Trouble pulling toggles/ complete flare

[BelskyBlueEyes 0]

So maybe I have wimpy girl arms or something, but has anyone experienced trouble pulling the toggles all the way down to complete flare? I have only got through AFF 2, and partially because of this trouble ended up hardly flaring, crashing into a hill and sprained my foot. (very fortunate that I did not break anything). So now I am in early stages AFF and can't even jump for a few weeks. My approaches have not been that great yet, but if anything, you need to get that flare down, no questions asked!! Can anyone suggest anything for me? I am a bit nervous about my next jump because I did get slighty injured, but I do know most of it is due to flare problems. What can I do to overcome this??

[riggerrob 643]

"Flares like a girl" is the exact opposite of "skates like a girl."
Hint: look at Canadian scores at the last Winter Olympics.

Too many girls try to flare with their hands a long way out in front. This method only uses the triceps muscles, which are not very strong on any of us.

Next time, try practicing flaring by pulling your hands to your shoulders, then rotate your elbows up and press straight down your sides to your hips.
By pulling straight down your sides, you involve triceps, latimus dorsi and pectoral muscles.

My other piece of advice is to keep your eyes a lone way out in front, because it makes it easier to time your flare.

[ScottTX 0]

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So maybe I have wimpy girl arms or something, but has anyone experienced trouble pulling the toggles all the way down to complete flare? I have only got through AFF 2, and partially because of this trouble ended up hardly flaring, crashing into a hill and sprained my foot. (very fortunate that I did not break anything). So now I am in early stages AFF and can't even jump for a few weeks. My approaches have not been that great yet, but if anything, you need to get that flare down, no questions asked!! Can anyone suggest anything for me? I am a bit nervous about my next jump because I did get slighty injured, but I do know most of it is due to flare problems. What can I do to overcome this??

I made my 3rd AFF on September 30th, and although I dont have "wimpy girl arms" , I flew a great pattern according to my instructor, and started the landing flare but never got the toggles past the shoulders. I ended up making a hard landing, right on my tailbone, and bruised it badly. I am hardly the one to give you advice considering I obviously have difficultys with flaring. I believe that the blessings on this landing were that it had just rained the day before, so the field was muddy, but soft, and that I was able to walk away from it.

A couple of the instructors at the dz I noticed later were taking some students up to a stairway attached to the hangar.

The stairs have markings on it at the 5ft, 10ft and 15ft levels . Its difficult to describe but they have the students stand at the 15 ft mark, have their arms in the full up position, and have them repeatedly go down the stairs , the instructor beside them, calling out at the various marks, "shoulders (#1), chest (#2), and waist (#3), to signify the 1, 2, 3 landing flare. The students that I spoke with later said that it helped them to varying degrees.


IF you want to read about the nervousness I am experiencing before my next jump, I just posted in the General discussion thread titled "First jump after an injury", and believe me I am nervous.

Heal quickly and have a great jump!

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[Katherine 0]

maybe try to build up some strength in those arms. do some pull ups or lift a bit or weight or something?

x

Leeds University Skydiving Club
www.skydiveleeds.co.uk

[marybalfanz 0]

I recently posted about the exact same thing. I took the advice of one of my instructors, and lifted my elbows and pushed the toggles down instead of pulling; as a previous poster also advised.
That did help but I still have trouble getting them all the way down. I've started lifting weights to build up those muscles but haven't had a chance yet to see if it will help, but i'm guessing it will. Ask your instructors for advice and good luck.

[kkeenan 14]

You need to build up your strength in order to get the proper control. The techniques described already will help, but it sounds like you need additional conditioning for your upper body strength. There is probably a good gym in your town that can help you out with this.

_____________________________________
Dude, you are so awesome...
Can I be on your ash jump ?

[pilatus_p 0]

I had the same trouble and kept having to run landings out.

Then a tall bloke used the same rig and they extended the straps for him. They werent reset, and so when I pulled I suddenly found I had a chest-strap in my face.

However, the extra foot of travel I had in the brake lines gave me a lovely flare, and one of the guys suggested the brake lines needed resetting.

Having said all this I think it is more likely you are just a wimpy girly girl (pulls ponytail and runs off)

Ross

http://www.teamtechnology.co.uk/troll.htm

[lekstrom10k 0]

Consider what you are jumoing, a very de tuned canopy. look up and see how much slack is in the steering lines. If there is a big bow and takes 6 or 8 inches to make them taut maybe take wraps around your hands to take uo some of it.Your arms as is might not be long onough for a good flare from full up position.They were set that way so Mr Macho cant impress his instructor with how far down he can pull. the only impression is the one he makes on the ground Once you are beyond half brakes and the canopy slows down the rest should be easie.r

[JohnMitchell 16]

Like several have said, keep your hands close to your body as you flare. That's where you have the most muscle. As you flare to chest level, put your elbows up and push the toggles all the way down to your thighs.

Also, go to the gym.
Hope your sprain is all better, too.

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[stanlholmes 0]

First of all, please don't take advice from me. I'm very new. That being said, here's what I did. . . .

After reading Brian Germain's (spelling??) book and article about slow speed flying, I got under canopy and tried to stall mine. I found out I could bury the toggles all the way down and still not get it to stall. Someone suggested I try wrapping one "handful" of brake line. I did and it worked perfectly. My landings have improved now that I can really slow the canopy down. I know I should probably get the lines re-rigged and I'll get to that eventually, but it works great now. If your issue isn't strength, but technique, talk to the instructors at your dz about this.

Stan

[BelskyBlueEyes 0]

I definitely believe strengthening my triceps is the way to go for me. I for some odd reason have always had weak triceps, even trainers over the years had told me so. I need to get back to routine at the gym and I think using the cable pull downs is a good way to practice flares- right? Wouldn't that be the closest thing to the real deal?

I did practice flares in the playground area, and even then was struggling to get toggles down, but did accomplish after a few tries. I know I dont have the option of letting up and pulling again when I am in landing, so I need to be SURE I can pull all the way first time. I thought I was pulling in close to my body as mentioned, but the instructor told me my arms were out more to the side. I will have to concentrate better on doing that.

I am concerned because the flare took me by surprise, I knew I was coming in fast and I was definitely not in tune with the timing of that. That has scared me. I nearly came in with no flare at all. I think I was trying to flare but I was so low at that point I didnt even have time to follow through. How can my mind be so distracted at such an important time? I did land uphill, so maybe that toyed with my perspective??

[Jumpah 0]

Working out is a great idea! Someday you come will be on final and you'll flare but not much happens...the ground is still coming up fast. Your feet will pound in and you'll have to run like hell to stay upright. A few hours a week in the gym doing a total body workout can make a huge difference in how much damage (if any) you sustain from this. If you tumble, stronger muscles protect bones and help keep limbs pointed in the right directions.

I'm really interested in a trainer answering these questions (in addition to everyone else). A (serious) "Skydiver's Training Program" would be quite welcomed.

[davelepka 4]

Many other have already hit the nail on the head with regards to keeping your hands in close, getting your elbows up, and taking advantage of the increased leverage you'll get.

A couple of add-on ideas, under canopy be sure to conserve your energy for your flare. Try to use arms as little as possible, and keep them rested up for the flare.

Also, just some simple push-ups will help with this. You can do a handful every day, and build the nuber up as you go. It will only take a mintue or two, but it will pay off if you do it every day (maybe lay off or a day or two before a jumping day).

Soon enough your strength will come up, and as you progress, your instructors should be putting you on a smaller canopy, that'll be easier to flare (of course you need to demonstrate that you can land the current one first). Good luck.

[mdrejhon 8]

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I definitely believe strengthening my triceps is the way to go for me. I for some odd reason have always had weak triceps, even trainers over the years had told me so. I need to get back to routine at the gym and I think using the cable pull downs is a good way to practice flares- right? Wouldn't that be the closest thing to the real deal?

Many good suggestions in this thread.

(exercise is good -- start gentle -- if you're that weak, sometimes you have to ramp it up sooooo gently - for an excessively weak muscle, often surprisingly 1 set lasting a few seconds is all you need at the beginning and you can call it a day for that particular muscle, and make sure you fuel yourself with good nutrition before and after your exercise (diet can be a tricky matter, but bottom line, your muscle needs fuel). Then it may work miracles ramping up in a future week. Some trainers are too aggressive at the beginning and a certain muscle won't progress because it was unexpectedly worn out after only a few minutes of exercise... Hopefully you have a good trainer that knows good training procedures for weak-than-normal muscles. Wonders can be done. After all, you only need a few seconds of really strong flare strength.)

I would ask you to ask your instructor to allow you plenty of time, maybe even a little bit extra altitude, on your next jump to pratice flaring while flying under your canopy up high. Watch arm position close to your body as your instructor says. Pace them out so you don't tire out prematurely. Wait for a non-rushed not-too-windy day so the instructor and radio guys can really concentrate on you...

[GPSJane 0]

I have had the exact same problem only my arms are uneven so I usually end up flaring unevenly. I have taken a few tumbles like that I can tell you!

Holding your arms close and pushing down helps but I found my elbows were also giving me trouble. I have started to exercise my arms at gym and also visited a physio who has given me exercises to do and it is starting to help.

If it makes you feel any better; I did my 101st jump the other day right after my 100th. Since I didn't want to fall on my 100th (for obvious reasons) I landed perfectly but then on the next one I didn't flare at the right time and landed really hard on my coccyx!

I am definley going to start landing better cos my bum can't take any more of that.

Only skydivers know why the birds sing; they don't have to pack a parachute!

[mrGuy 0]

As stated above, by "pushing" down with your arms close to your sides you'll eliminate the strength problem. You have strong arms...you just aren't using them completely. if you needed to lift a 20lb weight, wouldn't you have better luck lifting it close to your body?

Also, practice the PLF...its amazing how fast you can hit the ground and stand up completely fine, without so much as a bruised elbow.

I demonstrated a PLF last weekend to a friend....off a picnic table, from a standing position....it was a thing of beauty! freaked her out! (btw: I'm no young kid...PLF's are great)

Hope your leg heals up nicely

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