Chest-mounted...iPhone??

[CrankyBabyBarry 0]

I do love my iphone! I would imagine getting a call in the middle of a jump...

"Hi, yeah....I'm falling through the air right now....can I call you back."

[MikeJD 0]

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Everyone is different and will be ready for different things in their own time. As few jumps as I get I may never be ready.

But I wouldn't recommend anybody be playing with a video camera under canopy after 42 jumps - arguably a hand-held camera is more of a distraction than a helmet-mounted one. Certainly it'll leave you less able to deal well with an emergency. Your post and profile suggest that as well as your jump numbers being low, you're not particularly current.

Please be careful.

Just sayin'.

[FFMedic 0]

MikeJD, appreciate your comment. I do want to point out that I made a very calculated effort to reduce any problems. I only used it after I was open, flying straight, in my holding area and away from all other jumpers. As I said, everyone was down way before me. ( in fact I was still about 2000 when the plane landed and the tandems were down and I was long done by then.)

I thought and found out that what I did was no more distracting at that point and maybe even somewhat less than the routine of : raising visor and loosening chest strap.

In thinking about this issue, besides the old advice that one should only listen to their instructor, I thought about playing "devil's advocate" on this question. Of course I realize that many people who are not my instructor will immediately take this wrong and want to fillet me rather than discuss, but I thought I'd put the question out there and see if there were any sane logical readers who cared to give reasoned appropriate responses.

What I hear from most is that low time jumpers are not ready for video. I tend to agree, though what exactly is low time, ( I know it when I see it?), and what is ready. Things change in the sport and world.

Used to be everyone jumped with round chutes and chest reserves. When someone came along and learned on a square did people say"Man you ain"t ready for that" or something to that effect. Other examples abound. Are these things because this is what people knew and "grew up" with ? Is there really the same concern with new tech or are there new concerns.

Question for this thread was about a "chest " mount non changeable video camera. What I mean is, with a helmet cam you look at what your taping. You may be distracted easily by trying to get that shot etc. With a chest mount non movable , non "changeable" camera can you do anything to distract yourself? You can't aim it, start or stop it, it just is.

The thing that interested me in the responses was that it appeared people were just parroting the old line from training when only helmet cams were available. Has there been any evidence that a chest mounted cam could be just as dangerous? I don't know, just asking.

Then I also thought, talk about distracting, new license and suddenly your OK to jump with any other licensed jumpers. Now you get to do two, three of four ways. Great if you jump with a lot of D jumpers, but four new A jumpers doing points? Nobody seems to care when you get on the plane. Fresh on the list and asked to if you want to do a tracking dive with 10 other jumpers?

Now there is some distraction. Trying not to screw up, paying attention to the points you dirt dived and trying to get them all in and tracking away without messing up! Damn, you people think that's ok for us new guys right out of the "chute"? I have found much of that very distracting, possibly much more than a non workable camera strapped to me might be. However, I've done most of it (not the tracking dive) and seen that I functioned just fine. I think most people do. Is there any real difference?

Again I invite intelligent comment. But, If your not my instructor, please try not to get personal, obnoxious or profane. He does that quite well without help. :) But he doesn't mind me asking questions.

Blue Skies

[skydiverbry 0]

NP,only you could start a bunch of shit with a iPhone!

Keep the damn thing in your pocket and your ideas in your head


Bry

--------------------------------------------------
Growing old is mandatory.Growing up is optional!!

D.S.#13(Dudeist Skdiver)

[MikeJD 0]

FFMedic, I do want to pick up on a few of your points.

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I thought and found out that what I did was no more distracting at that point and maybe even somewhat less than the routine of : raising visor and loosening chest strap.

Filming something with a hand-held video camera no more distracting than opening your helmet visor? Do you really believe that? I don't.

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Used to be everyone jumped with round chutes and chest reserves. When someone came along and learned on a square did people say"Man you ain"t ready for that" or something to that effect. Other examples abound. Are these things because this is what people knew and "grew up" with ? Is there really the same concern with new tech or are there new concerns.

I don't think my concerns are regressive - I think they're common sense. Just because new technology allows us to do something doesn't make it a good idea. It doesn't make it necessary. You mentioned earlier that you could have emailed the video while still under canopy. There's a good example.

And while I love to see the boundaries of the sport being pushed, I'd prefer it be done by people with lots of experience (meaning, more experience than me).

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Question for this thread was about a "chest " mount non changeable video camera. What I mean is, with a helmet cam you look at what your taping. You may be distracted easily by trying to get that shot etc. With a chest mount non movable , non "changeable" camera can you do anything to distract yourself? You can't aim it, start or stop it, it just is.

My response was specifically about you holding the camera in your hand. To me that's quite a different situation. Things I would ask myself (and maybe you did) are: if I suddenly need full use of my hands, will I really be quick to let go of my expensive camera, even though I know it's secured by a lanyard? If I do let it go, what are the chances that a dangling camera might entangle with something, e.g. in a cutaway situation?

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Then I also thought, talk about distracting, new license and suddenly your OK to jump with any other licensed jumpers. Now you get to do two, three of four ways. Great if you jump with a lot of D jumpers, but four new A jumpers doing points?

Not at my DZ.

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However, I've done most of it (not the tracking dive) and seen that I functioned just fine.

Again, this may sound to you like an old fart's comment - but doing something and getting away with it doesn't make it safe. Accidents can often be seen as resulting from a chain of events, or a combination of circumstances. If you introduce the first of those then you're potentially on your way to having one.

[thomas_crowe 0]

FFMedic; I think that it is great that you challenge yourself and evaluate things in a methodical and very logical way. That being said one of the best taglines I have seen on this board says to the effect; the biggest danger lies in breaking a safety rule and getting away with it. (that's not an exact quote, but I think that I got the spirit of the prose across).

I feel that a lot of the advice dispensed on this board has to be evaluated as applying to the broadest range of people possible! That's why we see things like minimum jump limits for attempting new things. Those evaluations are not based on you or your skills, but on most people and their skills. IMO if you want to get truly personal advice, you go to your local dz. Experienced jumpers that know you, and know your skills, and can have a more realistic conversation about *you* doing xyz (adding a camera, attempting sitflying or head down, etc). Your local instructors and the S&TA at your dropzone are fabulous resources, that are most likely willing to sit down and talk about what you want to do (especially if you buy em a beer for it)

Best of luck to you, blue skies, and be safe
Tom

Thomas Crowe, NRP
Nationally Registered Paramedic
Red Hat Linux Geek

[peek 21]

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What I did do was carry it in my leg pocket and planned to open early. Two of us exited together and had a nice flight as short as it was and I broke off at 6000. He tracked away and I was open at 4800. After checking everything out and the sky all around me, I took a short video of myself and the ground and other chutes below. It was all wrapped up by about 3000 and I watched the plane land. Even the 4 tandems all beat me to the ground by a long shot. (big ass ole canopy just keeps me up there)

Sounds like you planned it well. Just remember to continue to plan such things well and don't let anyone talk you into anything more advanced than what your planning can insure safety-wise.

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PS: I had a cutaway lanyard attached and wrapped it around my wrist for the filming.

You weenie! Real mean just hold cameras in their hand under canopy. :)


I think you have learned by now that you could probably post about pulling a handkerchief out of your jumpsuit under canopy and blowing your nose, and someone would tell you that under any conditions it would be too distracting, and dangerous.

Attached is a picture I took under canopy on about my 15th jump or so. When I showed the picture to the instructors at the DZ, they just commented that I must make sure that the photography does not interfere with my following the commands on radio arrow.

[MikeJD 0]

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Attached is a picture I took under canopy on about my 15th jump or so.

Sheesh, if you're under a round, do whatever the heck you want . It's not like you've got any control over the damned thing anyway - you just drift around and bounce off anybody who gets in your way.

[npgraphicdesign 3]

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NP,only you could start a bunch of shit with a iPhone!

Keep the damn thing in your pocket and your ideas in your head


Bry

Be quiet and get me a coffee!!!

[FFMedic 0]

Wow great, some intelligent well stated replies.

MikeJD: I appreciate your taking the time to answer. As to my visor and chest strap, yes I have found them to be very distracting. They both gave me trouble early on, visor slightly difficult to open and chest strap tight and hard to loosen. I have since gotten over them both but up front they were taking my eyes and mind off the road, so to speak.

To regression I guess we will have to disagree slightly. I do not find this particular activity much of a boundary and way far from a push. Despite all calls to the contrary I do not intend to fall belly first, alone, for 200 times so I can be called experienced. Little things will be added as I go and I considered this a little thing.

Would I let it go? Hell yes. Will it foul anything , as stated I had a breakaway lanyard, any abrupt force and it would have let go. Its only a couple of hundred and I do have a good job after all. I still would like to know specifically if anyone does know how chest mounted, non adjustable cameras might cause problems that seem particularly dangerous. So far I just hear don't do it. I'm an old guy, that might work on young guys but I have always needed to know what people mean and often they can not articulate what is the problem. Often its just "I said don't". Make it plain and real and I'll go along with it easy.

And to "chain of events". I agree. But we do not know what those events are until Monday Morning. Then everyone can say well I told you so. Every single thing I or anyone does up there could be the first link in the chain. Be cautious, think things out, follow a dive plan and be safe in general. Outside of that you might as well pack it in as you never know what that first link will be and it could be anything.

Finally I'd be very interested in what "A" jumpers can do in UK at your DZ. Maybe you have a better system across the pond and I really would like to hear it.

Thanks again and you sound like a great person to be able to jump with someday, if I don't scare you too much.

[FFMedic 0]

Thomas_crowe: I really like your response. I hope you don't take any grief giving it without being a 6 figure jumper.
Being old I guess one of my problems is static advise like "breaking rules". I need to understand rules not just obey them. My many years as a medic has taught me to evaluate situations and understand problems and then fix them. The administration spent a lot of time and money teaching me to think. I make mistakes for sure but I take care not to make serious ones because other people die if I do, not me. I apply the same process when it comes to my own life.

I think your advise about S&TA's, locals and instructors is right on the money. It's probably the right answer for most questions on here.

Peek: Yours is my favorite advise. Love your humor. If only I had not found sex in the late 60's I might have actually gone off and made that first jump on a round like I always wanted and been up there with you giving out advise to all the weenies. I probably agree with the "handkerchief" analogy and will temper my posts with that thought and your final tag. "1. Be safe, 2. Have fun, (everything else is way down the list)"

PS: even without any evidence to show harm, I will still not likely chest mount the iphone just yet.