Skydiving Death vs. Alcohol Death.

[jmpnkramer 0]

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both people are responsible for avoiding other traffic.

Well there Mr. Moderator GUY Youi are sadly mistaken.

In my case the guy hook turned into me. We were the only two in the sky. There are several witnesses to the fact. It was the last day and he was demoing something he should not have. The medics saved his life that day by holding me down!

He hit me from behind. I was lower jumper.

With this philosophy then; A person who blows a stop sign or red light and kills the other driver the driver that died was at fault as well? I do not think so there guy. WAKE UP!

I sure would like to see how you teach your students!

PILOT ERROR is just that ERROR! It is not necessarily stupid.


Laters,

KRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

The REAL KRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMER!

"HESITATION CAUSES DEATH!!!"
"Be Slow to Fall into Friendship; but when Thou Art in, Continue Firm & Constant." - SOCRATES

[billvon 2,991]

>In my case the guy hook turned into me. We were the only two in
> the sky. There are several witnesses to the fact. It was the last day
> and he was demoing something he should not have. The medics
> saved his life that day by holding me down!

>He hit me from behind. I was lower jumper.

Then he was mostly at fault. You were at fault for not knowing where he was. You bear less responsibility than him, but you still lost track of the ONLY other person in the sky who was a collision risk to you.

"Lower jumper has right of way." We've all heard that. Some of those lower jumpers are now dead as a result of their collision. Is claiming that "they had the right of way" going to help save the next two people who collide? Cause it sure doesn't help the dead guy.

You have to literally have eyes in the back of your head when you skydive. If you're on short final, and you see someone cross above your canopy? Glance behind your canopy to see if they're about to hook into you. If you are doing a low timer 8 way and there are only 7 people in the formation? Take a second and locate the 8th jumper. If you're about to pull? Make sure you wave off and look above you so that someone doesn't come ripping through your canopy. Perhaps you would be in the "right" if any of those people took you out, but being right doesn't pay the hospital bills.

>With this philosophy then; A person who blows a stop sign or red
> light and kills the other driver the driver that died was at fault as
> well? I do not think so there guy. WAKE UP!

Yes, if the other driver breezed through the intersection without so much as a glance at the other traffic to see that it has stopped. I've learned this the hard way; I was almost killed a few years back by a car that drove through an intersection at 60mph against a red light and almost took me out (I was on a bike.) Now I make sure traffic is stopping before I cross. Why? Because my life is MY responsibility, not the traffic light's. I could just cross anyway, and after I was killed, my family could claim "but he wasn't at fault! He was right." And I'd still be dead.

So decide if you want to be right or alive, and plan your skydives accordingly.

>I sure would like to see how you teach your students!

You're welcome to sit in on a class one of these days if you like. I teach them that their life is 100% THEIR responsibility; no one else will save them.

>PILOT ERROR is just that ERROR! It is not necessarily stupid.

An error you make that injures or kills you is a stupid mistake to make. I've made them; you will probably make them too. If we learn from them, we come out ahead. If we blame the accident on everything and everyone else, then we haven't learned a thing - and we are no safer than before we started.

[nightjumps 1]

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The odds of a chute just "not opening" altogether are about 1 in 50,000.

The probability of the chute not opening is 1:50,000. The odds are 50/50 (actually 1:1). Or would the percentage of 99.997 of it opening be the probability? So long ago... anyone help?

Paging Dr. John, Paging Dr. John.

[smellysue 0]

Kramer I know how you feel my proper dad is in jail due to stuff he did when drunk and has be from when i was 3 years old Im now 22 figer out what he did if you can. (life sentance) needles to say I had a twin sister and dont any more.

For this reason I dont like acohol either. My other half knows this and doesnt get him self drunk for that perpoise he at the most has 2 pints. and has offered to stop compleatly I said it was up to him.

I dont agree with drink driving or skydiving and I have the same views on drugs as my brother is on a life sentance for dealing.

Needles to say I turned out ok Im a trainned Nursery nurse and a Security gurad and no poilice record at all. just as well considering my adopted dad is a cop and my adopted mam is a maths teacher.

I think if ppl do insitst on drinking and then skydiving they should make sure they are not over limit just like driving and if drugs and skydiving they should be grounded.

[billvon 2,991]

>I think if ppl do insitst on drinking and then skydiving they should
>make sure they are not over limit just like driving . . .

Hmm. I might have two beers and drive home (which puts me just under the legal limit) but there's no way I'd have two beers and jump unless conditions were _very_ controlled (i.e. I was a passenger on a tandem.) The environments (judgement and skill required, less oxygen etc) make the skydiving environment a little more demanding, I think.

[WayneRATS 0]

but saying that , in the uk it's illegal to be drunk ON ANYTHING (even painkillers or caffine) and jump

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Can You Ere Me Now?

[nacmacfeegle 0]

Don't confuse 'illegal' and 'in contravention of BPA guidelines'.

If I get on the early bird after a hard night, and over the limit (what limit?) will I be charged, fined, face a jail sentence?

Not that I hold with 'jumping under the influence', I'm just curious to find out what, if any, 'legal' (as in the law of the land -or air?), conditions apply?

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He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson

[akarunway 1]

I'd like to know the answer to that one also. I've been stopped from jumping or questioned at a couple DZ's for having a little leftover breath. But the skygods are never questioned. They will let me operate a crane at a power plant as long as you are under .02 as well as drive a semi w/ a CDL. .02

I hold it true, whate'er befall;
I feel it, when I sorrow most;
'Tis better to have loved and lost
Than never to have loved at all.

[AllyMilne 0]

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Don't confuse 'illegal' and 'in contravention of BPA guidelines'.

I though they were the same thing, as the BPA controls skydiving for the CAA and therefore was law?

[nacmacfeegle 0]

I don't think that is actually the case, the BPA provides umbrella support for various individual clubs centres etc, under an easy to manage ops manual, group insurance, etc.
But if say "Bill and Ted" were to open a skydiving centre, and did their own ops manual etc, they don't necessarily have to be afilliated to the BPA.....They would just have to deal with the CAA themselves.
In fact I'm sure "Bill and Ted" did exactly that a few years back.
But I'm not sure.....which is why I'm asking.

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He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson