ozzy13 0
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yeah.. dont really care how you add it up.. skydiving is NOT a cheap sport. Tunnel or otherwise.. its been said countless times on this site...... save your pennies. Cuz no matter which direction you take, you're bound to spend your pennies! blue ones
If flying is piloting a plane.. then swimming is driving a boat. I know why birds sing.. I skydive.
I vote for tunnel time as being very valuable for beginning skydivers. Staying centered in the tunnel and developing fall rate, turn skills resulted in way better "real" skydives for me. The intensity of doing 15 minutes(2 min runs) is a great learning tool providing you have a AFF instuctor in the tunnel as coach. You can do the same with more jumps but realistically as a student it is not 20-25 bucks a jump but AFF level prices at 200 per jump....makes tunnel look really attractive.
I can't fly for shit in the tunnel i.e. I can't fly for shit[full stop]
I love the tunnel but would rather jump from a plane.
(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome
I love the tunnel but would rather jump from a plane.
(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome
pirana 0
I figure 70 seconds freefall from 13K means 51.4 jumps 
to get I hour of freefall. Multiplied by $22 per ride is $1131.43 for one hour in the dreamscape.
I'll probably do it someday just for kicks, or if I ever decide to compete at more than the lowest levels. Kids would probably really dig it too.
How quickly the money is spent is a bit of an ouch too. It's one thing to plunk down that much over several weeks in the summer, quite another to spend it all in one weekend.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
tdog 0
I am going to quote someone else in response to the original poster.
Shropshire, sorry I am going to give you a bit of a hard time, but you are the perfect example.
This whole thread has turned into "Tunnel time costs X, skydiving costs Y". That is not the point...
I MUCH rather be in the sky. I have a tunnel 10 minutes from my office, but only fly a few times a year for myself with my money...
However, the tunnel IS THE TOOL for learning freefall skills. After dozens of hours of tunnel time coached on formation belly work, now I am using it for freefly skills. Hands down, I tell all students to go there for their coaching, as do I. A coach jump at the DZ costs 2 slots, gear rental if needed, and a fee to the coach if they charge. That is between $55 and $100 depending on who pays what. You get 40 seconds of working time where the coach cannot stand on the net and correct what is wrong before moving on.
In fact, I almost refuse to do coach jumps with students unless the skill cannot be worked on in the tunnel, such as exit counts, tracking, exits and major separation recovery - in addition to alti awareness and canopy control.
Here is the deal, and why I quoted Shropshire... I never have flown with Shropshire, so I don't know if it is true or not - but they claim they can't fly for shit.
The tunnel has the power to transform, and is transforming, skydivers to be better skydivers.
When you can't fly for shit - your enjoyment of skydiving is hindered. When you can fly, because you spent some cash to learn, you get invited on big way invitationals, you are a trusted member of the base or 2nd plane captain on boogie big ways where you have to get in as 20 people will dock on you from both planes, produce and/or jump in television commercials for money, and in the epic sunset tracking dives, you are "in" and not "out".
Even if you like whimsical freefly jumps, you will be able to fly around your friends in a sit and put gum on their shoes as a joke instead of touching them only once - on exit.
Falling from the sky and saying "I saw you in freefall, dude" gets old after a while. You need the skills to challenge yourself and move on to make this sport rewarding.
There is a modern trend with some, if not a lot, of skydivers - to freefly after 20 jumps and never go back to belly work. Those are the guys who never get in a sitfly dock, or if they do, it is sloppy and rough.
My final words of thought: I was on a 50 way and a very, very, very well respected freeflier asked to be on it. Airspeed was organizing it, but this freeflier soon began to help. He started coaching people on cross referencing, fall rate, levels and grip management. I asked him after the jump, "That is weird, hearing a freeflier talk about crossreferencing."
He said, "Our VRW team had to learn belly flying all over again and we spent hours getting coaching on belly formation skydiving, then took those skills and kept them, but turned our body to head down - and that is how we improved our skills.
So, in the long run. It does not matter if the tunnel costs more or less per minute. It does not matter if it counts towards a jump or not in student progression. Dollar for Dollar - someone with good coaching in the tunnel will progress farther and quicker than someone without.
QuoteI can't fly for shit in the tunnel i.e. I can't fly for shit[full stop]
I love the tunnel but would rather jump from a plane.
Shropshire, sorry I am going to give you a bit of a hard time, but you are the perfect example.
This whole thread has turned into "Tunnel time costs X, skydiving costs Y". That is not the point...
I MUCH rather be in the sky. I have a tunnel 10 minutes from my office, but only fly a few times a year for myself with my money...
However, the tunnel IS THE TOOL for learning freefall skills. After dozens of hours of tunnel time coached on formation belly work, now I am using it for freefly skills. Hands down, I tell all students to go there for their coaching, as do I. A coach jump at the DZ costs 2 slots, gear rental if needed, and a fee to the coach if they charge. That is between $55 and $100 depending on who pays what. You get 40 seconds of working time where the coach cannot stand on the net and correct what is wrong before moving on.
In fact, I almost refuse to do coach jumps with students unless the skill cannot be worked on in the tunnel, such as exit counts, tracking, exits and major separation recovery - in addition to alti awareness and canopy control.
Here is the deal, and why I quoted Shropshire... I never have flown with Shropshire, so I don't know if it is true or not - but they claim they can't fly for shit.
The tunnel has the power to transform, and is transforming, skydivers to be better skydivers.
When you can't fly for shit - your enjoyment of skydiving is hindered. When you can fly, because you spent some cash to learn, you get invited on big way invitationals, you are a trusted member of the base or 2nd plane captain on boogie big ways where you have to get in as 20 people will dock on you from both planes, produce and/or jump in television commercials for money, and in the epic sunset tracking dives, you are "in" and not "out".
Even if you like whimsical freefly jumps, you will be able to fly around your friends in a sit and put gum on their shoes as a joke instead of touching them only once - on exit.
Falling from the sky and saying "I saw you in freefall, dude" gets old after a while. You need the skills to challenge yourself and move on to make this sport rewarding.
There is a modern trend with some, if not a lot, of skydivers - to freefly after 20 jumps and never go back to belly work. Those are the guys who never get in a sitfly dock, or if they do, it is sloppy and rough.
My final words of thought: I was on a 50 way and a very, very, very well respected freeflier asked to be on it. Airspeed was organizing it, but this freeflier soon began to help. He started coaching people on cross referencing, fall rate, levels and grip management. I asked him after the jump, "That is weird, hearing a freeflier talk about crossreferencing."
He said, "Our VRW team had to learn belly flying all over again and we spent hours getting coaching on belly formation skydiving, then took those skills and kept them, but turned our body to head down - and that is how we improved our skills.
So, in the long run. It does not matter if the tunnel costs more or less per minute. It does not matter if it counts towards a jump or not in student progression. Dollar for Dollar - someone with good coaching in the tunnel will progress farther and quicker than someone without.
QuoteSo, in the long run. It does not matter if the tunnel costs more or less per minute. It does not matter if it counts towards a jump or not in student progression. Dollar for Dollar - someone with good coaching in the tunnel will progress farther and quicker than someone without.
Limited to the freefall portion, not including the exit or breakoff.
When it comes to separation, deployment, and canopy control (aka saving your life), the tunnel is of no value.
Butters 0
If you're indoors you're not skydiving.
QuoteI figure 70 seconds freefall from 13K means 51.4 jumps
to get I hour of freefall. Multiplied by $22 per ride is $1131.43 for one hour in the dreamscape.
I'm paying ~$660 per hour.
"That looks dangerous." Leopold Stotch
Baksteen 84
Yes, tunnel IS the perfect training tool for freefall.
But if I can't afford skydiving for a month after a tunnel camp then what's the point?
To me tunnel is EXTRA, something I invest in when I can afford it.
QuoteIf you're indoors you're not skydiving.
that's just a matter of time
"That formation-stuff in freefall is just fun and games but with an open parachute it's starting to sound like, you know, an extreme sport."
~mom
~mom
pirana 0
QuoteIf you're indoors you're not skydiving.
QuoteI figure 70 seconds freefall from 13K means 51.4 jumps
I'm paying ~$660 per hour.
That is because you are weird.
" . . . the lust for power can be just as completely satisfied by suggesting people into loving their servitude as by flogging them and kicking them into obedience." -- Aldous Huxley
To me the term indoor skydiving is an oxy moron. Skydiving is jumping out of an airplane with a parachute. There is no sky indoors. That is flying your body in a wind tunnel.
I may be getting old but I got to see all the cool bands.
Now you are just splitting [h]airs
(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome
fastphil 0
QuoteDon't forget all the intangibles you get on real skydives; possible malfunctions, cutaways, canopy collisions, botched landings, etc.
I've seen jumps made indoors that come complete with possible malfunctions, canopy collisions and botched landings, but "flying hours" would take a long time to accrue...
QuoteThere is no sky indoors. That is flying your body in a wind tunnel.
Yep, true enough. BUT - a recent tunnel session finally cemented decent leg control for me, got me WAY more stable in the airstream, and I kicked-ass on my second attempt at AFF C-1. The JMs told me they were bored watching me fall, but I made their job a lot easier!
I will use the tunnel as a tool in my training - nothing replaces being in the sky, but one can work on body flight in a tunnel, then take it to the sky!
Live deliberately; Dare greatly; Land gently
SkyPainter
SOS 1304, POPS 10695, DS 118
SkyPainter
SOS 1304, POPS 10695, DS 118
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