DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

I saw NOTHING in his bio that qualifies him to make judgement on that money and where it has been.

I am sure from the way he spoke to me in reply to one of few PM's I sent him (offering unfilter information about where the money could have been) - that he is going to try to slaughter the truth. He does NOT have an OPEN mind and/or he has been manipulated to keep the lid on Cooper.

More than likely the later since he is not CIA or FBI or an investigator of crimes. These super intelligent individuals with all of the degrees and credits are very easy to manipulate when it comes down to digesting common sense information.
I should know 1st hand - I come for a family of these well educated, mulit-degreed, scientific, structured and politically correct individuals.

I expect this film is the " Lid Lock" in the Cooper Case so the FBI and our government get the focus off of Cooper and their inadequate investigation, then they can get about business as usual - screwing up.

I hope the documentary surprises me and is going to be factual and open, but until then I remain a skeptic...and a pessimist or AS THE FBI AND OTHERS VIEW ME -
a limited brain cell PEST. (Dumb blonde).


PS: The filtered information about the money, the water and possible areas comes from the source - man on the ground. My experience with the source is first hand and it has NOT been pleasant.

If ones information is bias and delibertly filtered - a true evaluation could and would never be made by any researcher....unless the reciever of the information has enough common sense to see thru his source and make confirmations thru a second party. An excellent example of this is soil samples. Trust only samples you yourself take.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

170th Assault Helicopter Company

GO to Gallery and then to CARL BRADER.

Maybe this is who Waugh was referring too.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

Quote

170th Assault Helicopter Company

GO to Gallery and then to CARL BRADER.

Maybe this is who Waugh was referring too.

It does make a lot of sense that I would throw out Billy Waugh, then Billy Waugh would throw out a name, then I would throw out a lot of posts mentioning a lot of stuff, including the 170th, and then there'd be a picture there of the guy Billy was talking about.

Life does work that way. I hope the Nat Geo is as good.

(edit) Hey, just realized.
For anyone who thinks I was glib about throwing Waugh's name in the hat, I didn't see Waugh hesitating much before throwing someone into the same hat. So I be cool.

[snowmman 3]

This seems like a good book. Guy covers the history of some of the parchute testing they did stateside, even before the '60s. As well as other stuff. T-10's, E-1, Blank gore.

Get this: very early: 1958ish? They tested the Pioneer Parachute Company's "Sky Diver" model (28' canopy). On page 187 they tested jumping up to 150 knots.

So the idea that military wouldn't be familar with sport parachutes, isn't exactly right.
page 188
http://books.google.com/books?id=hzGE2X2kEIMC&pg=PA188

"Fortune Favors the Brave"
By Bruce F. Meyer
Publisher: St. Martin's Press
Pub. Date: August 2004
ISBN-13: 9780312996802

I found one interesting thing that might be worth investigating. It's possible that the Vietnam HALOs weren't acknowledged until 1995? or is there evidence of earlier acknowledgment?
He says on page 241
http://books.google.com/books?id=hzGE2X2kEIMC&pg=PA241

"A number of subsequent HALO insertions were made into Laos and into the border areas of South Vietnam. ....It was not until twenty-five years later, however, that the U.S. Army acknowledged the fact that its Special Forces jumpers (while serving with SOG) had made these combat jumps at all. In 1995, S.Sgt. Cliff Newman and the other HALO parachutists were given special HALO wings with a gold star, indicative of a combat jump."


from a review
"This is the untold, inside story of a super elite reconnaissance force-U.S. Special Operations Forces who practiced clandestine insertion and extraction by submarine, jet aircraft and helicopter, using tools and techniques that had never been tried before. Strapping you in the harness of a HALO parachute, launching from the torpedo room of a submerged submarine or climbing the extraction rig of a hovering marine chopper, Fortune Favors the Brave is a firsthand account of what it was like to build a new strike force from the ground up... to make sure that the next time America fought a war, Force Recon would be there.
At the end of World War II, when daring marine reconnaissance units made a life-and-death difference in island warfare in the Pacific, a secret unit was formed inside the military. With courageous men risking their lives, Test Unit 1 experimented with new ways of inserting marines behind enemy lines-by sea and by land-and then getting them out again. As America barreled towards a confrontation in Indochina and a new era of warfare, First Force Recon was born..."

[snowmman 3]

I don't know what the full article says, but he mentions HALO later on. Be interesting to know if things really were secret till '95.
I do know that for a while they said there was only one combat parachute jump in Vietnam. We know now that was untrue.

"More Dirty Work
By Stuart H. Loory

August 27, 1973, Monday

Page 29, 880 words

COLUMBUS, Ohio-The revelation in recent days of clandestine crossborder operations by American ground troops in Cambodia, Laos and North Vietnam during the war reminds me once again that, somewhere in the United States, at least one Vietnam veteran has some important stories to tell."

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F60915F6385C1A7A93C5AB1783D85F478785F9

(edit) this is a funny news article from Jan 30, 1966 where they say US Army was doing HALO training..they called it "Horizontal Parachuting"

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=V8UNAAAAIBAJ&sjid=V3QDAAAAIBAJ&pg=7146,5230161&dq=horizontal+parachuting

[377 22]

I know I am stating the obvious, but to credibly finger someone as a possible Cooper, you'd have to know a LOT about the case. Billy projects disinterest, yet deflects attention right away to a guy who is MIA. Based on what?

Billy's suspect can't be questioned and Billy himself doesn't want to discuss Norjack. Dead end, unless you are Snow, who just shifts into a higher gear.

There is so much I'd like to ask Billy, especially concerning who knew about the Air America 727 jumps, but he isn't interested in any dialogue on this subject.

We are all getting a fascinating look at a part of the Viet Nam war that was not covered in the popular press, regardless of how Waugh plays out.

If you participated in the kinds of missions Waugh and his colleagues did, seems to me you'd be really angry when the Pentagon just decided to pull the plug on everything.

A hijack for ransom is not a direct payback to the Pentagon, but you can see how someone who felt double crossed by our government could get pretty antisocial and not care about the rule of law any more.

Embittered soldiers sometimes direct their anger towards war profiteers. I don't think NWA was generally seen as such a company, but what could you do against e.g. Dow Chemical (napalm mfr often held out as immoral Nam war profiteer)?

What do we know about Waugh's suspect? Anything?

Eagerly awaiting the Tom and Larry show. National Geographic has always quietly profited from sensationalism, starting with bare breasted photos of native women offered (but not consumed) as sterile non sexual educational material.

Those yellow and white covered "respectable" magazines were the Playboy for adults too embarrassed to subscribe to the real thing and for kids who had no access. Do I hear an AMEN brother?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

It's very interesting to now go back to the mid '60s newspaper articles, where all sorts of CIA activity was being alleged, and realize that a lot of it was probably true. But people in the mid '60s didn't have the info that we have now. It's interesting to put yourself back then, just not knowing what we know now.

Here Green Berets were on trial for murder, but the case got dropped because CIA wouldn't cooperate.

I've been reading another set of articles, where an NCO who was most decorated in Korea, quit in an incident at Fort Bragg, where he was complaining about murders that were done in front of him.

Don't know the details of this case.

http://select.nytimes.com/gst/abstract.html?res=F50A1FFB345E1B7493C2AA1782D85F4D8685F9

ARMY DROPS BERETS' CASE AS C.I.A. BARS ITS AGENTS FROM TESTIFYING AT TRIAL; RESOR TAKES STEP He Says the Agency's Stand Has Ruled Out Fair Courts-Martial Army Drops Beret Case as C.I.A. Bars Testimony

By ROBERT B. SEMPLE Jr.

September 30, 1969, Tuesday

WASHINGTON, Sept. 29 -- The Army, conceding that it was helpless to enlist the cooperation of the Central Intelligence Agency, today abruptly dropped its case against six Special Forces soldiers who were arrested in July in connection with the alleged murder of a Vietnamese agent.

3 Berets Reportedly Take 5th Amendment
Aug 22, 1969
Creighton W. Abrams, commander of U.S. forces in Vietnam, that the South ... The officials have acknowledged that the CIA knew some details of the case, ...

Murder Charges Against Eight Green Berets Dropped by Army
Sep 30, 1969
Robert B. Rheault, 44, the West Pointer who commanded all Special Forces, (Green Berets) in Vietnam. The CIA had no

ARMY DROPS BERETS' CASE AS CIA BARS ITS AGENTS...
CIA Ordered 100 Killings, Beret's Attorney Charges
SAIGON. Viet Nam. Aug. 16, 1969 UPD-More than 100 agents in South Viet Nam have been ordered killed by the ...

[snowmman 3]

http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,901231,00.html

Mystery of the Green Berets

Friday Aug. 15, 1969

Although they are the most glamorous and publicized soldiers of the Viet Nam war, the U.S. Army's elite Special Forces have always been enveloped in the sinister. Highly trained in guerrilla and psychological warfare, they operate covertly on the fringes of battle. They often ignore the nominal rules of war in their day-to-day battle for survival in isolated rural areas.

Last week the aura of intrigue was deepened and tinged with scandal when the Army's Saigon command announced that eight Green Berets, including the Special Forces commander for all of Viet Nam, had been detained while the Army investigated charges of premeditated murder against them in the shooting of a South Vietnamese. The commander is Colonel Robert B. Rheault, 43, a much-decorated West Pointer. Also arrested were two majors, three captains, a chief warrant officer and a sergeant first class.

Ripples of Disbelief.
The Army did nothing to lessen the mystery. The killing was said to have occurred June 20 near the Special Forces headquarters at Nha Trang, 200 miles northeast of Saigon. Rheault was relieved of his command on July 21. Who the victim was, what his connections with the war might have been, who brought the charges — all these facts remained secret. Regular military investigating units professed to have no knowledge of the incident, leading to conjecture that the case involved a secret agency, possibly the CIA. This speculation was supported by the fact that at least three of the Green Berets were intelligence specialists. According to one story, the victim was a Vietnamese spy for the Americans, who had disappeared when he was discovered to be a double agent. No body has been found, and rumor has it that the victim was disposed of at sea. Such a killing would not be unique in Viet Nam, not difficult to disguise. Why the Army chose to publicize the case is another mystery.

Rarely has an officer of Rheault's high rank faced a murder charge. Thus the case sent ripples of disbelief and disillusionment through Army camps and mess halls. Rheault had been respected and well liked by his men. Said one Green Beret captain: "My first reaction was shock. The second was that Colonel Rheault was getting shafted." Several soldiers had first thought that Rheault was relieved of duty in order to be promoted to brigadier general.

Rheault's replacement, Colonel Alexander Lemberes, said he was just as puzzled as everyone else. He had only 15 minutes to pack after being notified that he was replacing Rheault, and subsequently broke his right ankle in a hasty attempt to qualify as a parachutist —something all Green Berets must do.

Relatives of the eight men were also left without explanations. Mrs. Rheault said she had sensed that something was wrong from her husband's most recent letters, but relatives of the others said that they had not been aware of any difficulties until news reports of the arrests appeared. By week's end, four of the accused had hired civilian lawyers. Two of the attorneys received security clearances, reinforcing the belief that the case involves some supersecret operation. The Army is now investigating the charges to see if there are grounds for a court-martial. Conviction on a charge of premeditated murder carries a maximum penalty of death.

[snowmman 3]

I mentioned Project Gamma before, in terms of how it fit organizationally.

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/5th_Special_Forces_Group_(United_States)

In June 1969 an incident developed which led to the arrest in July of seven officers and one non-commissioned officer of the 5th Special Forces Group (Airborne) including the new commander, Colonel Robert B. Rheault. The incident, which may have had Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) involvement, was the murder of a suspected double agent, Thai Khac Chuyen working on Project GAMMA and an attempt to cover it up.

Mr. Chuyen would undergo some ten days of rigorous interrogation and solitary confinement. Ultimately, he would be shot and dumped into the sea.

National newspapers and television picked up the story, most likely due to the involvement of the Special Forces, and the “Green Beret Affair” became another lightning rod for anti-war feeling. Finally in September 1969 Secretary of the Army Stanley Resor announced that all charges would be dropped since the CIA, in the interests of national security, had refused to make its personnel available as witnesses.

On March 5, 1971, 5th SFG returned to Fort Bragg. During their time in Vietnam, members of the unit earned 19 Medals of Honor, making it the most prominently decorated unit for its size in that conflict.

(edit) added TIME article:

Who Killed Thai Khac Chuyen? Not I, Said the CIA
TIME Sept 05, 1969
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,901339,00.html

Silence and secrecy are articles of faith and a way of life in the high-security halls of the Central Intelligence Agency. It took a murky internecine dispute with the U.S. Army to force the CIA to step forward last week to tell its side of the strange story of Thai Khac Chuyen, a supposed Vietnamese double agent killed late in June.

Eight members of the U.S. Special Forces, including the Green Beret commander in Viet Nam, Colonel Robert Rheault, are under arrest in Long Binh. A civilian lawyer for one of the Green Berets has hinted that Chuyen worked for the CIA and that it ordered his execution by the Green Berets when he was discovered to be a North Vietnamese agent as well.

Not so, says the CIA. About a year ago, the agency decided to limit its work in Viet Nam to intelligence monitoring, and handed over active spying operations to the Green Berets. In mid-June, however, as the CIA tells it, the Green Berets came to the CIA for advice on what to do with a Vietnamese —whom they did not then identify—suspected of being a double agent.

The CIA claims that it said that it could do nothing to help, but strongly urged the Green Berets not to kill the man. The agency repeated the advice after learning the agent's name from the Green Berets a few days later. The CIA says that it had not heard of Chuyen before that moment.

Nonetheless, Chuyen was killed shortly thereafter.

A Green Beret sergeant, Alvin Smith Jr., now one of the eight under detention, came to the CIA office in Nha Trang, explained that Chuyen had been executed, and asked for protection from "a bunch of wild men" in his outfit.

The CIA agent alerted the Army's Criminal Investigation Division, which moved Smith to Saigon. General Creighton Abrams, the U.S. commander in Viet Nam, ordered a full-scale probe that led to the arrests.

The Green Berets, according to the CIA, at first insisted that Chuyen had been sent on a mission and had simply not returned; later, some changed their tune. The CIA version does not explain the exact role of Colonel Rheault. One theory is that he demanded to be arrested with his subordinates, taking a commander's responsibility for what they did.

Why has the CIA broken its customary silence since the arrests? Apparently out of pique at the Army.

CIA men in Saigon reportedly asked General Abrams to explain publicly that the agency was not involved in the killing of Chuyen; Abrams refused.

Then, in Washington, the agency turned to Army Secretary Stanley Resor, pleading at length to be let off the hook of complicity in Chuyen's death. Once more it got no satisfaction, so now it is leaking its case to the public.

[snowmman 3]

Green Berets on Trial
Aug 22, 1969
TIME
http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,898517,00.html

In the shadowy world of the intelligence agent, the phrase "to terminate with prejudice" means to blackball an agent administratively so that he cannot work again as an informer. When the phrase "to terminate with extreme prejudice" is used, it often becomes the cloak-and-dagger code for extermination.

In June, just such an execution order reached a U.S. Special Forces outfit in a port city of South Viet Nam. Seven Green Beret officers and one enlisted man helped to carry it out.

The upshot was their arrest and detention pending investigation. Last week, as the Army maintained total silence and a host of rumors swirled through offices and bars in Saigon, Washington and Green Beret headquarters at Fort Bragg, N.C., a bizarre tale of counterespionage began to unfold.

The alleged crime centers around Special Forces Unit B57 (code name: "Black Beard") located on Nha Trang airbase 190 miles northeast of Saigon. Like two other outfits (B52 and B-55) operating in Viet Nam, B57 is a Special Forces intelligence unit, commanded by Major David Crew of Cedar Rapids, Iowa, one of the eight under arrest.

It was engaged in counterespionage along the borders of Laos and Cambodia, employing a network of 300 secret agents to spot enemy infiltrators, supply dumps and rest camps. One of its top agents was a Vietnamese national with the cover name of Thai Khac Chuyen.

Early in June, B57 received intelligence photos snapped in Cambodia by another of its spies showing Agent Chuyen in conversation with a man known to be a high official in the North Vietnamese intelligence system, the CNC (Cue Nghien Cuu—Central Office for Research and Studies).

Chuyen was picked up in Tay Ninh near the Cambodian border and brought to Nha Trang for "hard" interrogation. Later he was taken to Saigon, shot full of sodium pentothal and given a lie-detector test.

The interrogations convinced the Green Berets that Chuyen was a double agent serving Hanoi as well as the U.S. Because the CIA has overall responsibility for secret agents in Viet Nam, it was notified at once.

The CIA sent the fatal reply: "Terminate with extreme prejudice." A few days later, the CIA countermanded its "extreme" order —but by then it was too late.

Chuyen had already been given a massive dose of morphine, bundled into a boat and shot to death with a .22-cal. pistol. His body, weighted with chains, was dumped into either the deep, mud-bottomed Giang River or the South China Sea.

Despite weeks of full-time dredging by three ships, Chuyen's body has not been recovered.

South Viet Nam literally swarms with spies and agents of all sorts. On the allied side alone, there are said to be at least 15 separate intelligence organizations, often antagonistic to one another.

A roundup of suspected enemy spies and agents last month netted 69 prisoners, including Huynh Van Trong, a longtime friend of President Thieu's and his Special Assistant for Political Affairs. Rumors in Saigon at once linked the Green Beret case to the recent roundup.

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

edited for space.
If you participated in the kinds of missions Waugh and his colleagues did, seems to me you'd be really angry when the Pentagon just decided to pull the plug on everything.

A hijack for ransom is not a direct payback to the Pentagon, but you can see how someone who felt double crossed by our government could get pretty antisocial and not care about the rule of law any more.
377

Attention Snowmman and 377:
Night Halo's were done way before 1967 - I have this in writing in one of the reports - I have been looking for it for hours. The date I had been reading did not correspond with my notes - and I had just recently read the report. I have 4 ft of papers stacked on my dining room table right now.... been sorting for hours.

They are mentioned in the JMWave and Cuba project (Mongoose) - and that started in 1962. I have a book and research on this at another location - so I will check on that this wk.

I am sure that one of you with all of the electronic technology will find it before I do. I just told you were to look for it.

377: Think about this - if someone contributed to a war effort in a covert operation or CIA covert action and was promised compensation, would they not also be just as angry at the Pentagon (or whoever was making the promises), such as Wilson.

The covert groups where more likely to have retaliated against the government after not receiving compensation or acknowledgement. In fact the government with all of its secrets would quickly have covered the jumpers tracks - which THEY in MY opinion did.

It would have been necessary to eliminate ALL involved - the government was not going to take any chances. That paper sack (whatever was in it) and tie left the necessary messages. Although the FBI may not have known what was going on they got their directions regarding what they found on that plane from Hoover.

Some have paid heavy penalties with their lives, and later encarcerated for unrelated incidents. I don't mean just the peons, but those holding office in our government offices. What comes around goes around. Recent CIA disclosures by some of these prior officials and others has resulted in the government declassifing information that has inadvertantly pointed out who Cooper may have been.

Perhaps Cooper was doing what could well be a death mission and by happen chance survived. He had already taken the necessary precautions to "wipe" himself out (severing all ties) so NO one would miss him.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 244]

Quote

I know I am stating the obvious, but to credibly finger someone as a possible Cooper, ....
377

I think you and Snow & Jo are on your own for a while -
the rest of us somewhere doing something, anywhere
but here. Good luck to you and Michael Jackson and
Jo Jackson.

[377 22]

Since show biz (Jacksons) is being used for analogies, I ask this:

How many times has Cher delivered her "Final Performance"?

Bye Cher. We hardly knew you.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 22]

Quote

the rest of us [are] somewhere doing something

Sounds very important. Glad we have the best and the brightest working on it.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[SKYWHUFFO 1]

Snow,

Here is somthing to think about, Did Waugh and Gossett's past history ever cross together? Were the the ever in the same place at the same time or serve under the same guy etc? That may be an interesting angle.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Quote

I know I am stating the obvious, but to credibly finger someone as a possible Cooper, ....
377

I think you and Snow & Jo are on your own for a while -
the rest of us somewhere doing something, anywhere
but here. Good luck to you and Michael Jackson and
Jo Jackson.

I'm going somewhere too.
Always kind of felt like I was on my own, so nothing new.
Good luck to everyone.

[377 22]

You can go somewhere Snow but please don't leave the forum. I was really looking forward to your review of the National Geographic show
about DBC, scientists and citizen sleuths.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

Quote

:
Night Halo's were done way before 1967 - I have this in writing in one of the reports - I have been looking for it for hours. The date I had been reading did not correspond with my notes - and I had just recently read the report. I have 4 ft of papers stacked on my dining room table right now.... been sorting for hours.

Something tangible?! Well then Jo, please tell us - what report, who wrote it etc? Its not in the database of military jumps, the only night jumps I could find before Asia were SL jumps. Please give us a proper reference at least, if you have something there there is no need to waste hours searching on the net through all the other stuff... Thanks...

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[quade 4]

Quote

Jo, don't respond to any of those posts.
I'm just posting their words.
They deserve more respect than your picking.

If you can copy and paste drivel, she can respond to it.

The words you're posting aren't special and certainly don't "deserve" any special treatment.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[377 22]

Quote

Quote

:
Night Halo's were done way before 1967 - I have this in writing in one of the reports - I have been looking for it for hours. The date I had been reading did not correspond with my notes - and I had just recently read the report. I have 4 ft of papers stacked on my dining room table right now.... been sorting for hours.

Something tangible?! Well then Jo, please tell us - what report, who wrote it etc? Its not in the database of military jumps, the only night jumps I could find before Asia were SL jumps. Please give us a proper reference at least, if you have something there there is no need to waste hours searching on the net through all the other stuff... Thanks...

Looking forward to Jo's reply.

Orange, are we among the very few posters who have never threatened to leave the DBC forum? Guess we are just low drama folks. Does that make us boring? I worry about that. Should we fuss more and throw a tantrum now and then?

Hope Snow stays around. The stuff he is finding is truly eye opening about what happened under our flag in Viet Nam. I want more. Every time I think I have found the gold nuggets he posts stuff I have never seen.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

Oh 377!

Orange1 IS NOT boring!

And, you are...n....t... either...... snore....snore... sno UH! What was I saying? Oh yeah... You're n...o...t... b...o.... snore... snore....snooooorrrrree.

Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum

[377 22]

An aging jumper, rejected by his peers, seen as boring,

What to do, what to do...

Aha, hijack the International Space Station. That would get their attention. Have ransom delivered in a unmanned space tug. Re-enter in a MIR escape pod, land in the Washougal.

Now, just have to raise 20 million for a space tourist ticket and go up under a fake ID. Just minor details.

Oh, and leave a clip on tie aboard the ISS.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

How is it even possible that these threads still exist? Man, I quit moderating like four years ago and they are STILL popping up! Amazing. God Bless You Paul Quade.

[quade 4]

Quote

How is it even possible that these threads still exist? Man, I quit moderating like four years ago and they are STILL popping up! Amazing. God Bless You Paul Quade.

We fight them abroad so we don't have to fight them at home.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[georger 244]

Quote

You can go somewhere Snow but please don't leave the forum. I was really looking forward to your review of the National Geographic show
about DBC, scientists and citizen sleuths.

377

dont worry. he will be back, could not resist sniping at that which he covets... and must
steer. something will come up which requires his
presents.