JUDYJ 0 #1 February 17, 2007 So what are one's options when you learn that a pilot of a dropzone (and owner) isn't really licensed to fly jump planes.. just licensed as a "private pilot??" Or are there exceptions and I just am not seeing where??? Isn't this illegal and like wrong?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #2 February 17, 2007 Is it a "club" operation? Do they charge money to take people up?Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadbug 0 #3 February 17, 2007 Judy, I am a former jump pilot with 1200 hours jump flying experience and a D-lisc jumper with over 1000 jumps. I am currently a airline captain. If someone is flying for compensation of hire with a only a private certificate, he is clearly in violation of the FARS. In the past there has been some debate over the legality of it when the pilot is flying for a club and is a club member shareing in the cost of the flight operations. It's a week argument at best. If he's getting compensation in any way it is a clear violation. Even if no money is changing hands, the FAA considers flight hours to be compensation. Doug Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tombuch 0 #4 February 17, 2007 My understanding of the regulation: Jump pilots "hold out" to the public and must hold a commercial certificate. The only exception I have ever heard of is a private club where every member does the same amount of work, and the pilot is just doing his share. The group would need to be very small (about four), and there could never be students or non-club members on the flight. That's rare, and even if you met that requirement, the FSDO could still violate you. The thinking there is that the flight is not "incidental" to the jump, and thus the private pilot exemption doesn't apply. A broader answer: Private pilots flying jumpers is a very bad idea. The aircraft is loaded close to max weight, and the balance point can sometimes be out of limits. The aircraft is flown at slow speed and steep bank angles, and is often close to a stall. That's tough flying. It should be handled by a commercial pilot who has been trained in aerodynamics, and has significant experience flying with ground reference in unusual configurations. The private pilot certification doesn't cover that. If you have questions about what is happening I would first make sure the pilot is rated as just a private pilot, and then I suggest, at a minimum, that you refuse to jump at that DZ at all, and caution all your friends to avoid the DZ. I would take it further and report the violation to the local FAA office. I'm a commercial pilot too, and understand the problem, and the regulation, and I've lost too many friends in jump plane accidents. I'm a bastard about this. There is simply no excuse for a private pilot to be flying jumpers. Ever. You can ask to see the pilot's certificate, or, if you know his first and last name you can look him up on the FAA database at http://www.faa.gov/licenses_certificates/airmen_certification/interactive_airmen_inquiry/. You will need to fill out a form first that includes your personal information, and then you can search away.Tom Buchanan Instructor Emeritus Comm Pilot MSEL,G Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
xlh883 0 #5 February 17, 2007 Report both of them to the local FSDO (Flight Standards District Office) and to the USPA. Also, I wouldn't jump from that plane. No if's, and's or but's about it. I am a Private pilot and I am smarter than to do that. That pilot is logging flight hours as a jump pilot which is considered compensation by the FAA. Besides, he/she may not have enough training to save your life. 'Nuff said. David Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skybeergodd 0 #6 February 18, 2007 The FAA has made it pretty clear that even a skydiving club must have a commercial pilot. Look in any manual and you will see that a private pilot must pay at least 50% of the operating costs. If someone else pays for rental, feul ect. and the pilot does not get compensated the FAA still considers the "free" hours compensation hence you must be a commercial pilot. To put it simply...if your a private pilot you pretty much have to pay $$ to fly with very litlle exception. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #7 February 18, 2007 Not aimed at you Tom. But WOW, skydivers talking about and encourging other jumpers to go to the FAA and Snitch/Rat out someone in the sport? WTF! So we have a bunch of folks who jump all over Mr. Peeks shit for "just talking to a FAA rep" (rantol 06 bandit base) so where are all those people who got all in Peeks shit? What you guys aren't going to get all up Tom's ass for wanting to rat out and snitch on a pilot. Oh I guess it is ok to rat out a pilot but not a jumper... I happen to agree with going to the FAA on this BTW, and I also think Mr. Peek did the right thing as well. If more jumpers who are "really in the know" (A&P's pilots,FBO's, riggers) would grab their nut sacks and tell the truth we would see many who couldn't pass the mustard. But as we have seen in the treatment of Mr. Peek, cutting corners in skydiving is SOP and many many people will turn a blind eye for many reasons, we have been doing so for years and if you speak out or deal with the FED's your a fucking RAT and don't belong in the brother/sisterhood....you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
recovercrachead 0 #8 February 18, 2007 Not aimed at you Tom. It sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". So If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger??????????Track high, Pull LOW!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #9 February 18, 2007 QuoteNot aimed at you Tom. But WOW, skydivers talking about and encourging other jumpers to go to the FAA and Snitch/Rat out someone in the sport? WTF! So we have a bunce of folks who jump all over Mr. Peeks shit for "just talking to a FAA rep" (rantol 06 bandit base) so where are all those people who got all in Peeks shit? What you guys aren't going to get all up Tom's ass for wanting to rat out and snitch on a pilot. Oh I guess it is ok to rat out a pilot but not a jumper... I happen to agree with going to the FAA on this BTW, and I also think Mr. Peek did the right thing as well. If more jumpers who are "really in the know" (A&P's pilots,FBO's, riggers) would grab their nut sacks and tell the truth we would see many who couldn't pass the mustard. But as we have seen in the treatment of Mr. Peek, cutting corners in skydiving is SOP and many many people will turn a blind eye for many reasons, we have been doing so for years and if you speak out or deal with the FED's your a fucking RAT and don't belong in the brother/sisterhood.... What does "self-policing" mean? Does that mean we confront issues directly and if the unacceptable situation continues then we go to the authority (in this case the FAA)? I say yes. We should be on the lookout for those that don't conform to standard. However, I would say that shouldn't be our first option. I think we do need to make it known that we don't approve of such a situation. It might take getting the help of some people that are more experienced in the industry to confront them. This is what I possibly see happening here but the original poster has yet responded with more info that is needed. A long time icon in the sport of skydiving once told me when I started my safety website "be prepared to be attacked. Get a thick skin quick." He was right. Even when you know you're right you will be attacked for your views and actions. There is ALWAYS someone who differs in opinion and probably strongly. Just always try to have your ducks in a row and stick to facts. This will cut through the bull most of the time.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2cmyzx 0 #10 February 18, 2007 Stratostar, that is the best post rsponse ever! If it really concern's you (judy) then just dont jump there. I myself will get in anything that will get me in the air, but hey thats me Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diverdriver 5 #11 February 18, 2007 QuoteNot aimed at you Tom. It sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". So If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? I say yes you are. If that pilot can not conform to the current regulations and demonstrate their ability to a set standard then what other regulations are they disregarding? You are in danger from an "anti-authority" attitude that has killed more than one pilot and his pax.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diverdriver 5 #12 February 18, 2007 QuoteThis is the best post ever! If it really concern's you then just dont jump there. I myself will get in anything that will get me in the air, but hey thats me Please review this incomplete list of jump plane accidents. Sometimes, they don't always make it into the air. The ListChris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2cmyzx 0 #13 February 18, 2007 I know that and I will take that risk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diverdriver 5 #14 February 18, 2007 QuoteI know that and I will take that risk Why do you want to and why do you feel you have to? It's not necessary. Aircraft operation safety is not a mystery or by random. It is a deliberate approach.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2cmyzx 0 #15 February 18, 2007 I dont feel I have to. No one is forcing me to. I choose to because I live in remote part of Montana where when I was growing up every rancher had a plane to go and check the cow's and fly in to get the groceries. Many of the pilots had no licence. Most have gone by the wayside because of the increase in aircraft cost. I like to make a jump once in a while and our club DZ is 2 hours away from here and only operates on weekends from April to Oct. So I catch a ride up with a local rancher that has a 175 once in a while Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #16 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". No it is amied at those who are so quick to jump all over someone else who posted their dealing with a "talking to a FAA rep" and labeling them as a rat/snitch. I don't personally know Tom B. but for him to post that and say this should be turned in to the FAA takes BALLS. At my best guess upon reading many of his post/info, me thinks he is a standup guy. But I'm still waiting for the "he's a snitch" crowd to show up to bash him as they did Mr. Peek. QuoteSo If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? Yes. I'm sure the folks who took off in a 182 in beaver PA? that crashed didn't think anything of flying with a old jump pilot who lost his license due to medical, till they crashed.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #17 February 18, 2007 It's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #18 February 18, 2007 Tom. this is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. He's been doing this for years... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #19 February 18, 2007 Sorry, I didn't respond sooner.. I was with kids. What do you need to know??? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #20 February 18, 2007 so then.. what do you do?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #21 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1. If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a longtime "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3. You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got the dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp checks and other FAA biz. I find it hard to believe they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL and has been flying jumpers.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites deadbug 0 #22 February 18, 2007 If the FAA was aware that he was exercising the privileges of a commercial pilot with only a private lisc they would take swift action. If there was an accident he would be hung out to dry by not only the FAA but the lawyers in the civil suit that follows. Are there private pilots that can safely fly jumpers? I'm sure there are, but the question is is it legal. The regs are clear, it's not. Don't jump there if they can't follow that simple rule. Doug QuoteQuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1.If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3.You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp check. I find it hard to beleive they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #23 February 18, 2007 I don't jump there.. It's not in California.. as a RN.. you see that my work and moral ethic makes me feel that if there is something I know to make others safe and I fail to respond to that.. then I'm just as guilty if I committed the act that led to harm. I am a patient advocate completely. So as a skydiver..I don't have an issue today or any day of my life for standing up for what is right and what I believe can keep other's safe. Perhaps 'good ole boys' need to rethink some thoughts... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #24 February 18, 2007 Do you think the USPA doesn't check this stuff out?? I would've thought that being a USPA DZ they would keep up with that little bit of info... uh?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites icevideot 0 #25 February 18, 2007 QuoteStratostar, that is the best post rsponse ever! LMAO I happen to agree completely with Stratostar on this but I am not sure you understood what he said. If you will read it again you will see he agrees with going to the FAA on this. He was bashing the people who attack anyone who stands up against unsafe practices. I understand your willingness to fly in anything going but what if someone you love goes to make a tandem? I think people have a right to expect a professional operation. I have been in 1 full-blown stall and I am very grateful to have had a qualified pilot at the controls. If the pilot in this case is qualified let him prove it and earn the ratings."... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 1 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
diverdriver 5 #11 February 18, 2007 QuoteNot aimed at you Tom. It sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". So If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? I say yes you are. If that pilot can not conform to the current regulations and demonstrate their ability to a set standard then what other regulations are they disregarding? You are in danger from an "anti-authority" attitude that has killed more than one pilot and his pax.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #12 February 18, 2007 QuoteThis is the best post ever! If it really concern's you then just dont jump there. I myself will get in anything that will get me in the air, but hey thats me Please review this incomplete list of jump plane accidents. Sometimes, they don't always make it into the air. The ListChris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2cmyzx 0 #13 February 18, 2007 I know that and I will take that risk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diverdriver 5 #14 February 18, 2007 QuoteI know that and I will take that risk Why do you want to and why do you feel you have to? It's not necessary. Aircraft operation safety is not a mystery or by random. It is a deliberate approach.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites 2cmyzx 0 #15 February 18, 2007 I dont feel I have to. No one is forcing me to. I choose to because I live in remote part of Montana where when I was growing up every rancher had a plane to go and check the cow's and fly in to get the groceries. Many of the pilots had no licence. Most have gone by the wayside because of the increase in aircraft cost. I like to make a jump once in a while and our club DZ is 2 hours away from here and only operates on weekends from April to Oct. So I catch a ride up with a local rancher that has a 175 once in a while Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #16 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". No it is amied at those who are so quick to jump all over someone else who posted their dealing with a "talking to a FAA rep" and labeling them as a rat/snitch. I don't personally know Tom B. but for him to post that and say this should be turned in to the FAA takes BALLS. At my best guess upon reading many of his post/info, me thinks he is a standup guy. But I'm still waiting for the "he's a snitch" crowd to show up to bash him as they did Mr. Peek. QuoteSo If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? Yes. I'm sure the folks who took off in a 182 in beaver PA? that crashed didn't think anything of flying with a old jump pilot who lost his license due to medical, till they crashed.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #17 February 18, 2007 It's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #18 February 18, 2007 Tom. this is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. He's been doing this for years... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #19 February 18, 2007 Sorry, I didn't respond sooner.. I was with kids. What do you need to know??? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #20 February 18, 2007 so then.. what do you do?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #21 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1. If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a longtime "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3. You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got the dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp checks and other FAA biz. I find it hard to believe they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL and has been flying jumpers.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites deadbug 0 #22 February 18, 2007 If the FAA was aware that he was exercising the privileges of a commercial pilot with only a private lisc they would take swift action. If there was an accident he would be hung out to dry by not only the FAA but the lawyers in the civil suit that follows. Are there private pilots that can safely fly jumpers? I'm sure there are, but the question is is it legal. The regs are clear, it's not. Don't jump there if they can't follow that simple rule. Doug QuoteQuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1.If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3.You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp check. I find it hard to beleive they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #23 February 18, 2007 I don't jump there.. It's not in California.. as a RN.. you see that my work and moral ethic makes me feel that if there is something I know to make others safe and I fail to respond to that.. then I'm just as guilty if I committed the act that led to harm. I am a patient advocate completely. So as a skydiver..I don't have an issue today or any day of my life for standing up for what is right and what I believe can keep other's safe. Perhaps 'good ole boys' need to rethink some thoughts... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #24 February 18, 2007 Do you think the USPA doesn't check this stuff out?? I would've thought that being a USPA DZ they would keep up with that little bit of info... uh?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites icevideot 0 #25 February 18, 2007 QuoteStratostar, that is the best post rsponse ever! LMAO I happen to agree completely with Stratostar on this but I am not sure you understood what he said. If you will read it again you will see he agrees with going to the FAA on this. He was bashing the people who attack anyone who stands up against unsafe practices. I understand your willingness to fly in anything going but what if someone you love goes to make a tandem? I think people have a right to expect a professional operation. I have been in 1 full-blown stall and I am very grateful to have had a qualified pilot at the controls. If the pilot in this case is qualified let him prove it and earn the ratings."... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 1 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0 Go To Topic Listing
diverdriver 5 #14 February 18, 2007 QuoteI know that and I will take that risk Why do you want to and why do you feel you have to? It's not necessary. Aircraft operation safety is not a mystery or by random. It is a deliberate approach.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2cmyzx 0 #15 February 18, 2007 I dont feel I have to. No one is forcing me to. I choose to because I live in remote part of Montana where when I was growing up every rancher had a plane to go and check the cow's and fly in to get the groceries. Many of the pilots had no licence. Most have gone by the wayside because of the increase in aircraft cost. I like to make a jump once in a while and our club DZ is 2 hours away from here and only operates on weekends from April to Oct. So I catch a ride up with a local rancher that has a 175 once in a while Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #16 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". No it is amied at those who are so quick to jump all over someone else who posted their dealing with a "talking to a FAA rep" and labeling them as a rat/snitch. I don't personally know Tom B. but for him to post that and say this should be turned in to the FAA takes BALLS. At my best guess upon reading many of his post/info, me thinks he is a standup guy. But I'm still waiting for the "he's a snitch" crowd to show up to bash him as they did Mr. Peek. QuoteSo If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? Yes. I'm sure the folks who took off in a 182 in beaver PA? that crashed didn't think anything of flying with a old jump pilot who lost his license due to medical, till they crashed.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #17 February 18, 2007 It's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #18 February 18, 2007 Tom. this is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. He's been doing this for years... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #19 February 18, 2007 Sorry, I didn't respond sooner.. I was with kids. What do you need to know??? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #20 February 18, 2007 so then.. what do you do?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites stratostar 5 #21 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1. If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a longtime "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3. You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got the dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp checks and other FAA biz. I find it hard to believe they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL and has been flying jumpers.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites deadbug 0 #22 February 18, 2007 If the FAA was aware that he was exercising the privileges of a commercial pilot with only a private lisc they would take swift action. If there was an accident he would be hung out to dry by not only the FAA but the lawyers in the civil suit that follows. Are there private pilots that can safely fly jumpers? I'm sure there are, but the question is is it legal. The regs are clear, it's not. Don't jump there if they can't follow that simple rule. Doug QuoteQuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1.If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3.You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp check. I find it hard to beleive they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #23 February 18, 2007 I don't jump there.. It's not in California.. as a RN.. you see that my work and moral ethic makes me feel that if there is something I know to make others safe and I fail to respond to that.. then I'm just as guilty if I committed the act that led to harm. I am a patient advocate completely. So as a skydiver..I don't have an issue today or any day of my life for standing up for what is right and what I believe can keep other's safe. Perhaps 'good ole boys' need to rethink some thoughts... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites JUDYJ 0 #24 February 18, 2007 Do you think the USPA doesn't check this stuff out?? I would've thought that being a USPA DZ they would keep up with that little bit of info... uh?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites icevideot 0 #25 February 18, 2007 QuoteStratostar, that is the best post rsponse ever! LMAO I happen to agree completely with Stratostar on this but I am not sure you understood what he said. If you will read it again you will see he agrees with going to the FAA on this. He was bashing the people who attack anyone who stands up against unsafe practices. I understand your willingness to fly in anything going but what if someone you love goes to make a tandem? I think people have a right to expect a professional operation. I have been in 1 full-blown stall and I am very grateful to have had a qualified pilot at the controls. If the pilot in this case is qualified let him prove it and earn the ratings."... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 6 Next Page 1 of 6 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. 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stratostar 5 #16 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt sounds like it is. More like " Not JUST aimed at you Tom". No it is amied at those who are so quick to jump all over someone else who posted their dealing with a "talking to a FAA rep" and labeling them as a rat/snitch. I don't personally know Tom B. but for him to post that and say this should be turned in to the FAA takes BALLS. At my best guess upon reading many of his post/info, me thinks he is a standup guy. But I'm still waiting for the "he's a snitch" crowd to show up to bash him as they did Mr. Peek. QuoteSo If there is a pilot that has been flying skydivers for a club for 25 years and does not have a com. lic. were are in danger?????????? Yes. I'm sure the folks who took off in a 182 in beaver PA? that crashed didn't think anything of flying with a old jump pilot who lost his license due to medical, till they crashed.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #17 February 18, 2007 It's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #18 February 18, 2007 Tom. this is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. He's been doing this for years... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #19 February 18, 2007 Sorry, I didn't respond sooner.. I was with kids. What do you need to know??? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #20 February 18, 2007 so then.. what do you do?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stratostar 5 #21 February 18, 2007 QuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1. If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a longtime "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3. You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got the dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp checks and other FAA biz. I find it hard to believe they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL and has been flying jumpers.you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
deadbug 0 #22 February 18, 2007 If the FAA was aware that he was exercising the privileges of a commercial pilot with only a private lisc they would take swift action. If there was an accident he would be hung out to dry by not only the FAA but the lawyers in the civil suit that follows. Are there private pilots that can safely fly jumpers? I'm sure there are, but the question is is it legal. The regs are clear, it's not. Don't jump there if they can't follow that simple rule. Doug QuoteQuoteIt's a USPA dropzone that takes money and operates taking anyone's money. No big surprise there. Quotethis is how I discovered that this dzo was only a private pilot. You asked to see it or looked it up? QuoteHe's been doing this for years... Again no big surprise there. Quoteso then.. what do you do?? Well that would depend on you. What do you think is right. 1.If you snitch to the FAA or USPA your a rat and will be baclkballed at many area DZ's and maybe worse things may be tried to shut you up or teach you a lesson for snitching. 2. If you tell the USPA, you only piss off "friends" of the DZO, they more then likely already know he has been doing this for years. The DZO may be a "member of good standing in the good old boy network". 3.You can keep your mouth shut and go on doing your thing at that dz or keep your trap shut and move on to another dz and not look back. 4. After you move on, you can tell others you know why you left, this is when you find out who are your real friends. 5. Now that you have posted this on the net, even if you don't do anything and someone else dose, everyone who knows you will think you got dzo busted and they will be pissed off at you for turning in their dope dealer. Now sit back and ask yourself, how many jumpers are at that dz, that have been jumping there for years, you really think your the first person to find this out? You really think the FAA don't know this DZO? if he has been in the biz for any amount of time, then the FAA has been there at some point to ramp check. I find it hard to beleive they (the FAA) don't know he only has a PPL. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #23 February 18, 2007 I don't jump there.. It's not in California.. as a RN.. you see that my work and moral ethic makes me feel that if there is something I know to make others safe and I fail to respond to that.. then I'm just as guilty if I committed the act that led to harm. I am a patient advocate completely. So as a skydiver..I don't have an issue today or any day of my life for standing up for what is right and what I believe can keep other's safe. Perhaps 'good ole boys' need to rethink some thoughts... IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JUDYJ 0 #24 February 18, 2007 Do you think the USPA doesn't check this stuff out?? I would've thought that being a USPA DZ they would keep up with that little bit of info... uh?? IF you are going to be Stupid - you better be tough! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
icevideot 0 #25 February 18, 2007 QuoteStratostar, that is the best post rsponse ever! LMAO I happen to agree completely with Stratostar on this but I am not sure you understood what he said. If you will read it again you will see he agrees with going to the FAA on this. He was bashing the people who attack anyone who stands up against unsafe practices. I understand your willingness to fly in anything going but what if someone you love goes to make a tandem? I think people have a right to expect a professional operation. I have been in 1 full-blown stall and I am very grateful to have had a qualified pilot at the controls. If the pilot in this case is qualified let him prove it and earn the ratings."... this ain't a Nerf world." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
