Incident reports quoteing newspaper reports

[slug 1]

Hi Folks

In the spirit of cooperation I'm possting this in the skydiving forum rather than the incident forum.

Whats the point of posting links and quotes from news sources when there's a incident?

The news reports are written by reporters who don't have a clue about what their reporting when it involves a skydiving incident.

Wouldn't it make more sense to wait for someone from the DZ to report the facts and cut out the BS. We've recently seen some incidents that contain links to three different news reports that don't say squat about the real deal.

For those that feel the need for speed (to post) the say nothing news reports Post on

R.I.P.

R.I.P.

R.I.P.

[NWFlyer 2]

It's the nature of the beast with this era of instant information. People want information and they want it now. The press is often the first source of info - the people who are on the DZ are too busy dealing with the loss of a friend to post, and/or don't want to post for a variety of reasons.

The newspaper reports may not get it right, but I'd consider them no inherently less reliable than the "guy who heard it from his friend whose friend was at the DZ that day." Occasionally they even get it right.

I guess the theory is that some information is better than none; all of it together creates the whole picture. Some of it (the early reports - even directly from the DZ, some of the published reports, some of the secondhand accounts) has to be thrown out.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[quade 4]

Further . . . sometimes a drop zone owner and operation are so closely linked with their skydivers, a newspaper report is the ONLY indication to the rest of the world that something has happened.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[slotperfect 7]

You know, you have a really good point here. Out of fairness I will preface my comments by saying that I am not a fan of mainstream media, especially newspapers. I don't want to taint the conversation.

I think people post whatever's out there because that's all they know, and it validates that something happened, even though it's usually "they pulled all their cords and their shrouds got tangled."

I don't know that there is any really good way to report incidents here, and we often settle for what we can get. Patience is hard to muster, especially if you know someone that skydives where the incident took place.

Arrive Safely

John

[PhreeZone 20]

I get blasted all the time when I post in the incidents fourms since "We didn't want it talked about online" or some other excuse to not talk about an incident. Some people view it as bad press for their dropzone, others view it as a personal insult to their friend.

I've seen things hit the paper and never get talked about on here until someone links to it a few days or even weeks later.

Its kinda a running joke in the incidents fourm about "waiting for the final report". Guess what? Final reports are never posted here. I've been waiting on them to be posted for years and it has only occured maybe 1 time out of the hundred+ fatal accidents reported on here.

For me, I post incidents here to try and get the root details of incidents. I know the press is hardly ever right, but by getting it out there the real details usually end up coming out in the end.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[billvon 3,076]

>Whats the point of posting links and quotes from news sources when there's a incident?

Because if you don't, there are a dozen posts asking "What happened at Eloy? Did a tandem go in? Did a student go in? Why isn't anyone posting? Is there a cover-up?"

We encourage people to post first-hand or _reliable_ third-hand accounts (i.e. from a DZO, or an S+TA etc.) But often all that's available is a newspaper story, and honestly that's better than nothing. Removing such posts would be pointless since someone would read about the incident and post a "what happened at Eloy?" post minutes later. We simply don't have the resources to remove all "unauthorized" posts and research incidents enough to be able to post only verified information.

[jakee 1,563]

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I think people post whatever's out there because that's all they know, and it validates that something happened, even though it's usually "they pulled all their cords and their shrouds got tangled."

Yep. I see new posts with a newspaper report as a request for information really. The things that they (almost) always get right are X person died/ got broken at Y place on Z date. Once you know those three things it's a fair bet that someone else can fill in the details.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[cocheese 0]

I rarely go to that forum until there is a condolance thread in the bonfire. The posts piss me off so bad that I now wait until the smoke and cheap,cold speculation clears.

A person with 20 jumps doesn't need to be asking questions in that forum.

Also weird to see a member having that be their only post ever.

Too bad the whuffos go there for info also.

People: If you don't have anything educational to ad to incidents forum, then please refrain from posting there. It's really that simple.

[Orange1 0]

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A person with 20 jumps doesn't need to be asking questions in that forum.

Part of the function of the incidents forum is to learn from incidents. People with low jump numbers generally discover that they have a lot more to learn than they realised when they read some of the incidents. What, then, is wrong with asking questions that may prevent the same thing happening to them?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[DougH 270]

Quote

People: If you don't have anything educational to ad to incidents forum, then please refrain from posting there. It's really that simple.

Would you rather a new jumper not post "what is a horseshoe malfunction" in an incident thread, because he had his head up his ass during his first jump course, instead of admiting he is missing some key knowledge?

"The restraining order says you're only allowed to touch me in freefall"
=P

[cocheese 0]

Yes. There are better forums for questions like that. Also the student can do some research instead of getting in the way of finding out what happened.

I don't go there much because it's filled with nonsense most of the time. Not worth sifting through the BS.

Study why people die in this sport. But don't fill up a thread with irrelevent BS.

[mjosparky 4]

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A person with 20 jumps doesn't need to be asking questions in that forum.

Also the student can do some research instead of getting in the way of finding out what happened.

Incidents

A forum to report, discuss and learn from actual incidents.

My idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals

[Zing 2]

"Incidents

A forum to report, discuss and learn from actual incidents."

What he said. Else, why bother?

Zing Lurks

[bob.dino 1]

Quote

"Incidents

A forum to report, discuss and learn from actual incidents."

What he said. Else, why bother?

Exactly.

It's worth noting that many times the lessons learned are only tangentially related to the actual incident. Discussion brings up other issues that may be poorly understood by many jumpers.

Though not perfect, I think Incidents is a truely excellent forum.

[slug 1]

Quote

Quote

"Incidents

A forum to report, discuss and learn from actual incidents."

What he said. Else, why bother?

Exactly.

It's worth noting that many times the lessons learned are only tangentially related to the actual incident. Discussion brings up other issues that may be poorly understood by many jumpers.

Though not perfect, I think Incidents is a truely excellent forum.

Hi Dino

I just want to make myself clear the incident forum is a life saver. Some people paid a very high price to get on te forum, and the lessons learned from the factual info, discussions, safety procedures etc is priceless.

I'm sure the lessons learned from the incident forum have and will continue to save lives for those that are willing to learn from the factual info in the incident forum.

The reason I started the thread was because the quotes and links to the media which IMO add very little value from a learning standpoint.

The press reports from Bridge day are the latest example of misinformation Vs the info coming from the factual info provided by the base jumpers that were there.

I'm not a Mod, this isn't my websight I'm only a guest

R.I.P.