King Air engine loss?

[normiss 843]

I'm hearing through the "grape vine" that there was possibly a catastrophic engine failure on a twin otter somewhere in the Midwest US last week/weekend?
I'm told this happened at 5k and AFF students were left ABANDONED on the aircraft.
I'd be short a few AFFI's were this my DZ.
If this is true I think we need some new burger flippers.
Anybody hear anything about this?

Questions:
Any injuries?
Pilot handle it good?
Did jumpers bail?
Everyone exit ok?
Students? Tandems? Observers?

I'd like to know the details of the exits of the AFF's and the tandems.

Good thing to keep fresh in our minds folks!

[davelepka 4]

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I'm told this happened at 5k and AFF students were left ABANDONED on the aircraft

Seeing as there was no news reports of an Otter going in missing a wing, the failure couldn't have been that bad. Without damage to the airframe, there's still one good engine to get home on.

As far as AFF-Is leaving without students, that's what happens when you hand out AFF ratings like candy.

All of the 'real' AFF-Is I know would love a chance to drag a student out of an injured aircraft for a 10 sec. skydive. That's as real as it gets, and if you want to be an AFF-I, you have to be ready to face reality, not run from it.

I hope the part about the AFF students isn't true.

[normiss 843]

I'm told the engine is a total loss, non-repairable and the pilot instructed everyone to exit.
Agreed on all you other comments!

[skymama 37]

What's the USPA rule on this? Does the Pilot get the final say or should the instructors exit with their students regardless?

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[Remster 30]

The pilot is always in charge. That being said, "everybody out" is different from "you, get out to lighten the load" directed at the instructors.

Remster

[JohnMitchell 16]

My 2 cents? The pilot is in command of the airplane, and that includes the door. The instructor is in charge of the students. It would be a very tough situation in which I would override the pilot's authority by getting out when he told me not to. The pilots I fly with these days all seem to have pretty good judgment.

Any truth about the instructors leaving without the students?

I remember leaving a C-182, rough running engine, at 1200', but telling two novices with new gear, first piggyback jump, first square jump, to stay in the plane. Wide open fields, lots of places to do a forced landing. The plane made it back to the runway, the other experienced jumper and I were picked up, eventually. Kind of a quick decision, but I figured the 2 noobs were safer riding it down from that altitude.

[peek 21]

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What's the USPA rule on this? Does the Pilot get the final say or should the instructors exit with their students regardless?

That is a good question. In the case of an engine failure at 5000 feet there should be time to do something to insure the student is deployed shortly after exit, but if it was somehow an emergency that required that the jumpers leave the aircraft as quickly as possible so that the pilot could get the aircraft back in control, I think the pilot's opinion should take precedent. And a pilot in that situation would not care who is the instructor and who is the student.

[skymama 37]

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Any truth about the instructors leaving without the students?

It was my understanding that two AFFI's bailed and left the students on board alone as per the Pilot's instructions.

She is Da Man, and you better not mess with Da Man,
because she will lay some keepdown on you faster than, well, really fast. ~Billvon

[BillyVance 34]

Also, isn't it a part of AFF training, or any other method (not an instructor here) to understand what to do in case of aircraft emergencies?

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[normiss 843]

A pilot said specifically to leave the students?

Damn.
AFFI's should make student calls IMO.
At 5k, take student with and deploy for them, IMO.

[peek 21]

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Also, isn't it a part of AFF training, or any other method (not an instructor here) to understand what to do in case of aircraft emergencies?

Short answer, yes.

[jumpwally 0]

any location yet ?

smile, be nice, enjoy life
FB # - 1083

[jverley 1]

One consideration in that decision is where is the plane? Over the top of the DZ where the students can be landed by radio is one thing. Over the local town, probably not a good place to put a student with no practical canopy skills.

John
Arizona Hiking Trails

[IMALSUTIGERFAN 0]

Since I am fresh off AFF, on my first jump my AFF-I gave me emergancy coaching for that situation. He even took us out to the plane and showed us how to make an emergacy exit (non-poised) on exit and where my coachs would be....

[ikon 0]

As a current aff student I can attest that I was briefed on airplane emergencies during my fjc. From what I was told, with an airplane emergency at 5k we would definitely NOT be landing with the plane, we would jump solo and pull immediately.

I'd feel more than comfortable bailing out at 5k. But if these were all students doing fjc then who knows, maybe they really are safer landing with the plane.

I believe what I was told was, I could be wrong on these altitudes btw; <1500ft ride down with the plane, 1500-2500 go straight to silver, >2500 jump and pull main.

[wmw999 2,514]

One out of two engines out on a Twin Otter is not the same as losing the only engine on a Cessna.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[ikon 0]

Understood. I was talking about jumping from otters.

[Remster 30]

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From what I was told, with an airplane emergency at 5k we would definitely NOT be landing with the plane, we would jump solo and pull immediately.

Just remember: listen and obey the Pilot in Command's directives. If he stays stay put, stay put.

Remster

[ikon 0]

Yea, we only briefly covered airplane emergencies because there would obviously be instructors on board to tell us what to do in the event of an emergency, and that the pilot makes the call to get out or not.

[riggerrob 643]

During an aircraft emergency, an instructor is responsible for being the last one out alive.

Is it possible that most of the AFF Instructors jumped, but left one Instructor on board to supervise the students belting in for landing?

[billvon 3,058]

>During an aircraft emergency, an instructor is responsible for being
>the last one out alive.

Well, that's the issue here. If the pilot says "Everyone but students OUT NOW!" what do you do? Refuse?

[MajorDad 0]

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During an aircraft emergency, an instructor is responsible for being the last one out alive. {Snip}

To a point. I will TRY to get the student out.

If, however he will not budge and I can't physically get him out, then I will not go in with him.

They have been instructed that if they see the Instructor and the Pilot leave, then they should too!

Major Dad
CSPA D-579

[lpdwntnd 0]

We were told during our fjc that it's the pilot who makes the call and when he says get out you get out now, or you will find yourself sitting in the plane with no one flying it! I would never want to be the person sitting in the plane when the pilot already bailed! haha

Stop looking at me

[likestojump 3]

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We were told during our fjc that it's the pilot who makes the call and when he says get out you get out now, or you will find yourself sitting in the plane with no one flying it! I would never want to be the person sitting in the plane when the pilot already bailed! haha

it's quite rare you will see a Twin Otter pilot bail or even carry a parachute...

[normiss 843]

+1