Deployment altitude

[WeakMindedFool 0]

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and there was no way most mains these days would be inflated and flying by 2600 where his flatline was set

That is a pretty broad statement, do have any idea what his main is?
Sparky

Ok...you're right. Still the question stands. Would you suggest someone chop a main that wasn't malfunctioning...yet?

Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves.
-Eric Hoffer -
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[Chrisky 0]

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Still the question stands. Would you suggest someone chop a main that wasn't malfunctioning...yet?

Simple answer: When passing through his HARD DECK, definitely.
You don't want to burn through the hard deck just to find out that it is a malfunction and you could have chopped on time.

Where you set your hard deck is another matter.

The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open.
From the edge you just see more.
... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ...

[cvfd1399 0]

Even when my freefall speeds are 129-174 mph belly to earth?

[tombuch 0]

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I'm suprised to see so many people saying they break off at a certain altitude, and pull 1000 feet lower. At belly speeds that is only five seconds to turn, track, clear airspace, reach, and pull. If the posters here can do all that in five seconds with only about 100 jumps, then I am impressed.

Good point Dan. The USPA suggestion is to break off 1,500 feet above the highest planned opening altitude for groups of 5 or fewer, and 2,000 feet above the highest opening altitude for groups of six or more.

I generally pull between 2,000 and 2,500 feet (4,700 jumps, "D" license, fast opening main), so I like to break at about 4,000 - 4,500 feet.

Many folks on my RW loads like to open at 3,000-3,500, as seems common from this thread, so I generally request a group break off in the range of 5,000 feet. Lot's of jumpers have been complaining about it. I actually wrote a feature for The Ranch web site that addresses the issue of break off and opening altitudes. It will be posted at: http://ranchskydive.com/safety/index.htm soon, but in the mean time I've attached it as a Microsoft RTF file. It's an interesting concept worth thinking about.

Tom Buchanan
Instructor Emeritus
Comm Pilot MSEL,G
Author: JUMP! Skydiving Made Fun and Easy

[Darius11 12]

Pulling at 4,000ft, hard deck at 2,500ft.

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[ps5601 0]

It may be good in theory to break off 1500ft above your planned deployment altitude for groups above 6, but in practice often does not happen, and isn't overly practical.

In a competition the standard exit altitude for 8-way is 12,500 to 13,000. You have 50 seconds working time, which takes you down to around 4 grand. I then turn and track for 6 or 7 seconds before pulling just under 3 grand. There is no team I know who will break off early in a competition.

I have also done a lot of bigways. Even on 50+ formations break off is still only 5000ish. While low time jumpers should not be thinking of such low break offs (or groups of this size), for experienced people who can track correctly I don't consider these altitudes to be unreasonably low.

It may be just my imagination, but a lot of people are now able to track much further with less loss of altitude than in the past (although I still too many crucifix trackers, or people tracking with bent legs).

Blue Skies

Paul

[BETO74 0]

I was thinking the same thing, how about how is your tracking have you done enough tracking jumps to say you lose litle altitude tracking or you sank your dive and loose 500 feet, I seen people while I do video that their believe their tracking but their not only dive too much but their not move foward at all, dangerous for me doing the video. I seen freefliers deployng while tracking they slow down so much, I still dont think waiting to slow down and getting low is a good think to do I rather spend that time flat tracking.

http://web.mac.com/ac057a/iWeb/AC057A/H0M3.html

[JustRelax 0]

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I break by 4500, pull at 3500. I have just over 100 jumps and I want the extra time to react if I see something unusual above my head.

Me too. If I'm doing RW I try and influence the group to break at 4,500. If i'm late to the plane and the decision is made at 4,000 then I'll go with it, but will try and get to pull without such a pause to level out of the track.

________________________________________
Taking risk is part of living well - it's best to learn from other peoples mistakes, rather than your own.

[adamUK 3]

man, the higher the better. 5k+ if I can persuade the jump master & CCI to let me. I just dig the canopy ride...

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[Darius11 12]

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man, the higher the better. 5k+ if I can persuade the jump master & CCI to let me. I just dig the canopy ride...

Dude i know how you feel i love that shit more then any thing

I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain

[lug 4]

On a work jumps, AFF, main or reserve side I usually throw out on average at 2500.
On fun jumps either belly or free flying I like to be in the saddle between 3000 to 2500. This gives me time to evaluate the congestion of the landing pattern and see if I can enter the pattern without disturbing the flow. If I am not conformable with what I see I have the altitude to land elsewhere.

Memento Mori

[DanG 1]

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It may be good in theory to break off 1500ft above your planned deployment altitude for groups above 6, but in practice often does not happen, and isn't overly practical.

I agree, for 8-way competitions, big ways, or other dives where the experience level of the participants can be assumed to be quite high, break-off's tend to be on the low side. When every second counts, I can understand the desire to extend working time.

I was responding more to the lower time jumpers (most with 100-200 jumps) who only give 1000 feet for break off on normal jumps. I don't think this is a good practice. My 4-way team plans for 1500 feet for break-off, and we average over 1500 jumps each. Could we get away with only 1000 feet for break-off? Sure, but the safer practice is to allow more time.

- Dan G

[atsaubrey 0]

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Hey Bro,
Get rid of the neptune and get a pro-trac. You threw your PC around 3100/3200 and were in the saddle by 2600. It was not a snivel but a asymmetrical opening, the right side opened and then the left. Things seem to happen fast at the altitude at first but you will adjust as you get more time in the air. Nice 5 way.
Sparky

I was in the saddle at 2000ft on the button according to my wrist altimeter. It may have been asymmetrical but damn did it snivel. It was fun jumping with you and Michelle Sparky!!

"GOT LEAD?"

[LiveLifeGoJump 0]

Hi

Have read most of the replies and as always they are right, for them that is. What is right for you is what YOU are comfortable with.

I am comfortable pulling at 3K as this allows me time to deal with the canopy opening and getting settled (collapse slider, ALL ROUND OBSERVATION, release brakes etc.).

Some replies seem to suggest that the jumper sometimes pulled lower or higher according to the situation. Is this a good idea? When did they decide at what altitude to pull?

Please remember the following points.

1: Pull at the height YOU are comfortable with.
2: Base it on your confidence, experience & equipment.
3: Remember the spot is set for jumpers opening at approx. 3K (well ours is!), higher or lower than that may cause off landings due to upper wind speeds.
4: Find out what height others are pulling at & let them know what height you are pulling at.
5: STICK TO THAT HEIGHT provided it is safe to do so. Don't change your mind in freefall without good reason.
6: By 50 jumps you should be comfortable pulling at 3K (which seems to be the normal these days).
7: Dumping higher doesn't make you a bad person (unless you didn't tell the other jumpers). Be dead COOL not DEAD cool.
8: If you can see the whites of the spectators eyes then you've probably left it a bit late.
9: If a tandem freefalls through your canopy you probably pulled to high.
10: If you don't pull, grab the grass. They say it's the bounce that kills you. Don't rely on it though.

Get out, Land on a green bit. If you get the pull somewhere in between it would help.

[Gatzo 0]

I usually pull at 2800. Hard is 2000...

[rylord 0]

I wave off and deploy at 3500.

Rylord
Kentucky Skydiving Center

[Tailgate 0]

Notice my ultra-low jump number and no license yet

According to the BSR I must pull by 3000 and depending on the spot I shoot for 3500. haven't gone ( or ended up below ) that yet.

During the safety day canopy/safety presentation our presenter was talking about those who like to "go low".

His take on it was that higher gives you more options and in a bad spot or mal situation options are a good thing. this just made sense to me.

(edited because my fingers are fat)

_________________________________________________
Let me live in my house by the side of the road and be a friend to man- Sam Walter Foss

[BoondockSaint 0]

Well I usually push it as far as I can without getting in trouble since I am a student. On my 1st 10 second delay they took me up to like 6500 or something and said pull at 4 well I was so caught up in the freefall smiling my ass off I didnt end up pulling till probably 3400 maybe. I watched my dvd and it was 24 seconds of freefall so whatever that comes out to be. I think since I am in category G now I can actually pull at 3 but I would always try to pull lower than 4 anyway. Its probably stupid but my rig seems to open so damn fast it has never worried me. At my dropzone when I was on student gear I would wait all damn day for 2 jumps and didnt want to get screwed out of some freefall

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[kelpdiver 2]

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Well I usually push it as far as I can without getting in trouble since I am a student. On my 1st 10 second delay they took me up to like 6500 or something and said pull at 4 well I was so caught up in the freefall smiling my ass off I didnt end up pulling till probably 3400 maybe. I watched my dvd and it was 24 seconds of freefall so whatever that comes out to be. I think since I am in category G now I can actually pull at 3 but I would always try to pull lower than 4 anyway. Its probably stupid but my rig seems to open so damn fast it has never worried me. At my dropzone when I was on student gear I would wait all damn day for 2 jumps and didnt want to get screwed out of some freefall

No mals yet? Obviously you s/l guys are far less paranoid at 3500 than us AFFs used to pulling at 5500.

You do your packing all along, or still upcoming? I pulled my pack job at 5k.

I've been pulling between 3500 and 4, but last week got chided for a pull (I thought) was at 3800, because my canopy wasn't open until 3. It opened into a diving turn which might account for the result, not sure. So now I'm thinking about how much time I want before the hard deck, will probably go back to throwing at 4 again.

Any instructors care to comment further about throw out time versus "deploy altitude?"

[BoondockSaint 0]

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Well I usually push it as far as I can without getting in trouble since I am a student. On my 1st 10 second delay they took me up to like 6500 or something and said pull at 4 well I was so caught up in the freefall smiling my ass off I didnt end up pulling till probably 3400 maybe. I watched my dvd and it was 24 seconds of freefall so whatever that comes out to be. I think since I am in category G now I can actually pull at 3 but I would always try to pull lower than 4 anyway. Its probably stupid but my rig seems to open so damn fast it has never worried me. At my dropzone when I was on student gear I would wait all damn day for 2 jumps and didnt want to get screwed out of some freefall

No mals yet? Obviously you s/l guys are far less paranoid at 3500 than us AFFs used to pulling at 5500.

You do your packing all along, or still upcoming? I pulled my pack job at 5k.

I've been pulling between 3500 and 4, but last week got chided for a pull (I thought) was at 3800, because my canopy wasn't open until 3. It opened into a diving turn which might account for the result, not sure. So now I'm thinking about how much time I want before the hard deck, will probably go back to throwing at 4 again.

Any instructors care to comment further about throw out time versus "deploy altitude?"

Well actually I did have a mal on my 19th jump. It was my 3rd complete solo where I could do whatever I wanted. I was flying on my back and one of my toggles came out in freefall and was flapping all around. I had no idea what to do and I was at 7k so I grabbed it and continued my freefall till about 5 and then flipped over and chucked into the air and pulled. Opened into what I consider a wild spin but i just pulled both toggles down and it fixed it. What a rush. Got my heart pounding pretty hard. I let this idiot that had like 20 pack jobs under his belt pack it because I watched him pack other stuff and no one had died yet. Probably a dumb thing but I wanted to get back up in the air.

My first pack job was my 20th jump and I was sure I was gonna die. lol god man jumping your first pack job is insane. On that one I pulled at 4 but my 2nd one and the one after that was packed by a jump coach I initiated the pull at around 3500. The dytter I was borrowing is set at 3000 and it always goes off while my canopy is opening. Holy shit are those things louds. Hurts my ears.

[vonSanta 0]

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1: Pull at the height YOU are comfortable with.

Might work fine at some DZs, but keep in mind that some DZs have rules about not pulling high. At busy DZs, doing so can be dangerous for you and the groups coming after you.

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4: Find out what height others are pulling at & let them know what height you are pulling at.

Doesn't work in, say, Russia. Unless you speak Russian. Fortunately, such places tend to have an intervall during which you must deploy your main.

Santa Von GrossenArsch
I only come in one flavour
ohwaitthatcanbemisunderst

[Icon134 0]

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Might work fine at some DZs, but keep in mind that some DZs have rules about not pulling high. At busy DZs, doing so can be dangerous for you and the groups coming after you.

Even on busy days a good load organizer should be able to setup someone that wants to pull a little high.

not only that I would think that pulling high would be less of a problem then pulling low because once I open my parachute I'm effectively out of the way of everyone else on the jump run. (because they are all below me.) not that I would necessarily condone pulling at 10k... but if someone flying solo belly pulls at 5k followed by a group of FreeFlyers (that have likely long passed the belly flyer by that time...) I can't imagine it being a big problem. (I have watched FF falling much faster then I in free fall from good distance away prior to me pulling around 4.5k...)

I've seen tandums that were pulled at 10k by the student (yeah, oops.) that still made it down to the ground before the next load was off the ground.

Fyi: I've been pulling between 4 - 4.5k ft and am usually in the saddle by 3 - 3.5k and so far no one has complained... and if they do then the don't have to jump w/me.

Scott

Livin' on the Edge... sleeping with my rigger's wife...

[shunkka 0]

my lowest was at 550 m (but my chute open very very fast and the jump were from 1000m)

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"jump, have fun, pull"

[bigway 4]

maybe you should start listening to your instuctor when it comes to pull time. He tells you what height to pull at for a reason.

.Karnage Krew Gear Store
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[ZigZagMarquis 9]

I usually breakoff between 4.5 and 4K, higher if its a real big-way.

While tracking off... I'm looking to get max horizontal separation going (i.e. flat track), but will admit I've gone for vertical seperation in a pinch and probably will again again if need be.

I don't wear one of those new-fangled "audibals" with all those beeps, whines, chirps, sirens and shocks... just an old fashioned Dytter... one beep, one beep only, please... that's set for breakoff.

Once tracking, I'm strickly looking for seperation and at the dirt... not to really scare me, the dirt, that is... wave, pull... I'm usually in the saddle at about 2K... that's my story and I'm sticking too it! So, I'd say I'm pitching between 2.5 and 2.8K.