DB Cooper

[377 22]

Quote

Skydiving Fatality Stats for 2009 at 40-Year Low
2009 came to a close with a total of 16 civilian skydiving fatalities for the year. While even one is too many, 16 is the lowest number of fatalities in the United States since 1961, which ended with 14. 1962 finished with 19 fatalities, and the numbers generally went up from there, before reaching an all-time high of 56 in 1981. While we have no way of knowing how many jumps were made in 1962, it is safe to say that the estimated 2.5 million jumps done in 2009 by 32,177 members, far surpasses the number of jumps completed in 1962, when USPA membership totaled only 6,658 members.

2009 was a pretty good year, only 16 sport jumpers died. That's a 40 year low!

Did they miss one in 1971?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Farflung 0]

377,


Those rogue members of aviation are always difficult to track.

Recall the launch of 'Inspiration One' from San Pedro by truck driver and instant legend Larry Walters.

He managed to navigate his lawn chair across LAX and Long Beach airports while climbing to an altitude measured by passing airliners at 16,000 feet. Man that guy had a large set.

Using a CB (that's right chicken band) radio he communicated with FAA officials about his unauthorized flight.

The FAA was waiting for him when he landed and was quoted as saying "We are ready to prosecute this man and pull his license." But Larry out foxed the 'Man' by not having one in the first place. For one of the few times in history the government was at a loss due to a lack of legislation. He was finally charged with operation of an unregistered aircraft and fined.

Since Larry had no pilots certificate and no 'N' registration there was also no record of the flight. Just like Cooper's jump.

So how would one categorize jumps completed by Elizabeth M. Otto (EMO) and Ivan McGuire?

[377 22]

Larry Walters was a really sad case, ended up killing himself with a shot through the heart.

Manny (Manuel) Real, who was later appointed as a very controversial federal judge, was the Asst. US Attorney who prosecuted Walters. Manny was a hard ass and had no sense of humor or tolerance for minor infractions.

I dont think Walters ever talked directly with the FAA on CB. Do you have contrary info?

It was a miracle he survived his aerial adventure and a tragedy that he later took his own life.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Walters

Larry had a US Forest Service connection, but let's not get carried away. He wasnt a viable Cooper suspect.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Farflung 0]

377,

I'm not sure if Larry communicated directly with the FAA but he was in contact with ATC via his CB rig.

http://www.markbarry.com/lawnchairman.html

Half way down the page you will see a wav file for The Lawn Chair Pilot (18:25).

It is pretty amusing to hear Larry getting scolded by his girlfriend and explaining to some official his launch site location.

Never thought he was a Cooper suspect but in the same category of non-existant flights or jumps.

[377 22]

What always amazed me is the very accurate description given by the airline pilots who spotted him.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Interesting NTSB report.

http://libraryonline.erau.edu/online-full-text/ntsb/aircraft-accident-reports/AAR81-07.pdf

the pilot basically missed the runway...too early by 13 feet.
They fly over once first to make sure the fire truck is there, it comes from a town 20 minutes away for takeoffs and landings.

he sheared landing gear and the plane caught fire when it stopped in the jungle. Everyone got out okay.

Yap Airport, Yap, Western Caroline Islands. The runway is just 4820 feet. (I'm still planning on landing the 727 at Cooper Island with the gold and uranium..just researching possible things to watch out for. Might talk to John Travolta to pilot it)

And the mechanic and other flight crew knew the pilot was coming in too low (pilot was taking pictures of the airport and runway on the landing approach too!)

Now picture the scene with the poor guy with his one fire truck trying to deal with something that he never really thought he'd have to deal with:

...the aircraft came to rest, the firefighter manually poured 3 1/2 five-gallon containers of the AFFF firefighting agent into the 500-gallon watertank in the firetruck before proceeding to the aircraft. He estimated that it was 7 minutes before he was in position fight the fire, although the mechanic aboard Flight 614 assisted him and gave instructions to apply the firefighting agent.

The firefighter was the sole trained person on scene to on where to apply the agent and water. possible because of a drainage ditch along the runway perimeter between the aircraft and Direct access to the right wing area where the fire was concentrated was not the runway surface.

The firefighter drove the firetruck down the runway a few hundred feet and then up a dirt road in the jungle to the area of the aircraft empennage. Because all of the occupants had evacuated by the time the firetruck reached the scene, firefighting efforts were concentrated on the area of the CVR and FDR (aft fuselage) and the cockpit to reduce the fire damage.

The truck-mounted turret was not used to apply the agent. A 1 1/2-inch handline was used to direct the agent. The firefighter departed the scene six times to refill the firetruck with water. Three and one-half 5-gallon containers of AFPF agent were added to the second load of water; the remaining loads of water were applied directly.

The firefighter stopped at 1800 after using 3,500 gallons of water and 35 gallons of AFFF agent. Each round-trip to secure water required about 20 minutes. On one trip to town to refill, the firetruck fuel pump malfunctioned and the mechanic who had been aboard Flight 614 went and assisted the firefighter in repairing the truck.


Interesting they still had the foil recorders like we talked before. Sent to Wash. DC to be read.

A Fairchild model 5424 flight data recorder (FDR), serial No. 6061,
...
The altitude information was based on a barometric pressure of 29.86 inches
The FDR traces for the final 8 minutes of the flight were read out (see Hg to convert pressure altitude to m.s.1.; no other corrections were made to the other parameters. The FDR airspeed trace showed a stabilized airspeed of about 132 knots during the final approach.

in terms of stats, it was
36th loss of a Boeing 727
31st worst accident involving a Boeing 727 (at the time)
57th worst accident involving a Boeing 727 (currently)
2nd worst accident in Micronesia (at the time)
2nd worst accident in Micronesia (currently)


I attached page 38 which is interesting FDR data they exracted from the last 8 minutes (I suppose they had more but only cared about last 8 minutes?). I guess this is what 1981 kind of FDR data extraction gave you.

The plane was modified cargo plus passenger. The aft stairs were a key requirement for emergency exit. (cargo was forward?)

I love some of the transcript from the cockpit voice recorder as they're approaching the landing:

Have you got the tower over there okay, Jocko?

Yeah

I'm looking for a golf course now

Plenty of places we can put one in here

Might even get thirtysix holes in here --- about a five hundred room hotel

What's that tower do anyway, is that satellite thing or something?

Nah, thatt ' s a Loran

That's a big one for a little bitty island.

Is that Loran station still active anyway?

((Air noise level decreases))

Look how tall that sucker is, one thousand eighty feet
* * wind blows from the east here

There's that old abandoned Jap airfield over there

Right over there?

Yeah, right over there .

Yeah that's what I thought first time we came in

[skyjack71 0]

The phrase has been around for a long long time - but those darn writers Scott and Scott who did the Number's segment "Old Soldier" have used this thread for other things they write for.

Tonight - on the First of the Final episodes of Lost - again - In Plain Site was used. (I didn't catch the name of the writers).
It was also used in a couple of other stories this past yr, but I didn't note which ones.

These writers Scott and Scott write for other series - usually on CBS. These guys must read this thread and maybe one of them is a jumper. He reads this site and picks up things to use such as BuDop (that one stretched the imagination since the only place Cooper and BuDop have been in one sentence was in this thread).

These guys write for lots of CBS programs - such as NCIS and CSI programs...they used our wording or my wording regarding the DNA. Well, there are only so many words and so many ways to describe things.

All created and true stories are a conglomeration of words. I just feel writers HiJacking ideas from a thread on a forum is stooping a little to far (sounds hungery).. DuBop or BuDop (however it is spelled) and a Cooper suspect was pretty hard to swallow. Just remember this guys - we discussed it here long before they had it in a script.

I guess the writer thinks none of us have time to watch TV. Watch for those writers - I think it is Riddley Scott and Tony Scott during the credits if you hear things on a program that seems unique...to this thread. Not that it really matters other than I would like to know if they are jumpers and what their interest in this thread is - other than one of them is a jumper.

Life and the things we do and say are all learned - or a group of words to describe a happening or to express our selves. Everything we hear, read and speak at one time in our life is usually incorporated within what we write or speak.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

"The phrase has been around for a long long time - but those darn writers Scott and Scott who did the Number's segment "Old Soldier" have used this thread for other things they write for."

The jumpers in Spain fall mainly from the Plaines.

Jo said "Everything we hear, read and speak at one time in our life is usually incorporated within what we write or speak. "

Exactly. See above.

[airtwardo 7]

Quote

"The phrase has been around for a long long time - but those darn writers Scott and Scott who did the Number's segment "Old Soldier" have used this thread for other things they write for."

The jumpers in Spain fall mainly from the Plaines.

Jo said "Everything we hear, read and speak at one time in our life is usually incorporated within what we write or speak. "

Exactly. See above.

...and ya gotta be careful what ya 'say' on here, even in jest huh Snow?!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Quote

"The phrase has been around for a long long time - but those darn writers Scott and Scott who did the Number's segment "Old Soldier" have used this thread for other things they write for."

The jumpers in Spain fall mainly from the Plaines.

Jo said "Everything we hear, read and speak at one time in our life is usually incorporated within what we write or speak. "

Exactly. See above.

...and ya gotta be careful what ya 'say' on here, even in jest huh Snow?!

heh! Lucky I'm not a jumper...I suspect I'd be taught a lesson about fibbing on the next jump....as I go out the door "Hey Snow: We were just kidding about packing that rig for you...but you got a reserve, right? right? see ya.."

[377 22]

Quote

heh! Lucky I'm not a jumper...I suspect I'd be taught a lesson about fibbing on the next jump....as I go out the door "Hey Snow: We were just kidding about packing that rig for you...but you got a reserve, right? right? see ya.."

You wouldnt believe the "pranks" jumpers have pulled:

1. dumping someone elses reserve in freefall
2. swiping the keys on exit leaving a Cessna pilot engineless on a NIGHT JUMP!
3. tossing hypoxic jumpers out to "wake them up"
4. planting a pack of condoms in the back seat of a straight up family guys car.

I am sure Twardo and Guru have even better examples.

Don't jumpers have great senses of humor?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Orange1 0]

Quote

Quote

heh! Lucky I'm not a jumper...I suspect I'd be taught a lesson about fibbing on the next jump....as I go out the door "Hey Snow: We were just kidding about packing that rig for you...but you got a reserve, right? right? see ya.."

You wouldnt believe the "pranks" jumpers have pulled:

1. dumping someone elses reserve in freefall
2. swiping the keys on exit leaving a Cessna pilot engineless on a NIGHT JUMP!
3. tossing hypoxic jumpers out to "wake them up"
4. planting a pack of condoms in the back seat of a straight up family guys car.

I am sure Twardo and Guru have even better examples.

Don't jumpers have great senses of humor?

377

Of course, #3 works. the others are a bit dodgy - #2 especially, did the culprits get grounded?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[hangdiver 1]

Speaking of skydiver pranks, Here is a link to a story 377 can appreciate. 377 probably knows this guy.
I know "Jack" from this story, good friend of mine. I guess the writer didn't ever know his real name because Norton always said "Hey jack! come here".
Lots of other cool aviation stories there also.

"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan

[SKYWHUFFO 1]

I thinks Snowmann is really Ridley Scott!

[377 22]

Quote

Coming from an army and fine arts background, Ridley Scott is an inveterate stickler for detail who tackles each movie project with the vehemence of a general with a battle plan. His persistent scrutiny of minutiae on the Alien (1979) shoot prompted Sigourney Weaver to complain that he cared more about his props and sets than he did about his cast.

Snow would pay a little more attention to Sigourney, especially back in her Alien 1 days.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Quote

Coming from an army and fine arts background, Ridley Scott is an inveterate stickler for detail who tackles each movie project with the vehemence of a general with a battle plan. His persistent scrutiny of minutiae on the Alien (1979) shoot prompted Sigourney Weaver to complain that he cared more about his props and sets than he did about his cast.

Snow would pay a little more attention to Sigourney, especially back in her Alien 1 days.

377

Okay, you got me.
Here's a funny coincidence.
Remember "Point Break", the movie Ckret loves?
well two things

1) Airtwardo actually did a real life version of the scene where the jumper leaves the LE in the plane when he jumps, and challenges him to follow (and the LE is armed). Airtwardo escaped, like in the movie. That Point Break scene was actually stolen from Airtwardo.

2) I bought the original script for Point Break from a surfer named Peter Iliff in 1987. It was his first script. I was planning on directing it myself. (look it up, if you are an unbeliever)

I guess I'm busted!

(edit) "he cared more about his props and sets than he did about his cast."

Like I said before ...it's all about the gear!

(edit) (I'll always own my own reserve..so I'm free to lie as much as I want..lesson learned)

[377 22]

Notice how Quade doesn't come around here any more?

Hey Quade, have we become District Nine?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[snowmman 3]

what I like, is that no matter how much someone complains this thread is crap, I've yet to see any evidence that any other process is superior.

(edit) The cathedral vs bazaar analogy applies.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cathedral_and_the_Bazaar
or the essay http://www.catb.org/~esr/writings/cathedral-bazaar/cathedral-bazaar/

example thoughts from the essay:

given enough eyeballs, all bugs are shallow

7. Release early. Release often. And listen to your customers.

12. Often, the most striking and innovative solutions come from realizing that your concept of the problem was wrong.

17. A security system is only as secure as its secret. Beware of pseudo-secrets.

18. To solve an interesting problem, start by finding a problem that is interesting to you.

and of course:

16. When your language is nowhere near Turing-complete, syntactic sugar can be your friend.

[skyjack71 0]

Naahhh. Snow posts "too much" here to have enough time left to write TV scripts

You -yeaaa maybe! Could be. I am thinking a couple who only piped in a half dozen times or so. I know one of those guys, I thought was Galen Cook and another I am pretty sure was Grey. Neither stayed long before they lauched their own efforts and gleaned whatever they needed regarding the jumping expertise and lingo needed to author books.

Frankly I think someone who has offered to help me might be one of the Scotts...I won't say who, but I feel sure he is a jumper and/or he plays a good game of pretending... or he feeds these two writers...with stories from the forum.

Using the BuDop connection was a dead give-away. Sure wish they would ID themselves to me.

First, I would give them Hell and then ask for their assistance to find someone to write "Weber's story" or what some call "Jo's Lies". Whoever they are they are too busy being pirates to be trusted. I have reached the point in time I do want someone to put what I have to say in words that have an orderly sequence and not my haphazard ramblings.

I would never live to see it published and if it was NO one would buy it. What I would like to do is have what I have to say permanently recorded - a book which would require me to sign off on the accuracy of what is told. Probably end up in an old and rare book store 50 yrs from now with a limited number of editions published and sold. That is how I found "Ha Ha Ha" by D.B.Cooper.

Regarding that book "Ha Ha Ha"
I never found out who the real author was - but there were somethings in that book - only I knew about Weber. I have not discussed this because you guys would just say he read the book, but there were a few things in that book, I thought only I knew about Duane Weber.

They were stories he told me prior to the publishing of this book in 1983. The stories were not even related to Cooper, but something's he could tell me about himself..without revealing any connection to Cooper.

I tried with all of my might to find the author of this book. I know the Editor was Judi Van Cleave (a name I had heard before). The first printing was by the Daily Journal of commerce, Portland, Oregon - Signum Books Ltd.

The company later became Journal Graphics and the name Gary Twituerd was provided. I was never able to trace the books writer. I always wanted to know where he picked up some of the little stories he had in that book - more than a couple of them rang a bell - things told to me unrelated to Cooper from 1978 - 1982. They were just sweet happen chance correlations between the character and Weber - but it was enough for me to make me wonder - What If!

Good Grief!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Quote

Coming from an army and fine arts background, Ridley Scott is an inveterate stickler for detail who tackles each movie project with the vehemence of a general with a battle plan. His persistent scrutiny of minutiae on the Alien (1979) shoot prompted Sigourney Weaver to complain that he cared more about his props and sets than he did about his cast.

Snow would pay a little more attention to Sigourney, especially back in her Alien 1 days.

377

Okay - you guys are sharing things in PM's or I have lost my mind - but, what is NEW? Where and who wrote that about Ridely Scott? I figured someone writing scripts for a TV series would never have done a movie? Where do I find some information about the "pirate" - just want to give him a piece of my mind -
If he is still playing "pirate" - he could be lofting around - but pirates take what they want and move on - and the only thing they look back for is the sound of a pistol or a cannon being fired.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

Jo theorized "Naahhh. Snow posts "too much" here to have enough time left to write TV scripts"

Let's pursue that theory.

What does it cost to post here? Typing and mouse clicks.
Assume touch typing, maybe 60 wpm?

Even at 10 posts a day, I think it would work out to me spending more time on the toilet or in the shower per day.

Although I don't any more, I used to work thru hundreds of emails a day. I think at 200-300/per day, that's about the limit for a full work day where you're doing nothing else.

What makes you think this thread consumes a lot of time?

(edit) Jo also theorized "Whoever they are they are too busy being pirates to be trusted."

Which implies non-pirates are better to trust.

I don't think that's true? The trust issue probably is unrelated to piracy issues.

[snowmman 3]

It was a couple posts back but may have been deleted.

The Science Team is apparently investigating Ridley Scott. He has a funny first name, minimally.

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

It was a couple posts back but may have been deleted.

The Science Team is apparently investigating Ridley Scott. He has a funny first name, minimally.

I am not sure of the first name and I haven't looked him up. ...leave the chase to you...maybe you already have him.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 244]

Quote

Quote

It was a couple posts back but may have been deleted.

The Science Team is apparently investigating Ridley Scott. He has a funny first name, minimally.

I am not sure of the first name and I haven't looked him up. ...leave the chase to you...maybe you already have him.

What were Cooper's "code words" he knew would
be published later?

How could you have missed this!

[377 22]

Quote

What were Cooper's "code words" he knew would be published later?

Rosebud?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.