smellysue 0 #26 February 25, 2004 I'd just ask Chris L he'd prob give us an answer he's bound to know if it is mandatory before we go over or while we're there dont want to be spending money on gear when it can be spent on jumps do you cos i know i dont even though i'd prob chip in for it for you just cos i loves ya though... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mjosparky 4 #27 February 25, 2004 Quotefor all those who want the aad's mandatory, we better install two nets, one above the other, in case one fails..YIKES!!!! Then the FAA would step in and you would need a certified spoter, otter, skyvan, DC-3, to be on each jumpship. You don't want to miss the net. SparkyMy idea of a fair fight is clubbing baby seals Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jumpmunki 0 #28 February 25, 2004 so then, does it mean that nets are mandatory in the USA then or just marshmallows Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #29 February 25, 2004 looks like you'll need an AAD anyway - I've heard that the BPA are making them compulsory in the UK they were talking about bringing it in this July... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 140 #30 February 25, 2004 QuoteQuotewhats that??? Have them or turn them on??? Have them. If you have one...why wouldn't you turn it on? That just seems rather silly to me. Just MHO though. when you do jumps outside of the AAD capacities... for example landing much higher or lower than the take off place... or when you know that the the flight path of the aircraft will pass lower than the take off alitude possible in mountain, with balloons etc...scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jumpmunki 0 #31 February 25, 2004 yoink, only for people studant and intermidiate B licence and over it isn't (thats what i heard from our cci anyway) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #32 February 25, 2004 i heard up to C... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pkasdorf 0 #33 February 25, 2004 Since this is the GENERAL SKYDIVING DISCUSSIONS FORUM it's great to joke and have fun! If it were the SAFETY & TRAINING FORUM I am sure we would have already heard from Moderators stating that one should not make fun of well proven safety measures that have saved so many lives!!! If one would ask if reserve parachutes are mandatory one would get the same sample of funny answers, including the marshmallows and double nets... But activated AAD's are very important for safety, very close to regularly repacked reserve parachutes! I think they should be as mandatory as reserve parachutes are. I cannot think of any reasonable argument against. The $$$ argument is understandable but not valid in such a risky sport which is quite expensive and an AAD does not add significantly to the overall cost of skydiving!!! HISPA # 18 POPS # 8757 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuteless 1 #34 February 25, 2004 Hey, are you trying to tell me its mandatory to wear a parachute......damn, just when this sport was getting interesting !!!! I think it must be a CSPA conspiracy Bill Cole D-41 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #35 February 25, 2004 Quotefrom the 1st July 2004, all parachutists below FAI ‘B’ Certificate, excluding parachutists jumping Traditional (front & back) static line equipment, must use equipment fitted with an operational AAD which must be switched on prior to any descent. Quotethat from the 1st July 2004 all parachutists taking part in display jumps must use equipment fitted with an operational AAD which must be switched on prior to any descent. QuoteNote: The above two decisions will be worded as Operations Manual amendments for presentation at the STC meeting of the 8th April 2004. Extract from the STC minutes...so, the only extra people it is now mandatory for are 'A' Licence Holders and those doing demos. Also, this has not yet been passed, it first needs to be ratified by STC on 08/04/2004, then at the next Council meeting.--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vt1977 0 #36 February 25, 2004 AADs will be mandatory at Nethers as of 1st April 2004 and at a number of other UK DZs too. IMHO It’s only a matter of time before they'll be mandatory for all in the UK. Vicki Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pkasdorf 0 #37 February 25, 2004 Exactly! HISPA # 18 POPS # 8757 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jumpmunki 0 #38 February 25, 2004 ho hum ... i wanted to come to netheravon in may as well Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #39 February 25, 2004 Quote I think they should be as mandatory as reserve parachutes are. I cannot think of any reasonable argument against. An AAD can kill you. I think that's why they should stay optional. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Liemberg 0 #40 February 25, 2004 QuoteHey, are you trying to tell me its mandatory to wear a parachute......damn, just when this sport was getting interesting !!!! No,no,no - this thread is about mandatory AAD's. Means you could jump without the rig and let your buddy carry it for you. But it should have an AAD. Wouldn't that add a bit more spice to certain endeavors? "Whoever in discussion adduces authority uses not intellect but memory." - Leonardo da Vinci A thousand words... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bmcd308 0 #41 February 25, 2004 >>Oh I don't want aad's mandatory...I just want to jump into a net from 13,500' Now that would be a rush! << You better learn to spot GOOD. ---------------------------------- www.jumpelvis.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yoink 321 #42 February 25, 2004 Quote You better learn to spot GOOD. LMAO!! launch a 4 way, turn a couple of points, look down... oh crap.. we're deep! TRACK!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #43 February 25, 2004 QuoteAn AAD can kill you. Yes someone could be killed due to an AAD firing (duel out canopy entagglement scenario). But who's fault was that? The AADs? No!!! The skydiver ... Personally I think AADs are good. But should they be mandatory? Probably not ... Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
krkeenan 0 #44 February 25, 2004 QuoteI think it should be, Bullshit ! If you want to jump one, then do so. But what kind of socialist are you to want to require ME to wear one? kevin====================== Seasons don't fear the Reaper, nor do the Wind, the Sun, or the Rain... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #45 February 25, 2004 USPA BSRs specify that AADs are already mandatory for students (anyone not holding an A license or higher). Anyone with an A license or higher may choose not to have one. This should be true of any dropzone that is affiliated with USPA. Dropzones not affiliated with USPA may still require an AAD - it is up to the dropzone owner. Even USPA dropzones may still require AADs for jumpers that have an A license or higher. Bottom line - no, AADs aren't required for everyone in the USA. Ask the S&TA at the dropzone.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pkasdorf 0 #46 February 25, 2004 QuoteQuote I think they should be as mandatory as reserve parachutes are. I cannot think of any reasonable argument against. An AAD can kill you. I think that's why they should stay optional. Could you be some more specific? Because if it concerns the two out scenario, I would say that if you do not wear a reserve parachute it won't happen... but you do wear a reserve parachute. Pros of wearing it way outlast the cons, for reserve parachutes and I would say nearly as well for AAD's. That is why I think they should be mandatory as they are in more and more countries. Honestly I do not believe, based in facts, that they should be optional because of the risk of doble out. With all due respect, and admitting that I may be wrong since I am very far away from being a top experienced skydiver, once again, pros way outlast cons. HISPA # 18 POPS # 8757 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chuteless 1 #47 February 25, 2004 I think anyone who wants to wer one should be allowed> If they gave me one for free, I'd set it to open at sea level, or not open at all. If I cant take care of myseklf in freefall then I shouldnt be there. As for always having a reserve...I jumped with one only about 15 times...and would again if required. I do wear a reserve unless the situation would give me a reason not to. That is MY personal approach. I am not recommending it to anyone else. Bill Cole Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkM 0 #48 February 25, 2004 Quote Could you be some more specific? Because if it concerns the two out scenario, I would say that if you do not wear a reserve parachute it won't happen... but you do wear a reserve parachute. So you're saying that if an AAD misfires the fault is in that you wore a reserve parachute? I guess you could look at it that way. I'm not anti-AAD, I just spent 1350 on one two days ago, because I'm a lowbie jumper and I should be wearing one. But while the disclaimer says: Quote Automatic activation devices(AADs) sometimes fail to operate properly, and sometimes activate when they should not, even when properly installed and operated. Therefore the user risks serious injury or even death to themselves and others during each use. Then I don't think they should be manditory. It's just opinion, no real right or wrong to it, and in 10 years if AAD reliability improves as much as it has in the last 10 then I might even change it. I'm just uncomfortable with the idea of forcing people to use tech that could kill them for what may be, for their situation, small benefits. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andrewwhyte 1 #49 February 26, 2004 QuoteAn AAD can kill you. Yes, and a mothers milk can drown a baby. Do you know anyone who was killed by an AAD? I'm not talking about someone whose name you can't remember but you heard the story about. I mean someone you knew or were there to witness. I have known several people who were saved by AADs, I have known some people who an AAD would have saved if they had had one, but I have never in my nineteen years in the sport known anyone, nor have I had the misfortune to be intimate with the details of anyone getting killed by their opener. This is not a pitch for manditory AADs; it is merely a rebuttal to those who claim detriments other than financial ones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pkasdorf 0 #50 February 26, 2004 QuoteQuote Could you be some more specific? Because if it concerns the two out scenario, I would say that if you do not wear a reserve parachute it won't happen... but you do wear a reserve parachute. So you're saying that if an AAD misfires the fault is in that you wore a reserve parachute? I guess you could look at it that way. I didn't mean exactly that. I meant that an absolutely indisputable item like a reserve parachute is involved in a double out. But I got your point. Anyway, I keep thinking that the pros way outweigh the cons and therefore it should be made mandatory. But it's just my opinion. It would be interesting to know the Moderators opinion. due to their knowledge and experience. Peace and love! HISPA # 18 POPS # 8757 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
