howardwhite 6 #1 August 17, 2007 Tired of looking at pictures of old airplanes? Try looking at old canopies, instead. I will be impressed if someone gets this. HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beatnik 2 #2 August 17, 2007 I am not going to stop the thread right here, I will let others rack their memories. I just happen to be looking my collection of magazines and came across the exact same picture of this canopy. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zing 2 #3 August 17, 2007 Man, Howard, you sure come up with photos of some obscure stuff. I think I know what it is, but I want to see how many others give it a go before I prove I'm wrong.Zing Lurks Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #4 August 17, 2007 Could that be a Crossbow canopy? A friend and I bought one once, when we were green horns, back in 73, We thought it was a para-commander. We never jumped it, and I never saw it inflated. So I'm guessing some....Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,442 #5 August 17, 2007 Not an XBO, Steve. I 'think' it is an East German 'version' of a PC used in about '66. So do I get the prize? Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #6 August 17, 2007 Well, maybe it will help if I add pictures of two other canopies from the same source. I especially like #3 and hope Beatnik will soon get one and show us pictures of him jumping it. (Prizes to be awarded later) HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #7 August 17, 2007 Nah, sorry. Here's an xBo. My Crossbow story is about the local jumper back in the sixties who borrowed what he thought was the hot new Crossbow canopy only to learn on opening that it was instead a Thunderbow -- the canopy with the arrow so you knew what direction it was flying. HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmytavino 16 #8 August 17, 2007 UT -15.???? (russian, i think ) jmy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Beatnik 2 #9 August 17, 2007 QuoteI especially like #3 and hope Beatnik will soon get one and show us pictures of him jumping it. You and me both. That looks like it would be a hoot to fly. I have some pictures of some jumps I will have to send your way when I get them all. Lots of fun old canopies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #10 August 17, 2007 Nope. UT-15 is a Russian copy of the PC, considered by some to be superior to the original. Pioneer sold "Russian PCs" for a while. I have a UT-15 packing manual (in Russian) if anyone wants a copy.HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d123 3 #11 August 17, 2007 Really interesting, How were the landings on those canopies? Was there any flare?Lock, Dock and Two Smoking Barrelrolls! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmytavino 16 #12 August 17, 2007 looking more closely at the original picture, I wonder if it's just a 'cheapo' ( flat circular) which has spent some time on a riggers table,,,, having it's gore fabric cut out,,,for drive slots and turning slots,,, (Might even have the suspension lines gutted, for reduced bulk. I seem to recall that "550" line consisted of an outer sheath, which housed maybe 8 to 10 strands of smaller diameter nylon which was very strong and durable,, BUT it added to pack volume...) and then having "stabilizers" added, below the skirt line hems, maybe even utilizing the material that was taken from above...just a guess..... I can't really say I see center lines, going up to the apex, and all the suspension lines seem to go , only to the skirt..... for sure it's before MY time.....!!! I'm just a kid... Hmmmm... Drive slots... on the FRONT of the canopy!!!!?????? j t Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #13 August 17, 2007 Quote How were the landings on those canopies? Was there any flare? The question of whether PC-class canopies "flare" has been discussed on dz.com endlessly. See, e.g.,http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=2036704;search_string=PC%20flare;#2036704 or:http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=839757;search_string=pc%20flare;#839757 The notion that you will seriously destroy your body if you attempt to stand one up is widely circulated among jumpers who have never seen one in the air.HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,442 #14 August 17, 2007 Hi howard, That Pat Works: Quote actually 1-pubic-hair AGL everyone knows that the correct terminology is an RCH. Jerry Baumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveJack 1 #15 August 17, 2007 I think the picture of Canopy3 in Post Six is a version of the Barish Sail Wing. Am I close Howard? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #16 August 18, 2007 OK, contest over. No clear winner, though JerryBaumchen is just about right except for the PC reference.It's a Seifhennersdorf RL-3/5, taking its name from the (East) German town, near the Czech border, where it and lots of other parachutes were and still are made. The RL-3/5 was used by the (East) German individual accuracy winner of the 1966 World Meet, held in Leipzig. As that was then in an Iron Curtain country, the US did not participate. The DDR (East Germany) printed stamps (see picture) for the event. (Note the AN-2 ) The Sky Diver caption says the canopy had three Derry-type steering slots and five stabilizers on each side, plus five windows in the front and three in the rear. Parachute manufacture in Seifhennersdorf continues today; SPEKON is a member of PIA and has exhibited at PIA symposiums since 2003. The other pictures of its canopies came from http://www.spekon.com/. To SkydiveJack. I don't think the strange canopy you refer to looks much like a Sailwing. It's an RL6 "fläschenfallschirm," literally, I guess, a "surface parachute." It's hard to tell from the one picture, but it seems to have far more slots and appendages than the Sailwing, which was a clean design (attached picture is Lee Guilfoyle,D-50, jumping it at the '65 Nationals in Orange.) To JerryBaumchen: Can a color-blind person accurately judge the value of an RCH? HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,442 #17 August 18, 2007 Hi howard, Well, what do I win? Quote Can a color-blind person accurately judge the value of an RCH? It's done by feel. JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #18 August 18, 2007 Quote Well, what do I win? Well (putting on my patent judge's robe), pending my further review of the relevant Lemoigne claims, nothing. The RL-5 does not appear to have a pulled-down apex, which would seem to be a critical design element of the PC. Feel free to appeal.HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airdvr 210 #19 August 18, 2007 That contraption looks as if it would be going backwards! At first I thought maybe it was on backwards.Please don't dent the planet. Destinations by Roxanne Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d123 3 #20 August 18, 2007 Thanks Howard Lock, Dock and Two Smoking Barrelrolls! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steve1 5 #21 August 18, 2007 Quote I'm just a kid... ................................. Me too! I don't know who that old bastard is in my bathroom mirror.....Steve1 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
d123 3 #22 August 19, 2007 I'm really interested in learning more about those wings. I don't know why but I am. Was the down speed on a PC as big as the down speed a square loaded 1:1? I've talk to a guy that build a NASA-WING. I think that there's a parachute with the same design called Paradactyl. The landing on Paradactyl looks pretty cool. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZbTQr7KcHwELock, Dock and Two Smoking Barrelrolls! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JerryBaumchen 1,442 #23 August 19, 2007 Hi howard, Quote Feel free to appeal. My son is an attorney; I'll have him contact you regarding the settlement. JerryBaumchen Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveJack 1 #24 August 19, 2007 My son is an attorney; I'll have him contact you regarding the settlement. JerryBaumchen Well Howard, I know you meant well but your screwed now. Do you have any last words or pictures? Jack Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
howardwhite 6 #25 August 19, 2007 Quote My son is an attorney; I'll have him contact you regarding the settlement. My brother and his wife are both attorneys; she's a partner in a high-powered DC law firm and he used to represent Mobil Oil when one of its tankers got into trouble. We'll just have duelling family fights. Does this mean I have to stop runnng contests here until this blows over? Just when I was starting to get into the good stuff? HW Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
