DB Cooper

[JerryThomas 0]

Ice climbing Glacier travel. Now were talking 12 point crampons Jumars Ice axes, Ice mills, We use to teach a course on Gulcanna Glacier in alaska that was my favorite. On that glacier the cravases weren't to bad not as big as whats on Mt McKinley or some of the other glaciers up there though Still it was a lot of fun.At least I thought so then I think I was 29 yrs old then. Wow I do no who brought that up about the Ice climbing Imean but it sure brought back good memories. thanks, The experiment I'm sure the results well be very exciting as well as informative. That is the experiment about which dog bite's his tail first right. (humor)

[georger 247]

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Sluggo Longveiw fiber does most of the logging in these area's and they generaly clear cut. Yes it was like this back in 1971 as it is still today if a logging contractor had of found something pertaining to this case or any artifacts of any kind, it is unlikely it would have been reported. If they report any findings, they have to cease operation emidiatly this cost thim time and money( then there wive's get mad because they can't pay there bills. Just a little humor.) However from the air it looks just as you discribed.Hope this answer's your question.

I had an idea and will post it here - has to do
with the indian rock burials.

any chance you could dig one of those burial mounds
up, stuff cooper and his chute in and cover him
back up with the rocks and debris, then by say March it wouldnt show? The rocks looking undisturbed? (and make off with his money of course). ?

[JerryThomas 0]

What a thought,I hope not but that is something I've never thought of I suppose it's possible. WoW !Now Geoger that's not fair you realy got me on that one.I always left those alone after I discovered what they were by Mistake. But those are stones that will remain unturned for me.WoW! One thing, some of those stone mound graves are of victims from the yacolt burn back in the early 1900"s

[377 22]

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Your intirely correct I was a Instructor at the Northern Warfare Training center In Ft Greely Alaska Im sure your son is aware of the High Altitude Rescue team from there. WE also taught rock climbing courses asault climber courses survival search and rescue river rescue and navigation, Skiing both Alpine and Nordac. And warefare tactics.Your correct about the terain it is some of the toughest and chalenging I've ever seen.Even the Jungles or easier to negotiate than this area Ive been there also.

Wow! That is an impressive set of survival credentials. Maybe YOU are Cooper? Just kidding Jerry.

You mentioned blackberry patches in the area. I have seen some so tall, thick, wide and impenetrable that I think a fit person dropped into the middle without a good knife might never emerge alive. Am I right or do they look like bigger hazards than they really are?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

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i reckon if he's not ex-military gone back to SEAsia, the crawfish got him.

Interesting you should mention that. I was in Louisiana in 1969 right after Hurricane Camille hit it hard. People in the remote coastal marsh areas who ignored warnings and stayed behind and drowned were very quickly attacked by hordes of crabs who stripped most of the flesh from their bones. At least that's what the locals told me.

I imagine crawfish could do the same.

377

That's precisely what scavengers do!

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[georger 247]

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Now Snowmman stop flirting with me.Shelly will get Jellous. Besides flatery will get you know where.

Yeah, but watch this, ignoring you will.
I've learned from the best women.

See you!

did your mother have any chilren that lived?

[georger 247]

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What a thought,I hope not but that is something I've never thought of I suppose it's possible. WoW !Now Geoger that's not fair you realy got me on that one.I always left those alone after I discovered what they were by Mistake. But those are stones that will remain unturned for me.WoW! One thing, some of those stone mound graves are of victims from the yacolt burn back in the early 1900"s

I know but its the perfect place to stach something.
Since they are untouchable few would suspect them.
Just thot I would mention it!

YOU STILL UP. IF I dont get a quick reply here
will call later or you can call me when you're back.
Its 2:21 my time here.

[377 22]

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Chimps and other primates make nests and sleep in them of course. When you
think about it, clothes are nothing but a portable nest.

An interesting thought Georger, but which sounds more provacative: nestless or naked?

I always thought JG, when she wasn't posing for centerfolds in National Geographic, got a bit too cozy with the chimps... if you catch my drift.

I too have pondered whether Cooper WAS found dead, the loot taken, and the body and gear hidden.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[skyjack71 0]

I do have some questions:

1. The area that Jerry is searching is not far as the crow flies from the areas I have asked to be searched and was told that these places did not exist, yet I was there with 3 other women and a man in 2001 - when asking about these areas I was repeately told "You are lieing".

2. Coffey Road and the Trailer park that was there in 1979 and 2001 and did not vanish. Lake LaCames and the other areas I told him about did not vanish. The air strip did not vanish. The dairy did not vanish. The pipe line and power lines did not vanish. The tributary may have been diverted due to developement since 2001. All of these place are not very far from and are West of Jerry's seach area. Yet, he scoffs at me!

3, The Tavern at Dollars Corner that Duane told me about in 1979 and I would visit to in May of 2001, did not vanish .

I understand recently thw bar is no longer in existence, but another business is in its stead. It was the Dollar Corner Tavern Duane pointed out to me on our way to Seattle - that he knew a man there, but we weren't going there. I went there in 2001 to see this bar - it was there.

4. The area Jerry is talking about is East of the Washougal and for the plane to have diverted that far East is far-fetched - considering all the other conversations you guys have had over the last 2 yrs regarding the flight path. This is my opinion, but derived from opinions stated by many of you in this forum as you have digested the information given the flight path.


prefer you do them in a PM, please.

1. Miltary Records: Duane was sent to NTS, Newport, R.I. August 28, 1941. I don't understand the designations - AS to C.R. to S2c. from 9-30-41 to 10-18-41.

2. Selective Training & Service Ca (D.S.S. 166) to BuNave in accordance with SECNAV despatch 1216 (that last number I had to guess at) of 12 Oct. 1940

3. Little Creek, Va.?

4. San Quentin / Folsom there is a mention of his being sent to Soledad (I had been told this was Soledac, but Sluggo was in error). Soledad is a prison in Ca. On March 18, 1954 Duane was sent there and returned to San Quentin the next day. His parents where not too far from Soledad and it may have been at this time his father became ill...the father died in 1956. At that time in our penal system would - they have had to compassion to send Duane close enough for his father to see him one last time - or was this for something else all together?

5. This record also states he was wanted by the Bureau of Prob. and parole, in Columbus, Oh. and that the Wanted was cancelled in 1957. when he was paroled from San Quentin.

Enjoy the Race, because Now that I am out of it - I am able to get a lot done. Thanks for the Hospitality.

Wayne L. Weber also known as John C. Collins and Duane L. Weber. Don't forget Tommy Gunn and Tony Wong - they knew Duane as John. Don't forget the Soldier of Fortune magazine important enough to place in a safe deposit box - Do not for get Du Dop. Do not for get Camino, CA. and the men who jumped around Mt Hood, OR from 1945 to 1948. When you least expect it - an Angel comes out of no where.

Just a little refresher for Jerry"s benefit - He has NO idea what I have been doing since I spoke to him in 2001.

Good night Bruce - sorry I meant Snowmman.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[JerryThomas 0]

The black berry vines are tall and thick and a total nightmare if you land in them at nite you wouldn't realy want to move untill daybreak, so yo can figure out what direction you would want to go.The patches are normally prety large and mixed with neddles in the summer. In the winter its just the blackberry vines. The best way to get out of them is to crawl its easier to nogtiate at the bottom of the vines there stiff and you can move them around to make your self a path.Your hole body will be full of stickers and in a lot of pain. Then your enemy will be infection.But you could survive it.Although you may wish you hadn't. The stickers normally fester up within 24 hrs. Some you can pop out some you can't. I hope that answered your question .Georger can fill you in better on the infection part of it , better than I can.

[georger 247]

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Chimps and other primates make nests and sleep in them of course. When you
think about it, clothes are nothing but a portable nest.

An interesting thought Georger, but which sounds more provacative: nestless or naked?

I always thought JG, when she wasn't posing for centerfolds in National Geographic, got a bit too cozy with the chimps... if you catch my drift.

I too have pondered whether Cooper WAS found dead, the loot taken, and the body and gear hidden.

377

Ive always thought its a possibility but it also increases the chance of a bill turning up in a bank
to be noticed ... none ever were noticed.

When Sluggo first came up with Scotton-Orchards
my first thought was RR tracks (see attached)
and the hijacker being hijacked. It happens more than you would think.

Let me explain. Jerry can fill in details. Those
old indian graves (rocj cairns) are untouchable.
People leave them alone for the most part. If
one is disturbed say in logging you have the
fed/State mandate to call an archaeologist and
report it, but nobody ever does (too costly to wait).
So except for grave poachers the cairns are pretty
much left alone. So it might be a place to stache
things, even a person, especially late in the year
before snowmelt and rains... if you could cover it
back up and make it look undisturbed. Its just a
thought.

Somebody brought up RR tracks behind Fazios -
guess Snow did - and I meant to post this map so
will now and hopfully Jerry will see it -

Its late - later.

PS* These tracks come down from the Orchards area.
You can get all the way back north to SEA by them.

[georger 247]

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The black berry vines are tall and thick and a total nightmare if you land in them at nite you wouldn't realy want to move untill daybreak, so yo can figure out what direction you would want to go.The patches are normally prety large and mixed with neddles in the summer. In the winter its just the blackberry vines. The best way to get out of them is to crawl its easier to nogtiate at the bottom of the vines there stiff and you can move them around to make your self a path.Your hole body will be full of stickers and in a lot of pain. Then your enemy will be infection.But you could survive it.Although you may wish you hadn't. The stickers normally fester up within 24 hrs. Some you can pop out some you can't. I hope that answered your question .Georger can fill you in better on the infection part of it , better than I can.

Lets talk when you get back. Have a good trip.
Im to bed...

[skyjack71 0]

Georger. it was aggravating Jo who brought up the railroad tracks from the Orchard area right to the Fazio's, but Duane didn't go that far. Just to the area across from the Vancouver Airport.

I have changed my avatar back to the SALT LAKE CITY photo from 1979. I have a very good reason - I wanted to.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

All-

Jerry Thomas has asked me to let everyone know that he won't be near a computer to post for the
next 5-7 days, but will return after that.

Stay tuned for new developments -

Thanks,
Georger

[SKYWHUFFO 1]

ok, I am going to open myself up for a barrage of right hooks from alot of people on here. Going back to my question other than the flight crew on the plane who saw Cooper in the role of a hijacker???? The ticket agent only saw a guy buy a ticket. From what you have responed the passengers basically only saw a guy sitting there matching a description of Cooper. I am trying to just think as i was taught in a logic class in college many moons ago.

In another class as a demonstration on preception of a situation under stress The professor had a person run into class and steal 2 purses off of females desk during class in plain site. We were asked to provide a written description to a fake police officer the professor arranged to add to the situation. You would not believe the descriptions, black, white short tall, grey jacket, blue jacket, hat no hat. People said he said stuff when he said nothing.
What i am rambling about is what if these people didnt really see "Cooper", but just another passenger. Could you describe the person setting in the row in front of you across the isile on the last Flight you took when you got off. I just flew for business I thought about this the whole flight. I could not.
Here is where I am opening up the can of worms. What if Cooper didn't exist. What if this was a group of disgruntled flight crew who made up Cooper and put this together? Had a guy buy a ticket in Coopers name. The ticket agent probably saw hundeds of people that night how would he remember Cooper out of all of them? Remember you didn't have the security to buy a ticket or board as we do now I.E Cameas, or checking ID's even. Then they made the rest up together. The imagination of passengers or their need to be important to the FBI only enhances the belief or lore Cooper was there. If you are Cooper and have a plane hijacked and only you and the crew are on it, would you go into a bathroom where you could be locked in knowing your bomb was fake???? If the crew knew he was in there and going to be there for awhile. why would they not slip out of the plane leaving Cooper alone for Ralph to deal with????? They get the money pull some out to celebrate and see it is real, leave it out of the bag, Then decide we better open the door and get rid off the parachutes, The money blows out while doing this and ends up on Tinas bar, either lands or floats there. As we have discussed a flight crew would have ALL the info dictated as what was suposed to come from Cooper. The crew knows the stair operations, The rest of the money is hidden on the plane. The plane was searched but not to the point of looking for hidden objects such as money except for the cabin area from what i read. The rest of the stuff was ditched in the thickest nastiest area around thus why the pilot insisted on that flight path Knowing it would not be found for a long time if ever. This is why we are finding that the plane was not where it suposedly was and the conlfict in when Rat said Cooper went out showing several different stories coming out. this is why no Radar signature was seen of a jumper, Why no chase planes made contact with the plane or Cooper, Why nothing has been found. the crew launders the money in a foreign bank, Canada, Mexico, or other on their next flight there after it is retreived from the plane.
Once again, Logic! People yell at Jo saying PROVE Duane is Cooper(sorry he is not) or put him under a canopy. Well I guess I want a 100% beyond a shadow of a doubt other than a four member flight crew Cooper existed. I hope you can understand my logic. I don't have notebooks from 1980 to research or a computer simulation to pour over to support my Logic. I just have what i read, and I have never seen this proved as well a smy experience in the sport. I am basically being sacreligious to my fellow jumpers in saying there is no Cooper is like telling a kid no such thing as Santa, but can we prove other than testimony of the crew he existed in the role of a hijacker, not just a peson who matched the descrition.
sorry no ties to Oswald or spacemen, just logical things I see as not right from a highly educated person who has fun doing what we are trying to say Cooper did.

D

[skyjack71 0]

Source Unknown:
GOD LIVES UNDER THE BED

I envy Kevin. My brother, Kevin, thinks God lives under his bed. At least that's what I heard him say one night.

He was praying out loud in his dark bedroom, and I stopped to listen, 'Are you there, God?' he said. 'Where are you? Oh, I see. Under the bed...'
I giggled softly and tiptoed off to my own room. Kevin's unique perspectives are often a source of amusement. But that night something else lingered long after the humor. I realized for the first time the very different world Kevin lives in.

He was born 30 years ago, mentally disabled as a result of difficulties during labor. Apart from his size (he's 6-foot-2), there are few ways in which he is an adult.
He reasons and communicates with the capabilities of a 7-year-old, and he always will. He will probably always believe that God lives under his bed, that Santa Claus is the one who fills the space under our tree every Christmas and that airplanes stay up in the sky because angels carry them.

I remember wondering if Kevin realizes he is different. Is he ever dissatisfied with his monotonous life?

Up before dawn each day, off to work at a workshop for the disabled, home to walk our cocker spaniel, return to eat his favorite macaroni-and-cheese for dinner, and later to bed

The only variation in the entire scheme is laundry, when he hovers excitedly over the washing machine like a mother with her newborn child. He does not seem dissatisfied.

He lopes out to the bus every morning at 7:05, eager for a day of simple work. He wrings his hands excitedly while the water boils on the stove before dinner, and he stays up late twice a week to gather our dirty laundry for his next day's laundry chores.

And Saturdays - oh, the bliss of Saturdays! That's the day my Dad takes Kevin to the airport to have a soft drink, watch the planes land, and speculate loudly on the destination of each passenger inside. 'That one's goin' to Chi-car-go! ' Kevin shouts as he claps his hands.

His anticipation is so great he can hardly sleep on Friday nights.
And so goes his world of daily rituals and weekend field trips.

He doesn't know what it means to be discontent.

His life is simple.
He will never know the entanglements of wealth or power, and he does not care what brand of clothing he wears or what kind of food he eats. His needs have always been met, and he never worries that one day they may not be.

His hands are diligent. Kevin is never so happy as when he is working. When he unloads the dishwasher or vacuums the carpet, his heart is completely in it.
He does not shrink from a job when it is begun, and he does not leave a job until it is finished. But when his tasks are done, Kevin knows how to relax.

He is not obsessed with his work or the work of others. His heart is pure. He still believes everyone tells the truth, promises must be kept, and when you are wrong, you apologize instead of argue.
Free from pride and unconcerned with appearances, Kevin is not afraid to cry when he is hurt, angry or sorry. He is always transparent, always sincere. And he trusts God.

Not confined by intellectual reasoning, when he comes to Christ, he comes as a child.. Kevin seems to know God - to really be friends with Him in a way that is difficult for an 'educated' person to grasp. God seems like his closest companion.

In my moments of doubt and frustrations with my Christianity, I envy the security Kevin has in his simple faith. It is then that I am most willing to admit that he has some divine knowledge that rises above my mortal questions.
It is then I realize that perhaps he is not the one with the handicap. I am. My obligations, my fear, my pride, my circumstances - they all become disabilities when I do not trust them to God's care.

Who knows if Kevin comprehends things I can never learn? After all, he has spent his whole life in that kind of innocence, praying after dark and soaking up the goodness and love of God. And one day, when the mysteries of heaven are opened, and we are all amazed at how close God really is to our hearts, I'll realize that God heard the simple prayers of a boy who believed that God lived under his bed.

Kevin won't be surprised at all!
FRIENDS ARE ANGELS WHO LIFT US TO OUR FEET WHEN OUR WINGS HAVE TROUBLE REMEMBERING HOW TO FLY!


reminds us all we sometimes complicate life and situations by over thinking things.

You do know SKYWHUFFO that there are some individuals out there who toot a story for real very close to yours - it did not involve the stewardess, but the Capt and Co-Capt where mentioned along with a group of other pilots and FAA members, CIA and several jumpers. The claim was that the skyjack was staged to create reform within the regulatory organizations. The Skyjack did accomplish this - hence the Cooper Vane.

I am sure most of you have heard this, but until Skywhuffo made his post we never explored this because most, if not all find it hard to believe such was even think-able much less do-able.

Just let some more Monkeys loose in this Zoo. Georger is definitely a money - see his avatar. Snowmman he must be one of those rare white moneys, 377 must be one of those in a laboratory because he has a number instead of a name. I don't know what kind of monkey I am - I am sure I am on the bottom of the chain as some monkeys are related more to RATS. I wonder what kind of Monkey Jerry is?

Well, we need some fun and Skywhuffo's post showed another simple view.

[Orange1 0]

The theory about a conspiracy by crew will be unproveable unless anyone actually finds proof of Cooper's existence. It certainly explains why no body was ever found, though not why none of the bills other than the Ingrams' showed up - "laundering" in a foreign bank wouldn't explain this as the money would very likely make its way back to the US (as discussed before - though money spent in a dollarized or largely dollarized economy overseas might not).

Whatever the true events, I have always been a bit sceptical about the ticket seller's description - simply because I cannot see a reason to remember someone who by all accounts was a very non-descript passenger - why would she have taken enough notice of just another customer to be able to offer a description?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[377 22]

Skywhuffo,

Your theory about there being no Cooper and that it was a crew scam might be true, but it is NEARLY IMPOSSIBLE for more than two people to keep a secret like that. Eventually someone slips up or talks.

Barry Bonds in the end could only rely on his trainer to keep his steroids secret. Everyone else involved broke under a little legal pressure and talked.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

I thought this was brought up before, It was, and you did it. Here. It's not a bad idea, but I agree with 377 that the entire crew couldn't have been able to keep it a secret. When you consider that 2 of the Flight Attendants were left at SeaTac, that Tina went into a convent, and that the FBI did search the plane at Reno; all that adds up to not likely. Not impossible, but unlikely.

I think Ckret said this was investigated and dismissed, but I can't find where he said that (and I could be wrong).

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

SKYWHUFFO,


I spent a period of time thinking along similar lines. I just never come up with a scenario that made sense taking into consideration what I know about the case (or THINK I know).

The one issue that is haunting me right now is:
In later years (as recently as 2001) Rataczak was making statements (publically and supposedly to the FBI) that he was certain the oscillations followed by the “pressure bump” marked Cooper’s jump.

He even said; “I think our passenger has taken leave of us.” If that is true, why was Scott afraid to enter the cabin to check on Cooper (even after getting no response on the interphone)? Why did they continue all the way to Reno with the gear down and aft stairs extended? Why did they risk landing at Reno with the aft stairs extended? I’m sure if they didn’t know you could fly with the stairs down, they could not have been sure that they could land (safely) with them down.

Does it sound (to you) that Rataczak (and/or Scott) were CERTAIN the “pressure bump” delineated where he jumped? And, don’t forget the strange characteristic of the pneumatic “cabin pressure-altitude” system on the 727-100 to exhibit spurious “pressure bumps.”

These questions leave me with the feeling that there is a BIG piece of the puzzle missing. I don’t mean a conspiracy… just something (important) that we have not been told.


Sluggo_Monster

Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum

[skyjack71 0]

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Whatever the true events, I have always been a bit sceptical about the ticket seller's description - simply because I cannot see a reason to remember someone who by all accounts was a very non-descript passenger - why would she have taken enough notice of just another customer to be able to offer a description?

Can't remember the name of the ticket agent just now ,but She was a He not that it makes any difference. I did interview this man over the phone many many yrs ago. At that time he actually could not identify Duane. I will say that time has tainted the memory of the witnesses. For instance, Florence by new accountings and other writings has identified several individuals as being Cooper.

It is going to take much more than any witness saying "that was Cooper" or 'that was Not Cooper".
Mitchell is the only one I got to send my photos of Duane to. The others have only saw whatever the media presented and in the beginning that was some that didn't look like the Duane I knew.

Many photos of Weber have been accumulated over the yrs. but for no reason other than I wanted them. At this time in history photos of any suspect are useless.
We will need a lot more than witness identification.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[377 22]

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Why did they continue all the way to Reno with the gear down and aft stairs extended?

I can see staying in the cockpit just to be 100% sure to avoid a confrontation with a bomb wielding hijacker. That means leaving the stairs down. Leaving the landing gear down for the rest of the flight if you are reasonably certain that Cooper has left the plane is puzzling. Sounds like they weren't so sure,

Could Cooper have exited way later than we have been assuming? I can't see how to square that with the Tena Bar money find.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 247]

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Quote

Why did they continue all the way to Reno with the gear down and aft stairs extended?

I can see staying in the cockpit just to be 100% sure to avoid a confrontation with a bomb wielding hijacker. That means leaving the stairs down. Leaving the landing gear down for the rest of the flight if you are reasonably certain that Cooper has left the plane is puzzling. Sounds like they weren't so sure,

Could Cooper have exited way later than we have been assuming? I can't see how to square that with the Tena Bar money find.

377

Hi 377. I have posted some relevant passages
below from the PI Transcript.

If you take these passages at face value, they did not go back to look until during their approach at
Reno and then only a 'cursory' look, as the text
conveys. Their primary concern was the bomb.

However, they may have been listening for any
sign of Cooper in the back? The PA may have
allowed them to listen? They also had a curtain separating them from the back so perhaps peeked
from time to time? And it is clear they were having
private conversations with Nyrop and others during
this whole period, which are not included in the
PI & NWA Transcripts.

My instinct is they looked prior to public comment
transcribed, as they approach Reno. There is one
comment from the ground (included below) which
asks them to look and then land asap if the HJ is
gone (we know they did not land before Reno).

Excerpts from transcript below:


7:45 pm t1
305: Still at 7000 feet. 19 DME SOUTH (S) V32. Dunno (what he’s doing) no comms with him but have an aft stair lite.
MSP:Roger 305. After a while someone will have to take a look back there to see if he is out of the aircraft.
305: Roger.

7:54 pm t1
MSP: As soon as reasonably sure the man has left the quicker you can land.
305: Roger. Miss Mucklow said he apparently has the knapsack around him and thinks he will attempt a jump.
MSP: Roger. After leaving this freq go to 131.8 we have direct phone patch There (to Company and FBI)
305: Roger.

8:20 pm t1
305: Called. (called to Cooper? No answer & think he has jumped?)
MSP: Go to 131.8 (phone patch to company on that freq.)
SEADD: He (Nyrop?) is already on that frequency.
MSP: Roger. We are on the phone and will be talking to him shortly.
SEADD: Roger.

10:36
305: Ok, ah, we’re trying to make contact with the back now and we’re going to get these steps up before we can make our landing. So we’ll proceed in and uh we’re liable to break it off at some point (if we don’t get it up) and we’ll keep you advised.

10:48
305: Approach? Uh 305. We cant seem to raise him back there if he is there. We kind of hate to .. uh, we’d just as soon land with the thing (stairs) hanging down. It isn’t all the ay down and then probably won’t have any pressure on it so we hope it’ll (unintelligible) free and uh where do you want us to go after we get on the ground?
305: I want to stay away from any hazard if the bomb goes off we don’t want it to hinder anyone and we’ll want the fuel trucks to pull up so anyway, if you’ve got a wider apron.
305: We’ll remain on this frequency with your advised approach. We’re now marker inbound and we’re going to be landing with the air stair
in the down position. We don’t seem to get any response from our friend in the back.

11:08
305: Reno? OK ah I’ll tell you what – Stand by just a moment. We’re ah, we’re gonna look back here and see what’s going on.
Reno: OK

11:13
305: Reno this is Northwest 305. Ok sir. Be advised that ah we apparently ah, our passenger took leave of us somewhere ah, between here and Seattle we have ah, made a rather cursory examination of the aircraft for the brief case and we are unable to do this. We would like to secure the aircraft we’ll leave the beacon on. We’re going to, well fact of the
matter is we’re going to shut everything down. We’re going to take leave of the aircraft …

[SKYWHUFFO 1]

Well i won't uncover yet, Snow and georger have not rung in with their right hooks. In this day and age, of media media media, it seems like EVERYONE talks sooner or later. I just still find it odd none of the crew have never spoke over the years not even at the major anniversaries, other than in my opinion the well prepared interview we saw on tape withing days of the incident where they acted nervous. 377, being an attorney doesn't it raise an eyebrow when sombody imediately shuts up(then on CSI demands their attorney HA) like the crew has or if you are reading their manurisms from the tape? I just find it wierd. I know if i am looking at a long time in Jail, or a life of seclusion basically, guess what i am taking. I can not quote jo exactly but somwhere you have mentioned one of the stewardesses basically being borderline hysterical if sombody approached her about the case and you had to respect her privacy. I am going from memory so nobody go off about false info please. That is just very odd behavior to me. I am NOT crying Conspiracy, I am just trying to see if there is an answer for this VERY LARGE piece in this puzzle i dont see fitting with the rest of the story. Snow you usually look at logic, and i would think you would come to the same conclusion this piece does not fit when you look at the science vs. the stories as Sluggo and many other are now disproving.
Sombody mentioned Berry Bonds. it took how many years for the truth on he and A-rod to come out cause some reporters finally pushed it. That info was easy to find for them compared to this. We are seeing these descrepencies now because they are just now being looked at, questioned and not accepted as just truth as they have for all these years. My hats off to some of you on here for that!

IF the pieces doesn't fits, Cooper didn't exists! HA! I am just having fun with this statement nothing meant by it.

D

[wolfriverjoe 1,523]

I hope you don't take this as a "right hook". Everyone has their opinions, yours isn't any more or less valid than anyone else's. Most "airplane people" won't talk to the media much. Mainly out of distrust due to bad experiences. I'd bet that the airline actively discouraged the crew from any media contact other than the televised news conference to try to avoid negative publicity. That's pretty standard even today. Tina went into a convent after the experience (I think she is the one you are referring to about hysteria). I think after spending several hours sitting next to a guy with a bomb, PTSD is a very real possibility.

Snowmman - you were wondering about whether or not ATC would notice or comment if the plane was off course.

I don't know how far off course the plane would have to be to raise comment, but -

1- Victor airways are 8 miles wide - 4 on either side of the center line.
2- With the airplane being a very special case, would they comment about anything that wasn't safety related (plane going toward high terrain)?

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo