WooHoo 0 #1 June 29, 2006 When I was around the 20 jump number, I had a coach jump to learn to track. At the apointed time I tracked, (like a sea lion gliding up a shingle beach) and though I did not make much lateral distance, I stayed with the plan. I locked on, waved off and deployed. (it was a school G3 with a Spectre 210) nothing happened for a the first 2 seconds of the count, then the deployment began, and was fine. Upon landing my instructor told me I had what looked like a possible bag lock on the first stow, though it cleared itself. In fact he went to the packer and gave him a hard word, about the stow. My question is had I cutaway, would there be enough drag ro enable the RSL to pull the reserve. I know from my EP's to pull red then pull silver. I rehearse before EVERY jump. So this is somewhat academic, Is there a situation (other than PC in tow) where there would not be enough drag to have the RSL work. " I live my life by the rules. Wait a minute I make the rules, so what am I worrying about" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #2 June 29, 2006 QuoteIs there a situation (other than PC in tow) where there would not be enough drag to have the RSL work. Any situation in which there is not enough drag to clear your risers from your harness would mean that the RSL would not work. I don't really see how if you had enough drag to clear your risers that there wouldn't be enough drag to clear your RSL as well.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bentonu2 0 #3 June 29, 2006 Is there a situation (other than PC in tow) where there would not be enough drag to have the RSL work. Yes: 1/ A total malfuction with nothing out, 2/ If the RSL was not connected, and I'm sure there is more because as in Murphy's law anything will and dose happen so therefore anything can happen, as in any situation that requires a cutaway! then will also require "YOU" pulling the reserve handle, in the correct sequence, and don't ever wait for the RSL to do the job for you. In any situation that requires you to pull the reserve handle, "YOU" pull the handle! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Yossarian 0 #4 June 29, 2006 i was looking at different kinds of container the other day on the internet (dreaming of the day i can afford a rig...) and saw the option of an rsl for teardrop containers and wondered how that works as the pin(s) for the reserve are against your back, someone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) basically what im getting at is with a teardrop, if you had a grip on the reserve handle and cutaway, would that grip slow down the rsl? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gofast_ER 0 #5 June 29, 2006 I don't know what these other responses are about. I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. Being it was my 32nd jump and 1st malfunction I couldn't really think straight. I went for my cutaway first (even though I obviously didn't need to). As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle.I may not agree with what you have to say but i'll defend to the death your right to say it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites billvon 3,075 #6 June 29, 2006 >I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites marks 0 #7 June 29, 2006 Quote>I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. it is a good thing he didnt go straight to his reserve, because the pilotchute in tow cleared. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #8 June 30, 2006 Quotei was looking at different kinds of container the other day on the internet (dreaming of the day i can afford a rig...) and saw the option of an rsl for teardrop containers and wondered how that works as the pin(s) for the reserve are against your back, someone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) basically what im getting at is with a teardrop, if you had a grip on the reserve handle and cutaway, would that grip slow down the rsl? It's gonna work like any other RSL except the RWS RSL. Most RSL's have a lanyard with a ring on one end and the snap shackle on the other. The ring goes around the reserve cable at some point and pulls on the cable in both directions at once, (from the ring to the handle, and from the ring to the pin). I believe that is one reason why some TSO tests require that reserve ripcords used with RSL's have to be tested to twice the limits of standard systems, i.e. 600lbs vs 300lbs. The RWS RSL on the other hand has the RSL pulling the the pin directly, while the reserve handle had no pin on the end, but instead a special fitting that encircles the pin. I've not heard a great explanation for why it is this way, but it makes it harder to remove or install an RSL on a Vector. If the rig wasn't ordered with one in the first place it either has to go back to the factory (or be modified with a more standard system) and if it was ordered with one, and the jumper wished to have it removed they will have to obtain a new reserve handle. Not bad things, but just different.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gofast_ER 0 #9 June 30, 2006 QuoteQuote>I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. it is a good thing he didnt go straight to his reserve, because the pilotchute in tow cleared. Ok my bad. I mixed up my 2 malfunctions. They were a week apart from each other. The 2nd happend because I was so jumpy from my pc in tow. Infact, the 2nd really wasn't a mal but I had cut it away anyway because of how jumpy I was. When I had my pc in tow I did pull my cutaway but then my reserve handle too. My bridle was stuck. Not going anywhere. I had accidently misrouted it. No way in hell was it going anywhere. The 2nd one I kept spinning after opending. I couldn't think straight enough to realize what was going on so i ditched it. Only then I land and someone (that someone was jim wallace) shows me that I had one brake stowed and the other stowed. I felt like a jackass. But atleast I felt. Since then, no malfunctions. I may not agree with what you have to say but i'll defend to the death your right to say it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites damion75 0 #10 June 30, 2006 Quotesomeone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) Quote[It's gonna work like any other RSL except the RWS RSL. Actually I had heard the same thing, although since I have never seen an RSL on a Teardrop I can neither confirm nor deny - perhaps this is why they are so rare?! I tried to check the TSE website but can't access it as I don't have flash software. If true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... Is there anyone out there from the company who can give the lowdown truth on the TSE RSL system?*************** Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kevinwhelan 0 #11 June 30, 2006 QuoteActually I had heard the same thing, although since I have never seen an RSL on a Teardrop I can neither confirm nor deny - perhaps this is why they are so rare?! I tried to check the TSE website but can't access it as I don't have flash software. If true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... Is there anyone out there from the company who can give the lowdown truth on the TSE RSL system? I am not from the company, but jump a teardrop on which I have had 3 cutaways with an rsl attached. The lanyard goes from the reserve pin and has an eye in the other end . the reserve ripcord is first passed through this eye and then into the housing to the reserve loop. when the risers depart the rsl pulls the reserve ripcord directly. On all of my mals I had a grip on the reserve handle. I pulled the handle each time but would say I could have been beaten by the rsl. I never felt anything to suggest that the handle was pulled in a dangerous way, but rather the eye on the lanyard just slipped off over the end of the reserve ripcord. Now I don't know what would happen if I didn't have the handle in my hand> Would the rsl pull the handle with it, or would the velcro hold it because of the direction of the pull? I would be interested to know if there is any reliable way to test this on the ground. "be honest with yourself. Why do I want to go smaller? It is not going to make my penis longer." ~Brian Germain, on downsizing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites bch7773 0 #12 June 30, 2006 Quote I would be interested to know if there is any reliable way to test this on the ground.\ when you are due for your next reserve repack, try it. and 3 mals in 99 jumps? MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites diablopilot 2 #13 June 30, 2006 QuoteIf true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... I don't think you quite picture it.....imagin having a ripcord laying on a table. No pick it up with two finger in the middle of it's length. That's essentialy how the ring of a standard RSL pulls on the cable. The handle won't be going anywhere when on the rig as it's stowed in the pocket, and if it weren't, the RSL would be trying to pull it back into the pocket.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites smiler 0 #14 July 17, 2006 QuoteThe handle won't be going anywhere when on the rig as it's stowed in the pocket, and if it weren't, the RSL would be trying to pull it back into the pocket. On something like a Javelin or any similar setup where the RSL goes around the cable near the back of the neck, yes. But on a TearDrop, the RSL goes around the reserve ripcord next to the handle, at the end of the housing, on the left of the jumper's torso. There's nowhere else for it to go...www.wingin-it.co.uk Wingin' It wingsuit school Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. 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Yossarian 0 #4 June 29, 2006 i was looking at different kinds of container the other day on the internet (dreaming of the day i can afford a rig...) and saw the option of an rsl for teardrop containers and wondered how that works as the pin(s) for the reserve are against your back, someone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) basically what im getting at is with a teardrop, if you had a grip on the reserve handle and cutaway, would that grip slow down the rsl? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gofast_ER 0 #5 June 29, 2006 I don't know what these other responses are about. I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. Being it was my 32nd jump and 1st malfunction I couldn't really think straight. I went for my cutaway first (even though I obviously didn't need to). As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle.I may not agree with what you have to say but i'll defend to the death your right to say it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,075 #6 June 29, 2006 >I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
marks 0 #7 June 29, 2006 Quote>I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. it is a good thing he didnt go straight to his reserve, because the pilotchute in tow cleared. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #8 June 30, 2006 Quotei was looking at different kinds of container the other day on the internet (dreaming of the day i can afford a rig...) and saw the option of an rsl for teardrop containers and wondered how that works as the pin(s) for the reserve are against your back, someone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) basically what im getting at is with a teardrop, if you had a grip on the reserve handle and cutaway, would that grip slow down the rsl? It's gonna work like any other RSL except the RWS RSL. Most RSL's have a lanyard with a ring on one end and the snap shackle on the other. The ring goes around the reserve cable at some point and pulls on the cable in both directions at once, (from the ring to the handle, and from the ring to the pin). I believe that is one reason why some TSO tests require that reserve ripcords used with RSL's have to be tested to twice the limits of standard systems, i.e. 600lbs vs 300lbs. The RWS RSL on the other hand has the RSL pulling the the pin directly, while the reserve handle had no pin on the end, but instead a special fitting that encircles the pin. I've not heard a great explanation for why it is this way, but it makes it harder to remove or install an RSL on a Vector. If the rig wasn't ordered with one in the first place it either has to go back to the factory (or be modified with a more standard system) and if it was ordered with one, and the jumper wished to have it removed they will have to obtain a new reserve handle. Not bad things, but just different.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gofast_ER 0 #9 June 30, 2006 QuoteQuote>I had a pilot chute in tow on my 32nd jump. >As soon as I pulled the cutaway pillow the rsl activated and my >reserve opend before I could even start to pull the reserve handle. You might be mixing up your terms here. A PC in tow means the main is still in the container; it cannot deploy the reserve via an RSL. You may have meant a bag lock, in which case the main PC may have enough drag to pull the RSL and open the reserve. (may not be true if the PC is collapsed.) You may have meant that you pulled the first handle on an SOS system; some systems have two SOS handles that seem like a regular rig, but both cut away the main and open the reserve. Also, you may have looked back, seen a PC in tow, looked away (and had the main deploy) and then cut away, resulting in an RSL-deployed reserve. it is a good thing he didnt go straight to his reserve, because the pilotchute in tow cleared. Ok my bad. I mixed up my 2 malfunctions. They were a week apart from each other. The 2nd happend because I was so jumpy from my pc in tow. Infact, the 2nd really wasn't a mal but I had cut it away anyway because of how jumpy I was. When I had my pc in tow I did pull my cutaway but then my reserve handle too. My bridle was stuck. Not going anywhere. I had accidently misrouted it. No way in hell was it going anywhere. The 2nd one I kept spinning after opending. I couldn't think straight enough to realize what was going on so i ditched it. Only then I land and someone (that someone was jim wallace) shows me that I had one brake stowed and the other stowed. I felt like a jackass. But atleast I felt. Since then, no malfunctions. I may not agree with what you have to say but i'll defend to the death your right to say it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
damion75 0 #10 June 30, 2006 Quotesomeone told me that it works by the lanyard going directly to the reserve handle and pulling it for you (either the handle itself or the cable in the area of the handle, i couldnt work it out) Quote[It's gonna work like any other RSL except the RWS RSL. Actually I had heard the same thing, although since I have never seen an RSL on a Teardrop I can neither confirm nor deny - perhaps this is why they are so rare?! I tried to check the TSE website but can't access it as I don't have flash software. If true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... Is there anyone out there from the company who can give the lowdown truth on the TSE RSL system?*************** Not one shred of evidence supports the theory that life is serious - look at the platypus. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevinwhelan 0 #11 June 30, 2006 QuoteActually I had heard the same thing, although since I have never seen an RSL on a Teardrop I can neither confirm nor deny - perhaps this is why they are so rare?! I tried to check the TSE website but can't access it as I don't have flash software. If true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... Is there anyone out there from the company who can give the lowdown truth on the TSE RSL system? I am not from the company, but jump a teardrop on which I have had 3 cutaways with an rsl attached. The lanyard goes from the reserve pin and has an eye in the other end . the reserve ripcord is first passed through this eye and then into the housing to the reserve loop. when the risers depart the rsl pulls the reserve ripcord directly. On all of my mals I had a grip on the reserve handle. I pulled the handle each time but would say I could have been beaten by the rsl. I never felt anything to suggest that the handle was pulled in a dangerous way, but rather the eye on the lanyard just slipped off over the end of the reserve ripcord. Now I don't know what would happen if I didn't have the handle in my hand> Would the rsl pull the handle with it, or would the velcro hold it because of the direction of the pull? I would be interested to know if there is any reliable way to test this on the ground. "be honest with yourself. Why do I want to go smaller? It is not going to make my penis longer." ~Brian Germain, on downsizing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bch7773 0 #12 June 30, 2006 Quote I would be interested to know if there is any reliable way to test this on the ground.\ when you are due for your next reserve repack, try it. and 3 mals in 99 jumps? MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #13 June 30, 2006 QuoteIf true, it seems like a great way to lose fingers / teeth as the handle comes out propelled by your departing main... I don't think you quite picture it.....imagin having a ripcord laying on a table. No pick it up with two finger in the middle of it's length. That's essentialy how the ring of a standard RSL pulls on the cable. The handle won't be going anywhere when on the rig as it's stowed in the pocket, and if it weren't, the RSL would be trying to pull it back into the pocket.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
smiler 0 #14 July 17, 2006 QuoteThe handle won't be going anywhere when on the rig as it's stowed in the pocket, and if it weren't, the RSL would be trying to pull it back into the pocket. On something like a Javelin or any similar setup where the RSL goes around the cable near the back of the neck, yes. But on a TearDrop, the RSL goes around the reserve ripcord next to the handle, at the end of the housing, on the left of the jumper's torso. There's nowhere else for it to go...www.wingin-it.co.uk Wingin' It wingsuit school Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
