dragon2 2
riggerrob 643
QuoteQuoteWhen I researched retro fitting RSL's to some people's gear after this incident - I was told by a chute shop rep that doing so would invalidate the TSO and should he come across the rig in the future - he would destroy it.t
That is just nuts? How can a company destroy something that's not their property anymore? Declare it unairworthy, okay, but not damaging it in any way.
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Funny, I remember Ray Farrell (sp?) at Action Air bragging that he had FAA approval to retrofit RSLs to almost every rig on the market. Once you understand RSL design, retrofits are not that difficult, but still best left to Master Riggers who have factory drawings.
For example, Ray retro-fitted an RSL to my 1985-vintage Mirage Astra.
As for the concept of destroying gear - that has been retrofitted without factory approval - sorry, but that does not work in a capitalist economy.
PhreeZone 20
>There seem to be quite a few "pros" who don't wear cypres'.
The reason a lot of the professional swoopers don't have a cypres is because until the Cypres2 they were not water resistant and even now with the Cypres2 there is still maintence required if the unit gets wet. A lot of the pro swoopers also have two rigs, one for nothing but clear and pulls thats designed for runs on the water and a freefall rig.
I'm yet to see a Open level 4 way team that did'nt have Cypres or Virgil's if they wanted them. Thats pro's... Instructors trying to make their living off jumping often lookat the Cypres as a summer's worth of food. There is a difference in the level of professionalism there.
The reason a lot of the professional swoopers don't have a cypres is because until the Cypres2 they were not water resistant and even now with the Cypres2 there is still maintence required if the unit gets wet. A lot of the pro swoopers also have two rigs, one for nothing but clear and pulls thats designed for runs on the water and a freefall rig.
I'm yet to see a Open level 4 way team that did'nt have Cypres or Virgil's if they wanted them. Thats pro's... Instructors trying to make their living off jumping often lookat the Cypres as a summer's worth of food. There is a difference in the level of professionalism there.
Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery
Parachutemanuals.com
And tomorrow is a mystery
Parachutemanuals.com
QuoteQuoteYou can never tell how you will react in a situation till you've been there.
Excellent point, and 100% true! I have never cutaway, in fact, in one instance that I should've cutaway, I did not. I can only hope I learned a good lesson from that and will realize that next time I need to cutaway. But, I won't know until I get there, I can say I learned, I can believe I learned, but I won't KNOW I learned until I save myself when the time comes.
Angela.
What about the time when you don't pull (or pull too low)? Unfortunately, there won't be a next time to learn from your mistake and try again.
I agree that its a personal decision, however, I am one of those 'pro aad' guys. I made my first 200+ jumps without an AAD. I considered myself a very altitude aware skydiver. Then one day while doing an eval dive (for my S/L JM Rating) I was lurking a student (who was doing 15 second delays with a JM) and had my first experience with getting 'wrapped up in something else'.. well the student dumped, we (JM and myself) tracked and dumped. Holy Sh*t, I looked at my altimiter and I was sitting in at about 1000'...
That was my first and only experience with a really dangerous (low pull) situation. I learned from it alright. I learned that I can and did make a mistake. I learned that an AAD would have saved my life in a few more seconds of freefall.
Like others, I just could not afford it (prior to that incident) because I was a poor college student.. blaa .. blaa... Well, I went out and got a credit card with a $1200 credit limit; and bought myself a new CYPRES. I spent the next year paying down the credit card as fast as I could.
I hope that I never screw up and it never activates. The day that it does I will be happy that I spent the money on it -- and so will my family and friends.
Quotebut at this time, I can't justify the cost of one vs the chance that i'll need one.
I am not sure what you mean by this?
QuoteI am not sure what you mean by this?
It means, i'm still paying down credit debt from AFF. I don't have any credit left. I can't justify the cost of one of these things when the chances i'll need it are slim. I know they are there, and when I have more $$ I intend to get one. I just don't at this time.
I understand your points, please know that I am not arguing here. An aad is a great device. I wish I had one. I personally just haven't got the cash right now to spend on one. I will get one next year.
Angela.
Auryn 0
Quote>Can you explain please?
Interestingly, Lutz was a current AFF-JM. I had asked him earlier in the day what he would do if he ever found himself at 1200 feet in freefall. He said he'd pull his reserve, then pantomined doing it. And he couldn't make himself pull his reserve when he got low - his instinct to go for the main was too strong. That's why I think it's a good idea that people with a cypres get CRW training, because if you do get low, you're gonna go for your main no matter what you tell yourself.
I am glad I am not the only one. When I went low (pulled below 1500, flatline on my audible) I went directly for my main. no hesitation, no thinking, I just did it.
I second your conclusion 100 percent. and taking the time to think (main or reserve????) could just make it worse.
I sat in at just about a grand. no cypres fire. luckily.
blue ones.
D 27808
billvon 2,990
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>What about the time when you don't pull?
Then the cypres may save you.
>(or pull too low)?
Then the cypres may injure or kill you. Two-out scenarios can be very dangerous. It's a tradeoff. In general cypreses do far more good than harm, but they can turn an otherwise uneventful low opening into a life-threatening situation.
>That was my first and only experience with a really dangerous (low
> pull) situation. I learned from it alright. I learned that I can and did
> make a mistake. I learned that an AAD would have saved my life in
> a few more seconds of freefall.
Those are two good lessons to learn, but I hope that you also learned to better judge altitude, preferably visually. That's the primary lesson there.
>>but at this time, I can't justify the cost of one vs the chance that i'll
>> need one.
>I am not sure what you mean by this?
Everyone chooses what to spend money on. For some, training (i.e. AFF jumps, coach jumps, canopy training) may be a wiser choice than an AAD. If you have a choice to either stay current or get an AAD and avoid jumping for a year, you are probably better off staying current. For some jumpers (i.e. jumpers who only do C+P's because they are jumping high performance canopies) staying current may be _far_ more important than getting a cypres.
If you have the money, of course, it would probably make sense to do both.
Then the cypres may save you.
>(or pull too low)?
Then the cypres may injure or kill you. Two-out scenarios can be very dangerous. It's a tradeoff. In general cypreses do far more good than harm, but they can turn an otherwise uneventful low opening into a life-threatening situation.
>That was my first and only experience with a really dangerous (low
> pull) situation. I learned from it alright. I learned that I can and did
> make a mistake. I learned that an AAD would have saved my life in
> a few more seconds of freefall.
Those are two good lessons to learn, but I hope that you also learned to better judge altitude, preferably visually. That's the primary lesson there.
>>but at this time, I can't justify the cost of one vs the chance that i'll
>> need one.
>I am not sure what you mean by this?
Everyone chooses what to spend money on. For some, training (i.e. AFF jumps, coach jumps, canopy training) may be a wiser choice than an AAD. If you have a choice to either stay current or get an AAD and avoid jumping for a year, you are probably better off staying current. For some jumpers (i.e. jumpers who only do C+P's because they are jumping high performance canopies) staying current may be _far_ more important than getting a cypres.
If you have the money, of course, it would probably make sense to do both.
riggerrob 643
Everyone chooses what to spend money on. For some, training (i.e. AFF jumps, coach jumps, canopy training) may be a wiser choice than an AAD.
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Interesting concept Bill.
For some people limited funds would be safer spent on coach dives ...
... replacing a worn-out main ...
... replacing an un-reliable altimeter ...
... replacing scratched goggles, so they can read their altimeter ...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Interesting concept Bill.
For some people limited funds would be safer spent on coach dives ...
... replacing a worn-out main ...
... replacing an un-reliable altimeter ...
... replacing scratched goggles, so they can read their altimeter ...
skypuppy 1
he said thats why he uses a cypress and said some d00d once had 12000 jumps and got KO'd by a lesser experienced jumper and went in
In actual fact he the 12000 jump skydiver had a cypres on his rig - he just didn't remember to turn it on.
In actual fact he the 12000 jump skydiver had a cypres on his rig - he just didn't remember to turn it on.
If some old guy can do it then obviously it can't be very extreme. Otherwise he'd already be dead.
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone
Bruce McConkey 'I thought we were gonna die, and I couldn't think of anyone
New to the post, and this might be a stupid question; but why would you? To me it sounds like high risk vs. no reward.
Hey, not being an a** (and as far as I am concerned people are entitle to make their own decisions) I am a NOOBIE, maybe there is something I am missing.
Hey, not being an a** (and as far as I am concerned people are entitle to make their own decisions) I am a NOOBIE, maybe there is something I am missing.
"I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET
billvon 2,990
>New to the post, and this might be a stupid question; but why would you?
Why would you what?
Why would you what?
Jump without one. What's the point? Does the presence of it somehow diminish the dive?
"I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET
billvon 2,990
>Jump without one. What's the point?
I think for most people it's a money thing. A jumper under a small parachute has to be current to land it safely - for them, it's probably better to spend the $1200 to stay current than to buy a cypres. It's best to do both, of course, but not all people have that kind of money. (And of course some people, like swoopers, may push the limits of the cypres and decide not to use one to avoid misfires.)
I think for most people it's a money thing. A jumper under a small parachute has to be current to land it safely - for them, it's probably better to spend the $1200 to stay current than to buy a cypres. It's best to do both, of course, but not all people have that kind of money. (And of course some people, like swoopers, may push the limits of the cypres and decide not to use one to avoid misfires.)
Got ya. I guess I was looking at it like seat belts; I did not realize that there could be a downside depending on your personal style and/or preferences.
"I gargle no man's balls..." ussfpa on SOCNET
"Jump without one. What's the point? Does the presence of it somehow diminish the dive?"
No more than its presence enhances a dive.
That said I used to jump with a guy who didn't use a Cypres, he felt it detracted from his sense of being master of his own destiny.
'Chaque un a son gout' as they say in France, or chuck in whats good.
My opinion is, the only valid excuse for not jumping an AAD is financial as discussed above.
No more than its presence enhances a dive.
That said I used to jump with a guy who didn't use a Cypres, he felt it detracted from his sense of being master of his own destiny.
'Chaque un a son gout' as they say in France, or chuck in whats good.
My opinion is, the only valid excuse for not jumping an AAD is financial as discussed above.
--------------------
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson
That is just nuts? How can a company destroy something that's not their property anymore? Declare it unairworthy, okay, but not damaging it in any way.
Well I happen to have an old Chute Shop container, with retrofitted RSL. Tough.
ciel bleu,
Saskia
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