those with NO, NONE, ZERO ratings....

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

Quote

I believe you need a coach rating prior to any instructional rating.

-Dave

Not in every country. You need to remember that this is not an "american" website.

[docjohn 0]

Shooting tandem video helps pay for this sport and doesn't require any ratings. Although after the recent fatality (cameraman hit TM on opening), makes you wonder if one will be required someday.

Food for thought. Do we need a 'tandem video' rating?
.
.
.

Doc
http://www.manifestmaster.com/video

[stratostar 5]

Many of the bigger dz's in the u.s. require you to be AFF rated
to fly camera.
As to the fatality, the camera man had a AFF rating, so it goes to show that anyone rated or not can fuck up!
So don't be a fuck up.

Do we need a 'tandem video' rating? (quote)
Yes we do in a way as long as DZO's will keep using anyone who just got a camera and straped it to their head.
It happends way more then most think.
As with everything else in the sport you should prove yourself first before being turned loose to shoot video or teach.
With that said, just because you have proven yourself don't mean you won't fuck up and kill yourself or someone else while doing it, ie: Gus Wings death of recent. RIP -GW

~

you can't pay for kids schoolin' with love of skydiving! ~ Airtwardo

[rocketdog 0]

Quote

AFF students scare me!

ARE YOU KIDDING ME?!?!?! -- all students are scary (including watching them land!)

for that reason ^ i would *maybe* consider a Coach rating because the students are a tad more experienced..... doubtful though!

~hollywood

see the world! http://gorocketdog.blogspot.com

[daveb 1]

Quote

just wondering what the reason is:
1) don't need to be staff to have jump funds?
2) students are potential "killers"
3) you have fun jumping with friends
4) you plan on it, just waiting for enough experience/jump #s

1, 3 and 5: don't need a rating to coach 4way or organize. As for 2, I'm not so worried about a student killing me as I am about a student dying on my watch -- I'd be second guessing myself until doomsday, wondering if it was something I said, or didn't say, or didn't say well, or didn't confirm, or ....

[popsjumper 2]

I want two ratings....Coach and PRO.

Coach to "legally" be able to give back to the new guys.

Pro because it is just kick-ass to do demos. Being on our DZs ground crew is fun in and of itself but the great fun is getting in free without having to go through the gate or hop a fence.

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[darkwing 5]

Quote

just wondering what the reason is:
1) don't need to be staff to have jump funds?
2) students are potential "killers"
3) you have fun jumping with friends
4) you plan on it, just waiting for enough experience/jump #s

I was strongly influenced by altruistic aspects of the sport when I started jumping, and I don't want to further increase the ways we suck money out of novices. I do lots of organizing and casual coaching for novices, and don't want to become part of the formal structure for separating them from their money.

I am not saying that I couldn't benefit from some formal training to do what I do anyway, but I don't want to invest my time, money and effort in the process. I just like to jump, and to help out beginners, and non-beginners.

-- Jeff
My Skydiving History

[Andy9o8 2]

Quote

I was strongly influenced by altruistic aspects of the sport when I started jumping, and I don't want to further increase the ways we suck money out of novices. I do lots of organizing and casual coaching for novices, and don't want to become part of the formal structure for separating them from their money.

I am not saying that I couldn't benefit from some formal training to do what I do anyway, but I don't want to invest my time, money and effort in the process. I just like to jump, and to help out beginners, and non-beginners.

Agree completely. One good way the sport has changed in the past 30 years is that once you’re off student status, you don’t have to just hook up with your fellow 40 jump wonders to teach each other bad habits in the sky until you cross that magic 100 jump number, when the skygods would stop treating you like you have b.o. and be willing to teach you some serious RW. It was always great when an up-timer would jump with you and teach you great stuff just for the fun of doing so. Now, there’s a lot more willingness by up-timers to help low-timers with the learning curve early on. But I like to do it to pay it forward to novices, and it bugs me when I see it done by people just looking to avoid paying for what are essentially their fun jumps.

[mdrejhon 8]

I think eventually I'll want coach and just maybe EJR (PRO) ratings. Just so I can jump with newbies and teach them a thing or two (and know how to keep myself as safe as possible). Oh, and demos definitely do interest me.

Due to my deafness, I am not sure I want to go as far as instructor or tandem ratings, but I am capable of doing one-on-one coaching.

[BillyVance 34]

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Due to my deafness, I am not sure I want to go as far as instructor or tandem ratings, but I am capable of doing one-on-one coaching.

It can be done. Just ask Fred Goebel, totally deaf and a former (rating lapsed when he took a 7 year sabbatical) AFF jumpmaster... You'll meet him in a couple weeks at Lake Wales.

"Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban

[packerboy 3]

In Canada you do need a coach rating to be a TI. We are getting our ratings from the same place. I would bet by Danger's avatar he is probably Canadian, or a very unpatriotic American .

I will get my coach rating to facilitate my tandem rating, but I would still not charge for coach jumps. I never paid for a coach's slot and I don't believe in it. I believe that the knowledge should be paid forward to new jumpers so that they become new instructors so that they take students which are the bread and butter of our sport who without, we would not be able to do what we are doing for such a great price.

In our world, if noone jumps with the new kids then our experienced jumpers would eventually have noone good at anything to jump with.

--------------------------------------------------
In matters of style, swim with the current; in matters of principle, stand like a rock. ~ Thomas Jefferson

[riggerrob 643]

Skydiving is like sex:
First you do it for yourself,
then you do it with a few freinds,
then you do it for money!

[Jackpunx 0]

Quote

In Canada you do need a coach rating to be a TI. We are getting our ratings from the same place. I would bet by Danger's avatar he is probably Canadian, or a very unpatriotic American .

I will get my coach rating to facilitate my tandem rating, but I would still not charge for coach jumps. I never paid for a coach's slot and I don't believe in it. I believe that the knowledge should be paid forward to new jumpers so that they become new instructors so that they take students which are the bread and butter of our sport who without, we would not be able to do what we are doing for such a great price.

In our world, if noone jumps with the new kids then our experienced jumpers would eventually have noone good at anything to jump with.

I dig your outlook.. I'll be looking forward to meeting someone like you at my DZ

• Quote

[Airman1270 0]

All I have is my "A" license, which I purchased in 1987 when I had about 120 jumps. (I was traveling and stopped at a DZ in Virginia. Even though I was current, they made me do a supervised solo because I didn't have the license.)

I've wanted to be an instructor since I was a student, but I can't jump often due to family responsibilities. Years ago my Dad offered to pay for me to become tandem certified, but I decided against it because 1) The only way I could be useful to a DZO would be by committing myself to the DZ from sunup to sundown at least one day every weekend, which is not a healthy lifestyle for the father of young children, and 2) Since I can't make more than a few jumps each month, I would have no business getting involved with students.

I do enjoy working with novice jumpers, and have been "coaching" newbies long before USPA invented the stupid, useless "coach" rating. I might consider getting a PRO rating someday, but I don't understand why it must be renewed each year. There 's probably a reason for this but it seems that $omething $ound$ a little $u$piciou$ about this requirement.

Cheers,
Jon S.

[mdrejhon 8]

Quote

It can be done. Just ask Fred Goebel, totally deaf and a former (rating lapsed when he took a 7 year sabbatical) AFF jumpmaster... You'll meet him in a couple weeks at Lake Wales.

Cool, I look forward to meeting him.

The question is money, since I do have other things in life I want to chase after (other kinds of adventures).

The two I definitely most want is coach and EJR (PRO). Coach to jump with newbies and teach them to be safe flyers, and EJR (PRO) so that I can do demos once now and then. Tandem does definitely sound like an interesting idea, but I'd want to know how I'd keep my passenger safe.

Another problem is I do have a life and I can really only commit two weekends per month at the dropzone (albiet I can jump whore in one weekend if I need to, 17 or 18 jumps in one weekend like I did for Labour Day and Canada Day weekends). But who knows...

My mind is set on eventually becoming a good bellyflyer for now. I want to try Deaf World Record (20-way). Then maybe eventually Canada's record for biggest formation (Even as early as 2006, if I get skilled enough)

I think I would prefer to be a video flyer since I probably will eventually get a camera "when I am ready". Less communication with the student needed, and I do enjoy video editing from time to time. I do have reasonable photography skills (http://www.marky.com/pictures/)

[RevJim 0]

Honestly, teaching never really interested me. I love seeing a student's eyes right after that first jump, but getting them to that point just isn't me.

There ARE 2 rating I want eventually though. One USPA, and one "private."

USPA, PRO. Basically, if I want to jump into someone's backyard, I'll be able to....

Private, BMI, but not until I feel as though I could fly circles around, or at least be able to stay glued to Chucky in formation flight (I'm still a loooong ways away from THAT.)

It's your life, live it!
Karma
RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1

[rocketdog 0]

i think it's funny (ironic) how most people with ZERO ratings just want a coach and/or pro......... very, very interesting
i totally agree with the atruism perspective. it seems like everyone is a paid coach or paid organizer there days -- BOO!

see the world! http://gorocketdog.blogspot.com

[happythoughts 0]

To me, a rating is for people who wish to be in the business end of skydiving. For work, I'd rather do my regular job and just play when jumping.

Also, I'm not that responsible. I like to sleep late on weekends and go to the dz when I get there.

If someone sees me at the dz, I will put gladly put something together. Usually there are already plenty of organizers.

I do organize at the convention (see Oct. Parachutist centerfold).

[RevJim 0]

Exactly, Bill. As I said above, I'm just not the teacher sort. As a BMI, sure, I'd be "teaching," but only a discipline, not a true FJC. This is for EXPERIENCED jumpers. Sure, I feel some responsibility, but not as much as say, and AFFI or a TMI. These are people that have saved their own lives HUNDREDS (at least) of times, if not thousands, who are looking to try something new.

As for the PRO, I like the occasional off-dz landing (unlike some that are mega paranoid about it), and this allows me to actually PLAN some of them...

It's your life, live it!
Karma
RB#684 "Corcho", ASK#60, Muff#3520, NCB#398, NHDZ#4, C-33989, DG#1