Jumping through clouds

[skreamer 1]

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Here in U.K everybody jumps in cloudy weather.

By your own admittance you've only ever jumped at one dropzone in the UK so what are you basing this generalization on?

Have you not seen this BPA warning poster?

http://www.bpa.org.uk/safetydocs/Cloud%20poster.pdf

[Mikko 0]

Please, let the people who know me and coach me (i.e local canopy experts.) do the judgment, they can and will stop me jumping my canopy if they feel it's necessary.
If they don't, they will do their best to coach me in a way that I'll be flying safe. And I'll train enough to fly safe and not to risk anyone elses, or my own safety.

Thanks.
Blue Swoops
Mikko

(Dereck, explanations are never short. I sent you a private message.)

[Lok 0]

I have seen the poster and also Section 8 of operational manual of BPA:

3.1. Cloud

Parachutists may not leave the aircraft if, at the point of exit, the ground between the opening point and the intended landing area is not visible.



'MAY' means that is not mandatory for someone to not jump.

In UK if you want to jump frequently, you must jump with Clouds in the skies, which is fantastic and very Funny.

[Fast 0]

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Please, let the people who know me and coach me (i.e local canopy experts.) do the judgment, they can and will stop me jumping my canopy if they feel it's necessary.
If they don't, they will do their best to coach me in a way that I'll be flying safe. And I'll train enough to fly safe and not to risk anyone elses, or my own safety.

Thanks.
Blue Swoops
Mikko

(Dereck, explanations are never short. I sent you a private message.)

I have responded to your PM but here is something for everyone to go back and read in regards to "I have expert coaches teaching me expertly" That thread was just one that came to mind quickly. There are others I just don't feel like digging them up. Page through the incidents forum. I am sure you can find them. Or maybe ron could point a few out.

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=1125536;

~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka

[matthewcline 0]

"MAY NOT"

It means NO.

Doesn't look to me like it is optional, just becuase it is done "normally" because of the weather pattern doesn't make it legal (as an association can't be a legal rep but a Gov Organization can, I do not know what the UK version of the FAA is called).

I could use the whole friends jumping off a bridge analogy but it was made up pre-BASE.

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[kelpdiver 2]

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3.1. Cloud

Parachutists may not leave the aircraft if, at the point of exit, the ground between the opening point and the intended landing area is not visible.

'MAY' means that is not mandatory for someone to not jump.

I know our English languages have diverged, but I think you're kidding yourself here just because it used the word 'may' instead of 'must.'

[RkyMtnHigh 0]

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3.1. Cloud

Parachutists may not leave the aircraft if, at the point of exit, the ground between the opening point and the intended landing area is not visible.

'MAY' means that is not mandatory for someone to not jump.

I know our English languages have diverged, but I think you're kidding yourself here just because it used the word 'may' instead of 'must.'

May vs Must is the same as Recommendation vs Requirement in the SIM...many get confused with the difference until they take the C license test

_________________________________________

[skreamer 1]

I think an instructor at your dropzone needs to sit down with you and explain a couple of things. From a previous post :

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But the jumpmaster is typical with the exit separation, and nobody trucks, so the possibility for accident is nearly zero.

Also the cloud elevation must be at least 5000ft so everybody have clear view before pull at 2000-2500ft or 5000ft for AFF students and tandems.

Now I understand that English is not your first language but I still cannot understand the 'nobody tracks' bit. And regarding the second part, it is very important that everyone in the group has visual contact at breakoff. Typically this is around '5 000, breaking off in cloud at this altitude and higher is very bad. Also, I would suggest that the average deployment altitude for experienced skydivers is between 3000' and 3500'.

I am not picking on you, but the incorrect opinions that you put forward as fact are causing concern. Bear in mind the inexperienced jumpers following these forums.

Thank you.

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[Remster 30]

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May vs Must is the same as Recommendation vs Requirement in the SIM...many get confused with the difference until they take the C license test

Are you serious about what "may not" means?

Remster

[bob.dino 1]

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May vs Must is the same as Recommendation vs Requirement in the SIM...many get confused with the difference until they take the C license test

May = you can if you want.
May Not = you must not.

Here endth the english lesson.

[Katherine 0]

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'MAY' means that is not mandatory for someone to not jump.reply]

Think back to school...
"Please CAN I go to the toilet?"
"Yes, you CAN, but no, you MAY not untill the end of class."

Leeds University Skydiving Club
www.skydiveleeds.co.uk

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[Lok 0]

When I mean Nobody tracks, I mean Nobody tracks before the cloud level at about 5000ft.
After this level everybody can track or not and deploy his chute.
As far as I know the majority of local jumpers at my homedropzone and me deploy always below 3000ft.....normally 2500ft, sometimes 2000ft.
For FS groops 4-way, 8-way, the break-off is at 4000ft sometimes 3500ft.

For sure you have some problem with me but I really don't care AT THE MOMENT...

Otherwise the problem you have with me, must not push you to give incorrect opinions in this forum. Bear in mind that 'inexperienced' jumpers' following these forums.

For all the other comments and people, thank you very much for the English lessons, I much appreciate it.

So, if MAY NOT, means NOT, then all the CCI of the 25-26 Skydiving centers-clubs in U.K must go to prison (at least 150 years each), All the Skydiving activities must stopped in U.K right now and for ever, because are ILLEGAL, because if we wait in U.K the skies to clear from clouds, then we must WAIT, wait, wait, WAIT, wait , wait.......and so on....

By the way, the photo in the poster of BPA:
http://www.bpa.org.uk/safetydocs/Cloud%20poster.pdf is very funny, because as far as I can see the weather IS PERFECT!!!!

[simplyputsi 0]

I don't see anything wrong with the weather in the picture. There is clearly a hole at least a mile long.

Skymama's #2 stalker -

[Stevetaylor 0]

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3.1. Cloud

Parachutists may not leave the aircraft if, at the point of exit, the ground between the opening point and the intended landing area is not visible.

'MAY' means that is not mandatory for someone to not jump.

"may not" = "don't do it", IMHO

Steve

I know our English languages have diverged, but I think you're kidding yourself here just because it used the word 'may' instead of 'must.'

The definition of insanity is to keep doing things the same way, but then to expect different results. -Einstein

[kevinwhelan 0]

A video to show what the Irish think of "cloud bustin"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I-tnXHBkDrI

"be honest with yourself. Why do I want to go smaller? It is not going to make my penis longer." ~Brian Germain, on downsizing

[kelpdiver 2]

that wasn't cloud busting - they were a very loose FF group (30-40ft +) and could still see each other.

[Vlad 0]

In Russia we can and do jump through the clouds. there is one requirement: the bottom of clouds must be higher than the opening point.
Jumping through clouds is much fun !! Everyone who says he will never jump through clouds is plain stup,,, I mean narrominded !

[mdrejhon 8]

Been to 8 dropzones now, and sometimes some will jump through, um, very thick industrial haze (won't go into which dropzones) - if the plane empties, I'm usually going. I'm far more concerned about how thick the low visibility is, low visibility at breakoff altitude, and low visibility at pull time, and massive availability of safe outs if the GPS spot is bad. Oh, and whether the dropzone has a history of enroaching air traffic.

However, I've also landed with the plane too, because of clouds. I prefer, though, they turn it into a hop and pop rather than landing. I've jumped out of a Twin Otter at 2500 feet

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[NWPoul 1]

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In Russia we can and do jump through the clouds. there is one requirement: the bottom of clouds must be higher than the opening point.
Jumping through clouds is much fun !! Everyone who says he will never jump through clouds is plain stup,,, I mean narrominded !

+1!
Just can't understand, how can anyone keep himself from jumping in THIS?

Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly?

[jakee 1,489]

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Just can't understand, how can anyone keep himself from jumping in THIS?

Fo' Sho'!!

Nothing beats the views you get in that gleaming, pristine white playground above the clouds - especially when you know its yucky and grey for everyone on the ground

Very nice photos BTW, #5 is one to mount on your wall

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Dolph 0]

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In Russia we can and do jump through the clouds. there is one requirement: the bottom of clouds must be higher than the opening point.
Jumping through clouds is much fun !! Everyone who says he will never jump through clouds is plain stup,,, I mean narrominded !

I got a shitload of your Russian clouds. Being hit by the same drop of rain twice was rather interesting.

Being beaten bloody in the process sucked. Not having a clue where the 20 others were sucked in a major way.

Surviving that mess was very uplifting.

[NWPoul 1]

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Just can't understand, how can anyone keep himself from jumping in THIS?

Fo' Sho'!!

Nothing beats the views you get in that gleaming, pristine white playground above the clouds - especially when you know its yucky and grey for everyone on the ground

You just ged the point here!
In such moment I allways remember the episode from "Matrix: revolution" when Trinity and Neo get above the black sky and saw the Sun

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Very nice photos BTW, #5 is one to mount on your wall

Not a big fan of myself

Why drink and drive, if you can smoke and fly?

[JohanW 0]

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In Russia we can and do jump through the clouds. there is one requirement: the bottom of clouds must be higher than the opening point.
Jumping through clouds is much fun !! Everyone who says he will never jump through clouds is plain stup,,, I mean narrominded !

One word: TRAFFIC.

On my DZ, below those clouds be gliders.

Johan.
I am. I think.