Billy 0 #1 April 24, 2003 Hay All, This just happened to be our safety and training tip for the day at work. After witnessing Hol's accident, I feel this may have played a major factor in her lack of action. The information came from the Aeronautical Information Manual, AIM, Section 8-1-5. It deals with illusions pilots may experiance while in flight and what maneuvers they take in response. We are all piloting our canopies and I saw many possibilities relating to how we fly, especially on final approaches, in spins as was Hol, and also numerous situations that may occur during a night jump. I feel we all should be aware of these possibilities, read them, and maybe make them part of the USPA Safety Day review. I will type them all out later when I have time.. I am at work an the bosses are wondering what the hell I'm doin,, but I was hoping maybe PilotDave or someone in that line will know of a link to that section of the AIM and could post it here. Thanks all... Blue Skies, Soft Landings Natural Born FlyerZ.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
quade 4 #2 April 24, 2003 Aeronautical Information Manual Chapter 8. Medical Facts for Pilots 8-1-5 Illusions in Flight While this is very good information, it would be improper to speculate that any of these illusions was the primary cause of any specific accident without further investigation.quade - The World's Most Boring Skydiver Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #3 April 24, 2003 I don't think we could ever speculate that. It would be impossible for anyone to say what Holly saw, or thought she saw, except Holly. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pilotdave 0 #4 April 25, 2003 Most of those illusions are inner ear type things that affect pilots flying by instruments. When you have no view, or even worse an obscured view, you can't trust your senses and need to go by what the instruments are telling you. I'm sure there are plenty of visual illusions, similar to the landing illusions, that affect skydivers, but I have no idea how much the instrument flying type illusions would affect a skydiver. The landing illusions for pilots can be tough to get over. Wide runways tend to look short, especially if you're coming in too high. A short, wide runway makes it look like you're too high, so you might come in too low to compensate. Sloping runways can really look weird from final. Can anyone think of visual illusions that affect skydivers landing? Dave Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jumpy 0 #5 April 25, 2003 Quote Can anyone think of visual illusions that affect skydivers landing? Dave The only one I can think of is water landings. When people chop to high.... Although that in no way effects everyjump Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Billy 0 #6 April 25, 2003 Thanks Paul for the link, and sorry ta speculate, Riddler your right,, Natural Born FlyerZ.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DBCOOPER 5 #7 April 27, 2003 Height perception illusion:Areas of limited contrast or areas without visual cues such as snow fields,sand or water make it difficult to determine your altitude. Fixation:Staring or concentrating on an object...you may become fixated on it and fly into it......Using a good scan will prevent this. Reference :UH1H Pilots Desk referenceReplying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
trigger 0 #8 April 27, 2003 Height perception illusion:***I've experience,once possibly due to a change in goggle type[lense colour]Once possibly due to fading light conditions[sunset]hooked low on that one resulting in a urgent recovery from a dive.Not good!.CHOP WOOD COLLECT WATER. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billdo 0 #9 April 28, 2003 QuoteCan anyone think of visual illusions that affect skydivers landing? Dave Landing on a slope, especially when you're headed up a hill. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BlindBrick 0 #10 April 28, 2003 Quote Can anyone think of visual illusions that affect skydivers landing? Back just after I got of student status, I made the mistake of jumping with an inner ear infection. I was just turning in on final and the windsock was in my peripheral vision. I had a moment of disorientation and thought the windsock had did a 180. I paniced and did a /hard/ turn to get into what I though was the wind. Luckily I was under a Manta so I didn't hook it in but I ended but going downwind with a lot of speed from the turn. Nasty, nasty landing. -Blind"If you end up in an alligator's jaws, naked, you probably did something to deserve it." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billdo 0 #11 April 29, 2003 QuoteQuoteCan anyone think of visual illusions that affect skydivers landing? Dave Also, this was pointed out to me on a night jump briefing at Eloy. When you approach the ground on a night jump sometimes you'll see the shadow of your canopy approaching you at an angle. When this hits your peripheral vision it freaks you out cause it looks like another canopy on a perfect collision course with you. The consequences are great because this situation sets you up to do some kind of aggressive avoidance maneuver close to the ground. It's kinda funny to because you're literally being scared by your own shadow. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites porter1 0 #12 May 2, 2003 Just like flying over water, all grass and nothing to break up the patter or lack of, can cause the depth perseption to be questionable. I have caught myself staring at the ground before flare and wondering where the ground was. look up and down your landing path. building and shrubbs both near and far can give you better perception then just grass or dirt to look at. In planes you look down the runway not at it so why would canopy landing be any different(curious) If I am wrong feel free to tell me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
porter1 0 #12 May 2, 2003 Just like flying over water, all grass and nothing to break up the patter or lack of, can cause the depth perseption to be questionable. I have caught myself staring at the ground before flare and wondering where the ground was. look up and down your landing path. building and shrubbs both near and far can give you better perception then just grass or dirt to look at. In planes you look down the runway not at it so why would canopy landing be any different(curious) If I am wrong feel free to tell me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
