ic1 jm1 cp1 cp2

[JohnGraham 0]

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CP1 is ALL about high performance landings (read the manual and you will see this). Yes, HP landings go hand-in-hand with learning to control your canopy but CP1 is about swooping.

I have read the manual and been to the BPA seminars on the subject. CP1 is a prerequisite to swooping. SKILLS are a prerequisite it obtaining CP1. Obtaining CP1 ensures you have SKILLS. SKILLS reduce the likelihood of DEATH. CP1 is ALL about learning how not to DIE.

I completely agree with you.

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I'll give you it's all about how you want to spin it.

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those wanting to load higher than 1.4 will be forced to swoop in order to do so

Have you read the manual? Can you point me to where in the manual the BPA require CP1 before allowing you to load your canopy above 1.4?

The BPA is not forcing anyone to obtain CP1. If you want to swoop you must have CP1 first. If you never want to swoop you don't have to even know about its existence. The BPA is not linking CP1 to wing loading... if a DZ does, that's down to the individual DZ not the BPA.

I know that the BPA ops manual does not require CP1 to load your canopy above a certain limit, but somebody posted before that a DZ is requiring this, and if this is true I don't see the sense in that. Granted, the person who didn't want to swoop could just keep their canopy loaded lighter than 1.4, but as Zoter said, there are plenty of people out there that fly their canopies very carefuly and in a safe maner loaded above 1.4 - if one of these people wanted to go to a DZ that is enforcing a "CP1 for >1.4 wingloadings" policy, they would not be able to jump their canopy no matter how proficient they are under it.

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be applied to not killing yourself in a panic turn is one thing, but making it mandatory to swoop makes no sense to me at all. (btw have you read the CH manual? I'm pretty sure that flat turns as an avoidance maneuver is covered in CH2, maybe CH1 I'm not sure)

Yes I'm fully familiar with the manual and have had guidance on the subject above and beyond the manual alone. If you don't want to get CP1 don't get it. It only allows you to perform swoop landings anyway, nothing more. If your home DZ is linking it to wingloading and you don't like that, move, but don’t blame the BPA – they didn't create that rule.

BTW the first practical requirement of CH1 is 3 jumps using flat turns.

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making it mandatory to swoop makes no sense to me at all.

Just to emphasize this point; it is NOT mandatory to swoop. It is only mandatory to swoop if you want to swoop. If you want to swoop you have to obtain CP1 which includes swooping, but that surely wouldn't bother you – you're only obtaining the qualification to enable you to swoop.

If for some reason you don't want to obtain CP1 but want to learn the elements of it you believe are most associated with saving your life you can still obtain and practice those skills with coaching.

I'm obviously not stressing my point since what you have written here I totally agree with! My point is purely concerned with any DZ that would implement a rule meaning you have to have CP1 to load higher than a set limit - I know the BPA is not enforcing this.

[JohnGraham 0]

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Ask the instructors at your centre about this, I know that checking that a person is jumping a "suitible" canopy is (should be) a part of the flightline checks at our centre already.

Is it? Ive never been asked what canopy is in my container. Maybe it should be.

I was taught that this it is supposed to be a part of the flightline check, but only really comes into effect when you're checking out someone you don't know or making sure someone who's just bought a new canopy has been approved by Ian (That's as I was taught when given a flightline cheking brief, things may have changed I'll ckeck)

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Yes, HP landings go hand-in-hand with learning to control your canopy but CP1 is about swooping.

I disagree. You can learn to control your canopy without doing HP landings. I see myself as a safe canopy flyer and have spent lots of time learning to control it appropriately in all situations and have NEVER done or attempted a HP landing.

I agree fully that you can learn to control your canopy without doing HP landings - what I meant was that if you are going to learn to do HP landings, then you are going to learn more about canopy control, but you can learn this same canopy control without swooping.
That's half my original point, really - that you can learn safe canopy control without swooping.

[achowe 0]

agreed, see your point.

canopy checking on flight line sounds good but is it really going to be accepted? I'm sure this kind of thing has been dsicussed before...

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Woooaaaaaa!!! Woooaaaa!!! I'm gettin' off it!

[mr2mk1g 10]

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My point is purely concerned with any DZ that would implement a rule meaning you have to have CP1 to load higher than a set limit

Righto'. I can see why the DZ might want to use that restriction though... it would help in many cases... but yes it suck to be one of the exceptions.

[JohnGraham 0]

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canopy checking on flight line sounds good but is it really going to be accepted? I'm sure this kind of thing has been dsicussed before...

I think it would make little difference, to be honest - jumpers who are new to the center have to go through Ian and be "aproved" anyway, and those that want to downsize to canopies too small for them, well, I wouldn't want to be the one to tell my mate I won't sign him off - although in reality I think I would if I really was woried about them. Anyway if I did, they'd probably just whinge about me being a low-timer and just go get someone else to sign them off. And maybe they'd be right, but I'm not putting my signature down if I'm not happy to stand up in front of an inquest and explain my actions.

[adamsr 0]

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I was reading the ops manual today, I like these new 'grades'.

The implementation of them will be a ball ache.

If they stop people from spanking themselves into the ground so often, then thats good.

As the stats show, most people get injured/dead under a perfect canopy.

This should go someway to correcting that.

gotta agree with you here, i support the new regs and think it's well overdue that something was done.

It is gonna be a bit of a bitch switching over to the new system, and i hope they have grandad rights, at least for long enough for everyone to update their ratings.

I do think british skydivers will benefit from less deaths under canopy in the long run though, which can never be a bad thing!!

[reddevil1 0]

But if we sill have the same death rate,with the new systems ....what then.....?only time will tell.

The point of no return what a rush.

[adamsr 0]

that would cause issues, but really the problem of people getting injured/killed under a perfectly good canopy can't continue.

Something had to be done and these new regulations are at least a step in the right direction. I'm sure the regulations will be reviewed and refined as time goes on.

[efex 0]

What I would like to know is what restrictions will be placed on foreign jumpers in the UK with 200-400 jumps who do not posses a form of CP1 and want to swoop. Will they have to be signed off for the cp1 qualification first?

Warwick University Skydiving Club

[mr2mk1g 10]

I'm guessing here... but it'd probably be something similar to where they want to freefly or join RW formations but there is no national freefly/rw qualification back home.

Then it's basically at the CCI's discression based on the contents of your logbook, what qualifications you do have and what kind of attitude you have... that's if it's actually picked up upon.

[reddevil1 0]

when you go to a uk drop zone ,u find out,cci discretion mean's buy him/her beer'ssssssssssssssssssssssssssss,.

The point of no return what a rush.