fear of floating

[Rookie120 0]

The door doesnt bother me when I float. I dont like giving the count but I floating doesnt bother me. I am more affraid of falling of the plane while floating which I did while trying to do a 20 way. Needless to say I was a little bit low on that jump.

If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

[kevinwhelan 0]

I have only done a few floater exits,but what I find different about them is what you see. on a dive exit I tent to just look down, check the spot,watch the previous group etc. On a floating exit I am standing on the step looking along the plane with no real view of what I am about to jump into, This stepping off blind feels strange to me. Also when I am inside the plane I feel in full control of the exit. On the outside there is all ways the risk of slipping and so exiting when i am not exactly ready

"be honest with yourself. Why do I want to go smaller? It is not going to make my penis longer." ~Brian Germain, on downsizing

[immanence 0]

Quote

I am the exact opposite. I love altitude. I would rather be hanging onto the side of an airplane at 14K rather than 2K

It's such a funny thing in me, this climb out thing. See, I love altitude. Though I started getting out at 2000ft (round static line), nowadays that seems way low. Yet, in my head, climbing out on a step seems more natural and less stressful at 2000ft than at 14 grand, where, normally, of course, I'd much rather be.

For some reason I'm happier on the outside of the plane when I feel a little closer to the earth than very far above it. What the hell is that about?

Bob Dino: Thanks so much for digging out those threads! Both are great! As Skr says in one of the threads, "We're dealing with powerful stuff here." The other thread — on fear abatement — is a gem. To use the words of one poster there, I think on this I have been "thinking myself into a corner". I don't have a dog, so I can't think of his floppy ears (as that poster does) in order to relax, but I will find another mental image. It is all about being at ease. This is a big principle for me in life; I can extend it to hanging off the outside of a plane.

"Leaning forward into the energy is how we transform the energy into joy." Right on, man .......... From Jules: "I think that standing up to your fears gives you something to look forward to." Word. And lest we forget, as Mike said: "Fear is a vital component to survival."

I'd really like to find this book by John Derosalia which is mentioned on the thread: Mental Training for Skydiving and Life.

I'm half way through reading this thread, but I'd recommend it to anyone who wants to work through a specific or general anxiety related to our beautiful sport.

Riddler: Thanks for your reply. That video I mentioned in my original post — the guy getting on top of the plane — is not so bad for me now that I have watched it 2000 times. I do the same: try to find and watch video of crazy-assed climb-out exits, or just normal floats, full screen, and try to imagine myself there and undo the knots in my head. As one of the posters on the thread that Bob digged up says: "try visualising before your jump and then in the door, take a big deep breath."

Finally, we've not heard yet from any 2000+ or 3000+ jumps skydivers. If you're one of them, I'd be really interested in your experience. Climbing around outside the plane: is it a matter of repetition putting one at ease, or were there mental adjustments that you made, or still make?

And anyone who feels vertigo: let us know your feelings too.

How I love this sport!

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

[immanence 0]

Quote

I have only done a few floater exits,but what I find different about them is what you see. On a floating exit I am standing on the step looking along the plane ...

This is definitely a big part of it for me. It feels damn wierd seeing the top of a fuselage at 14k. I mean, we're not supposed to really see that, are we? And letting one leg trail, too, makes me uneasy about slipping off. In general, the plane looks like a mighty big piece of metal. I know the principles of aeroflight: how jumbos get off the ground, etc. It still makes me double take to be hanging off this wierd contraption in the middle of the sky .......

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

[popsjumper 2]

Hanging on tho the side of the plane is what turned me on the most on my AFF1 - it was absolutely the gas....I still love it and a dive exit just seems to be missing something for me...I dunno.?

My reality and yours are quite different.
I think we're all Bozos on this bus.
Falcon5232, SCS8170, SCSA353, POPS9398, DS239

[kallend 2,026]

I don't especially like floating because it disagrees with the tendonitis in my right shoulder.

But sometimes you just gotta do what you gotta do.

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Jeff.Donohue 0]

I have a weird related experience.

I'm in AFF, and I have no problem with exits. However, I'm also learning to spot. A couple of jumps ago, my instructor asked me to stick my head out the door, find the spot, etc. The process of sticking my head out -- when NOT getting ready to jump -- gave me a weird sense of vertigo. Can't explain why. Apparently, I turned pale white... People on the Otter were kind enough not to openly laugh (but probably should have...)

At the time, my instructor pointed out something to the effect of, "ummm... you know you have a rig on, right?" Of course at an intellectual level, I knew it, but the experience of "stick head out of aircraft when not jumping" was just not being processed properly by my brain.

My guess is that when I'm exiting, my brain processes "side of plane, prop, etc.", which is all in focus. As I shift from poised exit to freefall, my brain sort of recalibrates to "heading/horizon, freefall, etc." But when I spot, my brain is rapidly shifting from focusing on an "interior space" (the aircraft) to focusing on a very distant space (ground, clouds, etc.) The radical shift in focus gives the mild vertigo.

Don't get me wrong, it's not enough to make me stop jumping, just an odd reaction I had. At other times, spotting has been no problem.

For what it's worth, I had no problem exiting on any of my jumps.

[calledisrael 0]

i was going to echo this. i thought i would be terrified of floating, but i started it with an sdu coach (who happened to be a pretty large guy, and took the pressure off of me) and did middle float a few times - and i LOVED it. easing in like that may help.

life is either a daring adventure or nothing at all.
(helen keller)

[jblooming 0]

I have that vertigo from time to time still when I am just about to climb out the door and when I am spotting. It has gotten less though the more I do it. I started jumping with a 4-way team and I am flying tail (or rear float). I had to get used to it in a hurry. It was really wierd at first to climb out and see the camera guy standing there. The worst part for me is the climb out. Once I am set and we are just about ready to go I am fine. The worst thing was when I had to hook my helmet under the bar and only hold on to the plane with the back of my neck. My hands had grips on other people. That was really a trip.
When I am sitting next to the door I am holding on to something until we close that door. We have one team member who is really freaked out by sitting there and we always mess with her.
Being on the team though we are out first much of the time so I have had to spot quite a bit and the float every exit. It's a different perspective and just takes time to get used to.
I think if you spend 3 or 4 days in a row spotting and floating every exit it will get better.

[bob.dino 1]

Quote

I'd really like to find this book by John Derosalia which is mentioned on the thread: Mental Training for Skydiving and Life.

Ask and ye shall receive:

Skydiving Magazine Store
Amazon

If you're not too fussed, keep the money in the sport and order from Skydiving. I've had nothing but good experiences with them.

As for the book itself: the longer I spend in the sport, the more I learn from it. I spent an hour this morning going through some of the exercises it recommends. And at USD $15, it's not going to break the bank.

Oh, and when Brian Germain's Transcending Fear comes out, buy it. I've read an early draft, and it's excellent. I take the bus to work, and four out of five days that I'd be reading it, my neighbour would be reading over my shoulder and would ask where (s)he could get a copy .

[MB38 0]

I've only had three diving and two floating exits at this point, so I can't really chime in on how to solve any fear. For some reason, I just love having the plane as a "static" point in space. Be it sticking my head out the door, sitting next to the door on the way to altitude, hanging on outside the door before exiting or diving and watching the plane go away... it just breaks down that mental wall for me.

99% of the times I've been on a plane in my life, I've landed in that plane. There's always this separation between what's going on inside the plane and what's going on outside. Obviously on a commercial jet, that's the way it has to be.

Being able to stick my head [or my whole body] out of the plane shatters that mental barrier and I love the feeling.

I graduated AFF today and did my first solo. Just for kicks, I decided to do a diving exit and didn't try to get stable. I let the wind whip me around into whichever position was the most natural. After about a second, I ended up in a limp back track and just watched the plane fly away.

After all, what's the worst thing that could happen? You could fall out.

I really don't know what I'm talking about.

[immanence 0]

Quote

Ask and ye shall receive

Sweet
Do you know when Germain's book is coming out? For both, unfortunately, I'll have to wait until my next occidental adventure: I live in Cairo and not a single piece of post has reached my mailbox intact in 4 years

"where danger is appears also that which saves ..." Friedrich Holderlin, 'Patmos'

[bob.dino 1]

Quote

Pretty please for a V3, Safire 2 and Smart reserve also.

The Lord helps those that help themselves. Or, Get Stuffed!

Quote

Do you know when Germain's book is coming out?

No idea... email him and ask; his email address is on his website http://www.bigairsportz.com or he's BrianSGermain here on dz.com.

Quote

I live in Cairo and not a single piece of post has reached my mailbox intact in 4 years [Mad]

Get the book sent via UPS or FedEx to work? It'll cost, but at least it'll arrive in one piece...

[Trae 1]

The general increase in exit speeds due to larger aircraft being more common has made your 'fear' of floating into the rear of the aircraft very topical. Quite a few people have suffered tail strikes due to being light-weights or exiting when the aircraft is going too fast or in a climb .

In general the less experienced or talented the pilot the higher the exit speed .

If the pilots don't wear parachutes for some prehistoric reason they will often be very jumpy about people taking out their tail.

Some aircraft in particular are prone to tail strikes with the low tail-plane more rear door types being obvious candidates.

In trying to overcome these valid concerns of yours perhaps you could try doing a few jumps from much slower aircraft such as C182's . These little beauties slow down to less than 70 knots with ease making for much less stress at exit time. It is also LOTS of fun and easy to strut hang or try some other climb on the sircraft type tricks.

A friend of mines speciality was to climb underneath the aircraft (C185) and come up on the other side and give the pilot a fright by banging on his window.

One of the funnest things I've done climbing on an aircraft was to shimmmy down to the tail and climb up onto the horizontal stabiliser holding onto the front of the fin and wobbling the rudder for the pilots enjoyment.

You can minimise your liklihood of a tail strike from a faster aircraft by putting yourself in the front part of a drag-out. It also helps to not grab too much air until you've actually left the plane.

Also try and ensure the pilot knows you're still there if you're geting out last as sometimes they'll begin their dive too early.

This is definitely a risk mangement type thing as these tail strike type accidents seem to keep happening.