laird 0 #1 March 28, 2005 I'm about to start PG course in may so I've been surfing sites and I found this http://www.flyozone.com/pgframe.htm Does anybody know if this was a stunt or are people trying to make paragliders deployable in freefall? (Anythings deployable) I guess the better question is are they trying to develop a canopy thats deployable at terminal and then has the same flight characteristics of a PG? Is this news or Im I just behind. "HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^% Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ryoder 1,590 #2 March 28, 2005 10 years ago the Discovery channel had a program about a French guy who did just that. And this has been on the military market for some time: http://www.paraflite.com/html/paris.html"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
laird 0 #3 March 28, 2005 I guess I was out of the know. It doesn't say if his attempt was actually sucessful. I assume he landed the PG, but it doesn't say. The site you linked has a skydiving canopy built for maxium glide (very simular to a PG) . I wonder if they have or are close to bridging the gap between modern PG and skydiving canopies. I mean a canopy that can be deployed at terminal and then flown as an actual PG. We could exit at 12,500, freefall untill 3 or 4 grand deploy the paraglider canopy and then potentially find a thermal and climb back to 12,500! That would be sweet! For the price of one jump ticket you could spend hours in the air. "HIGAF" Honestly I Give A F*^% Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DancingFlame 0 #4 March 28, 2005 Quote We could exit at 12,500, freefall untill 3 or 4 grand deploy the paraglider canopy and then potentially find a thermal and climb back to 12,500! Then we QUICKLY pack that beast and make one more freefall jump Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #5 March 28, 2005 There is atleast one PG canopy manufacturer working on it.---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #6 March 28, 2005 Quote Does anybody know if this was a stunt or are people trying to make paragliders deployable in freefall? (Anythings deployable) I guess the better question is are they trying to develop a canopy thats deployable at terminal and then has the same flight characteristics of a PG? Is this news or Im I just behind. Thinking back to working with my paraglider versus my skydiving canopy - some things scare me... First, the lines on a paraglider, I believe (am not sure) have very little dynamic stretch... The lines are super thin and very tightly woven. They feel like dental floss, just a bit bigger. If that were true - it would be like falling on a static line climbing rope - nothing to make a hard opening a little softer. You would have to install a shock absorber somewhere in the system to put some dynamic stretch. Second, there are so many lines on a paraglider... I often had a twist or tangle that needed work on the ground after laying it out and building a wall. A few times I missed one and flew it off the mountain with a "malfunction"... Sometimes I could clear it, sometimes I had a built in turn until landing… The lines are so thin knots don’t come out under tension, but do with no tension… The brakes are not stowed at an optimal position, and the stow does not hold... Often it is just a magnet. And there is the whole speed bar mechanism.... Lots of mods there. Deploy a paraglider as a "stunt" - sure, it can be done. But, I think you have something... Build a skydiving specific canopy with the flight characteristics of a paraglider. The opposite of the tiny little elliptical canopies the swoop course freaks love. Of course, the paraglider-like pilots would have to borrow the tandem containers for the canopy, because a paraglider is about the same size. Editorial note... Do you know a lot of skydivers would have to be much better canopy pilots to fly it, and understand the weather so much better? My Paraglider could stall, deflate, collapse, dive in front of me, dive in back of me, and generally stop flying under conditions that I have thought nothing of on my skydiving canopy... One of my first flights on my paraglider as a student I failed to "keep the glider overhead" by applying brakes as it surged forward and found myself in freefall with a ball of fabric in front of me after it dove. How many AFF students face that under “acceptable” flying conditions??? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 37 #7 March 28, 2005 The french government have been working on this for several years. They have reported on their efforts at a couple of the PIA symposiums. Didn't look for a link but I think some infor is out their. Same idea as paraflite ( and maybe same research). A very high glide angle deployable parachute for standoff insertions.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #8 March 28, 2005 Thinking back to working with my paraglider versus my skydiving canopy - some things scare me... First, the lines on a paraglider, I believe (am not sure) have very little dynamic stretch... The lines are super thin and very tightly woven. They feel like dental floss, just a bit bigger. If that were true - it would be like falling on a static line climbing rope - nothing to make a hard opening a little softer. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> How does this differ from the HMA lines installed on the latest pond swooping canopies? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 643 #9 March 28, 2005 Quote I'm about to start PG course in may so I've been surfing sites and I found this http://www.flyozone.com/pgframe.htm Does anybody know if this was a stunt or are people trying to make paragliders deployable in freefall? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This has been done many times before. Almost 20 years ago, I watched Hans Ostermunchner doing static-line jups with early production para-gliders, to collect data for Deutscher Hang Gleiter Verband ratings. Back then para-gliding students started with PD 260 parachutes, then graduated to purpose-built para-gliding canopies. The purpose-built para-gliding canopies lacked most of the reinforcing tapes that help parachutes survive opening shock. Over the years, many armies have experimented with reinforced para-gliders (made by Para-Flite, Fallschirmdienst Herbst, etc.) for HAHO operations. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tdog 0 #10 March 28, 2005 Quote How does this differ from the HMA lines installed on the latest pond swooping canopies? Me don't know1) Do those pond swooping canopies feel good opening at terminal? 2) Are those pond swooping canopies 320+ sqft, thus presenting a huge chunk of fabric over someones head. I don't know if it is a direct relation, but if I was gonna have a canopy slam me real hard, I would IMAGINE (no experience here) that a slammer on something small will be less intense than a slammer on something big, just because there is that much more drag on a bigger piece of fabric... I never have heard a tandem say, "ya my drouge slammed me on opening to the point I hurt all over." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #11 March 30, 2005 technora used on paragliders is the same stuff used on the Xaos and hyper canopies out there. good stuff...well I wouldn't want my steering lines made out of it. but seems alot of pilots like there openings on there Xaos' Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
evh 22 #12 March 30, 2005 Quote ... First, the lines on a paraglider, I believe (am not sure) have very little dynamic stretch... Quote Lines stretching won't soften the opening shock. The canopy is pulling on your lines with a certain force, and if the lines would stretch an inch well.... you'll be an inch further away from your canopy (but it would still be pulling on your lines with exactly the same force). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
evh 22 #13 March 30, 2005 BTW, I would love a canopy that could fly for hours, but wouln't that be kind of dangerous near a dropzone? I flew into a thermal once with my Manta, and was very surprised at my altimeter moving in the wrong direction. I spiraled down because the next load was almost on jumprun. Eelco Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rustywardlow 0 #14 March 30, 2005 If you want some real answeres contact Tony Dominiqo. Tony and his brother Tim were more than likely the first ones to attempt this back in the early 90's for a Mountain Dew commercial. As I recall they were some what successful at it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #15 March 30, 2005 Quote I would love a canopy that could fly for hours, but wouln't that be kind of dangerous near a dropzone? Wouldn't have to be, leave the a/c and fly away from the DZ, down wind... across country. (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kaerock 1 #16 March 31, 2005 I've heard rumors a while ago about about PD working on/playing with it. -R Quote I'm about to start PG course in may so I've been surfing sites and I found this http://www.flyozone.com/pgframe.htm Does anybody know if this was a stunt or are people trying to make paragliders deployable in freefall? (Anythings deployable) I guess the better question is are they trying to develop a canopy thats deployable at terminal and then has the same flight characteristics of a PG? Is this news or Im I just behind. You be the king and I'll overthrow your government. --KRS-ONE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Unparagoned 0 #17 March 31, 2005 Quote Quote ... First, the lines on a paraglider, I believe (am not sure) have very little dynamic stretch... Quote Lines stretching won't soften the opening shock. The canopy is pulling on your lines with a certain force, and if the lines would stretch an inch well.... you'll be an inch further away from your canopy (but it would still be pulling on your lines with exactly the same force). Lines stretching will reduce the opening shock as force is required to stretch the lines, & the lines stretching would spread the impulse over a longer time reducing force. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
eUrNiCc 0 #18 April 1, 2005 I hope i'm not the only person thinking of the way cool Mr. Bill potential here Egad, A BASE life defiles a bad age. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kevinwhelan 0 #19 April 1, 2005 Seems he has done it from http://www.flyozone.com/pgframe.htm 23/3/2005 :: Jimmy Hall Goes Para-diving As far as we know, Jimmy is the first person to ever jump a normal, production paraglider out of an airplane and then freefall before opening. Jimmy has been jumping from altitudes of up to 12,500 feet at his home dropzone in Hawaii with his Vulcan DHV 2. It took a lot of research and a lot of courage, but after working with the rigger at his local dropzone, Jimmy designed a special deployment bag, slider, and pilot chute system to deploy his glider from freefall. These photos are from just a few days ago when Jimmy jumped from an airplane at 12,000' at 90mph. Nice work Jimmy! "be honest with yourself. Why do I want to go smaller? It is not going to make my penis longer." ~Brian Germain, on downsizing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
shropshire 0 #20 May 22, 2005 I've just received my lates copy of CrossCountry magazine and read the article about Jimmy Hall and his set up... He wears a light weight PG harness under a free-fall rig, has added a slider to his Paraglider (so that it doesn't explode on opening- I guess) and then D-Bags it. He is cuurently deploying at around 5 seconds but expects to go terminal some time. Also from Here Quote ParaDiving. Jimmy Hall is the first person to jump a normal production paraglider out of an airplane and then freefall before opening. Jimmy designed a special deployment bag, slider, and pilot parachute system to deploy the wing from freefall. These pictures of when Jimmy jumped from an airplane at 3650m (12000') at 145 km/h (90 mph). Hawaii, USA. 2005/3/20 (+/- a few days). ParaDiving. Jimmy Hall est la première personne à sauter d'un avion avec un parapente normal et atteindre une vitesse de chute libre avant de déployer. Jimmy a conçu un sac de déploiement spécial, glisseur, et parachute pilote pour déployer l'aile depuis une chute libre. Ces photos de quand Jimmy a sauté d'un avion à 3650m (12000') allant à 145 km/h (90 mph). Hawaii, USA. 2005/3/20 (+/- quelques jours). (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
murps2000 86 #21 May 22, 2005 I'm not sure where it happened, but on Jimmy Halliday's Radix DVD, there's some cat direct bagging a Red Bull PG canopy off a bridge. It looks as if he then procedes to swoop the shit out of it on landing, although it cuts off the end. Not exactly a terminal opening, but I bet it took some stones to do it. Also, Jimmy himself takes a X-braced something in a Javelin off of what appears to be New River. Definitely worth checking out if you haven't seen it, yet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
