't need one. Get the winds aloft forecast, exit and open somewhere close to a good spot, and use your toggles to make adjustments as needed.

[howardwhite 6]

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anyone still use them?

Yes, for demos.

HW

[AndyMan 7]

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Yes, for demos.

Do you really depend on them for the spot, or is it just part of the show?

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[ROK 0]

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anyone still use them?

The Phantoms use them every time they jump (about once every three weeks).

First pass at 1000' over the peas, toss em, do a "go around", watch where they land, jumpmaster calls the offset for the next pass. Second pass at 800' to 1200', one go, two go...

Unless you're right in the door, they're hard to see (Otter).

[TrickyDicky 0]

In the UK, you have to throw a WDI before any static line jumping or displays.

UK Skydiver for all your UK skydiving needs.

[Andrewwhyte 1]

Yesterday we jumped in very strong, gusty winds all day. Eventually we were left with just the students. When the ground winds were down enough to drop them I found myself wishing for a WDI. We didn't have one around though, the DZO has never seen one.

[TFFTM 1]

We ALWAYS use them on demos and use the information they provide.

Occasionally we use them on the dropzone for the first lift or if the wind shifts drastically.

BSBD
Home of the Alabama Gang

[Armour666 0]

I have never used one I learned to spot doing rate one turns in a 182. Anything like an otter has been GPS and as MajorDad mentioned "load 1" I prefer to sit and watch that.

SO this one time at band camp.....

"Of all the things I've lost I miss my mind the most."

[redramdriver 0]

Yes. Before the 1st test dummies get out each and every jumpable day.

So, you bring your beer?

Its 5 o'clock somewhere
POPS #9344

[NealFitz 0]

yup students have to have WDIs dropped on the first load and maybe again if the winds change significantly. also we do a low spot for our B Licence in which we throw the WDI from 5000 and assess spot from there

Dudeist Skydiver #170
You do not need a parachute to skydive, you only need one to skydive again

[AndyMan 7]

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We ALWAYS use them on demos and use the information they provide.

Interesting. I've done close to a hundred demo jumps since I got my rating 3 years ago and I never seen a need to throw a WDI.

I think the only time I've ever seen one, is watching the Knights do their performance. I've always suspected they throw it for show - their accuracy with the WDI is impressive.

I have two canopies I jump regularly for demos. One is at a very high wingloading, one is much more moderate. With either canopy I can fly to virtually any target from any reasonable spot.

With modern canopies I just don't see the need for a WDI.

_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[airtwardo 7]

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Yes, for demos.

Do you really depend on them for the spot, or is it just part of the show?

_Am

Demonstration jumpers for the most part, actually know how to spot and yes we do use them for that purpose.

You said, 'depend' on them, and yes for a tight demo I do, much more so then even the 'reports' for winds aloft...trusting what I see much more than what I hear.

If you are good enough watching the drift, even from the aircraft, you can see any direction variations or dog-legs you may encounter under canopy.

I always put the WDI on the 'clock', because in addition to getting the wind-line, if there ARE any dog-legs it's simple to figure at what altitude you will be in it.

As far as 'for the show'...at many events it's not safe or practical to throw a WDI directly overhead.

In those cases I'll pick an area reasonably close to the LZ but far away enough not to interfere with the program that may be going at the event site at that time.

It's pretty simple to draw the imaginary lines and overlay what the spot needs to be on jump-run.

Good idea to keep in mind that you are spotting for your reserve, which may not have the drive as your main, and that you also could very well be 1500-2000' lower on that reserve than you'd planned to be on the main.

What's the big deal ya may ask?

If you've ever had to make a stadium demo in a big city, with winds at marginal and the only outs are trees, highways and skyscrapers...being dead-nuts-on with the spot is your ONLY option.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[airtwardo 7]

~With modern canopies I just don't see the need for a WDI.

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Eventually....you will Andy.



Clearly for some types of demos it's not as necessary, air-shows for example usually have plenty of safe outs, and if you're not planning on dead-centering a surface target as the Knights do, you can probably get away without using one for another couple hundred demos.

But another reason I like to throw one is it's a little ritual that focuses concentration and attention for several minutes in the AC on 'exactly' what the plan is...jump run direction, landing patterns, location, distance and direction of the 'outs'...etc.

Nothing worse than bombing out over a city (worse at night) than you haven't seen from opening altitude (if even at all) and 'trusting' the info you got from the NWS that might be an hour or more old...better if everyone 'knows' from watching the WDI, what, when, where & how.

Not to 'name names' but not long ago, for scheduling reasons I had to 'sub-contract out' a high dollar flag gig into a TIGHT west coast MLB stadium to an EXTREMELY experienced demo jumper buddy of mine, that like you seldom sees the need to drop a WDI...


Yup, he missed...

And this demo like many I do~

'doesn't pay if ya don't deliver the goods'.
(for reasons other than weather, like MISSING)



So trust me my friend it's cheap insurance, & even though I 'could' get away with not throwing one on 1/2 the demos I do, I still do it 'just-in-case'.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[rhanold 0]

What do you use for wind drift indicators at night? I have only thrown a few and the ones I have were a small wire with some yellow paper taped to it. But that has to be hard to see at night. Do you use a glow stick or something?

~Ryan

[airtwardo 7]

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What do you use for wind drift indicators at night? I have only thrown a few and the ones I have were a small wire with some yellow paper taped to it. But that has to be hard to see at night. Do you use a glow stick or something?

~Ryan

For me it's by guess & by golly.

I try to get an accurate read if possible, while it's late but still light.

Like I said, I use 'em for demos...demo 'season' for me is summer and early fall for the most part.

'Most' of the time during summer, the winds that day if any will fall off some and rotate clockwise...usually about 45 degrees, at times to 90.

You have to keep an eye on the weather of course because that 'rule of thumb' isn't set in stone.

You get a feel for what the spot will be when ya do it enough times...

~more often than not ~ By Golly you're on target!






~ First few seconds of this vid shows a pretty accurate WDI drop from 3500', tossed 'em dead nuts over the fountian.

Obviously a 'little to no wind' demo, but as I said above ~ something I always do if at all possible.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCWQLCF4lAU

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[DeNReN 0]

I dropped several WDI's this year on IAD loads in brisk winds.

WDI's are another tool that can be used to make things safer....why not practice using them...

[fendor1369 0]

For static line I used them once. Now I just go off the D-KAV, and wind direction and speed from the DZ.

Don’t think I have ever heard or seen anyone using them for freefall.

John - D.S 1313

"I'll jump it, Np. It's all good"

[steve1 5]

I've only used a wind drift indicator once. We were doing a demo back in the 70's. We threw the thing out and never saw it again.

And that was back in the day when I had good eyes. So, about all I really know about wind drift indicators is that they are hard to see....

[ZigZagMarquis 9]

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anyone still use them?

No... quit doing static line students years ago.

[matthewcline 0]

To add to Airtwardo's sound advice: WDI's in a Major City also shows the numerous "shifts" around buildings. These numerous shifts are refered to as a "Dog Leg" if it is one and some times Turbulance if it is many. The reality is the buildings act like a venturi and redirect aswell as channel the winds through the city, accelrating its speed as well as cause turbulance.

So even though WX brief is "accurate" (wish I had a job where I could mostly be wrong and still get payed, too much), it is also only accounting for "open air". Do enough Demo's and there will be one or two where a WDI in conjuntion with WX Brief and D=KAV (a round days through back) will save the day.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[pchapman 279]

Still use WDI's at a dz I'm at, where the DZO is very traditional. Used on 1st load of the day if it is a 182 and not the Caravan, and at the start of any solo first jump course (static line) later in the day. Students learn to throw the WDI as part of learning spotting.

Anyone doing demos around here, no matter what DZ they are from, seems to use a WDI. (I think a WDI is normally on the list of conditions for doing a demo when Transport Canada approval is needed for built up areas etc.)

CSPA rules are to use a WDI or an alternative method of determining wind drift -- which essentially allows anything from a rate 1 turn to checking the forecast.

[airtwardo 7]

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I've only used a wind drift indicator once. We were doing a demo back in the 70's. We threw the thing out and never saw it again.

And that was back in the day when I had good eyes. So, about all I really know about wind drift indicators is that they are hard to see....

Couple things Steve;

I always throw two WDI's out together for demos...they don't cost 'that' much.

~~~ & ~~~

If ya pull the tape off and let 'em un-roll, makes it considerably easy to see and follow them...

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[matthewcline 0]

Yeah take off the tape and maybe about 8 inches unrolled.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!