franz69 0 #1 February 5, 2004 Hello, I have one question considering emergency exit from an airplane. I read in a recent discussion that the skydiver were "respecting" the delay between jumpers at 2000 foot from a plane with only one motor working. My feeling would me more to do a kind of continuous exit every second and then track and open. For that I see two main reasons, which is to facilitate the job of the pilot and to escape quickly from a messy situation. Thank you to give me your opinion and maybe the best practices. See you in the air, Franz#1141 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #2 February 5, 2004 I wouldn't have thought you'd have a lot of time to track from 2000? It's probably be better to let the airspeed sort out your separation rather than exiting, tracking and then opening... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jerm 0 #3 February 5, 2004 this really should be in safety and training, but i'm sure it'l get moved anyway. It's all up to the pilot. In a 1 engine out scenerio, if you're not already in an unrecoverable spin by the time she says get out, she's probably got good control of the airplane. At that point the plane won't climb much if at all with a full load, so you get out, but it's not necessarily as urgent as, say, an engine fire or a stabilizer ripped off. If the pilot caually mentioned there's an engine out and everyone needs to get out low, you can probably afford a little exit separation (not what you would normally give for freefall, as you don't need to account for drift). If the pilot shouts "GET THE FUCK OUT" and takes out their rosary or starts getting up to follow you, exit separation be damned, you've got a better chance in a wrap. Landing without injury is not necessarily evidence that you didn't fuck up... it just means you got away with it this time Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #4 February 5, 2004 QuoteI read in a recent discussion that the skydiver were "respecting" the delay between jumpers at 2000 foot from a plane with only one motor working. My feeling would me more to do a kind of continuous exit every second and then track and open. For that I see two main reasons, which is to facilitate the job of the pilot and to escape quickly from a messy situation. You don't need much seperation if you are opening right out the door. I did some 4 way CRW jumps years ago,a nd trust me if you bail and pull...you will be much further away than you think from the other folks. But like Jerm said, take your cue from the pilot. If he is like "Hey guys...Im gonna bring her around and let you guys out" You could take a second or two...If he is asking the AFF instructors for tips on a good exit that he can do...Well I'd go faster. If the plane is spinning...Well just get the fuck out. If you are flying at say 10 grand, and one of the engines blow on the plane...And the pilot tells you to get out...DON'T put floaters out and try to launch a chunk....Don't ask HOW I know this, but trust me it kinda pisses the pilot off."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lippy 918 #5 February 5, 2004 QuoteIf the plane is spinning...Well just get the fuck out. I've been in a spinning jump-plane after the pilot lost control. The Gs had my hand pinned to my leg and opening the door was out, let alone getting over to it.I got nuthin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #6 February 5, 2004 If you are bailing at 2,000 feet there is no need to track. Let the plane do the seperating for you. Also, some main canopies opening at 2,000 feet take awhile so you need to know your gear and what you will do at each exit altitude if you had to. Waisting time tracking while exiting at 2,000 feet can put you in jeapordy for other bad things to happen. If the plane is under control and you are doing what I term a "precautionary exit" then just do solo hop-n-pops at regular intervals. Talk to the pilot. If the plane is spinning out of control and you are losing parts in flight then it is every man for themselve. The LAST thing you want to have happen is everyone shifting around in a panic and exiting. You can cause problems for the pilot AND for you and your fellow jumpers. It is an exciting situation the first time it happens to you. So, do yourself and everyone a favor. Breathe in really deep and hold it. Count to 3. Then exhale slow. Ok, what is going? What is the pilot doing and is the pilot talking to anyone about the situation. They have procedures to go through so give them a chance to do something before exiting on your own. Get with some really experienced people and talk out senarios. There are more than can be talked about here. Make sure everyone is on the same page at your DZ about what to do in an aircraft emergency. The last thing you need to have is an arguement during an emergency. There should be some structure to your thought process before you get in the air. 3,000 hours flying skydivers. 5 engine failures in jump planes. 3 dead stick landings. 2 precautionary exit runs as pilot.Chris Schindler www.diverdriver.com ATP/D-19012 FB #4125 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #7 February 5, 2004 QuoteQuoteIf the plane is spinning...Well just get the fuck out. I've been in a spinning jump-plane after the pilot lost control. The Gs had my hand pinned to my leg and opening the door was out, let alone getting over to it. Ok, this is a bit of a smartass question but also I'm interested in the answer. Did you make it? What happened? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #8 February 5, 2004 no chris he died sorry - couldnt resist it edit: (would love to hear the story too) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #9 February 5, 2004 Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- If the plane is spinning...Well just get the fuck out. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I've been in a spinning jump-plane after the pilot lost control. The Gs had my hand pinned to my leg and opening the door was out, let alone getting over to it. ----------------------------------------------------------- Would you feell better if I said TRY to get the fuck out? I hvae known people to manage to get out...but trying is better than just siting there and dying anyday"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lippy 918 #10 February 5, 2004 We were at 10,500 in a 182 on a night jump. All of a sudden things were really loud and I was watching stars spinning through the windshield. He got it back at about 5 grand. Apparently he flew us into a thunder cloud or something. I didn't stick around long enough to find out, and havn't been back to that DZ since.I got nuthin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 37 #11 February 5, 2004 I had a guy fly a 182 into a cloud about 7 grand. When we came out we were on our back, nose down and heading down with 2 or 3 positive G's. I was not a happy camper.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diverdriver 5 #12 February 5, 2004 QuoteWe were at 10,500 in a 182 on a night jump. All of a sudden things were really loud and I was watching stars spinning through the windshield. He got it back at about 5 grand. Apparently he flew us into a thunder cloud or something. I didn't stick around long enough to find out, and havn't been back to that DZ since. Dude! Not cool. And on a night jump? Man. Not cool at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lippy 918 #13 February 5, 2004 Very not cool. That DZ is a shit-show. Student fatalities aren't rare there, most experienced jumpers in the area hate the DZO, except a few people who were booted from the other local DZ and go there to be instructors. I started there, left when I found a better place and came back that one night for night jumps. On that same jump I busted myself up bad on landing and they wouldn't call me an ambulance cause they'd bounced a student earlier that week and the media was watching close.I got nuthin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #14 February 6, 2004 Can I just add a comment here? I haven't been in a real emergency (thank you God, and yes, I'm knocking wood). Please DON'T JOKE about needing to do one, especially if you're sitting in the front of the plane, and the plane has just done something rather "odd"...this is not healthy. People might pound you a bit when you get down; at the very least you might have some chubby irish chick in your face, who got all geared up in about 2 seconds flat at 8K, reaching for the door and ready to bail. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Foursprouts 0 #15 February 7, 2004 If a plane has one engine out and is holding level or even in a slight descent the worst thing would be to move 3500lbs to the back of the plane suddenly. A rear CG in one engine flight causes the speed at which you start spinning to be much higher due to the rudder being less affective. The pilot should be well above this speed but if they are not expecting their rudder to suddenly loose alot of force it may mean that no one gets out of a situation that could have ended with little problem. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
