DB Cooper

[snowmman 3]

Quote

who drew this map?????

No one knows. (says Carr)

Duane Weber?


(edit) I've attached the iconic Robbie Burroughs + parachute shot that led to the unraveling of the staged FBI stunt, which led to Carr showing up on DZ.com, which led to him being discovered trying to maintain the coverup and run off.

I've researched the fonts used on the parachute shown, and the font below was only used by three companies: one supplied interoffice memo envelopes to the FBI. There is also a match on a set of rubber stamps used by a insurance company that Duane Weber worked for, but I believe that is just coincidence.

[snowmman 3]

http://www.boston.com/news/local/breaking_news/2009/04/mother_accused.html

This was an interesting case in April. The guy probably is/was just stupid.

Reed was in Boston on a layover from Las Vegas and was bound for Charlotte, officials said. The materials in his bags apparently eluded detection at the Las Vegas airport and were discovered in Boston only because baggage handlers inadvertently routed his arriving luggage to baggage claim rather than onto his connecting flight.

TSA screeners in Terminal B at Logan called State Police at 7:10 a.m. after they said they discovered the following items in Reed's luggage: a locked gun box containing a semiautomatic handgun; a fully loaded gun magazine; several boxes of 9 mm and 7.62 mm ammunition; three model rocket engines containing an explosive mixture; military fuses; electronics kit boxes with various components; and a hand grenade fuse assembly with detonator."

(edit) some more detail, which kind of verifies he's just stupid, but still, the stuff got thru
http://www.lvrj.com/news/breaking_news/48641557.html
They mention "This was the second time in three months that a member of the U.S. military tried to travel on an airline with luggage containing live ammunition."

[snowmman 3]

Dick Cheney has discovered that our government is up to some nefarious misdeeds

1) Obama is going to give terrorists the rights of Americans, let them lawyer up and read them their Miranda rights.

2) Obama is going to bring the mastermind of 9/11 to New York, give him a lawyer and trial in civilian court.

3) Obama is going to close Guantanamo and release the hard-core al Qaeda-trained terrorists still there.

This sounds pretty outrageous.

I'm reminded of the Declaration of Independence, when the colonists outlined their complaints against King George.

I think Dick is compelling us to Rise Up! for the reasons above. (I believe he said there's some kind of clause that allows the Rise Up! without being charged with terrorism)

I can't believe the leader of the purported most powerful nation in the world would do 1-3 above.

And Ed Prince is stepping down from Xe? What is going wrong with this world?

Hey I noticed that survivalists now call themselves "preppers"..all nice mom and apple pie. How can I make money off them?

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

I think I get it!
Jo is talking about Forest Rangers!
That includes anyone who ever raked leaves on Federal property. Its all - Ranger Training!

Jo posts all these Ranger pictures and then says that she never claimed Duane was pictured among them. So why post them? Why post anything?

Sometimes I REALLY wonder if Jo knows that forest rangers and Army Rangers are not the same animal. You do know that don't you Jo? The first are civilians who tend parks, the latter are combat soldiers.

377

The only thing I wonder about, is how long it took everyone to agree Jo was actually kind of nuts.

Why so long?

--------------------------------------

Duane L. Weber had Ranger training....Army Ranger training.

Jo Weber is not a nut.

The forum is no longer about Cooper, but an orchestrated one. One person posting here is involved in Cooper for only one reason - confuse, divide and disfuse.

--------------------------------------
Anyone have any idea where the term Norjax came from?

The file name existed prior to 1971............and prior to the publishing of the Himmelsbach book in 1986.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Anyone KNOW why Robbie Burroughs is actually retiring and why she would not speak on her behalf?

--------------------------------
-------------------------------


Recently I divulge (to only ONE person) the email address of a person who contacted me for a period of time (a few yrs ago) with some information. This was a piece of very coveted information EVERYONE involved in the aftermath of Cooper has tried to obtain. The email address was not traceable.

Only in the last 2 wks did I make any of that information available to anyone. Sluggo did not see this information, nor has anyone else. The events coming down at this time along with a very long conversation with someone today - only adds to this and it is spelled -
C-O-V-E-R-U-P!

The aftermath is spelled
F-E-D-U-P.

Because I told only ONE person this very confidential information, I NOW know who NOT to trust and what is happening. I am very disturbed that something I have done - may be causing problems for someone else.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

I was wondering about something that might be modelled with some kind of economic theory.

How many coverups can be sustained at any one time in the United States?

100?
1000?
10,000?
1,000,000?

I'm wondering how big the secret network of US citizens has to be, to investigate them all.

Or does someone run triage?

Who?

(edit) See what I'm thinking, is that there's a tipping point, where something goes from coverup, to just institutionalized behavior..i.e. that's just how we do things. Where is the tipping point?

(edit) Another thing: there's this implicit belief that "trust" has value (economic or otherwise). In a world with no privacy, does "trust" get devalued to 0? (there is no reason for "trusted" control of info, since there is no private info). Or does "trust" get valued even higher? And based on something other than exchange of info?

See I'm getting out of the "untraceable" email address business (the FBI, even though they can get any record they want, is unable to trace the email addresses I sell)

I want to sell trust. I don't know what price to put on it. Orange1?

[Sluggo_Monster 0]

Jo,

I can tell that you are very emotional, but I don’t think you realize that post like this are all but incomprehensible to the reader(s).

The Forum is orchestrated. (??? More)

Norjax or NORJAK. An i-net search shows Norjax is a computer gaming company or a South African Cannery. NORJAK is the FBI code for the Cooper case. What do you mean by “file name”. Do you mean “a file with the name Norjax” or “a computer filename”?????

Yes, there is something behind the Burroughs resignation. Read Post #14739 of 14905 and read between the lines. You would be the last person to be told what’s going on at the Seattle FBI.

C-O-V-E-R-U-P ??????? WTF are you trying to say???? Just come out with it!

Who did you tell? What did you tell them? And why would anybody here care?

Why don’t you calm down and redo this post, unless the purpose was just to “vent.”

Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum

[Farflung 0]

snowman,

I do have some vague recall of Felhaber and the antics associated with a multi-million dollar exchange of cash. I recall thinking what a brilliant ruse it would be to attempt such an audacious move unless you were incredibly innocent or incredibly stupid.

Yet the basic assumption remains valid that you are going to have to leave the country. Mexico is well known for having large amounts of drug cash. How tolerant would the UK be about this? Or most of western Europe for that matter. As the curve goes up regarding a country accepting your cash and person, the other curve trends down which represents life style and security. Imagine having a few million in cash but living in Burkina Faso.

How much of this cash is from a 'lump sum ransom'? Drug money is collected in small amounts by bad people doing bad things with other bad people down the line. A ransom is gathered by a victim under the supervision of the FBI and inherently passed to a known location. The two only have the end result in common - a large pile of cash. One is a very traceable ransom and the other is an accounting nightmare of tiny sources from across the country.

Did McCoy, McNally and crew strike you as having a plan of what to do with these large amounts of traceable cash in the US? Only one chose a foreign country to jump, but that was his home country so only half credit.

These drug enterprises have been operating and evolving for years where the cash handlers are out front and taking all of the risk. The guys making the big bucks are insulated deep within the organization and typically live in a compound in some less than desirable location. Just make sure you keep everyone paid very, very well and you can probably enjoy some sort of zoo exhibit type life for some amount of time.

Recall how much easier it was for gangsters to operate in the early 1900's. The FBI was created partially to control the growth of interstate crime and their biggest cases have been solved through the application of tax laws rather than a western style shoot out. What have you done to demonstrate you are a good American? (raspy voiced response) I paid my tax. What sort of answer was that? You rob, murder and steal for a living but want the world to know you paid your tax. This is funny stuff, the next thing people will be hiding micro-film in pumpkins or acting crazy in order to avoid court all together.

I see a ransom as inherently difficult to handle. So did Cooper. This is why he made his drop off mobile. After jumping then what? Spend $30 on a milkshake and ride home which is enough money to make the person remember you. No one waiting in a get away car for McCoy or in any of the other examples. Perhaps Cooper was the exception.

[snowmman 3]

I was at a thrift store, and in an old box, I found some photos.

Amazingly, one was from when DB Cooper landed in the scary woods.

I believe after lighting a cigarette, he immediately took a picture.

Attached.

I now agree with Jerry. Those woods look scary.

[snowmman 3]

Farflung posited " One is a very traceable ransom and the other is an accounting nightmare of tiny sources from across the country. "


So, the current hacker schemes of siphoning small dollar amounts from large numbers of credit cards doesn't make sense?

What exactly is an accounting nightmare? Why do you need accountants?

[snowmman 3]

Global Arms Sales By Supplier Nations

The 5 UN Security Council permanent members are generally the largest arms dealers:

Arms sales (agreements), by Supplier, 2001-2008 (in billions of constant 2008 U.S. dollars)
Supplier Total Sales in US Dollars (billions) Percent of total sales

United States 154.882 41%
Russia 63.823 17%
France 31.247 8%
United Kingdom 26.914 7%
China 10.125 3%
Germany 16.261 4%
Italy 11.053 3%
Other European 40.291 11%
Others 22.849 6%

The US amount is split roughly 50/50 between developing and industrialized countries.

Source: Richard F. Grimmett, CRS Report for Congress; Conventional Arms Transfers to Developing Nations, 2001-2008 September 4, 2009

But if you look at the trend lines (2001-2008) here,
http://www.globalissues.org/article/74/the-arms-trade-is-big-business
the growth is in developing nations.

A big benefactor of globalization is the arms trade.

(edit)
A report from the World Policy Institute released mid-2005 has found that the U.S. is routinely funneling military aid and arms to undemocratic nations. In 2003, for which the most recent data was available at the time,

* The United States transferred weaponry to 18 of the 25 countries involved in active conflicts;
* More than half of the top 25 recipients of U.S. arms transfers in the developing world (13) were defined as undemocratic by the State Department;
* When countries designated by the State Department’s Human Rights Report to have poor human rights records or serious patterns of abuse are factored in, 20 of the top 25 U.S. arms clients in the developing world in 2003—a full 80%—were either undemocratic regimes or governments with records of major human rights abuses.

[snowmman 3]

Sluggo disclosed "Norjax is a computer gaming company or a South African Cannery."

Hey, if you don't understand by now that it's all about South Africa, I don't know what planet you're from.

(edit) Some people dream of being great roller ballers.
I dream of being a better propagandist than Dick Cheney.
In the US, boys can dream, and act on that dream.

(edit) Unless someone blasts them in the face with some pellets?

[Farflung 0]

snowman,

What is the accounting nightmare?

$200,000 all in 20's with the serial numbers recorded.

or

$???,NNN in every denomination from every state from individuals making a purchase as small as a few dollars.

Yes, siphoning small amounts is genius. Why do you need accountants? According to Bernie Madoff you don't. Monetary crimes need probable cause just like any other crime. Mr. Minimum Wage suddenly having a pile of money may be investigated by a government hired accountant. Believe it or not, accounting is a very desirable skill to have in the government.

Where did you get this money? Mr or Ms America better have a good one or they will get the visible means of support clause used.

Mr or Ms Foreign National says; "None of your business" or says nothing.

Strange thing about the Mafia types or Conforte who end up overseas is how they want to negotiate their way back into the US. Why? If your living the Life of Riley in some exotic location surrounded by beauty, why the desire to return to Lawng Island, New York or more baffling Sparks, Nevada?

Their actions should be telling. How many times have I heard someone go on and on about how they luuuve their job and can't imagine doing anything else? Yet the day they ALL (100%, every single one, no exception) turn 65 years of age they develop a desire to not luuuve their job any more and travel or go fishing.

Love your job, keep doing it for free after your retirement or Social Security kicks in. Yeah, this happens all the time. So I have learned to ignore what people say and observe what they do.

For people with millions in cash having any desire to return to the US may be indicative of a gilded cage. My personal security budget for travel across North America is zero. Ever been to a country where a beer or soda delivery truck is bristling with guards armed with Uzis? What does this one silly, stupid, ubiquitous service tell you about that country?

I truly feel that once you make it across the border with your marked pile of money; the fun has just begun. I realize there are other larger enterprises which operate with impunity. Will they let you in the club because you have managed a 'one off' of theft? A highly visible one as well.

Even the nature of this post illustrates how the challenge of managing this money is viewed. It's no problem, others are getting away with much larger amounts, don't worry about it and so on. Who has escaped with a ransom in the US? I simply can't think of any and view ransom demands in cash as extremely high risk.

[snowmman 3]

Farflung: "Who has escaped with a ransom in the US? I simply can't think of any and view ransom demands in cash as extremely high risk."

Well, don't think it's worth researching...but note that your thoughts revolve around Cooper being risk-averse :)

(edit) actually you reminded me of a train of thought I pushed a lot here, a while back.

Carr was all about "Cooper did it for the money"

I always thought the money was secondary, and was searching for other more primary motivators.

I couldn't understand how Carr could say money was the primary motivator. If it was, it has the problems you mention. So either Cooper was dumb + money primary motivator. Or the money was maybe secondary.

[snowmman 3]

The Citizens' Sleuth Group has it on good authority that DZ.com is included here:

"the Transportation Security Administration is going after bloggers who wrote about a directive to increase security after the incident."

http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2009/12/30/us/politics/AP-US-Airliner-Attack-TSA-Supoenas.html

I don't know if the subpoena references posters with names involving "skyjack" but any sensible investigation would seem to go that way.

This could be what blows the Duane Weber case/coverup wide open.

"Frischling said he met with two TSA special agents Tuesday night at his Connecticut home for about three hours and again on Wednesday morning when he was forced to hand over his lap top computer. Frischling said the agents threatened to interfere with his contract to write a blog for KLM Royal Dutch Airlines if he didn't cooperate and provide the name of the person who leaked the memo."

I have taken the precaution of storing all Cooper/Weber evidence on a DVD and hiding it in my underwear.

(edit) The article says nothing about whether the TSA agents had Uzis, but given Farflung's mention of soda trucks, it's possible.

(edit) I would remind everyone, in case of doubt, that I am president-for-life of the Citizens' Sleuth Group that the FBI is working with (see TV shows and youtube videos). We are not admitting anyone new to the network, although you can send funds to duaneweber@paypal.com. We operate totally independently from the FBI and never communicate with them, but are aligned spiritually in our hearts.

(edit) Oh yeah, we are not nuts. We have self-certified that.

[snowmman 3]

U.S. DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY
Transportation Security Administration
Aviation Security Directive
Subject: Security Directive
Number: SD 1544-09-06
Date: December 25, 2009
EXPIRATION: 0200Z on December 30, 2009
This Security Directive (SD) must be implemented immediately. The measures contained in this SD are in addition to all other SDs currently in effect for your operations.
INFORMATION: On December 25, 2009, a terrorist attack was attempted against a flight traveling to the United States. TSA has identified security measures to be implemented by airports, aircraft operators, and foreign air carriers to mitigate potential threats to flights.
APPLICABILITY: THIS SD APPLIES TO AIRCRAFT OPERATORS THAT CARRY OUT A SECURITY PROGRAM REGULATED UNDER 49 CODE OF FEDERAL REGULATIONS (CFR)1544.101(a).
ACTIONS REQUIRED: If you conduct scheduled and/or public charter flight operations under a Full Program under 49 CFR 1544.101(a) departing from any foreign location to the United States (including its territories and possessions), you must immediately implement all measures in this SD for each such flight.

1. BOARDING GATE

1. The aircraft operator or authorized air carrier representative must ensure all passengers are screened at the boarding gate during the boarding process using the following procedures. These procedures are in addition to the screening of all passengers at the screening checkpoint.
1. Perform thorough pat-down of all passengers at boarding gate prior to boarding, concentrating on upper legs and torso.
2. Physically inspect 100 percent of all passenger accessible property at the boarding gate prior to boarding, with focus on syringes being transported along with powders and/or liquids.
3. Ensure the liquids, aerosols, and gels restrictions are strictly adhered to in accordance with SD 1544-06-02E.
2. During the boarding process, the air carrier may exempt passengers who are Heads of State or Heads of Government from the measures outlined in Section I.A. of this SD, including the following who are traveling with the Head of State or Head of Government:

1. Spouse and children, or
2. One other individual (chosen by the Head of State or Head of Government)
3. For the purposes of Section I.B., the following definitions apply:
1. Head of State: An individual serving as the chief public representative of a monarchic or republican nation-state, federation, commonwealth, or any other political state (for example, King, Queen, and President).
2. Head of Government: The chief officer of the executive branch of a government presiding over a cabinet (for example, Prime Minister, Premier, President, and Monarch).

2. IN FLIGHT

1. During flight, the aircraft operator must ensure that the following procedures are followed:
1. Passengers must remain in seats beginning 1 hour prior to arrival at destination.
2. Passenger access to carry-on baggage is prohibited beginning 1 hour prior to arrival at destination.
3. Disable aircraft-integrated passenger communications systems and services (phone, internet access services, live television programming, global positioning systems) prior to boarding and during all phases of flight.
4. While over U.S. airspace, flight crew may not make any announcement to passengers concerning flight path or position over cities or landmarks.
5. Passengers may not have any blankets, pillows, or personal belongings on the lap beginning 1 hour prior to arrival at destination.

AIRCRAFT OPERATOR ACKNOWLEDGMENT: The aircraft operator must immediately provide written confirmation to its assigned PSI indicating receipt of this SD.
AIRCRAFT OPERATOR dissemination required: The aircraft operator must immediately pass the information and directives set forth in this SD to all stations affected, and provide written confirmation to its PSI, indicating that all stations affected have acknowledged receipt of the information and directives set forth in this SD. The aircraft operator must disseminate this information to its senior management personnel, ground security coordinators, and supervisory security personnel at all affected locations. All aircraft operator personnel implementing this SD must be briefed by the aircraft operator on its content and the restrictions governing dissemination. No other dissemination may be made without prior approval of the Assistant Secretary for the Transportation Security Administration. Unauthorized dissemination of this document or information contained herein is prohibited by 49 CFR Part 1520 (see 69 Fed. Reg. 28066 (May 18, 2004).
APPROVAL OF ALTERNATIVE MEASURES: With respect to the provisions of this SD, as stated in 49 CFR 1544.305(d), the aircraft operator may submit in writing to its PSI proposed alternative measures and the basis for submitting the alternative measures for approval by the Assistant Administrator for Transportation Sector Network Management. The aircraft operator must immediately notify its PSI whenever any procedure in this SD cannot be carried out by a government authority charged with performing security procedures.
FOR TSA ACTION ONLY: The TSA must issue this SD immediately to the corporate security element of all affected U.S. aircraft operators.
FOR STATE DEPARTMENT: Retransmittal to appropriate foreign posts is authorized. Post must refer to STATE 162917, 201826Z Sep 01, Subject: FAA Security Directives and Information Circulars: Definitions and Handling, for specific guidance and dissemination.

Gale Rossides
Acting Administrator

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Jo,

I can tell that you are very emotional, but I don’t think you realize that post like this are all but incomprehensible to the reader(s).

The Forum is orchestrated. (??? More)

Norjax or NORJAK. An i-net search shows Norjax is a computer gaming company or a South African Cannery. NORJAK is the FBI code for the Cooper case. What do you mean by “file name”. Do you mean “a file with the name Norjax” or “a computer filename”?????

Yes, there is something behind the Burroughs resignation. Read Post #14739 of 14905 and read between the lines. You would be the last person to be told what’s going on at the Seattle FBI.

When I speak of Norjak regardless of how I spell it, know what I mean. I was told the file name existed before Himmelsbach wrote his book and prior to the actual Skyjacking. How much of that was truth I don't know.

What I am trying to say about the rest of it I cannot say in a public forum. You know how to contact me and I would be glad to share with you what happened regarding this information about a contact being divulged - then you tell me what it is all about. It does not involve you, but your mind might be able to decipher what it means - unless you already know.

P.S. I did make another contact with the Night Clerk - as he contacted me just a few days ago - has been in a remote part of China and just recently got his American Made laptop working.

I asked him about the maid story. Enquiring if he knew anymore about it than what you have reported in the forum. I am also contacting his ex-wife, but I believe he was the source of my hearing that story a few yrs ago. I am sure I did ask him back then if he knew the source and he did not.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

skyjack warned "It does not involve you, but your mind might be able to decipher what it means - unless you already know. "

Hey, I can fit 9 GBytes on a double-sided DVD, and I tested it: a dog can't sniff it in my crotch.

I'm not worried.

TSA: do your worst!

(edit) skyjack also offered "P.S. I did make another contact with the Night Clerk - as he contacted me just a few days ago - has been in a remote part of China and just recently got his American Made laptop working. "

I've done some research on this. The vast majority of night clerks that have gone to China, use American Made laptops and jeans. (which of course, are actually made in China).

Unless you have more evidence, I think you're just trying to obfuscate the truth here?

Duane Weber has shown the way, why have you forsaken him?

(edit) "When I speak of Norjak regardless of how I spell it, know what I mean. I was told the file name existed before Himmelsbach wrote his book and prior to the actual Skyjacking. How much of that was truth I don't know. "

Of course Norjak existed before Norjak. We're not a bunch of creationists here. If it didn't exist before, how could it just appear?

[georger 244]

When I speak of Norjak regardless of how I spell it, know what I mean. I was told the file name existed before Himmelsbach wrote his book and prior to the actual Skyjacking. How much of that was truth I don't know.

[snowmman 3]

georger: "For example, make sure case file names on the
sides of folders and other papers are not exposed during patient interviews."

well, any sensible coverup should hide the names of the overarching project/experiment. That's fundamental conspiracy stuff.

[snowmman 3]

I asked the TSA about the Cooper/Weber investigation.

All I got back was:

"Security Directives are not for public disclosure. TSA's Office of Inspections is currently investigating how the recent Security Directives were acquired and published by parties who should not have been privy to this information."

It sounds to me like the Weber Case has gone hot!

(edit) I always knew they'd come to us..I mean we have the most info on the only unsolved hijacking, by Duane Weber, and the resulting coverup. Who else would they talk to...Dick Cheney?

(edit) They're rounding up the usual suspects, stay alert everyone!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/blake-fleetwood/exclusive-tsa-seizes-hard_b_407877.html
"Yesterday evening Chris Elliot, another respected travel blogger -- who works for MSNBC, National Geographic, and the Washington Post -- was at home in Florida, when TSA Special Agent Robert Flaherty knocked on his door with a similar subpoena.

The subpoena demanded that Elliott turn over all documents, emails, or faxes and his hard drive by the end of business day, Dec 31, New Year's Eve."

(edit) I'm wondering now whether I misunderstood the real stuff behind the Robbie Burroughs surprise resignation. It's getting complicated!

[Orange1 0]

Quote

The forum is no longer about Cooper, but an orchestrated one. One person posting here is involved in Cooper for only one reason - confuse, divide and disfuse.

Would that be you, Jo?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[snowmman 3]

How come Obama isn't jumping on things like Bush did when Reid did the attempted shoe bombing. (Dec 22, 2001, American Airlines Flight 63)

Hmm. what did Bush do anyhow? Can anyone remember?

There's no way Bush would have tried that bastard in a civilian court. Oh wait, he did. Never mind.

Who gets to torture this Nigerian kid?

(edit) Reid sentencing. The bastard plead guilty and was sentenced to life

http://edition.cnn.com/2003/LAW/01/31/reid.transcript/

I hadn't read what Judge William Young said. It's actually quite cool to read..(see link). I excerpt the fine bits here:

This is the sentence that is provided for by our statutes. It is a fair and a just sentence. It is a righteous sentence. Let me explain this to you.

We are not afraid of any of your terrorist co-conspirators, Mr. Reid. We are Americans. We have been through the fire before. There is all too much war talk here. And I say that to everyone with the utmost respect.

Here in this court where we deal with individuals as individuals, and care for individuals as individuals, as human beings we reach out for justice.

You are not an enemy combatant. You are a terrorist. You are not a soldier in any war. You are a terrorist. To give you that reference, to call you a soldier gives you far too much stature. Whether it is the officers of government who do it or your attorney who does it, or that happens to be your view, you are a terrorist.

And we do not negotiate with terrorists. We do not treat with terrorists. We do not sign documents with terrorists.

We hunt them down one by one and bring them to justice.

So war talk is way out of line in this court. You're a big fellow. But you're not that big. You're no warrior. I know warriors. You are a terrorist. A species of criminal guilty of multiple attempted murders.

In a very real sense Trooper Santiago had it right when first you were taken off that plane and into custody and you wondered where the press and where the TV crews were and you said you're no big deal. You're no big deal.

What your counsel, what your able counsel and what the equally able United States attorneys have grappled with and what I have as honestly as I know how tried to grapple with, is why you did something so horrific. What was it that led you here to this courtroom today? I have listened respectfully to what you have to say. And I ask you to search your heart and ask yourself what sort of unfathomable hate led you to do what you are guilty and admit you are guilty of doing.

And I have an answer for you. It may not satisfy you. But as I search this entire record it comes as close to understanding as I know.

It seems to me you hate the one thing that to us is most precious. You hate our freedom. Our individual freedom. Our individual freedom to live as we choose, to come and go as we choose, to believe or not believe as we individually choose.

Here, in this society, the very winds carry freedom. They carry it everywhere from sea to shining sea. It is because we prize individual freedom so much that you are here in this beautiful courtroom. So that everyone can see, truly see that justice is administered fairly, individually, and discretely.

It is for freedom's seek that your lawyers are striving so vigorously on your behalf and have filed appeals, will go on in their, their representation of you before other judges. We care about it. Because we all know that the way we treat you, Mr. Reid, is the measure of our own liberties.

Make no mistake though. It is yet true that we will bear any burden; pay any price, to preserve our freedoms.

Look around this courtroom. Mark it well. The world is not going to long remember what you or I say here. Day after tomorrow it will be forgotten. But this, however, will long endure. Here, in this courtroom, and courtrooms all across America, the American people will gather to see that justice, individual justice, justice, not war, individual justice is in fact being done.

The very President of the United States through his officers will have to come into courtrooms and lay out evidence on which specific matters can be judged, and juries of citizens will gather to sit and judge that evidence democratically, to mold and shape and refine our sense of justice.

See that flag, Mr. Reid? That's the flag of the United States of America. That flag will fly there long after this is all forgotten. That flag still stands for freedom. You know it always will. Custody, Mr. Officer. Stand him down.

[georger 244]

Quote

georger: "For example, make sure case file names on the
sides of folders and other papers are not exposed during patient interviews."

well, any sensible coverup should hide the names of the overarching project/experiment. That's fundamental conspiracy stuff.

well, we dont ewant some Dropzone member rowing out to sea in their bedpan, just because DS666
was written on the side of their folder - its enough
that we have avatars here that look likesome
schixophrenic episode!

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Quote

georger: "For example, make sure case file names on the
sides of folders and other papers are not exposed during patient interviews."

well, any sensible coverup should hide the names of the overarching project/experiment. That's fundamental conspiracy stuff.

well, we dont ewant some Dropzone member rowing out to sea in their bedpan, just because DS666
was written on the side of their folder - its enough
that we have avatars here that look likesome
schixophrenic episode!

georger! you made me laugh out loud! I'm shocked! (good one)

(my avatar: I was attempting to recreate "The Shining" and the "All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy" scene. I loved that!)

(edit) Amazon: where were the exterior scenes shot for "The Shining" ...Timberline Lodge, Mt. Hood, Oregon!... The references are complete!

[snowmman 3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OZS6wem7OQ&feature=related

(Kubrick directed FMJ..my prior post reminded me of it. Actually it's kind of a downer watching the clip)

(edit) I would also note: Georger's reference to DS666 was obviously related to 377's "F 666" license/jump reference. Who would have known there were so many F licenses?