DB Cooper

[quade 4]

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I thought it was interesting when I first saw a picture of "Ckret", I thought whoa, that guy is brimming with confidence. A good thing to have when you are dealing with the environment he is in. The point is, I think you can get a basic reading on somebody from just one picture.

Sigh . . . no . . . no you can't.

If you could, then nobody would ever been susceptible to lies and cons; Jo would have never been involved with Duane. Actors would be out of work.

In fact, I would go exactly the other way and say that most people are actually horrible at judging people this way. (1)

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[SafecrackingPLF 0]

I've always felt as though McCoy was the "better" of the two HJ's (other than his big mouth and prints)...

I think I'm rethinking that. If he was a DZ regular, someone would have noticed him missing after the crime (either through death, or through him avoiding heat like the plague)...

Opinion: Cooper may have been better than McCoy for the simple reason that his "mistakes" and bravado made it that much harder to determine who he was & what happened. For me, that's a big shift.

If Cooper was not a real skydiver, then his MO was outside of his "expertise".... outside of his area of operation if you will... well, could that translate to other factors (such as geography)?

[Albert18 0]

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Sigh . . . no . . . no you can't.

If you could, then nobody would ever been susceptible to lies and cons. Actors would be out of work.

In fact, I would go exactly the other way and say that most people are actually horrible at judging people this way. (1)

I didn't say you could. I can.

You seriously can't see the differnce between Tina and Flo in the pictures?

Did you not catch the news where they hire people at airports to read people. It is part of security.

[snowmman 3]

Dum..
I thought this post of yours was amazing, and wondered if it was true, and why no one mentioned it before if so.

Apparently Poynter says something similar at 4.2.1 on page 20 (scroll down on the left)

http://books.google.com/books?id=BKTuTXrXQu0C&pg=PA20&lpg=PA20&dq=%22Limited+to+Use+in+Airplane+Under+150+MPH%22&source=web&ots=n_moyn5R4q&sig=skxz5NVO5C7YMal3myfi-4vtIYo&hl=en

Poynter says it would be on the outside. Was the 2nd unused rig a low speed chute like dum is implying?

It's interesting to think how Cooper might be accumulating knowledge as he goes along...talking to the pilots, getting feedback based on his requests...he may be soaking things up like a sponge based on what people are saying...what he reads (like how to operate the aft stairs)

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maybe he chose the nb6 over the pioneer sport rig because the pioneer rig would have been stamped(on the botton flap in inch and a half red letters)
LOW SPEED PARACHUTE LIMITED TO USE IN AIRCRAFT UNDER 150 MPH

[quade 4]

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I didn't say you could. I can.

Did you not catch the news where they hire people at airports to read people. It is part of security.

Are you saying you have some sort of super human powers or training?

Did you not catch the news that trying to do this is wildly inaccurate? (1)(2)

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[normiss 798]

Seemed to work quite well in Orlando this past week....
although I would tend to agree with you as to it being highly unreliable.

[Orange1 0]

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One last thing... if the flight was not crowded, would it be common for average people to WANT to sit in the rear of the plane???? You'll be the last one off...

I think the answer to this one is very simple: smoking section was always in the rear.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[SafecrackingPLF 0]

Orange1,

Thanks. It's always been assumed that Cooper took the rear rear inorder to maintain control.

I would agree. However, if the smoking section was in the rear, then perhaps that's how he got the idea for the last row. Perhaps he was used to sitting back there, and when he visualized the crime in his mind, he thought (accurately) that it would be easier to keep an eye on everyone (and keep most passengers clueless) if he wasn't just in the back, but the very back.

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

1. If you are going toi exit the rear, why not sit at the rear?

2. Smoking section?

?. Boarded from the rear. (it is my understanding that the aft door had to be extended and locked for boarding, 377 can confirm).

4. There was a belief that the tail section most often survied in a crash and most survivors came from the tail section. (can't confirm).


Sluggo

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[quade 4]

Do you know of a seating plan diagram for the 727-100 available on-line anywhere?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

All,

Several of you have asked about the possibility of Cooper being Canadian. Also, there has bee a lot of discussion about the origin of the alias “Dan Cooper”. I think someone has been “holding out” on good ol’ Sluggo.

Here’s a story:

This morning I got a news alert about an article on an Italian publication called “Avion News” it was a terribly translated (Italian to English) article about the Amboy Chute. (It insists that the chute Cooper used was made of Steel not Silk, I love babble fish).

The article (at http://www.avionews.com/index.php?corpo=see_news_home.php&news_id=1087954&pagina_chiamante=index.php) said:

“So, the hunt's still going on. But there' a curiosity about name. Dan Cooper was the name of a toon created by Albert Weinberg, from Belgium, during the 50's. He was a Canadian airman, involved in many adventures regarding spying's cases and science fictions. His adventures were released on papaer called "Tintin". {Emphasis mine.}

In Italy the stories have been translated and released on "Corriere dei piccoli" at the end of the 60's.”

So I did a Google search on:

"Albert Weinberg" Belgium Tintin "Dan Cooper"

And found:

Albert Weinberg (1922- ) began his comics career by working as an assistant to Victor Hubinon (Buck Danny) on a book devoted to the War in the Pacific ("Tarawa") and on the series Blondin & Cirage. From 1949 to 1956, he wrote and drew two space / science fiction series for "Heroic- Albums": Luc Condor and Roc Meteor. Weinberg joined the editorial team of "Tintin" in 1950, for which he created two science fiction series, the remarkable Alain Landier and Dan Cooper. Another character Weinberg created for "Tintin" was blonde tour guide Vicky in 1970. (Dan Cooper met Vicky in the spy-oriented "L'Affaire Minos" (#21) which took place in Athens. In 1971, Weinberg created Knut Andersen for "Pif" and soon after, Barracuda for the German magazine "Zack".

If you go to :

http://www.coolfrenchcomics.com/dancooper.htm

You will find something interesting. (See attached cartoons.)

Now, Weinberg is still alive (where? I don’t know), but maybe, just maybe, he had contact with a fanatical admirer in the late 50’s and 60’s.

Sluggo_Monster

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[Sluggo_Monster 0]

Addendum to last:

The cartoons in the 50s were more about conventional aircraft than space adventures. The only image I found was not very clear (I couldn't even tell what language it was).

Sluggo

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[snowmman 3]

I have two quick posts.

first there was comments from others about revenge theories.

although unlikely, there was a major crash earlier that year of a Boeing 727. all aboard killed.

It was Alaska Air though.
I've landed in commercial jets in Yakutat and Juneau (small planes too..funny it's easy to walk on the runway at Yakutat and people get all upset cause it's a commercial jet runway.)

details are here
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alaska_Airlines_Flight_1866

final destination was Seattle, so Seattle area passengers possible
Cordova, Yakutat, Juneau, Sitka stopovers
Seattle-Tacoma International Airport final


The NTSB report apparently faults the pilots?
interesting reading just as historical curiosity
http://www.ntsb.gov/alj/o_n_o/docs/AVIATION/3883.PDF

[Sep 4, 1971] On Sept. 4, 1971, a Boeing 727-100 hit a mountain slope about 28 miles from Juneau, Alaska, killing seven crew members and 104 passengers

from that news article on 9/4/1971

An Alaska Airlines jet carrying 83 passengers and five crew members plunged into chilly waters north of here late this afternoon, leaving behind what rescue officials described as a large debris field.

Eight bodies were recovered but there was no sign of survivors floating on the six-foot swells of sea turned greasy with jet fuel.

A massive search-and-rescue operation continued late tonight in the ocean channel known as "Windy Lane," for its high winds and fickle weather.

The pilots of the jet, en route to Seattle, with a stopover in San Francisco, had reported mechanical difficulties and were being diverted to Los Angeles International Airport.

[snowmman 3]

I just listened to a Tosaw radio interview, and a comment about Cooper supposedly reading magazines. Is that true?

It's interesting then to say that at some point in the moment of the big event, that's what he did (either to relax himself or to try to act "normal"). It's also interesting that if it's true, people attach more importance to cigarettes and bourbon than this. (like I said before, people "see" based on their biases)

I find it interesting because I always read the mags no matter how boring or how many times I've read the airline monthly that month.

How many magazines did he thumb thru? At what point in the event did he do that? I find it really interesting when we muse about his possible profile. I like that he might be a reader. I like to picture him reading stuff on the aft stairs. Reading stuff on the chutes. A human sponge.

[quade 4]

Why would anyone attempt to exact revenge for this against a completely different airline and crew?

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

According to Pasternak:

"Skyjacker at large
A Florida widow thinks she has found him
BY DOUGLAS PASTERNAK
It was the day before Thanksgiving, Nov. 24, 1971. As Northwest Airlines Flight 305, from Portland, Ore., to Seattle, sped along the runway preparing for takeoff, the man in Seat 18C, wearing sunglasses and a dark suit, handed a flight attendant a note. It said he had a bomb and threatened to blow up the Boeing 727 unless he received $200,000 cash and four parachutes when the plane landed. The man in Seat 18C, purchased his ticket under the name "Dan Cooper.""

I don't know how reliable this info is, so, I'm just throwing it out.

BTW: I have made it a point to (purposfully) not read any of the books on Cooper. I feel that helps free me from "preconcieived notions".


Sluggo_Monster

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[snowmman 3]

Hi quade.
I don't know if you've ever been part of a team trying to figure out something very difficult. The most important thing is to generate data. I know ckret says data is static. It's always possible to filter. But unless you have data, you have nothing to filter. The worst is when people self-filter.

Actually the more I learn from ckret about how the hunters think, the more I visualize committing the perfect crime, but that's off-topic.

Random data can also trigger other mental paths in the team.

I flagged it as random.

So don't come down on me. There's a consistent thread of "If you don't think linearly, you obviously are stupid".

I could hammer down even heavier, but I'm trying to stay useful.

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Why would anyone attempt to exact revenge for this against a completely different airline and crew?

[quade 4]

Yes, yes, because asking a simple question is "bringing the hammer down".

Uh, as for being on a team trying to figure out something very difficult . . .

I think you're confusing collecting data and generating data.

Collecting data is useful. Generating it is not.

I've sat in many "brain storming" meetings where someone will invariably say "there's no such thing as a bad idea". Well, ya know what, they're wrong. Some ideas are simply so bad that anyone with some functioning neurons can dismiss them instantly.

That said, that's not even what I'm doing here. What I'm asking is "Why would anyone attempt to exact revenge for this against a completely different airline and crew?" If you can't give a reasonable motive, then it's pretty much pointless going down that road of inquiry.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Albert18 0]

Great work on the Dan Cooper name Sluggo. What a find.

So Dan Cooper is a "test pilot in the Canadian Airforce".

Over 40 Dan Cooper graphic novels have been published to date.

Does "graphic novel" = comic book?

[quade 4]

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Does "graphic novel" = comic book?

Depends on if you're the artist or the mother that finds them in her kids bedroom.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[Albert18 0]

So the fictional Dan Cooper is a hero. Isn't that interesting.


http://www.coolfrenchcomics.com/dancooper.htm

I wonder how much of a US following this comic series had?

[quade 4]

If revenge is going to be considered as a motive in the DB Cooper case, then it has to make sense that DB Cooper would plan the event so that those upon who he was exacting revenge would actually know the motive for the event.

Look at it this way . . .

If your dog poops on the carpet, you can only teach him a lesson by giving him a swat on the ass if you do it right then and there. Ya can't wait until he's in the back yard a week later, walk out and slap him on the ass because he won't know wtf you're doing it for.

Revenge ONLY makes sense if the victim understands it as such.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[councilman24 37]

Those labeling requirements are for reserve/emergency parachutes only. The Pioneer main back container would not have had that marking.

You need to have the context of what you might happen to find on google.

I'm old for my age.
Terry Urban
D-8631
FAA DPRE

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

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I wonder how much of a US following this comic series had?

Albert18,

Or, Canadian.

All,

We're having Tornadoes here (Birmingham, AL) today, so if I don't reply, I'm not ignoring you.

Sluggo_Monster

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[Sluggo_Monster 0]

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Does "graphic novel" = comic book?

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Depends on if you're the artist or the mother that finds them in her kids bedroom.



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