DB Cooper

[snowmman 3]

377 said "Some wacked out nuke scientist forsees a message of impending Soviet ICBM attack hidden in the chess moves of a Russian opponent."

Okay this is a true story, and I'll provide the link below.
A company said they could decode bar codes from Al-Jazeera broadcasts, that encoded latitude and longitude to Al-Qaeda for their next strikes.

Really.

They demonstrated this to CIA and got money.

Some of the US "terror alerts" were tied to the warnings created by this "technology"

I'm not bullshitting you. I read this and thought "how come we missed out on that at SI".

here's a link. It's a great read.
It was in Playboy magazine ( i read it for the articles) but it's true.

Dennis Montgomery
summary here:
http://www.news.com.au/technology/playboy-goes-undercover-with-dennis-montgomery-the-man-who-fooled-the-cia-over-al-jazeera-codes/story-e6frfro0-1225812662560

also at NPR
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=121667905

the actual playboy article here (I think..I'm blocked at work from Playboy)

http://www.playboy.com/articles/the-man-who-conned-the-pentagon-dennis-montgomer y/index.html?page=1

excerpts from the NPR interview

RAZ: Let's start at the beginning. What was Dennis Montgomery claiming he could find in Al Jazeera's broadcasts?

Mr. ROSTON: First of all, let me point out it's still all classified. That said, what he was claiming to find were barcodes in essence. Sequences of information that he said then revealed the targets of intended terrorist attacks.

RAZ: Barcodes from a television signal?

Mr. ROSTON: Yeah. He said they were sort of embedded within the digital feed from Al Jazeera, so - and which is potentially technically possible, of course. You could sort of scramble the pixels in various ways. But he said he could decode all this and find these barcodes or sort of things like barcodes. And he said these translate into coordinates - latitudes or longitude, times, flight times, flight numbers - and those were terrorist targets, he claimed.

RAZ: Let's back up for a moment. How did Dennis Montgomery convince the CIA to give him business, because they gave him business? I mean, they actually put some money into this.

Mr. ROSTON: He was in business with another man, as the article describes, in a company called eTreppid. They were the initial contractor, although later, he would sell the same, or try to sell the same software through another company with another partner.

The first partner was a man named Warren Trepp. Now, people who are familiar with Michael Milken and the big scandal of the '80s, the Drexel Burnham scandal...

RAZ: The junk bonds.

Mr. ROSTON: ...the junk bonds scandals, exactly, they'll be familiar with Warren Trepp because he was Michael Milken's right-hand man in the junk bond schemes.

RAZ: And he was running this company that hired Dennis Montgomery and that company managed to get the contract with the CIA.

Mr. ROSTON: Exactly.

RAZ: You write about some of the code orange security alerts that came directly from Montgomery's so-called analysis of those al-Jazeera signals. Describe some of them.

Mr. ROSTON: On the 21st of December in 2003, there was this huge announcement -it was a Sunday. Everything seemed to be going fine that Christmas season, and then suddenly on that Sunday, Tom Ridge, the secretary of Homeland Security, made this announcement: we're going to orange alert - and nobody knew what it was.

Reporters, you know, investigative reporters and then people who cover the intelligence community and so forth, were all trying to gauge what was going on. They talked about was there chatter intercepts and informants and so forth. What it was was this guy's analysis or supposed analysis of al-Jazeera.

And people in the CIA, people who knew what they were talking about, were furious. Every quote I got from them was basically full of expletives. They were so upset. They were just losing it.

RAZ: But who believed him? I mean, who believed him there?

Mr. ROSTON: What happened was there was a particular division called science and technology, and they were the CIA's, you know, sort of high tech group. The ones that you often like in the movies - they make disguises and intercepts and special little gadgets. They were the ones that believed it. They were the ones that gave him the contract.

RAZ: And some of this data reached Frances Townsend, who was President George W. Bush's senior counterterrorism advisor.

Mr. ROSTON: Yeah. Well, what happened was sources told me she was chairing the meetings during this time that resulted from this stream of supposed intelligence. She was the one who President Bush appointed to oversee the response meetings - and she would hold them every day. And so I talked to her and she did admit she held those meetings. She agreed she held those meetings. She remember all the intelligence, she sort of laughed about it. She said, well, they had to take it seriously.

[snowmman 3]

Court case involving eTreppid's "Big Safari Contract" with the USAF

eTreppid and Dennis Montgomery are the players in my previous post. This is from 2007

http://fas.org/sgp/jud/statesec/etreppid082907.pdf


DENNIS MONTGOMERY and the )
MONTGOMERY FAMILY TRUST ) 3:06-CV-00056-PMP-VPC
) BASE FILE
Plaintiffs, )
) 3:06-CV-00145-PMP-VPC
vs. )
) ORDER RE PROTECTIVE ORDER
ETREPPID TECHNOLOGIES, LLC; )
WARREN TREPP; and the UNITED )
STATES DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE, )
)
Defendants. )
)
AND ALL RELATED MATTERS. )


The United States’ supports its application for protective order under the military and States Secret privilege by the Declaration of John D. Negroponte, formally Director of National Intelligence, and a Classified Declaration which has been reviewed by the Court in camera and ex parte, which demonstrate that disclosure of information at issue in this litigation subject to the proposed protective order could be expected to cause serious, and some cases exceptionally grave damage to national security.

...

a. The existence and nature of the 'Big Safari' contract (hereinafter referred to as 'the Big Safari Contract') between eTreppid and the Unites States Air Force, including but not limited to the fact that the Big Safari Contract required eTreppid to perform data analysis and the fact that the data analysis eTreppid performed under the Big Safari Contract involved image identification technology;

...

11. As the United States deems necessary, attorneys for the United States may attend all depositions and proceedings in this case and may make objections as necessary to protect national security information. If attorneys for the United States assert an objection based on the need to protect national security information with respect to either witness testimony or documents introduced or otherwise relied upon during a deposition, then the witness shall be precluded from testifying with respect to the line of inquiry that engendered the objection, and the document shall be withdrawn from the record pending an order of the Court with respect to the scope of the government’s national security objection.

[snowmman 3]

Orange1 made a reference to this
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqccyUpnZwA

[377 22]

Jo writes about Ckret:

Quote

too much into extraneous subjections and making himself public with hypothecital theories touted to the public

EXCUSE ME? You of all people raise this objection????

Astounding lack of self awareness.

And Jo, why not just admit you got him silenced by his superiors. I miss him and I'd bet that you had a lot to do with his exit.

You still owe us proof that Duane was a parachutist. Otherwise he will be always be known as Duane the WHUFFO roun these parts.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

Quote

Orange1 made a reference to this

I think I'm gonna watch the movie again this weekend

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[377 22]

Quote

A company said they could decode bar codes from Al-Jazeera broadcasts, that encoded latitude and longitude to Al-Qaeda for their next strikes.

This is so dumb that I find it hard to believe, but its true, Snow is right.

Sheesh, are they brain dead in the CIA tech shop? They paid my tax money for this nonsensical crap?

There are a zillion ways to communicate covertly that are a HELL of a lot easier than hiding lat lon coordinates in TV signals.

The CIA up to a few years ago used a surveillance receiver, a Micro Tel model PR900. It covers a huge range of frequencies and modes and was used for bug sweeps and other purposes.

I have used one. It has what is called a subcarrier decoder that can decode signals e.g. on FM broadcasts that are inaudible in ordinary receivers like you have in your home or car. I tuned around with it on the FM broadcast band and heard alternative programming (books being read aloud for the blind, elevator music, unknown data bursts etc).

I was told that subcarriers were used in highly sophisticated bugging to foil audio feedback detection techniques. This technique involves tuning through bands and listening for a feedback squeal when you happen upon a bug frequency that hears itself in your receiver speaker.

VERY VERY few receivers could decode FM subcarriers so this mode was used for sophisticated bugs. Maybe the old timer CIA guys remembered this technique and jumped to conclusions about the false claims of hidden messages in TV signals.

I am waiting for someone on Coast to Coast to market a dead person receiver. Why use tapes? I mean the signals are there, clear as day. Let's decode them in real time and try to make it a two way conversation.

Georger, Snow, Sluggo, Guru... you guys up for a new band? CQ dead guys CQ CQ.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

377, I'm working up the proposal to the CIA based on your post.

These things never have timelines, so no worries about a development schedule.

But we need a price? Is this a $1M thing, or a $10M thing?
Should I say $10M and let them knock me down to $5M?

I just want to be fair.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Quote

Orange1 made a reference to this

I think I'm gonna watch the movie again this weekend

No parachutes?
man, even Orange1 is creating thread drift.
Need some more "good" posts.

[377 22]

Bruce wrote:

Quote

I've never seen a pix of the evidentiary collection that displays the shard find. Has anyone else?

Why is this? If the shards were there, why no collected and preserved evidence?

What do we have besides people's recollections about the shards? I believe that they were there, but surely it must have been documented somewhere.

Am I forgetting some shard photo or have none been produced?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 244]

Quote

Quote

Brian was a child - when children come running with money in their hands - the crumbles fall.

Jo,

The VERTICAL distribution says D R E D G E deposit to me and to most others. Not Brian, not tides, not river currents.

377

You were there?

You have read the reports?

Tell us Oh Great Father of the Vertical waters -

give us the Tell of how it was.

[377 22]

Quote

377, I'm working up the proposal to the CIA based on your post.

These things never have timelines, so no worries about a development schedule.

But we need a price? Is this a $1M thing, or a $10M thing?
Should I say $10M and let them knock me down to $5M?

I just want to be fair.

Hey, the CIA was paying psychics to see if they could detect submerged Russian subs, very nebulous project, easily criticized.

This, by contrast, should be an easy sell because it involves HARDWARE. Let's really dress it up with DSP chips, SDR architecture and fantastic graphical displays. Let's get a development contract for $25M and a supply contract for 5M per receiver with a minimum buy of 50.

Dead men DO talk, and SI can show Langley how to hear them.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 22]

You were there? NOPE

You have read the reports? NOPE

Tell us Oh Great Father of the Vertical waters -

give us the Tell of how it was. OK, see below.

I was seeking to banish the deceptive spirit of White Buffalo Woman's husband from our sacred sandbar. I sent warrior Bruce to ride a great horse westward to seek a vision. He shared a pipe with the old medicine man Dorwin. A vision came: Shards is what he saw, a three dimensional cloud of shards.

Next question?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Bruce wrote:

Quote

I've never seen a pix of the evidentiary collection that displays the shard find. Has anyone else?

Why is this? If the shards were there, why no collected and preserved evidence?

What do we have besides people's recollections about the shards? I believe that they were there, but surely it must have been documented somewhere.

Am I forgetting some shard photo or have none been produced?

377

I was reading an article that documented the return of money to Brian six years later, and how it was split between him and the insurance company, with the FBI taking a cut off the top first.

Evidently they took turns picking, so no one could claim the other got all the good bills.

BUT: it got me wondering...was the pool just the bills in Brian's bundle, or did it include everything the FBI found?

There'd be no reason for the FBI to return stuff it found to Brian..so there must be something in the FBI stash, along with their stash, that's all the little pieces.

I'm thinking maybe that's why we've never seen it. We've only seen stuff where Brian was involved?

[377 22]

Quote

I'm thinking maybe that's why we've never seen it. We've only seen stuff where Brian was involved?

I think you may be correct Snow.

Bet Sluggo knows something about the shards.

Enough lurking Sluggo, move in and dock on the formation.

Do it soon. We are going to wave off at 4500 ft, got some old codger in the group who is absurdly conservative.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Dead men DO talk, and SI can show Langley how to hear them.

377

I have to keep you in the labs. You'll never do well with the powerpoint presentations to the chiefs of staff.

You have to caveat it...that's what makes it believable.

The slides will say
"While talking to dead people of any time back is theoretically possible, our technology is only (currently) capable of talking to recently dead people..on the order of 1 to 15 months.

Our research has shown that most actionable intelligence from dead people, is in that time window of death, so we don't foresee this being a limiter on USAF use of the technology"



Then you set the hook

"Instead of increasing receiver's time range of death, SI forsees using R&D funds to increase the portability of the Dead Guy Receiver.

The guys in the lab think they can have it running on a Reaper drone using some innovative stuff from another company we're collaborating with, which also happens to be working with the CIA on the Big Safari Project (although I can't talk about that).

All they need is the go-ahead"

[377 22]

What ever happened to Safecrackin PLF?

The dude was showing tunnel talent for sure. Very fast progression.

Would really like to see him chime in now on this Tena Bar money stuff.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Do it soon. We are going to wave off at 4500 ft, got some old codger in the group who is absurdly conservative.

377

here's a video you can comment on for me..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8BbPtNbT3U&feature=PlayList&p=9A904F4FB31CC97E&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=12

tandem. two other guys videoing.

BOTH of the guys videoing lose track of time (they had a plan to dock after the tandem pulled?)...

BOTH guys have reserves deploy automatically. One guy rides in a double canopy (calls it a biplane?)

the weird thing is the video shows one guy checking his hand altimeter a couple of times.

I think the only way 377 goes in, is if he loses awareness because he's trying to post to the DBC thread on his iphone during a jump.

[377 22]

I's a baffling video Snow, especially the camera guy who keeps looking at his altimeter and does nothing to deploy his main.

Downplanes are terrifying. Seeing one makes me want to go back to a round reserve. At WFFC I saw a very low pull turn into a biplane when the AAD fired and then start to turn into a downplane. The guy chopped the main really low, crashed into a big packing tent top and slid down unharmed. A chopped main when two canopies are out can tangle with the reserve as it leaves. Not a sure thing at all that it will be a clean cutaway.

I've never had a really low pull but it happens even to highly experienced jumpers if they get distracted. It almost looked like the non camera guy went unstable at one point (when he flips onto his back, intentional or?) and perhaps this distracted the camera flyer.

Audible altimeters help a lot. I usually have two audibles on my helmet. I made many of my early freefall jumps with no altimeter. I counted seconds in my head but also got really good at estimating altitude visually at my home DZ, Livermore CA.

I laud jumpers who post videos of their own screwups. It is hard pride wise but really helps others to avoid repeating the near tragedy.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Guru312 0]

Quote

Georger, Snow, Sluggo, Guru... you guys up for a new band? CQ dead guys CQ CQ.

377

My fascination is this: CQ DX ET

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[377 22]

And what band are you calling on Guru?

Using a dish?

Pointed towards?

Welcome back!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

On Thursday Feb 14, 1980 (possibly earlier) Jack Pringle, "assistant agent" in charge of the Seattle FBI office took over the search operations.

So there was a transition of power, during the money dig.

Jack said "Not a thing" was found Thursday, and "In all probability, we will not be back out there tomorrow"

So it seems like there's a distinction between the early Portland guys who found stuff, and Jack Pringle showing up, and finding nothing.

article at http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=ogokAAAAIBAJ&sjid=IQgEAAAAIBAJ&pg=6713,7352908&dq=fbi+fragments+cooper&hl=en

The article says the search started Tuesday, and additional scraps of money were found on Wednesday.

If Bruce talks to Dorwin again, it might be good to probe this apparent transition to Jack Pringle.

Maybe I need to find Jack Pringle.

[snowmman 3]

http://books.google.com/books?id=A2IzPOb0AfYC&pg=PA5&lpg=PA5&dq=%22jack+pringle%22+fbi&source=bl&ots=WNBOX2qDhr&sig=r_qcwuquJcVJCrBlDRLojKn0dp8&hl=en&ei=DYVWS7m6K43INae87MsE&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2&ved=0CAsQ6AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=%22jack%20pringle%22%20fbi&f=false

This is an interesting account of the money find.

"FBI agents found a few more dirty fragments of bills and some broken rubber bands."

That may be just myth.

Also, it mentions fresh snow covered the ground on Feb 15, which contributed to shutting down the search.


Seattle FBI agent Jack Pringle said of the search, "We'll work today and tomorrow and probably knock it off and bring my troops back up here and reassess the situation. Some of the area is inaccessible and there's no way we can search the whole river". The hunt was called off on February 15, 1980 after fresh snowfall had covered the ground.


I've never heard about new snow ending the search.

[Guru312 0]

Quote

Pointed towards?

Welcome back!

377

Pointed away from D B Cooper.

Not back, just passing through when my name is mentioned.

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

"By the way Georger I have only told a couple of very little WHITE lies"

Orange states:

thin edge of the wedge, grey area, etc etc. lies are lies. you didn't need to tell any lies to protect anyone Jo; after all there were plenty of times you simply claimed not to release info to protect people. i am afraid i am with georger on this one. your story had no credibility anyway; admission of lies just understates this.

------------------------------------
-------------------------------

Orange - you are incredulous.
Are you saying you won't tell a white lie to protect?
If your mother said she thought she look old - would you actually tell her she looked old.

If you had information regarding a friend or someone you like that could harm them if you repeated - Would you repeat it?

ARE YOU saying YOU would NOT tell a WHITE lie to protect someone you know or to protect them? Yuck that STINKS!

What kind of friend or mother are you?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

It sounds like it might be right that it snowed on 2/14/80 - 2/15/80, closing down the money dig (maybe that's also why that picture of Brian was in snow in the papers, although I don't think it was on the beach)

newspaper from 2/15/1980 talks about snow Thurs evening (2/14/1980)

http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=c4suAAAAIBAJ&sjid=qocFAAAAIBAJ&pg=3999,4547645&dq=portland+oregon+snow&hl=en

There had been a big storm around Feb 1, 1980 also.

Says "Interstate 5 from Portland to Seattle was layered with snow and ice"