mrwrong 0
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muff528 3
Quote.............Very often at DZ's you can see the "old timers" sitting loads out when the young guns are eager to jump... ..............
I had to laugh at that. It happened to me during my first year. I landed straight down into the ditch at ZHills and the wind blew my PC into a large bush. I damaged it while trying to get it down. When I took it in to the loft to get repairs the rigger pointed out all the more experienced jumpers inside watching TV. Only the low timers were jumping. Lesson learned
jimmytavino 16
It's TOO windy.....
when Birds 
are "Backin' Up "...
jmy
A 3914
D 12122
Ditto the previous about turbulence, wing loading, gusts, etc.
Double ditto about watching the old dogs sitting down having a coke and watching the low timers jump.
What I can add is HOW I make my wind decisions:
1. I get out into the wind. I will stand in the wind, clear of the wind shadow of structures, and FEEL the wind for a few minutes. This tells me a lot about gusts and wind direction variability, as well as wind speed.
2. I watch other jumpers with canopies which are loaded like mine. I look at them to see if they are getting penetration, if they are getting turbulence (and where), I look to see if they are having trouble on the ground with their canopies. I look to see if they are landing out too!
3. I consider the direction of the wind. Some wind directions require far greater accuracy skills. We have a long fairly skinny primary landing area. A strong wind blowing along the long axis doesn't require great accuracy skill. However if a strong wind is blowing across the long axis... it is very easy to land in the trees, fences, road, or runway if one does not judge penetration accurately.
Lastly.... We call the first load of the day the "wind dummies". It is called that for good reason. I have been on the wind dummy load and had surface winds of ~2-5 mph and winds at 2,000 of 25-30mph! Avoid the first load until you are confident that you can handle whatever the winds throw at you up high.
Double ditto about watching the old dogs sitting down having a coke and watching the low timers jump.
What I can add is HOW I make my wind decisions:
1. I get out into the wind. I will stand in the wind, clear of the wind shadow of structures, and FEEL the wind for a few minutes. This tells me a lot about gusts and wind direction variability, as well as wind speed.
2. I watch other jumpers with canopies which are loaded like mine. I look at them to see if they are getting penetration, if they are getting turbulence (and where), I look to see if they are having trouble on the ground with their canopies. I look to see if they are landing out too!
3. I consider the direction of the wind. Some wind directions require far greater accuracy skills. We have a long fairly skinny primary landing area. A strong wind blowing along the long axis doesn't require great accuracy skill. However if a strong wind is blowing across the long axis... it is very easy to land in the trees, fences, road, or runway if one does not judge penetration accurately.
Lastly.... We call the first load of the day the "wind dummies". It is called that for good reason. I have been on the wind dummy load and had surface winds of ~2-5 mph and winds at 2,000 of 25-30mph! Avoid the first load until you are confident that you can handle whatever the winds throw at you up high.
The choices we make have consequences, for us & for others!
wolfriverjoe 1,523
Quote...Lastly.... We call the first load of the day the "wind dummies". It is called that for good reason. I have been on the wind dummy load and had surface winds of ~2-5 mph and winds at 2,000 of 25-30mph! Avoid the first load until you are confident that you can handle whatever the winds throw at you up high.
I liked everything else, but loved this part.
My 2 out landings were the direct result of being on the wind dummy load. Until you are comfortable risking landing out, watch a couple loads land.
The OP's situation of winds changing on the ride up is a tough one to call.
My suggestion would be to get a good feel for what wind speed is what on the ground, using GLIDEANGLE's ideas, then knowing that "Above 18kt steady or 14 gusty" (or whatever your comfort level is) is when you ride down.
"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy
"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo
"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo
It's too windy when the experienced jumpers don't even get their gear out of their cars/lockers!
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wmw999 2,439
If the winds change that much on the way to altitude, there's a decent chance that they're either gusty, or that they're going to continue to change. Most of the time, it's smarter to stay in the airplane if they're worried about the winds.
If someone on the plane asks for a wind update on the way up it's a little different, but if the ground is worried, there's probably a reason.
And what glideangle said is absolutely right -- spend some time on the ground feeling what the wind feels like. Watch others land, and check the anemometer after landings for awhile. You'll begin to get a feel for what's too much.
But 15-20 and gusty is not a good wind condition for many experience levels.
Wendy P.
If someone on the plane asks for a wind update on the way up it's a little different, but if the ground is worried, there's probably a reason.
And what glideangle said is absolutely right -- spend some time on the ground feeling what the wind feels like. Watch others land, and check the anemometer after landings for awhile. You'll begin to get a feel for what's too much.
But 15-20 and gusty is not a good wind condition for many experience levels.
Wendy P.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)
JohnRich 4
QuoteMy Daughter and I got on the plane and at take off the winds were five to ten MOH. When we got to altitude Ground crew reported winds fifteen to twenty. Students stayed in the plane. Others were given the choice. My daughter stayed and I went with two others. Had a great dive turned short on the final, almost no penetration sank right down and landed on tip toes. Pulled my right toggle to get my canopy to colaspse and a gust blew across the landing zone picked me up about five feet and dragged me for another twenty. So how windy is too windy?
Since you had a bad landing, obviously that was "too windy" for you and your canopy.
That's now a reference point for you to use to make better judgments in the future.
What is "MOH"? Do you mean MPH?
I don't have a hard limit, but I use my personal judgment to make the decision. Very experienced jumpers sitting on the ground is definitely a sign for me to sit as well. I also look to see if the winds are constant or gusting. I will jump in higher speed constant winds than in gusts. If the landing area is clean of obstacles and there's nothing shadowing the wind (hangars, trees, etc), I may be more comfortable in higher winds. I jumped in Byron (JohnMitchell, that's in Byron, Nortern California) and their landing area is wide open, the winds were cooking, but I felt comfortable. Same thing at Summerfest this year, the first few days the winds were pretty strong, but very clean, and weren't passing over any structures. I was landing straight down :)
skybytch 273
QuoteIt's too windy when the experienced jumpers don't even get their gear out of their cars/lockers
I'd revise that just a bit.
It's too windy when the experienced jumpers who jump canopies of a type and loading similar to mine don't even get their gear out of the car.
My s/o will happily jump his 2.0+ loaded Velo in winds that I'd be backing up in under my 1.1 loaded Spectre.
Too windy is one thing that would keep me on the ground BUT so is too GUSTY ..... can be very dangerous.
(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome
(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome
too windy if you think you are not going to enjoy it.
or- your bone density is low because your old or/and unfit and when you fall you might break your hip bone or something ...
or- your bone density is low because your old or/and unfit and when you fall you might break your hip bone or something ...
ASTKU 1
QuoteSo how windy is too windy?
When you cannot go forward into the wind to land (landing backwards is no fun).
As a general rule I would rather land my canopy then land in one of these crappy skydiving planes with high winds.
Chubba 0
I sit down above 20 knots, I will also sit down if it's extremely gusty.
The majority of jumpers here will jump between 20-25 knots and will sit down above 25... I choose not to go with the majority because my Sabre2 170 @ 0.95 basically lands me backwards above 25 knots.
The majority of jumpers here will jump between 20-25 knots and will sit down above 25... I choose not to go with the majority because my Sabre2 170 @ 0.95 basically lands me backwards above 25 knots.
Gene03 0
If you have to ask, it's probably too windy or gusty.
If the old timer with more years in the sport than your age, is chilling on the ground...
If, under canopy, you couldn't drive a pin up your asshole with a sledge hammer, then yes, you're in over your head.
I've found it's easier to watch a few loads then decide based on wing loading, experience etc.
If the old timer with more years in the sport than your age, is chilling on the ground...
If, under canopy, you couldn't drive a pin up your asshole with a sledge hammer, then yes, you're in over your head.
I've found it's easier to watch a few loads then decide based on wing loading, experience etc.
“The only fool bigger than the person who knows it all is the person who argues with him.
Stanislaw Jerzy Lec quotes (Polish writer, poet and satirist 1906-1966)
Stanislaw Jerzy Lec quotes (Polish writer, poet and satirist 1906-1966)
QuoteIt's too windy when the experienced jumpers who jump canopies of a type and loading similar to mine don't even get their gear out of the car.
My s/o will happily jump his 2.0+ loaded Velo in winds that I'd be backing up in under my 1.1 loaded Spectre.
I'm loaded closer to 3.0 then 2.0 and I still don't like 20+mph winds. The point to the newer jumpers out there is that just because you *can* jump in certain winds, it doesn't mean that you *have* to jump in those winds. I'll hang out on the ground and shag tandems or sit near the landing area and watch or help out around the DZ when the winds simply aren't fun.
--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline."
If the winds are anything above 10, a lot of the time its associated with some gusts and canopy turbulence.
I'm a little more cautious these days since I had a canopy go completely out of control at 300ft about 3 weeks ago. It just turned sideways and partially collapsed while I was in a drive with just a little brakes.
By some chance it righted itself just in time for a flare and a nice landing. Believe me, there was absolutely nothing I could do about it at that altitude.
Winds were reported as 14 when we took off and the manifest office announced gusts to 23 seconds after I landed.
I'm a little more cautious these days since I had a canopy go completely out of control at 300ft about 3 weeks ago. It just turned sideways and partially collapsed while I was in a drive with just a little brakes.
By some chance it righted itself just in time for a flare and a nice landing. Believe me, there was absolutely nothing I could do about it at that altitude.
Winds were reported as 14 when we took off and the manifest office announced gusts to 23 seconds after I landed.
You live more in the few minutes of skydiving than many people live in their lifetime
I will admit to jumping in some pretty stupid winds...
Now I realize to keep my ass on the ground when people with a lot more jumps than I do stay down.
I was told early on "if you have to think about it then it probably isn't a good idea"
I notice sometimes that when instructors won't jump the people that ARE jumping are the 300-400 jump people.
In a way I think people need to jump in shitty winds.. because one day the winds will change on the climb to altitude and you will need that experience.. and you don't get experience by staying on the ground... There is obviously a point at which to draw the line though...
Or maybe I'm trying to say.. if you only jump in calm or no wind conditions then you are sort of hurting yourself .. if you travel to another DZ that is always windy for example then you are in unfamilair conditions over and unfamiliar place..
then again.. what the hell do I know?
Now I realize to keep my ass on the ground when people with a lot more jumps than I do stay down.
I was told early on "if you have to think about it then it probably isn't a good idea"
I notice sometimes that when instructors won't jump the people that ARE jumping are the 300-400 jump people.
In a way I think people need to jump in shitty winds.. because one day the winds will change on the climb to altitude and you will need that experience.. and you don't get experience by staying on the ground... There is obviously a point at which to draw the line though...
Or maybe I'm trying to say.. if you only jump in calm or no wind conditions then you are sort of hurting yourself .. if you travel to another DZ that is always windy for example then you are in unfamilair conditions over and unfamiliar place..
then again.. what the hell do I know?
Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night.
Hummm, that seems familiar.... Ohh yeah I've got mine on video
When windy is too windy highly depends on experience.
Very often at DZ's you can see the "old timers" sitting loads out when the young guns are eager to jump... We are telling our newbees that it's some times better to be on the ground wishing you were in the air than the other way around.
He who dies with the most toys, wins.....
dudeist skydiver # 19515
Buy quality and cry once!
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