riggerrob 643 #26 August 12, 2003 Sure I have seen plenty of loud-mouthed a**holes yelling rudely at other jumpers in the door. Fortunately that A type personality burns out fairly quickly and moves on to another sport. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tbrown 26 #27 August 12, 2003 I've heard a few people get hyper about yelling "door!". About a month ago the light went green and people were yelling at us (an 8 way) to "get out of the plane", but in the door we could see we were still about 2 mi. from the airport and we just told them to chill. Let's not forget there's an open door here. The thing that worries me about people getting hyper and emotional on jump run is that anger clouds judgement. Exits with grips are tricky enough when folks are being careful. An angry shove can injure somebody, or worse yet could deploy a pilot chute out the door. If this guy was on video, the ST&A should watch the vid and act decisively. This sport is dangerous enough when everything's working. Your humble servant.....Professor Gravity ! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StevePhelps 0 #28 August 12, 2003 QuoteI just think it is hilarious when people get all worked up and start shouting go, go, go. Of course it is very inconsiderate, but if you let it get to you then those people have won.. I agree -- I come to the DZ to enjoy life. I let no one rob me of that joy, even if they are a butthead. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
betzilla 56 #29 August 12, 2003 unbelievable. what a jackass. I hope the guy was banned from the DZ for that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pubwoof 0 #30 August 13, 2003 I've only witnessed this phenomenon on a couple of occasions, and, thankfully, never at my home DZ. While I agree that such behavior is indicative of having been weened off the teet at too young of an age, it isn't all that different from road rage on the ground. The smart advice on how to avoid road rage, in my opinion, is to avoid doing those things which inspire road rage to occur. On the plane, this means having your helmet/goggles on before taking up a position in the door, mo-better dirt dives, etc. I agree that the best way to deal with jumpers who clearly don't have their shit together is to address it on the ground. However, I think these issues need to be addressed before we can realistically expect the idiots to shut their pie holes. If that fails, just invite them to enjoy a nice steamy cup of SHUT THE FUCK UP! If that doesn't work, a cool refreshing can of whoop ass might be the appropriate last resort. The glass isn't always half-full OR half-empty. Sometimes, the glass is just too damn big. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
digurman 0 #31 August 13, 2003 I'm a new jumper and last weekend I was heading for the door and a tandem instructor behind me said to wait, that we were going around again. I moved on up to give the tandems some room and then the guy behind me started yelling GO, GO! I was frantically asking "GO TO THE DOOR, OR JUMP?" Go! He yelled. I just ran out the door. I think it was one of my best exits. He didn't call me a bitch though and I had a pretty good sit fly. He saw me and asked me to jump with him on the next load. Happy ending on this one, but I was a little rattled. Words aren't real Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
apoil 0 #32 August 13, 2003 Quote There is a REASON, just not one that makes sense to you because you're not part of that particular group in the door at that time. yes, I'm sure there's a REASON why a novice jumper, making a solo, who is going out ahead of the freefliers becuase there's this prevailing notion that EVERY flat flier MUST get out before a single freeflier, no matter what the uppers are doing or what the jumprun is, or what the planned pull altitudes are, is sitting there in the door counting the exit count on his fingers, then gettting in the door and then giving a READY SET GO for his SOLO jump. Sometimes, after a day of bad spots, you just want people to get the fuck out of the airplane... is that so wrong? When was the last time you saw a CASA or Skyvan make a go round? They just haul ass along jump run and don't care much if you end up in the next county. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nightjumps 1 #33 August 13, 2003 QuoteSometimes, after a day of bad spots, you just want people to get the fuck out of the airplane... is that so wrong? Yes. We'd like them to get the fuck out safely. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #34 August 13, 2003 Quote is sitting there in the door counting the exit count on his fingers, then gettting in the door and then giving a READY SET GO for his SOLO jump. I've done that. Here's what was in my head. Oh fuck, I'm gonna jump (1) I need to give them enough room (2) I don't want to clock them on the way down (3) Geesh, damnit, ok, start the climb out (4) which way do my hands go (5) here I am, looking over the plane top (6) breathe, reset, (7) ready, set, GO... So what's so wrong with making sure the separation is there? NOTHING. As to why we give a count on solos, it's because that is a) what we're taught, b) it helps us set ourselves for a good floating exit and c) it's what we will do, and have done, on most of our other jumps... From jump 1 in AFF, we are taught to count. Rock out, in, go...and then when we are learning floating exits w/ the instructor, we count ready set go with the leg swing. Yelling at a newbie does exactly nothing to help them, and in fact could interrupt their attention when they need to be totally focused on what is going on. If there is a consistent problem, then sure, bring it up with the experienced jumper on the ground. NEVER in the plane... Stephen King has a phrase in several of his books..."You have forgotten the face of your father"...I think a variant is applicable to those who yell at newbies and students and inexperienced folk...."You have forgotten what it's like to be a newbie". And I agree w/ Sparky - anyone who takes pleasure at yelling at a newbie is a jerk. And that is my opinion. Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
tattoojeff 0 #35 August 13, 2003 i really hope you guys are kidding about taking pride in fucking up a 4ways exit. its that kind of bull shit that feeds the anomossity between freeflyers and belly flyers. stay the fuck away from my dropzone we're very high quality people, you wouldnt fit in. im suprised your DZ put up with your bullshit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freakous 0 #36 August 13, 2003 Quotei really hope you guys are kidding about taking pride in fucking up a 4ways exit. its that kind of bull shit that feeds the anomossity between freeflyers and belly flyers. stay the fuck away from my dropzone we're very high quality people, you wouldnt fit in. im suprised your DZ put up with your bullshit. I was not under the impression that self professed high quality people were so judgemental based upon assumptions. How do you know that I am freeflying all the time? Maybe you were just kidding. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,046 #37 August 13, 2003 >yes, I'm sure there's a REASON why a novice jumper . . . is sitting >there in the door counting the exit count on his fingers, then gettting > in the door and then giving a READY SET GO for his SOLO jump. Yes; he's attempting to give safe exit separation. >Sometimes, after a day of bad spots, you just want people to get >the fuck out of the airplane... is that so wrong? Yes. >When was the last time you saw a CASA or Skyvan make a go round? Pretty often at Perris. >They just haul ass along jump run and don't care much if you end up > in the next county. Might want to find a better DZ if that's the case. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 3,046 #38 August 13, 2003 Story from Rantoul - Winsor is organizing a low time 8 way with camera out of an Arizona otter. On jump run he asks the cameraman (Bill Stanley) to check the spot. On the yellow Bill leans out and checks - solid, thick clouds below. This is a bad thing especially with a low timer 8 way jumping in the most crowded airspace in the skydiving world. He shakes his head. The green light comes on. Bill continues to spot, looking for a hole - he's hoping to clear the cloud so we can jump. No luck. By now everyone is screaming at Winsor: "Kick their asses out of the plane!" "It's just a cloud, it won't hurt you!" "If you're afraid of clouds you shouldn't be in the air!" "I have 11,000 jumps and I say it's safe" "You're fucking the whole load!" Finally Winsor says "Hey, if you want to go, feel free." The freeflyers and a tandem squeeze by, the TM hitting everyone as he goes past. They all exit. The 8-way puts their seatbelts back on, assuming they will have to land with the plane. The pilot turns around. "Hey, you want a second pass?" They say yes. They get a second pass with a big hole in the clouds and they jump. Sometimes part of being a load organizer is knowing when to ignore people - even if they have 11,000 jumps. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freakydiver 0 #39 August 13, 2003 People that yell from the front of the plane when THEY AREN'T LOOKING OUT OF THE DOOR TO SPOT piss the hell out of me. There is absolutely NO PLACE in the sport for idiots like that REGARDLESS of the number of jumps they have. They do not know the specifics of what the spotter is looking at NOR the specifics of the jump itself. STFU front seat drivers. -- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." -- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freakydiver 0 #40 August 13, 2003 Maybe your DZ should adjust jumpruns for long climbouts if necessary. Gee, there's a simple solution to all problems. -- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." -- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMonkey 0 #41 August 13, 2003 i don't know why we didn't think of that? where have you been all my life? it would be nice if jumpruns could be as long as needed so everyone could have 30 seconds of seperation, however here in the real world where we have to abide by the laws physics, take into account air speed, winds, drift, and the size of the airport that is just not possible -- as we like our jumpers to land back at the dz I assure that with reasonable (and by this i don't even mean fast) climb outs everyone on the load can get out safely, in a non hurried environment, with plenty of seperation, and not even come close to hosing the tandems. people on this forum love to argue just to argue, so when in rome i argue with the romans! one last point before i stop kicking mr. ed's corpse, we don't have issues with go arounds and this climb out phenomenon with yelling! edit to add the landing on dz part! --------------------- Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freakydiver 0 #42 August 13, 2003 LOL IM NOT ARGUING JUST TO ARGUE. I guess you are too good to learn from someone else, but at my DZ the pilot makes massive adjustments if there is going to be an initial climbout. Now, that doesn't apply to all situations, but it was a simple, humble suggestion. Forget I ever spoke my friend. Forget I ever spoke. I will continue to watch seperation grow smaller and danger increase as it has indeed proven itself to do in my years in the sport. PS I don't know you therefore I have avoided you my whole life, but come to Denver and I'd be happy to buy you a jump or two. Also: "I assure that with reasonable (and by this i don't even mean fast) climb outs everyone on the load can get out safely, in a non hurried environment, with plenty of seperation, and not even come close to hosing the tandems." Honestly - in the real world, and especially at busier DZs, it is more times than not, unrealistic to put everyone out on one pass safely, but hey, it still happens that everyone does get out on one pass, go figure. -- (N.DG) "If all else fails – at least try and look under control." -- Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheMonkey 0 #43 August 13, 2003 QuoteI guess you are too good to learn from someone else well not to blow my own horn but i am damn good just in this case your advice does not apply to me and my current situation (we don't have said problem)...and i have not personally witnessed this at larger drop zones i have visited. nevertheless i can foresee it being a problem (i mean i have never seen a nuclear weapon either but i know that one could seriously f*ck my day up if it went off). so with that being said, if you are buying, i will be visiting denver soon granted they have butter pecan ice cream - i love that stuff! --------------------- Never argue with an idiot, they will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bkdice 0 #44 August 13, 2003 Damn Freakous! You really got under this guy's skin. It's weird to see someone take you so seriously when I know how you really are. Also sad that there are some DZs out there that have animosity between freeflyers and bellyfliers. We sure don't at our DZ. Everyone mixes it up in the air and has fun trying different kinds of flying. On the ground, we are all on the same level and having fun being nothing but donkeys - students, coaches, and fun jumpers alike. Our DZ is probably one of the least judgemental DZs out there. I foget that until I see people get so upset since I guess they do not have the open environment we do. Who knows. Looks like you took over Monkey's mission. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
