Hook knife training

[unkulunkulu 0]

Scenarios in which to use the hook knife aside, what is the best way to train for using the hook knife?

I read a story of one of our experienced jumpers losing a hook knife during a reserve line over I noticed some jumpers using a rubber band probably to secure the knife (it won't fly away until you securely grab it and when you do you can tear the rubber band with your adrenaline-powered uber-strength. I guess). Would be interested in hearing of best practices of doing it (securing a hook knife on your rig/jumpsuit).

What is the best way to securely and conveniently grab a small hook knife like this one:
[inline cs061201.jpg]

What are other considerations?

[skyjumpenfool 2]

I carry more than one. It's the best cure there is for "butter fingers".

Birdshit & Fools Productions

"Son, only two things fall from the sky."

[airtwardo 7]

unkulunkulu

Scenarios in which to use the hook knife aside, what is the best way to train for using the hook knife?

I read a story of one of our experienced jumpers losing a hook knife during a reserve line over I noticed some jumpers using a rubber band probably to secure the knife (it won't fly away until you securely grab it and when you do you can tear the rubber band with your adrenaline-powered uber-strength. I guess). Would be interested in hearing of best practices of doing it (securing a hook knife on your rig/jumpsuit).

What is the best way to securely and conveniently grab a small hook knife like this one:


What are other considerations?

That would be your back-up hook knife...now get a real on that fits your hand.

Every jumpsuit I own has a knife on it and my rig has a baby one like in the pic.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[unkulunkulu 0]

skyjumpenfool

I carry more than one. It's the best cure there is for "butter fingers".

But with a hook knife you lose valuable time too. So being able to quickly and securely use the knife should be useful.

[airtwardo 7]

unkulunkulu

***I carry more than one. It's the best cure there is for "butter fingers".

But with a hook knife you lose valuable time too. So being able to quickly and securely use the knife should be useful.

Using it right is better than using it fast - both is good but 'training' for every possible scenario is kind of impractical.

It's a tool that's easy to use, knowing WHEN to use it is the key.

Having a quality knife that is accessible with either hand is smart, never use it for anything else but an emergency in the air...beyond that, IF you ever need it - it's pretty obvious, you'll know it when you see it.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[SecondRound 1]

This is purely an observation from a newbie, but when I do start carrying a hook knife it will be after I have become very familiar with my parachute and know it well enough to understand when and how to use the knife to make a problem better not worse. For me it will be a tool not the badge of a cool jumper.
This is my advice and judgement for me and fortunately I have plenty of wiser heads to consult and you can believe me that I will ask.

[councilman24 37]

And when your hanging from the tail of the airplane on your NEXT jump by your RESERVE you can chew the lines apart.

You can have the tool and not use it if you don't want to or don't know what to do. But there are situations where not having the knife can kill you.

No one I've every known wore a hook knife to be cool. If anything people have not wore one thinking they were too cool to every need one.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[councilman24 37]

And when your hanging from the tail of the airplane on your NEXT jump by your RESERVE you can chew the lines apart.

You can have the tool and not use it if you don't want to or don't know what to do. But there are situations where not having the knife can kill you.

No one I've every known wore a hook knife to be cool. If anything people have not wore one thinking they were too cool to every need one.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[skydiver604 0]

Whenever I hear of someone who does not carry a hook knife I think of this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEewo8M---Y

"The greater danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it." - Michelangelo

[topdocker 0]

Train on extracting it from the pouch/place the hook knife is stored. If you can't get it out quickly, it may be too late.

Also, I once asked a jumper in the plane about the placement of his hook knife on his chest strap, it was just a little odd. He yanked on it a few times and finally got it out, and cut his chest strap! (Yes, he rode the plane down!)

So, knowing how to get it out is just as important as knowing when to use it.

top

Jump more, post less!

[Hellis 0]

unkulunkulu

***I carry more than one. It's the best cure there is for "butter fingers".

But with a hook knife you lose valuable time too. So being able to quickly and securely use the knife should be useful.


Buy a bigger knife.
If you have a larger knife it's much easier to hold.

[airtwardo 7]

http://www.benchmade.com/products/8

Best 35 bucks you'll spend

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[unkulunkulu 0]

Thanks, will try and arrange this. Saw longer knives in the local shop too, but the blade in this one looks respectable

[jono 0]

airtwardo

http://www.benchmade.com/products/8

Best 35 bucks you'll spend

Wanted one to sew onto the upper leg of my jumpsuit (already got one on my chest strap) and saw that one but thought it was a bit too long for where I wanted to put it so got the smaller (nearly 4 1/2" long) version.
http://www.legear.com.au/Benchmade-7-Safety-Cutter-Hook-Black-Finish-p/benchmade-7blkwadc.htm
Big handle with a grippy texture that makes it easy to extract and hopefully not drop and sharp as all shit.
Hasn't been the best $38 I've spent yet but haven't had to use it yet

Remember you don't stop laughing because you grow old, you grow old because you stop laughing.

[-ftp- 0]

skydiver604

Whenever I hear of someone who does not carry a hook knife I think of this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEewo8M---Y

Jesus H Christ, he pulls his reserve!!! My heart sank when I saw that, man-o-man.

Is there a thread about this somewhere?

[skydiver604 0]

Jesus H Christ, he pulls his reserve!!! My heart sank when I saw that, man-o-man.

Is there a thread about this somewhere?

http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=3542055;search_string=static%20line%20hangup;#3542055

"The greater danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it." - Michelangelo

[firstime 0]

great question,, do search a search "lucky and stupid" this was my post about 6 yrs ago and much to my surprise it made a huge impact with jumpers with yrs and yrs in this sport. Good read

[Squeak 17]

skydiver604

Whenever I hear of someone who does not carry a hook knife I think of this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEewo8M---Y

what a total dick of a JM. Ill just keep yelling KNIFE, 'cause i dont have a friggin clue

You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky)
My Life ROCKS!
How's yours doing?

[pchapman 279]

Squeak

***

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AEewo8M---Y

what a total dick of a JM. Ill just keep yelling KNIFE, 'cause i dont have a friggin clue

He was understandably rather motivated to find out where the frigging hook knife was, in a dangerous and time sensitive situation, while he searched for one.

The one that was always in the plane had been stashed away from its usual holder by someone else, and the pilot didn't know where it was either. And the jumpmaster had by chance lost his personal hook knife recently and was waiting for a replacement to arrive.

While theoretically he might have noticed the missing knife when entering the plane, it isn't like jumpers normally inventory all the plane's safety equipment every time they board the aircraft...

[airtwardo 7]

Quote

...it isn't like jumpers normally inventory all the plane's safety equipment every time they board the aircraft.

Jumpers maybe not, but a Skydiver sure would, especially as a jumpmaster...NO excuse for a static-line jumpmaster NOT to have a quality knife ON them.

Any by quality knife I mean one that will cut a static line, not a plastic 2 dollar thread cutter some seem to thing is a tool.

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[pchapman 279]

airtwardo

Jumpers maybe not, but a Skydiver sure would, especially as a jumpmaster...NO excuse for a static-line jumpmaster NOT to have a quality knife ON them.

Fair enough, and maybe standard practice where you've been, or back in the early days. But I've personally never seen it be a requirement. Never heard of any instructor told to wear a hook knife, just as we don't carry fire extinguishers just in case the one in the plane is missing. The DZ probably got a little complacent as there had reportedly never been a static line hangup there in 30+ years of operation...

[airtwardo 7]

pchapman

***
Jumpers maybe not, but a Skydiver sure would, especially as a jumpmaster...NO excuse for a static-line jumpmaster NOT to have a quality knife ON them.

Fair enough, and maybe standard practice where you've been, or back in the early days. But I've personally never seen it be a requirement. Never heard of any instructor told to wear a hook knife, just as we don't carry fire extinguishers just in case the one in the plane is missing. The DZ probably got a little complacent as there had reportedly never been a static line hangup there in 30+ years of operation...


IIRC...it was in the Jumpmaster & Instructor handbook/study guide back when I went through it in the 70's.

It's really only common sense...it's part of what you need to do the job safely & correctly. It was also recommended you have good gloves in case you may need to 'short-line' a student.

The training back then even went so far as to suggest breaking the glass out of one of the aircraft instruments if you lost or broke your knife during an emergency.

I had to use my knife twice as a S/L JM, once for a student in tow and once when the sleeve retaining line broke leaving a T-10 sleeve & pilot chute trailing with the static line, slapping against the elevators underside.

Both times because of the tension on the S/L it cut like butter with a quick swipe.

Also both times things would probably ended less than ideal had I not had a knife in easy reach.

It's a cheap, simple tool that is a basic safety item for any static line jumpmaster...period. There isn't any real excuse of not having one with you when doing that type of instruction.

Complacency kills!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[3mpire 0]

Quote

It was also recommended you have good gloves in case you may need to 'short-line' a student.

Sorry for the quick interjection/thread drift, but what is short lining? Is that like an instructor PCA...?

[3mpire 0]

Does the sheath on that benchmade work well or do you need to find a more suitable sheath? I was thinking chest strap placement?

[councilman24 37]

Some jumpmasters would just let go of the static line and let the airplane pull the main container open. Other like me controlled the static line with in their hand and pulled the main container open with their hand. If the student was doing something stupid, like a back loop off the step, rolling on their side, etc. you could 'short line' them by pulling the main container open before the static line got to it's full length.

Out of several hundred if not more static line students I've thrown I could probably count the ones I didn't pull (and the airplane pulled) on both hands.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE