jumpinjackflash 0 #26 September 28, 2003 This is your brainThis is your brain on Static Line This is your brain on AFF Any Questions? Good jjf it's a gasIt's a gas, gas, gas... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #27 September 29, 2003 I learned via static line and I feel good about the program, either way you end up doing a number of coached jumps to get through your freefall proficiency requirements. With static line you do get more time under canopy while being pretty closely monitored by an instructor, and as someone mentioned earlier, most people hurt themselves under canopy, not in free fall. I'd say quality is pretty much a wash as long as you have good instructors and a dropzone that actually takes pride in the "A" stamps they give out. oh right, and (at least at my dropzone) the total cost of the static line program is about half as much as AFF /edit: and static line jumps definitely teach you about line twists. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fireflyer 0 #28 September 29, 2003 Quote It is 25 freefalls to get an A license. The big thing is getting all the objectives on your proficiency card signed off. If you're already 5 jumps into SL, you should be able to move on to the freefall portion of that program anyway. SL is generally a much cheaper option. If you find yourself really struggling once you're into the freefall portion, then consider switching to AFF. i think they want 5 minutes of total freefall time, in the fine print, which will come with your solos, S/L progression, etc. stick with the S/L, but be sure you start getting into the freefall portion (if offered) when you can! the static line and aff guys at our dz hit the A card in about the same time. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #29 September 29, 2003 ah! yet another thing I didn't think about. How many people who learned via aff can say with a straight face that they know how to spot? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fireflyer 0 #30 September 29, 2003 spotting from 13500 IS harder than spotting from 4500 tho...but we ALL have to be able to spot for the A...doesnt matter how you get to it.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #31 September 29, 2003 I am an AFF instructor, but I'm in Africa - so I'm not after your money. I was also a SL student. Go AFF. After 25 jumps (A licence) you'll have all the canopy skills of a SL student with 25 jumps. Maybe more, as you start deployment at 5500 vs +- 3500. You'll have a shitload more freefall skills though. As humans, we respond well to instant gratification. Once you have 4000 dives, how much you spent on SL vs AFF or gear, or time, or traveling isn't going to mean a damn thing. You're a skydiver. Now go skydive! tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #32 September 29, 2003 Quote The instructor only stays in the plane during your SLs to your 15 secs delays. After that, they will jump out with you... That's real DZ dependant. I dispatch MANY SL progression students from altitudes between 3500 and 8000 ft and then continue to altitude to do AFF, Tandem or fun jumps. No way am I leaving at 7000 if I can (or need to) go to the top. t tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skream 0 #33 September 29, 2003 Quote i think they want 5 minutes of total freefall time, in the fine print, which will come with your solos, S/L progression, I've seen this mentioned here before, but I can't find a reference to it in the SIM or on the A card. I see the B license requires 30 minutes, but no requirements for the A.--- Michael Teator Lexington, Kentucky Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
vonSanta 0 #34 September 29, 2003 Perhaps it should be added that a piece of paper doesn't add anything to your real life performance Here there's a 40 jump requirement + packing cert and exams - whether you're on AFF or SL only decides when you're allowed to go solo. I don't think my flying skills improved dramatically from the jump before I got my cert til the first jump after I got my cert. If ya got cash - go for AFF. More fun + solo earlier. Santa Von GrossenArsch I only come in one flavour ohwaitthatcanbemisunderst Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JYorkster 0 #35 September 29, 2003 It takes 25 jumps for an A license...no matter what progression you use to get there. Rock Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phonics1981 0 #36 September 29, 2003 Quote It takes 25 jumps for an A license...no matter what progression you use to get there. Rock I got mine in 18. 8 AFF Levels and 10 Consols. Edit: Heres an extract from the BPA Designation and Classification of Parachutists: AFF graduates may not be awarded Category 8 until a minimum of ten consolidation jumps have been completed. These consolidation jumps may be started after the successful completion of Level 7, but until Level 8 has been successfully completed the AFF Student must be dispatched and supervised by an AFF Instructor. ------------------------------------------------------ "Ive given up on sigs cos I make a mess of them!" ------------------------------------------------------ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #37 September 29, 2003 Quote I got mine in 18. 8 AFF Levels and 10 Consols. Those days are gone. New regs are 25 min, world wide, from 31/09/2003 tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JYorkster 0 #38 September 29, 2003 Ok, let me clarify...it takes 25 jumps for a USPA A license, no matter what method you use to get there. BTW, many people are getting "being cleared to self-supervise in freefall" and "getting a license" confused. Both IAD and AFF students end up with about the same level of skill around 25 jumps. AFF is quicker, but more expensive. Rock Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrickyDicky 0 #39 September 29, 2003 Ive not heard anything about that. In the uk you get your A-Licence when you have either finished RAPS or AFF. For both systems it takes about 18 jumps minimum. Nothing says, or has been mentioned about 25 jumps world wide, that is USPA rules afaik, so will affact many clubs "world wide" as many are USPA Affiliated. BPA regs still allow cat 8 (18ish, though it is possible to get it in 16). You are classed as a student until you have an A-Licence thoguh (no jumping with others, istructor may follow to observe). So those days are far from long gone. Also in this country alot of people come through s/l, though I think its becoming more 50/50 now. Getting through S/L takes ALOT of patience (its gonna take at least a few months) but I think it helps people settle into the social side of skydiving more. If you dont make friends at dzs you are not gonna enjoy skydiving. I recon skydiving is at least 50% social. Doing S/L, people see you are putting alot of effort in when you move on to freefall, and they respect that. You first freefall is a no turning back jump. Because aside from the Jump price, you have to fully join the BPA (starts at £70 in march, goes down throughout the year) and then buy beer for everyone. Theres alot more beer buying in S/L too. SO it should be encouraged more UK Skydiver for all your UK skydiving needs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BBKid 0 #40 September 29, 2003 Damn you Dicky, I was going to make the social point first. So, you drink my beer AND steal my thunder. Bastard. The other thing to note (and it's a bit different from the post about socialising), is that if you've been hanging round a DZ in crappy British weather and chatting to skydivers, you will have picked up more, in general, about the sport as a whole, you may well be packing for yourself before you get onto freefall, and you will probably have a better idea of what gear you'll be after when you come to buy your own rig. Plus, you'll have saved money if you go through static line. That said, if I could have afforded it, I would have done AFF. Either way, you get there in the end, and that's when you really start learning. Nick --------------------------- "I've pierced my foot on a spike!!!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nightjumps 1 #41 September 29, 2003 Ditto on what Rob said. A lot more US DZ's are going to a 3 S/L, IAD or Tandem single AFF Instructor format. Its really not about number of jumps as much as it is about category. No matter if you go through, S/L, IAD, or Tandem Progression, once you get to CAT D, you can be in any discipline you choose. THey all kind of merge together at that point. It is a good time to switch as long as you're at a DZ that sees the ISP as one path and doesn't have the "old school" of individual instructional paths. I've seen more than one student switch and they start them all over when they really didn't need to. If you look at your proficiency card, you'll notice that you've fulfilled the 3,500' HnP requirement that an AFF student will have to do in a later category. Do what you want, they all count till, 1) you're cleared for solos (AFF 7 or S/L 10ish) and they all have the same 25 jump minimum requirement to get your A License. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kelel01 1 #42 September 29, 2003 Quote And, you won't be scared of low exits True that. I am on the AFF program right now, and the upcoming jump that scares the crap out of me is the hop-n-pop. But I am a total freefall junkie, so I love the AFF program. If it weren't for the darn ground, I'd freefall forever!! Kelly Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
poohbeer 0 #43 September 29, 2003 I think it is set by the FAI. http://www.fai.org USPA is now in the process of getting their rules in compliance with the FAI's. ------- SIGNATURE BELOW ------- Complete newbie at skydiving, so be critical about what I say!! "The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phonics1981 0 #44 September 29, 2003 Quote I think it is set by the FAI. http://www.fai.org USPA is now in the process of getting their rules in compliance with the FAI's. Are the BPA doing the same? ------------------------------------------------------ "Ive given up on sigs cos I make a mess of them!" ------------------------------------------------------ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TrickyDicky 0 #45 September 30, 2003 Looking at it, these certificated are not "Law", but designed to make it easier for people traveling country to country, because the new licenses set an international standard so different DZs can more easily identify a skydviers level of proficiency. They are to be issued "In Parrallel" with certificates of national skydiving bodies. Read the FAI article http://www.fai.org/parachuting/certificates_proficiency/ Read the BPA Bulleting http://www.bpa.org.uk/bulletin1.htm Which says BPA FAI Certificates will not be replaced by the international licenses. The BPA will continue to issue its own BPA FAI Licenses. Edit: to fix links UK Skydiver for all your UK skydiving needs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tonto 1 #46 September 30, 2003 Quote Quote I think it is set by the FAI. http://www.fai.org USPA is now in the process of getting their rules in compliance with the FAI's. Are the BPA doing the same? I don't know. I know PASA is. tIt's the year of the Pig. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
