billvon 2,989 #26 April 8, 2003 >What medical background do you have Billvon? Officially red cross CPR and first responder and PADI medic rating. Unofficially I've been living with a surgeon for a few years and have spent a few nights in a trauma bay. Most of my real-world experience has come from either being a first responder at the DZ or being an assistant for Amy both at car crashes and DZ accidents. We have a routine down now where Amy runs for the victim and I sprint to the car to get the trauma bag. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jethers203 0 #27 April 11, 2003 Right on Billvon!!!! You know your shit. Thanks to everyone for their input. You never know when you will have to use some of the things we talked about. John D-24352 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #28 April 11, 2003 If the decision has been made to start CPR it doesn't go much downhill from there...the time for being careful has past...Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #29 April 12, 2003 Hi there Skymedic...I agree with most you say however, most non-field ppl aren't all that good at deciding when to and when not to start CPR. I spent several years on an EMS bird as well, how many times was your pt. going south on lift and you spent the next 10 min deciding if that's PEA on your monitor or not? When in doubt I say start CPR. While it's not the best of moves in the drunk guy that DFO's off the barstool (as we have all seen) I wouldn't be all that concerned in a patient that is hemodynamically unstable to the point of apnea. I would argue that an unresponsive, cool, pale, diaphoretic, apnic patient is not going to be worsed by chest compressions. For all of you non medically trained people, get some basic training, get a plan, interface with the local responders and PRACTICE. It sounds like you all did well in a bad situation! Nice Job! Us ems people become incredulous when you tell us you got someone back with basic CPR cause we almost never see it, but it does happen! PeaceFaith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ruffles 0 #30 April 13, 2003 Just playing the dicky devil's advocate here, but have you guys taken a look at the A.C.S. statistics for traumatic full arrest saves? We don't even work them in my county unless there are special circumstances involving mechanism. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #31 April 13, 2003 QuoteJust playing the dicky devil's advocate here, but have you guys taken a look at the A.C.S. statistics for traumatic full arrest saves? We don't even work them in my county unless there are special circumstances involving mechanism. Yup...we are not to work a traumatic arrest..unless it happens right in front of us...which means..if my partner died in front of me due to something. but other than that....so long.. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #32 April 13, 2003 Same thing here on the west coast...UCDMC did a study a couple of years back where they tag reviewed every traumatic code for the last 8 years. That was field starts only. What they found was that of ALL codes with a starting PEA of 40 they had like two...So our protocol is now to call everyone with a PEA of less than 40...I changed my licence plate to "pestilence" cause i feel like one of deaths close friends! Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skycat 0 #33 April 14, 2003 ok for those of us with 0 medical smarts with is PEAs?Fly it like you stole it! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #34 April 14, 2003 lol...sorry! Faith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Billy 0 #35 April 14, 2003 No shit,, Trauma arrests are hard to get back,, even if right there when they happen,, just off orientation, my helo ( Eurocopter twin stars ) was officially dubbed the "Death Star" .... year or 2 ago in these forums we discussed some advanced skills stuff ta have handy for ALS folks at the DZ,, ie chest darts, crics, adult intubation stuff and an AMBU,, large bore IV access for central lines and fluids,, stuff ta help stop getting to the PEA algorythym... paralytics were also discussed as well as some sedatives... ya know just in case.... Natural Born FlyerZ.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,989 #36 April 14, 2003 >When in doubt I say start CPR. While I agree with most of what you posted, I did want to clarify that, for a less-experienced first responder with no access to an EKG, the opposite is true - if you even think you can detect any pulse at all, don't start chest compressions. Rescue breathing can be done without chest compressions for someone who's apneic (not breathing) and can often turn up the 'real' problem, like an unexpected airway obstruction. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
WeakMindedFool 0 #37 April 14, 2003 Quote >When in doubt I say start CPR. While I agree with most of what you posted, I did want to clarify that, for a less-experienced first responder with no access to an EKG, the opposite is true - if you even think you can detect any pulse at all, don't start chest compressions. Rescue breathing can be done without chest compressions for someone who's apneic (not breathing) and can often turn up the 'real' problem, like an unexpected airway obstruction. Absolutely correct. You have to follow the steps. If that "repositioning of the airway" works, were good to go. Maybe it's just been my luck but several times i've found people doing rescue breathing on dead people. People are afraid to commit to chest compressions for fear of doing more damage. A little of that mentality is good, alot of it leaves dead people, well...dead. I guess in this crowd I shouldn't worry about people being afraid to jump in with both feetFaith in a holy cause is to a considerable extent a substitute for lost faith in ourselves. -Eric Hoffer - Check out these Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
