Freeflying too early?

[I3uller 0]

The gear question I talked to a coach about and he said the rigs I am using are fine for freeflying. I wasn't using any dolphins as I have heard they are not suitable for any freeflying at all. The point on having the camera stuck in the risers and then the malfunction and it not cutting away is a good point. The chances are really slim but the chances are still there for sure. Good point on that one. I havn't been jumping the cam since I posted here and all my flying has been belly flying. I've definatly noticed in my last couple jumps that I am being much more aware of other jumpers. I'm taking note of the jump run line and orienting myself to it, I'm spotting and taking glances at the jumpers above and below myself, and just generally being much more aware of the people around me and how they can affect me or vice versa. Doing the checks helped me notice another student jumping behind me a couple jumps ago not giving me more than 2 or 3 seconds of seperation and I tracked 90 away from the jump run to make sure nothing happened. He still opened level and about 200 feet away from me. The tips on the jump run and knowing where people around me are have definitely helped me be more aware of everything during the fall. So a big thanks for that for sure. I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience. Just wanna say thanks for the tips...I don't think I had to proper guidance to go off of and was kind of doing my own thing and when shown what kind of dangers it could pose to other jumpers it helped me get back on track. Thanks guys.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

Wow! Makes mistakes, asks for advice, actually listens to and follows advice. Is this a first?
Seriously, I'm glad you decided to listen. Some of the stuff you get here is just crap, but when ALL the advice says not to do it, it is probably worth listening to.
Listen most of all to your instructors.
Keep learning and blues skies

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[skron 0]

I too started freeflying too early (about 35 jumps, not 12). Of course at the time I didn't know I was doing it too soon, I just wanted to play with the big boys and girls. I found out quickly it was too soon. I ended up on the ground for 3 months with a broken back. Freefly speeds are much faster than belly speeds and when you don't slow down enough before deploying you end up broken.

You said you wear the camera to show you whatyou are doing wrong.... Hate to tell you this, but you need someone else to wear the camera to get that feedback. You wearing a camera doesn't show you your body position whether your flying on your belly or your butt.

You don't necessarily need a coach to help you improve your skills. Find an experienced jumper that is willing to help, believe it or not a lot of people want to help newer people get better. You just have to ask. And be careful of coaches. You don't need a whole lot of skill or experience to get a coach rating. (And before the coaches kill me for that, I am in no way saying that coaches don't know what they are doing. Just that not all coaches should be coaches)

Another thing about freeflying too early.. Yes its a lot of fun, but I am not so good at RW now because I focused on freeflying too early. SLOW DOWN Enjoy every jump. You have plenty of time to do everything if you take it slow and don't do anything stupid.

Well behaved women don't often make history.

[flyhi 24]

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I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks.

Some people think there is a problem with the coach program, but I'm not sure why.

Shit happens. And it usually happens because of physics.

[Kami-kaze 0]

I sometimes think that people say freeflying too soon is not good is just the right thing to say. I think before sit flying learn to fly on your back. Most people have a image of freeflying as sitfly and head down. They skip backflying.
When I started exit on my back and flying back, belly, back till about 5000...this excersise set me up for three things in the future.. 1) Before I wave off and throw, I roll on my back to check ...I think that is safer than assuming if someone is above you he is going to see you wave off.. 2) From the back position you can practise gointo sit. It a good recovery position, too.. 3) You have the basics to track on your back...
I was in NZ at that time and one instructor was setting me up this way, and then I got introduced to Pine from Deland and he showed me how to do Mantis on belly when nobody was doing it that way there. That was great because after that I can fall faster and fly with heavier people. Gave me range. If you are lucky to get good open minded coaches that is someting to thank for.
I know one old bellyflier from oz saying to me, "I have 5000 jmps and I tried head down for the first time and I spun out and only because I had so many jmps before I was able to recover on my belly. " He was just giving me a whole hearted warning but...Lot's of bellyflying is not going to make freeflying any easier. Lot's of flying made this guy think he can go head down straight away, his ego didn't allow asking for advise or coaching... so there are no fixed numbers to start freeflying. Just good instruction is what you got to look for. There are lots of things you can do. aint that coool.
It took me 250 jmps and a couple of thousand dollars in coaching to get my sitflying and I am just beginning to fly just with my legs. Still have a lot to do. I am backflying again cause I can do a lot more with it. So, I spent a lot of time sit, stand, back, freestyle layups and my head down has just began and it sucks. I started freeflying early but still taking my time in progression. It's going to take a longer time than bellyflying so why not start earlier than later. I don't have lot's of money! Not everyone likes BigWays and turning points.
I applaud you with your initiatives, and questioning and reasonings with people and listening. Not like follow the flock mentality. Good luck.

[DSE 5]

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I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience.

If I understand what you're saying here correctly, a coach at Raeford set up a 2-way between two non-licensed skydivers ?

[denete 3]

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I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience.

If I understand what you're saying here correctly, a coach at Raeford set up a 2-way between two non-licensed skydivers ?

You may have to throw a penalty flag on this one DSE.

SCR #14809

"our attitude is the thing most capable of keeping us safe"
(look, grab, look, grab, peel, punch, punch, arch)

[LyraM45 0]

If you think you're in "control," you should take a ride over to the tunnel since your in Carolina and do some flying. Even in that big tunnel you'll come out bruised and battered because you're so in "control." (Not even talking sitflying, probably just from flying on your belly, dude.)

Seriously... go do a few coach jumps with somebody flying base straight down the tube or go do some tunnel time and let me know how straight down the tube and in control you were. Trust me, you'll be very humbled!

If you're not going to do either of those things in the near future, at least stick to doing solos for a long time and DO NOT backslide/forwardslide/track up and down jump run; take a good look before you open please!!!!

Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :)

[I3uller 0]

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I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience.

If I understand what you're saying here correctly, a coach at Raeford set up a 2-way between two non-licensed skydivers ?

Yea I thought it was kind of strange as well.

[Baksteen 84]

You DID notice there is an entire thread after that original post, didn't you?

"That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport."
~mom

[Chubba 0]

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Yea I thought it was kind of strange as well.

...and the plot thickens

Though in all seriousness, you got to self-monitor your own situation, if seems out of the ordinary or it goes against the recommendations of your governing body... question it.

[denete 3]

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If I understand what you're saying here correctly, a coach at Raeford set up a 2-way between two non-licensed skydivers ?

You may have to throw a penalty flag on this one DSE.

In other words, I think it might be time to call bull.

SCR #14809

"our attitude is the thing most capable of keeping us safe"
(look, grab, look, grab, peel, punch, punch, arch)

[DSE 5]

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I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience.

If I understand what you're saying here correctly, a coach at Raeford set up a 2-way between two non-licensed skydivers ?

Yea I thought it was kind of strange as well.

So;
-You're claiming a coach put you and another non-licensed skydiver in the air as a two-way. Who is the person at Raeford that set up the two way? Perhaps he/she had a specific reason for doing so?

-At 17 jumps you're saying you know that you're not permitted to jump with another non-licensed skydiver, but went ahead with the jump?

-If you think corking/popping up 20 feet in a belly dive was something exciting, wait'll you do the same in a freefly dive. You'll likely be asked to not jump with that group until you can demonstrate confident fall rate skills.

[HN1 0]

If you think thats bad I heard this one time there was a pilot that was doing AFF from the plane. He gets a whole load of cat B and C jumpers and then they all jump out of the plane and the pilot puts it in a dive so he can watch. I even heard he had to dock with a spinning student to pull for them. He then debriefs all the students on landing. Well only if he doesn't have more students waiting.

Skydiving is borring!!

[I3uller 0]

HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

[DSE 5]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

I'm merely asking simple questions that for some reason, you've declined to answer. Do I seem riled up?

[Andy9o8 2]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

You said the exact same thing in the other thread, too. Acting obnoxious, juvenile and antagonizing people isn't going to enhance your already-nonexistent credibility.

[The111 1]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

You can actually get people riled up in real life too. But it's immature and pointless, and cowards choose to only do it on the internet.

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[LloydDobbler 2]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

You can actually get people riled up in real life too. But it's immature and pointless, and cowards choose to only do it on the internet.

(And then said cowards realize what a small world the skydiving community is when they start meeting all the internet people at random DZ's...).
Oops.

Signatures are the new black.

[I3uller 0]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

You can actually get people riled up in real life too. But it's immature and pointless, and cowards choose to only do it on the internet.

If you give me good advice I will gladly take it, follow it, and thank you for it as I have done with the real advice that I had gotten. If you are just going to call me a moron, be it on the internet or not, I'll likely ignore you and tell you to kindly fuck off.

[likestojump 3]

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HOLY SHIT I'M A BIG WARTY GREEN TROLL THAT LIVES UNDER THE BRIDGE OF DOOM!!!! So awesome how you can get people so riled up on the intertoobs.

You can actually get people riled up in real life too. But it's immature and pointless, and cowards choose to only do it on the internet.

If you give me good advice I will gladly take it, follow it, and thank you for it as I have done with the real advice that I had gotten. If you are just going to call me a moron, be it on the internet or not, I'll likely ignore you and tell you to kindly fuck off.

The only problem is that it seems that YOU are not willing to take any criticism and want all of us to give you advice on a silver platter with sugar coating. Trust me, I would not say anything different to you in person either.

Just stay safe and think

[I3uller 0]

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The gear question I talked to a coach about and he said the rigs I am using are fine for freeflying. I wasn't using any dolphins as I have heard they are not suitable for any freeflying at all. The point on having the camera stuck in the risers and then the malfunction and it not cutting away is a good point. The chances are really slim but the chances are still there for sure. Good point on that one. I havn't been jumping the cam since I posted here and all my flying has been belly flying. I've definatly noticed in my last couple jumps that I am being much more aware of other jumpers. I'm taking note of the jump run line and orienting myself to it, I'm spotting and taking glances at the jumpers above and below myself, and just generally being much more aware of the people around me and how they can affect me or vice versa. Doing the checks helped me notice another student jumping behind me a couple jumps ago not giving me more than 2 or 3 seconds of seperation and I tracked 90 away from the jump run to make sure nothing happened. He still opened level and about 200 feet away from me. The tips on the jump run and knowing where people around me are have definitely helped me be more aware of everything during the fall. So a big thanks for that for sure. I talked to a coach and he set me up with another girl with 21 jumps to do some RW work and it was much more challenging than the coach docks. On exit she jumped a good second after me so I had to get big and then when I got to her she fell decently faster than myself so I had to pretty much fold myself in half to stay with her and was having trouble rising up when I tried moving towards her. We got within a couple inches of docking but I got too hasty and reached far and subsequently shot 20 feet above her haha. We didn't get a dock in but it was a really good learning experience. Just wanna say thanks for the tips...I don't think I had to proper guidance to go off of and was kind of doing my own thing and when shown what kind of dangers it could pose to other jumpers it helped me get back on track. Thanks guys.

It seems like the only posts you focus on are the ones where I didn't know any better. I took your advice, and have been following it. I havn't jumped the camera, havn't done any freeflying, and have been talking to my coaches at the DZ since I got the advice. I came here with a concern that I might be doing something wrong so I figured I would ask people about it and all I seemed to get at first was a face full of flaming. Once people started giving me real advice instead of just calling me a moron I followed the advice, and was thankful for it. I don't really know what else you want?

[DSE 5]

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If you give me good advice I will gladly take it, follow it, and thank you for it as I have done with the real advice that I had gotten. If you are just going to call me a moron, be it on the internet or not, I'll likely ignore you and tell you to kindly fuck off.

Curious...does the ignoring of others begin before, or after you tell em' to kindly fuck off? Just asking....

t'is a small world out there...and the ground isn't any softer no matter where you skydive.

[tommyjoe 0]

You know, back in the day, you used to be a SkyGod if you could STAND UP in freefall. I didn't figure out how to do it until I had 150 jumps but I guess I couldn't even practice it now with that many jumps.

[I3uller 0]

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If you give me good advice I will gladly take it, follow it, and thank you for it as I have done with the real advice that I had gotten. If you are just going to call me a moron, be it on the internet or not, I'll likely ignore you and tell you to kindly fuck off.

Curious...does the ignoring of others begin before, or after you tell em' to kindly fuck off? Just asking....

t'is a small world out there...and the ground isn't any softer no matter where you skydive.

Lol well the ignoring would most likely come after the fuck offing...because if I was completely ignoring you beforehand I wouldn't know you were calling me a moron in the first place haha. I understand the skydiving community is small. I'm not trying to make enemies anywhere. Skydiving is supposed to be a fun, bonding experience and when all I get is that I'm a moron without any advice to un-moronify me then I'm not going to be very receptive to you and probably act like a jackass towards you. Once I got good advice I acted on it and thanked them for it. I understand the whole new people doing dumb things. I've been in the Army a while and when we get a new guy that does something stupid and endangers other people...of course we call him a moron. But we tell him what he did wrong, and how he can fix it, and the reasoning behind why what he did was stupid. The sugar coating thing I understand might be a pain in the ass, but if you tell someone something is wrong, they probably will still think that its not wrong and do it anyways. Especially thick headed people like myself. Even idiots will understand that its wrong but won't know why its wrong and when someone else asks them why its wrong they won't know. If you explain why its wrong to them they will understand that "hey, this is really wrong." and they won't do it anymore because they know what could happen if they do. I guess I would have rather gotten a brief explanation on why its wrong in the first place instead of just being called a moron. Is that too much to ask?