Is it possible to skyjump from an airliner?

[A-Train 0]

I am a newcomer to this forum and have never skyjumped. I have been doing research into elite commando operations, and have this question:

Is it conceivable possible to successfully jump out of the side cockpit window of a Boeing 757, given that the plane is slowed down to less than 200 knots, and at an altitude below 10,000 feet? Or would the wings or fuselage clip the jumper on his way down?

Here is a diagram of the plane I am talking about. Note the distance from the cockpit window to the bottom of the fuselage is no more than about ten feet:

http://www.757.org.uk/spec/images/fuse1.gif

Note I am not asking if this jump would be fun or advisable, only if it would be possible for trained professionals.

Thank you!

[darkwing 5]

how big is the window? I'd be really worried about wings, engines, and tails.

The word "possible" leaves room for an answer to be yes, even if the chance is 0.0000000000000000000001

Run down the aisle, blow open a rear door, and exit that way. It would look cooler on film anyway.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[A-Train 0]

Here is a link to a photo of the cockpit:

http://us.airliners.net/photos/middle/2/4/1/0685142.jpg

[DougH 270]

What an odd question!!!

Are you planning on bailing out after you plant a shoe bomb or something???

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[sundevil777 102]

It is a requirement that a pilot be able to escape the cockpit through that window in case the door to the cabin is blocked, like after a crash.

There is either a heavy rope with knots on it to help a person climb down, or what is called an inertia reel, which is a spool of wire with a big handle that you hold onto, the wire spool will let the pilot down at a controlled speed.

So, it is definitely big enough for even a somewhat fat pilot to get out, so a slim person with a small rig should be able.

People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am

[A-Train 0]

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What an odd question!!!

Are you planning on bailing out after you plant a shoe bomb or something???

No, but I'm researching if others may have done something like that.

[mnealtx 0]

Anyone want the over/under on hairyjuan or skinnyflyer coming back into SC with a theory of undercover operatives flying the planes on 9/11 and bailing out?

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Acoisa 0]

Nothings really impossible, but this will probably get you killed. Even at lowest TAS (true airspeed) you're still going at about 140kts.
You wouldn't even be able to get out of the window without ending up with your body trailing along the fuselage and yourself holding on to the window frame, at that point you probably won't be able to get back in, your only option will be to let go.
This will send you sliding along the fuselage towards either the vertical or horizontal stabilizer, which you will most probably hit.
If you manage to build a step and a handle outside of the cockpit, so that you can exit by actually jumping you will most probably hit the wing, or if you slip you might even get "stabbed" by the pitot tubes.

Weird idea dude. You might be able to do this with lots of preparation as a stunt of some sort, but I wouldn't know how you'd go about minimizing the risk....

[airtwardo 7]

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It is a requirement that a pilot be able to escape the cockpit through that window in case the door to the cabin is blocked, like after a crash.

There is either a heavy rope with knots on it to help a person climb down, or what is called an inertia reel, which is a spool of wire with a big handle that you hold onto, the wire spool will let the pilot down at a controlled speed.

So, it is definitely big enough for even a somewhat fat pilot to get out, so a slim person with a small rig should be able.

He's a better 757 pic to give scale and perspective...


I doubt it's possible 'cause I keep asking my wife if I can try....and she just replies S T F U !

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Loonix 0]

If hitting the wing is a problem, perhaps you can anchor a rope in the cockpit, and rapell out. I'd be a bit worried about the engine air-inlet though :) but if you're in the position to do this at all, i guess you could have had the pilot (you?:b) turn off one engine. I have no clue if this would work, but whatever you hit, you can avoid hitting it hard, at least.

and for the fbi guys watching: BOMB! PLANE! TERRORIST! .. yea, thats all.

[brettski74 0]

Based on a few rough calculations, at about 200 knots, I'm guessing that you're initial angle of departure once you release totally from the plane would be roughly 25 degrees below the horizontal, which seems to clear the wing and engine housing tidily, however, I've taken significant liberty in arriving at such a conclusion.

Basically, I've assumed that you're exiting in a poised position arching into the relative wind and have terminal velocity of around 120mph in a normal belly to earth attitude. At 200 knots (around 230mph), that would likely be difficult to do. I think you're more likely to tuck into a ball and therefore probably drop a bit faster, increasing your safety margin. Using the same logic, I think you'd need to be going at least 380knots (440mph) to have a hope of clipping the engine housing after exit.

Note that I'm ignoring any effects on the ariflow in that vicinity due to the intake for the turbofan. I have no idea how that will affect airflow at airspeed, but I understand that on the ground, there is a non-trivial danger area in front of the turbofan where you may be sucked in. I'd imagine that size of this region may be reduced at airspeed, but I'd be surprised if it was negated totally at such a relatively low airspeed for a jet.

Aside from the obvious "because I can" reasons and the kudos that may go to someone attempting this, I can't really see a lot of plusses. Very few skydivers actually own a 757 with which to try such a jump and they're probably not a very cost-effective jumpship.

Oh - this also comes with the standard disclaimer that I'm not qualified to give such advice and if you do happen to have your own 757 and choose to try this, you do this at your own risk/peril and should obtain independent expert advice before doing so.

[quade 4]

IF you were going to plan an operation like this, it would just be better to tell the person it was possible and let him die trying. IF he lives there is a chance of the leader being compromised. Dead men tell no tales.

IF you were planning on doing it yourself. There are easier ways of doing whatever it is you're trying to accomplish.

IF, on the other hand, this was only going to used in a book or movie plot . . . go for it. Who gives a shit if the odds aren't in favor of it being done? That's what makes things interesting.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Mr17Hz 1]

Here's an idea to work with:

Assuming that cabin pressure wasn't an issue... This could be done with a rope, repelling equipment, and a cutaway mechanism.

The rope could be secured inside the plane, The jumper could exit slowly around the corner with tention on the secured rope, and then slowly repel horizontally until he was safely behind the plane - at which point he could cutaway from the rope...; simulating a tailgate exit. At this point he's going to need to burn off speed - which could take a while; if he was not an experienced skydiver it would be best to add some kind of droge chute to help slow down the jumpers horizontal speed before deployment.

Using this method - the jumper could be sure to avoid hitting the wings at a high speed.

One problem that this might cause is that I don't know how HOT the air behind the plane gets. It would be a shame if everything was working fine except that all of the hair was burnt off the guys body and the ZP coating on the guys parachutes melted together.

Matt Christenson

mattchristenson@realskydiving.com
http://www.RealDropzone.com - A new breed of dropzone manifest software.

[quade 4]

Any idea of somehow "repelling" free and clear of the plane while in flight is flawed by the fact that the person would be pummeled to death by the wind repeatedly bashing him into the fuselage.

Repelling would only, in my estimation, make the entire endeavor much worse for the person attempting it and much more amusing to anyone else reading about it.

Sign the guy up for a Darwin Award for terrorists.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[RBM 1]

Still.. this has got to be one of the questionable questions asked here.

[Loonix 0]

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Any idea of somehow "repelling" free and clear of the plane while in flight is flawed by the fact that the person would be pummeled to death by the wind repeatedly bashing him into the fuselage.

According to another poster here, the plane could get down to 140kts (I have no idea if that is realistic, though).. do you think this would beat you to death if hanging by a rope? My quick forumsearch says propblast on the cessna easily feels like 90 knots, and you don't have any problems with that... So i figure even if you double that, you'll still live, if perhaps not able to hang on - but that's where the rope would come in.. Now I don't know any facts about those airspeeds :)


edit: A-train, go try it! I guess we'll read about it in the papers if it turns out one way or the other

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[DougH 270]

I suggest you search for the video of the guy at WFFC getting his main wrapped around the tail of his jump plane after a premie. Then reconsider the idea that some one can repel out of a moving jumbo-jet.

Hanging on a strut isn't even close to being the same as dangling on a rope.

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[quade 4]

Yes. At any normal flying speed the person would be pummeled to death.

This sort of thing occasionally happens to static line jumpers in MUCH slower aircraft and with much shorter distances to clear the aircraft.

Think about it. The person would have NO way of controlling themselves and the airstream would be continously trying to drive them as close to the aircraft as possible. The outside surface of the aircraft would be, for all practical purposes as slick as glass with no grip whatsoever and the slightest movements would cause the body to start spinning around the line attachment point.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Loonix 0]

but but.. I WANT TO BELIEVE!

ok, point taken. Now that you mention it, I've actually read a fatalityreport on an incident just like that.

[MakeItHappen 15]

Quote

I am a newcomer to this forum and have never skyjumped. I have been doing research into elite commando operations, and have this question:

Is it conceivable possible to successfully jump out of the side cockpit window of a Boeing 757, given that the plane is slowed down to less than 200 knots, and at an altitude below 10,000 feet? Or would the wings or fuselage clip the jumper on his way down?

Here is a diagram of the plane I am talking about. Note the distance from the cockpit window to the bottom of the fuselage is no more than about ten feet:

http://www.757.org.uk/spec/images/fuse1.gif

Note I am not asking if this jump would be fun or advisable, only if it would be possible for trained professionals.

Thank you!

If you pay me $1000.00 USD I'll run the calculations for you.
I already have a program that can do it.
see Collision Course

.

.
Make It Happen
Parachute History
DiveMaker

[floridadiver81 0]

ok..im going to say this..and i know it is based in a movie..but the theory is sound. Does anyone remember the movie Rambo First blood part 2? Specifically when he is jumping into vietnam with all his gear...his line gets stuck and he is repeatidly slammed against the aircraft...im thinking it would be the same type of setup.

"Age has absolutely nothing to do with knowledge, learning, respect, attitude, or personality." -yardhippie
"Fight the air, and the air will kick your ass!!! "-Specialkaye

[Eule 0]

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Note that I'm ignoring any effects on the ariflow in that vicinity due to the intake for the turbofan. I have no idea how that will affect airflow at airspeed, but I understand that on the ground, there is a non-trivial danger area in front of the turbofan where you may be sucked in.

The attached image is from Chapter 11 of the FAA's Advisory Circular AC65-9A. It shows that, on the ground, there is a "hazard area" in a 25 foot (about 8 m) radius in front of the intake. This area doesn't change size from idle to takeoff power settings. The "hazard area" behind the engine does get bigger with increased power settings.

I extracted the image from page 5 of the PDF that might be available at AC65-9A chapter 11. That link may not work - IMHO this is because the FAA's Web site is poorly designed. If the link is broken, you can probably go here and drill down to it: "Current ACs By Number", then click on "Next", then click on "AC65-9A", then on "Chapter 11.pdf".

Note that AC65-9A was last revised in 1976, so newer jet engines may differ.

Eule

PLF does not stand for Please Land on Face.

[billvon 3,070]

>The person would have NO way of controlling themselves and the
> airstream would be continously trying to drive them as close to the
>aircraft as possible.

Well, this would happen with floaters as well if you had zero experience. However, with some experience it becomes easier to brace yourself against the wind/prop blast.

I've rappelled off cliff faces in very stiff winds (40kts) and I've rappelled off other jumpers (going perhaps 30kts.) It feels very odd but is doable. In free air you can even use your body to orient yourself to the relative wind. I have a feeling doing it out of an airliner would be an issue of practice - if you rappel such that the wind was trying to drive you back into the plane, and you had your feet beneath you (which most rappellers generally do) you'd be in a similar situation as a rappeller on a lower-angle slope. The trick, I would think, would be to take up a position such that you were loaded towards your feet.

That being said, it would probably not be something you could get right on your first try.

[Acoisa 0]

BTW in 24 they did a similar thing which looked pretty cool. While still at cruising altitude the killer chick blows up the cabin door from the inside with c4 while sitting a few feet away from the door. The pressure difference between ambient air and the pressurized cabin goes up to 8 PSI.
By blowing the door open, she got sucked out with a big enough force to clear the 747.
She landed in the desert at night with a black parachute.
Of course that was mostly computer animated, but still was pretty cool!

[LongWayToFall 0]

You know, if there was still a pilot in control of the aircraft, you could have him roll inverted and apply down elevator, which would provide you some extra energy to clear the plane, and eventually you could hopefully have the aircraft in a nose vertical stall, and you would have no airspeed at all, increasing your chances of getting free of the airframe. During this time you might be able to get multiple people out. Not sure if a 757 can do that, but if possible it would be one heck of a ride! I think i will settle for watching video