Advice on Spins and Leg Awareness

[tri2sing 0]

I am a AFF student who has had a problem with spins. I have cleared level 5, but here is the problem. Took 2 jumps to clear level 3, 3 for level 4, and have already made 2 attempts at level 6 :(

Every level that I have had to repeat has been because I went into a spin. Of the 5 times I have gone into a spin, 4 have been to the left. The fifth time the first spin was to the left, the JM stopped it, then the next one was to the right.

Here is the clincher. On level 6 jumps I have been able to manage a stable exit. I have gone into the spin after doing the circle of awareness.

We have figured out that it is my leg position that is causing the problem. It seems that I let a leg get pushed in too much. Is there someone who can advise me on this?

Is there some way to build awareness about my leg position during the fall? If I am aware of my leg position, maybe then I can feel my leg getting pushed inward, then I can try and counter it.

Thanks in advance

--- You live only once ---

[Nightingale 0]

well, this is from a martial arts perspective rather than a skydiving perspective, but it sounds like one leg is stronger than the other. you're using equal force to push down on the air, but since one is stronger, that leg pushes more, and you spin.

I see something similar when my martial arts students are working on their kicks.

Get on a leg weight machine at the gym and see how much you can lift with each leg individually to see if there is a difference. Then, make an effort to work the weaker leg.

[Hazarrd 1]

are you getting video of it? if so, look at what you are doing wrong and practice the right way on the ground. its much different doing it in the air but thats really the best thing to do. the other option is to go to a wind tunnel.

.-.

[chuteless 1]

Go back to the postings on DZ.com for Jan 18-19th 2004. There was some discussion on this topic that may help you

If you find one leg is bending in and causing you a problem, bend the other match it and keep symetrical.

Bill Cole D-41

[EdC 0]

You might also try tapping your toes together in free fall just so your brain can figure out where your feet and legs are.

Big Ed

[FrogNog 1]

Quote

If I am aware of my leg position, maybe then I can feel my leg getting pushed inward, then I can try and counter it.

If you are starting to turn, you could just counter the turn. I'm not saying this is easy, but I am saying that you don't need to feel your leg being pushed in to know you're starting to turn, and which way - your eyes can tell you that.

-=-=-=-=-
Pull.

[arlo 0]

drive down to orlando, get in the tunnel for 10 minutes and work it out in there. 7 hrs from atl to orlando. book first, though. if you need help, PM me. $135 for 10 minutes is a helluva lot cheaper than 3 or 4 dropped levels due to a turn. seriously, it'll be worth the drive to figure out what's going on....

arlo

[benny 0]

No offense to you arlo but there's a shorter travel option. Pigeon Forge, TN has a wind tunnel and I'm sure they'd be happy to work on your leg problems.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[arlo 0]

it takes an aweful lot to offend me. i tend to think about skyventure for the more obvious reason. flyaway in pigeon forge is indeed a few hours closer to atlanta. i just have alot of friends that drive down from atl on a regular basis, so i'm used to that scenario more often.
blues,
arlo

[benny 0]

No problem, just supporting the home state ya know. The only wind tunnel experience i have was pre-pubescent and scared the shit out of me. But Pigeon Forge is definitely closer to hotlanta... As stated before though, don't forgert your toe-taps! And if you're turning one way, maybe think the other way.

Never go to a DZ strip show.

[ScubaSteve 0]

How do you book time in the tunnel?

[Nightingale 0]

call the tunnel in orlando, or perris valley in california. make an appointment. buy a plane ticket.

[arlo 0]

yep...what she said. call the tunnel once you have some idea when you are going to be in town, then reserve some time....

PM me if you have any questions...

arlo

p.s. LOVE that avatar.... resssssssssspect. aiiii.

[LouYoung 0]

Quote

If you are starting to turn, you could just counter the turn.

I think this is good advice.

Who cares where your legs are? You're starting to turn, so counter it. You've progressed to AFF Level 6, so you know how to do turns. Fly your body at all times. Don't expect to fly straight and level by putting your body into a neutral position and freezing it.

When you're driving down the road in your car, if you hold the steering wheel straight and freeze it, your car will veer out of your lane. You constantly steer the car to keep in your lane. Even if the car is out of alignment and the steering wheel is cocked to one side, you can still manage to keep it pointed in the right direction (I hope).

Use your knowledge of turning to counter the un-intentional turn to get through the AFF level. Eventually, the truely neutral position should come naturally and heading control will become an innate ability where you don't even think about it anymore.

DISCLAIMER: I'm a low time jumper. Don't listen to anything I say.

Lou

[Mad47 0]

I totally support Arlo. If I knew about SkyVenture and impact of wind tunnel training on freefall skills I would go there before making my first aff jump. It is not only about passing aff. Get some tunnel time and you jumps will be so much better when you get your license and start jumping with other people.

[Mad47 0]

I am sorry, but I have to say that all this looks like a bunch of bad advices.

Quote

Who cares where your legs are?

Everybody does. Most of the beginners problems with spins are due to uneven legs. That is why toe taps are included to aff training. Most of young jumpers do not use legs at all or use them wrong because they cannot see them.

Quote

You've progressed to AFF Level 6, so you know how to do turns.

Do you?
When I took my first tunnel camp with 350 jumps under my belt I realized that I know nothing about turns.

[Synapse 0]

I can't possibly agree more with arlo, I had similar problems with uncontrolled spins on AFF 3 and swore off jumping again until I could get some time in a tunnel. I made a post about that a few months back that you may want to check out.

To summarize that post... I felt way way more comfortable with my ability to control myself in free fall after spending time in the tunnel and its a lot cheaper than repeating AFF levels. Also as someone else stated, its not just about getting through AFF. You have to think about what quality you want from your jumps after AFF and how safe you want to make those jumps for yourself (being unstable isn't exactly a good thing). For me, the added enjoyment that came from jumping and not having to worry so much about my body position made the trip to orlando and the cost of the training well worth it.

benny: I totally understand supporting the home state.
-syn

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain
a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty
nor safety. - Benjamin Franklin

[Surf 0]

Newbie here as well. Caveat Insilior.

If you take the "who cares" approach to your legs, you have to counter poor leg position with poor arm position. with a bad enough leg position you could tie yourself into a pretzel- not very fun, not very stable, very difficult to do RW with your legs and arms all out of whack.

"Nothing is written"- T.E. Lawrence

[cruzit 0]

While countering your turn is one solution to the problem...it could cause problems later down the road. You may have to unlearn that body position. If you do decide to counter the turn...make sure you counter just enough to stop the spin...then adjust your body position back to neutral.

If you aren't getting video on your skydives, it would be well worth your money to do so. Have your instructors critique your position. Sometimes if you can visually see where you went wrong it will help you to fix the problem.

Hang in there and be patient with yourself...you'll get it.