377 22
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377 22
QuoteX’s friend said that the Utah NG staged night HALO training jumps in early November, 1971. On one particular jump a stranger joined them.
This individual was older than everyone else, who were all recently returned Vietnam airborne troops and in their twenties. Hence, the young troopers called their newcomer “Gramps,” and they ribbed him on the way up to height.
When they reached altitude, they called out, “C’mon Gramps, show us how it’s done.” “Gramps” in turn calmly stepped to the door and without hesitation jumped. That was the last anyone ever saw of him.
This account sounds fishy. It is VERY difficult to fly in or jump from an ANG aircraft informally. I've tried. You have two pilots whose retirement depends on no major screwups. I have some PJ friends who really tried to get me tolerated as a ride along jumper on a very low risk training jump but in the end the aircraft commander nixed it as too risky for his carreer if something went wrong.
I've another friend who got a contract ferrying C 119s from Florida to Italy. He and his crew lied and said they were experienced in C 119s. In reality they'd never flown them. My friend had a good friend who currently flew C119s in the Air National Guard. He thought it would be easy to get to ride along and get familiar with the aircraft. Nope. All he could do was spend time in the cockpit on the ground. Too risky to have non essential unauthorized people aboard a military plane if something went wrong and reports had to be made. My friend luckily learned enough from manuals and ground familiarization to successfully ferry all the overhauled C119s across the Atlantic.
Also, if a jumper on a night military mission disappears, the rest of the load doesn't just shrugg it off. It is a huge deal. A search is mobilized.
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
georger 244
Also, if a jumper on a night military mission disappears, the rest of the load doesn't just shrugg it off. It is a huge deal. A search is mobilized.
Exactly: it would have been a huge matter with all
kinds of people alerted/brought into the matter.
Moreover, when X says: ' On one particular jump a stranger joined them.' ... that is impossible. Let's forget about authorisation, command, etc. This sounds like a Jo Weber concoction.
This story presses a lot of buttons. Its a string of
archetypes connected. The one thing missing is a
McCoy Utah Ntl Guard connection - I guess X left
that out for the time being?
I smell a shiksa at work - hocken me ha'chinik -
and I don't mean efsheh!
Snowman will be all over this - send us a report.
377 22
UAL captains made pretty decent money in 1971. Why would Burnsworth throw away a lucrative and very respectable career for a couple of hundred K and life as a fugitive?
Seniority meant EVERYTHING if you were an airline pilot in 1971. You wouldn't walk away from it if you had a good number.
Was he still on the UAL payroll while flying intermittently for Sail Fish?
I REALLY doubt that "gramps" HALO military jump story. It has more holes in it than Swiss cheese does.
Divorce records are public, but there is no national database that I know of. You might have to search county records which could be tedious without a solid lead.
How would the FBI be onto Burnsworth so quickly (a couple of days after the hijack)?
It would be fun to find out that Cooper was a DC 7 pilot. The DC 7C was Douglas's final pre-jet airliner and was a great long haul aircraft. Only a couple of DC 7s are still airworthy, 1 or 2 as fire tankers, one freight dog in FLA and the latest restoration a DC 7B beautifully restored in EAL colors and just approved for passenger flights, see below:
http://www.historicalflightfoundation.com
377
Seniority meant EVERYTHING if you were an airline pilot in 1971. You wouldn't walk away from it if you had a good number.
Was he still on the UAL payroll while flying intermittently for Sail Fish?
I REALLY doubt that "gramps" HALO military jump story. It has more holes in it than Swiss cheese does.
Divorce records are public, but there is no national database that I know of. You might have to search county records which could be tedious without a solid lead.
How would the FBI be onto Burnsworth so quickly (a couple of days after the hijack)?
It would be fun to find out that Cooper was a DC 7 pilot. The DC 7C was Douglas's final pre-jet airliner and was a great long haul aircraft. Only a couple of DC 7s are still airworthy, 1 or 2 as fire tankers, one freight dog in FLA and the latest restoration a DC 7B beautifully restored in EAL colors and just approved for passenger flights, see below:
http://www.historicalflightfoundation.com
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Bruce et.al.,
I don't have much time, but here's something to chew on. The spelling probably should be Burnworth not Burnsworth.
DONALD O BURNWORTH
640 S BEAR CLAW
PRESCOTT,AZ 86301
Married to Nancy on 8/02/73
From divorce proceedings November 1, 1977:
6 Shortly after garnishment of Donald's employer, United Airlines, Chicago, Illinois, Donald made special appearance in the Oklahoma case seeking by motion to set aside the default judgment, to quash the garnishment, and to dismiss the cause.
See:
BURNWORTH v. BURNWORTH
No. 50138.
572 P.2d 301
1977 OK CIV APP 52
Decided: November 1, 1977.
Court of Appeals of Oklahoma, Division No. 2.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NANCY BURNWORTH, APPELLEE,
v.
DONALD O. BURNWORTH, APPELLANT.
Appeal from the District Court of Oklahoma County; Bill Biggers, Trial Judge.
Also see:
U.S. Patent Number 4,317,177
Power priority control system for aircraft and test apparatus therefor
February 23, 1982
Inventor
Donald O. Burnworth, Arvada, CO
Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum
I don't have much time, but here's something to chew on. The spelling probably should be Burnworth not Burnsworth.
DONALD O BURNWORTH
640 S BEAR CLAW
PRESCOTT,AZ 86301
Married to Nancy on 8/02/73
From divorce proceedings November 1, 1977:
6 Shortly after garnishment of Donald's employer, United Airlines, Chicago, Illinois, Donald made special appearance in the Oklahoma case seeking by motion to set aside the default judgment, to quash the garnishment, and to dismiss the cause.
See:
BURNWORTH v. BURNWORTH
No. 50138.
572 P.2d 301
1977 OK CIV APP 52
Decided: November 1, 1977.
Court of Appeals of Oklahoma, Division No. 2.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NANCY BURNWORTH, APPELLEE,
v.
DONALD O. BURNWORTH, APPELLANT.
Appeal from the District Court of Oklahoma County; Bill Biggers, Trial Judge.
Also see:
U.S. Patent Number 4,317,177
Power priority control system for aircraft and test apparatus therefor
February 23, 1982
Inventor
Donald O. Burnworth, Arvada, CO
Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum
377 22
Good catch Sluggo!
377
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
and i found 2 in northern Indiana, and one in OHIO. Sounds like Donald O. Burnworth is aboust as common as Bob Smith if i can find them. HA!
Orange1 0
Quote
Bruce et.al.,
I don't have much time, but here's something to chew on. The spelling probably should be Burnworth not Burnsworth.
DONALD O BURNWORTH
640 S BEAR CLAW
PRESCOTT,AZ 86301
Married to Nancy on 8/02/73
From divorce proceedings November 1, 1977:
6 Shortly after garnishment of Donald's employer, United Airlines, Chicago, Illinois, Donald made special appearance in the Oklahoma case seeking by motion to set aside the default judgment, to quash the garnishment, and to dismiss the cause.
See:
BURNWORTH v. BURNWORTH
No. 50138.
572 P.2d 301
1977 OK CIV APP 52
Decided: November 1, 1977.
Court of Appeals of Oklahoma, Division No. 2.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
NANCY BURNWORTH, APPELLEE,
v.
DONALD O. BURNWORTH, APPELLANT.
Appeal from the District Court of Oklahoma County; Bill Biggers, Trial Judge.
Also see:
U.S. Patent Number 4,317,177
Power priority control system for aircraft and test apparatus therefor
February 23, 1982
Inventor
Donald O. Burnworth, Arvada, CO
Hm... interesting. Of course, the dates are all wrong for a disappeared Cooper.
Bruce, you say Galen put you on to this man, and that he finds him credible. Does Galen find his story credible enough to make him change his mind about Gosset -- is this the reason the book is being delayed? Or does he think there is a connection ebtween Gosset and Burn(s)worth?
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.
377 22
an excerpt from the Burnworth patent which is OBVIOUSLY directed towards the Boeing 727 if you look at the system diagrams. The inventor sure knew the 727 systems:
http://www.google.com/patents?id=3ccuAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4&source=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false
"A control system prevents electrical overloads in an aircraft of the type in which electrical loads are automatically connected to an electrical supply bus when the wing flaps are extended. The control system determines the maximum capability of the electrical generators for generating electricity and determines the wing flap position. Because electrical load is related to the wing flap position in this type of aircraft, the control system automatically correlates the wing flap position to electrical load. The control system operatively disconnects electrical load from the supply bus, or prevents energization of additional electrical load, when it determines that the maximum power generating capacity of the operative electrical generators will be exceeded by the automatic connection of the electrical load upon extension of the wing flaps.
A test circuit apparatus is used for checking proper operation of the control system. The test circuit apparatus selectively supplies test input signals respresentative of different power generating capabilities and of different wing flap positions. Signals are supplied to indicate operation of the control system in response to the test input signals."
This is all interesting but I see nothing that ties Burnworth to Norjack. I discount that "gramps" military HALO jump story and even if true there is nothing that identifies "gramps" as Burnworth.
377
http://www.google.com/patents?id=3ccuAAAAEBAJ&printsec=abstract&zoom=4&source=gbs_overview_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false
"A control system prevents electrical overloads in an aircraft of the type in which electrical loads are automatically connected to an electrical supply bus when the wing flaps are extended. The control system determines the maximum capability of the electrical generators for generating electricity and determines the wing flap position. Because electrical load is related to the wing flap position in this type of aircraft, the control system automatically correlates the wing flap position to electrical load. The control system operatively disconnects electrical load from the supply bus, or prevents energization of additional electrical load, when it determines that the maximum power generating capacity of the operative electrical generators will be exceeded by the automatic connection of the electrical load upon extension of the wing flaps.
A test circuit apparatus is used for checking proper operation of the control system. The test circuit apparatus selectively supplies test input signals respresentative of different power generating capabilities and of different wing flap positions. Signals are supplied to indicate operation of the control system in response to the test input signals."
This is all interesting but I see nothing that ties Burnworth to Norjack. I discount that "gramps" military HALO jump story and even if true there is nothing that identifies "gramps" as Burnworth.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Orange1 0
Then again, the "gramps" story does not have to be true for the rest of it, if he was as experienced as was implied?
For me the bigger hole is implied by Sluggo's extract - whcih showed that (if it is the same guy) he was still working for United years later and thus clearly did not disappear anywhere.
For me the bigger hole is implied by Sluggo's extract - whcih showed that (if it is the same guy) he was still working for United years later and thus clearly did not disappear anywhere.
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.
377 22
an odd Burnworth post, trying to sell Iridium...
http://www.finishing.com/274/75.shtml
377
http://www.finishing.com/274/75.shtml
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
1969912 0
Pretty sure I remember Jo mentioning Cupil in this thread. From talking to "X", I guess.
"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG
"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG
You guys got it. Donald Burnworth from Arizona. Some things still don't add up, such as the divorce papers, dates and the name of his ex-wife, but here's the story I got from Don today. I'll be talking with him again, tomorrow.
Interview with Don Burnworth, Initial
Phone, May 5, 2010
Initial Report:
I spoke with Don Burnworth (no "s") at length this afternoon, and will continue again tomorrow.
He tells a wild tale, and it is strongly at odds with X's story in some places; but it also links up in many ways, too. Don wants to tell his story, and he has been keeping track of details, records, etc.
Don Burnworth was a UAL captain, and a key suspect in the DB Cooper skyjacking. He acknowledges flying with X, but says it was in the 1973-1974 time period, after the time of the skyjacking. Don corroborates all aspects of the flight experience with X on the DC-7 to Alaska and back for Sailfish Air Freight.
He was incarcerated by the FBI for eight days following the skyjacking; not sure of the exact time period. He was also fired by UAL at that time because he was an active suspect. That was when he went to fly for Sailfish Air Freight in Salt Lake City. He flew one trip for Sailfish, with X, to Alaska, and all the details of the trip check out with X's story.
However, Sailfish did not pay Burnworth in cash, and only offered stock options. He passed, and left.
He was later re-instated by UAL after a lengthy Labor Relations lawsuit.
Don Burnworth says that the DB Cooper skyjacking was set up by his ex-wife's family, the Vincent Eddy “Charlie” Bruno crime family of Kansas City, Kansas, and who is also connected to the Bruno crime family in Philadelphia.
Don says that Robert F Kennedy, Jr. personally prosecuted his father-in-law during the early 1960s.
Don says the intention of the Cooper skyjacking was to pin the blame on Don and discredit him, or get him incarcerated, so that his ex-wife, Bernice Lucille Day Bruno, would get full and exclusive custody of their three kids.
Burnworth describes his ex-wife, Bernice, pronounced Burn-iss, as having a Jekyll and Hyde persona, and he calls her a “hysterical personality.”
“She had very serious mental problems,” he added.
Bernice Burnworth Bruno is now deceased, as are her parents.
Don also says that custody of their kids was highly problematic upon their divorce. First she had them via wrangling and bribery from the Bruno family, then he had the kids, then she kidnapped them back, and he got them returned through court action. Following that he took them without telling her, which was illegal, to live with him in seclusion in Germany.
Don says he has court transcripts that indicate that Bernice had prior knowledge of the skyjacking before it took place. He says the records read:
"I was sitting in the living room and watching TV with my cousin Mary, waiting for it (the skyjacking) to happen. When it came over the news, I then called the FBI and told them DB Cooper was my ex-husband." (or words to that effect, from my notes of today's phone conversation.)
The skyjacking was designed to ferret-out Don from his hiding place in Europe. Apparently he was still flying for UAL from Germany, and the FBI found him and took him into custody, bringing him and the kids back to the United States.
“The Bruno family will protect their own,” he says.
Don says that every aspect of his involvement in the case had the feel of being orchestrated by powerful interests. He also says that J Edgar Hoover's replacement, Clarence Kelly, was on the Bruno payroll while a G-man in Kansas City, and was investigated for corruption at one point. Don says Kelley was placed at the head of the FBI directly from his post as Chief of Police of Kansas City, a job he had after having to leave the FBI earlier due to the corruption probe.
Don did not say if he knows DB Cooper’s identity.
He has been following the case intently since his incarceration, and has conducted a lot of research.
He says that the case has lots of inside tells, or personal artifacts. He claims that the skyjacking took place on November 24 because that was his ex-wife’s birthday.
He says that the actual Cooper forgot the alias he was supposed to use in purchasing the ticket in Portland, and actually signed the ticket Dan X. Cooper, and had erased the last name so many times as he made mistakes that he almost wore out the ticket paper.
Don did not say how he knew this piece of information.
Don also says that the FBI was involved, at least peripherally, in the early stages of the crime. He says the FBI fostered the name “DB Cooper” onto the media and world to reflect his connection with his own initials of “DB,” for Don Burnworth.
Don has extensive knowledge of 727s. He was a check pilot for UAL and a flight engineer for 727s
Don thinks that DB Cooper didn’t jump, but rather, he hid in a small side compartment in the stair well that was covered by a cloth and Velcro flap. These cloth covers were replaced on the 727 fleet shortly after the Cooper skyjacking, Don says.
Don claims that DB Cooper got out at Sea-Tac and that a car was waiting for him at the end of the runway, and he drove away. Again, he hasn’t said how he knows this.
The Bruno family is heavily involved in the skyjacking, according to Don, and he intimates that individuals with UAL were also involved, possibly his flight manager, whom Don says was having an affair with his ex-wife Bernice.
This flight manager was called to testify at the Labor Relations hearing on Don’s re-instatement, and was a very hostile witness.
Don said that the FBI placed an agent, thinly disguised as his cell mate during his eight days of incarceration, to gather more information.
Don is very eager to talk, and I found him to be a credible individual. He also seems like a nice guy. He answered every question thoughtfully and fully. He held nothing back.
377 found Don via a patent Don holds on electrical improvements he has made to 727s. Obviously, Don Burnworth is a very smart, capable guy.
In this initial interview we did not discuss any of his background, including any military experience, such as intimated by X.
Interview with Don Burnworth, Initial
Phone, May 5, 2010
Initial Report:
I spoke with Don Burnworth (no "s") at length this afternoon, and will continue again tomorrow.
He tells a wild tale, and it is strongly at odds with X's story in some places; but it also links up in many ways, too. Don wants to tell his story, and he has been keeping track of details, records, etc.
Don Burnworth was a UAL captain, and a key suspect in the DB Cooper skyjacking. He acknowledges flying with X, but says it was in the 1973-1974 time period, after the time of the skyjacking. Don corroborates all aspects of the flight experience with X on the DC-7 to Alaska and back for Sailfish Air Freight.
He was incarcerated by the FBI for eight days following the skyjacking; not sure of the exact time period. He was also fired by UAL at that time because he was an active suspect. That was when he went to fly for Sailfish Air Freight in Salt Lake City. He flew one trip for Sailfish, with X, to Alaska, and all the details of the trip check out with X's story.
However, Sailfish did not pay Burnworth in cash, and only offered stock options. He passed, and left.
He was later re-instated by UAL after a lengthy Labor Relations lawsuit.
Don Burnworth says that the DB Cooper skyjacking was set up by his ex-wife's family, the Vincent Eddy “Charlie” Bruno crime family of Kansas City, Kansas, and who is also connected to the Bruno crime family in Philadelphia.
Don says that Robert F Kennedy, Jr. personally prosecuted his father-in-law during the early 1960s.
Don says the intention of the Cooper skyjacking was to pin the blame on Don and discredit him, or get him incarcerated, so that his ex-wife, Bernice Lucille Day Bruno, would get full and exclusive custody of their three kids.
Burnworth describes his ex-wife, Bernice, pronounced Burn-iss, as having a Jekyll and Hyde persona, and he calls her a “hysterical personality.”
“She had very serious mental problems,” he added.
Bernice Burnworth Bruno is now deceased, as are her parents.
Don also says that custody of their kids was highly problematic upon their divorce. First she had them via wrangling and bribery from the Bruno family, then he had the kids, then she kidnapped them back, and he got them returned through court action. Following that he took them without telling her, which was illegal, to live with him in seclusion in Germany.
Don says he has court transcripts that indicate that Bernice had prior knowledge of the skyjacking before it took place. He says the records read:
"I was sitting in the living room and watching TV with my cousin Mary, waiting for it (the skyjacking) to happen. When it came over the news, I then called the FBI and told them DB Cooper was my ex-husband." (or words to that effect, from my notes of today's phone conversation.)
The skyjacking was designed to ferret-out Don from his hiding place in Europe. Apparently he was still flying for UAL from Germany, and the FBI found him and took him into custody, bringing him and the kids back to the United States.
“The Bruno family will protect their own,” he says.
Don says that every aspect of his involvement in the case had the feel of being orchestrated by powerful interests. He also says that J Edgar Hoover's replacement, Clarence Kelly, was on the Bruno payroll while a G-man in Kansas City, and was investigated for corruption at one point. Don says Kelley was placed at the head of the FBI directly from his post as Chief of Police of Kansas City, a job he had after having to leave the FBI earlier due to the corruption probe.
Don did not say if he knows DB Cooper’s identity.
He has been following the case intently since his incarceration, and has conducted a lot of research.
He says that the case has lots of inside tells, or personal artifacts. He claims that the skyjacking took place on November 24 because that was his ex-wife’s birthday.
He says that the actual Cooper forgot the alias he was supposed to use in purchasing the ticket in Portland, and actually signed the ticket Dan X. Cooper, and had erased the last name so many times as he made mistakes that he almost wore out the ticket paper.
Don did not say how he knew this piece of information.
Don also says that the FBI was involved, at least peripherally, in the early stages of the crime. He says the FBI fostered the name “DB Cooper” onto the media and world to reflect his connection with his own initials of “DB,” for Don Burnworth.
Don has extensive knowledge of 727s. He was a check pilot for UAL and a flight engineer for 727s
Don thinks that DB Cooper didn’t jump, but rather, he hid in a small side compartment in the stair well that was covered by a cloth and Velcro flap. These cloth covers were replaced on the 727 fleet shortly after the Cooper skyjacking, Don says.
Don claims that DB Cooper got out at Sea-Tac and that a car was waiting for him at the end of the runway, and he drove away. Again, he hasn’t said how he knows this.
The Bruno family is heavily involved in the skyjacking, according to Don, and he intimates that individuals with UAL were also involved, possibly his flight manager, whom Don says was having an affair with his ex-wife Bernice.
This flight manager was called to testify at the Labor Relations hearing on Don’s re-instatement, and was a very hostile witness.
Don said that the FBI placed an agent, thinly disguised as his cell mate during his eight days of incarceration, to gather more information.
Don is very eager to talk, and I found him to be a credible individual. He also seems like a nice guy. He answered every question thoughtfully and fully. He held nothing back.
377 found Don via a patent Don holds on electrical improvements he has made to 727s. Obviously, Don Burnworth is a very smart, capable guy.
In this initial interview we did not discuss any of his background, including any military experience, such as intimated by X.
quade 4
Quote“She had very serious mental problems,” he added.
Yes. I'm sure she did.
QuoteHe claims that the skyjacking took place on November 24 because that was his ex-wife’s birthday.
So, what you're telling me is, he's roughly as credible as Baron von Munchausen.
quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
The World's Most Boring Skydiver
georger 244
QuoteYou guys got it. Donald Burnworth from Arizona.
How does he explain money at Tina Bar and when
did it arrive there?
All,
Oh Boy!
You will never know how much it kills me to make this post! I know you guys will massacre me after this, but, I’ve always said: “I am open minded, but not so open my brains fall out.”
So here goes…
The last two long posts by Bruce are so fantastic that I tend to ignore the info as “telling tall tales” (the subjects he interviewed, not his reporting).
I still feel the same way, however, I feel it is incumbent on me (in the interest of honesty) to make this statement: ”The story told in the last post by Bruce parallels (in many ways) information given to me (in confidence) by Skyjack71 years ago.” That’s the statement (no more, no less).
There could be a million reasons for the parallel aspects of her story and Don Burnworth’s story. His story has some “material false statements in it.
He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW!
I have distanced myself from Skyjack71 because I felt like she ruined her credibility and could potentially ruin mine (by association). I have been quick to criticize her for her “leaps of logic,” none of that has changed.
If she wants to present (formerly withheld) information, I think we owe it to her to listen. If she makes her “typical illogical and circumstantial associations,” that’s her prerogative, we (I) don’t have to give any weight to her conclusions. But, I hope she chooses to weigh in with her information.
Now, all of you piranhas, take a big bite of Sluggo, it’s flavorful, tender, satisfying, and filling… but most of all… honest.
Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum
Oh Boy!
You will never know how much it kills me to make this post! I know you guys will massacre me after this, but, I’ve always said: “I am open minded, but not so open my brains fall out.”
So here goes…
The last two long posts by Bruce are so fantastic that I tend to ignore the info as “telling tall tales” (the subjects he interviewed, not his reporting).
I still feel the same way, however, I feel it is incumbent on me (in the interest of honesty) to make this statement: ”The story told in the last post by Bruce parallels (in many ways) information given to me (in confidence) by Skyjack71 years ago.” That’s the statement (no more, no less).
There could be a million reasons for the parallel aspects of her story and Don Burnworth’s story. His story has some “material false statements in it.
QuoteDon says that every aspect of his involvement in the case had the feel of being orchestrated by powerful interests. He also says that J Edgar Hoover's replacement, Clarence Kelly, was on the Bruno payroll while a G-man in Kansas City, and was investigated for corruption at one point. Don says Kelley was placed at the head of the FBI directly from his post as Chief of Police of Kansas City, a job he had after having to leave the FBI earlier due to the corruption probe.
QuoteIn 1961 the Kansas City, Mo., police department was badly shaken by a scandal that involved its chief and two of his high-ranking officers. To put the department back together again, the state hired FBI Agent Clarence M. Kelley.
Read More Here
He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW!
I have distanced myself from Skyjack71 because I felt like she ruined her credibility and could potentially ruin mine (by association). I have been quick to criticize her for her “leaps of logic,” none of that has changed.
If she wants to present (formerly withheld) information, I think we owe it to her to listen. If she makes her “typical illogical and circumstantial associations,” that’s her prerogative, we (I) don’t have to give any weight to her conclusions. But, I hope she chooses to weigh in with her information.
Now, all of you piranhas, take a big bite of Sluggo, it’s flavorful, tender, satisfying, and filling… but most of all… honest.
Web Page
Blog
NORJAK Forum
Great question Georger! Bruce, can you ask him that, and if the military experience X stated is true. If it is does he know Braden or Waugh, heck for Jo, mention Weber and Collins too. one other stange question i would like you to ask, did he do any other flying around Portland/Seattle for anyone or any entitity? I have a reason for that question, Ill share later.
377,
I think you have the manuals for the plane? Does it show this compartment, and if so how big is it? Will a man fit in it?
I find it interesting that there is snipits of a lot of stories from so many different people that could weave together. Mafia-Jo mentioned it, this guy and a couple others, the military elite who could make the jump weaves a couple stories together, heck even the Kennedy names have came up a couple of times.
377,
I think you have the manuals for the plane? Does it show this compartment, and if so how big is it? Will a man fit in it?
I find it interesting that there is snipits of a lot of stories from so many different people that could weave together. Mafia-Jo mentioned it, this guy and a couple others, the military elite who could make the jump weaves a couple stories together, heck even the Kennedy names have came up a couple of times.
georger 244
QuoteAll,
Oh Boy!
You will never know how much it kills me to make this post! I know you guys will massacre me after this, but, I’ve always said: “I am open minded, but not so open my brains fall out.”
So here goes…
The last two long posts by Bruce are so fantastic that I tend to ignore the info as “telling tall tales” (the subjects he interviewed, not his reporting).
I still feel the same way, however, I feel it is incumbent on me (in the interest of honesty) to make this statement: ”The story told in the last post by Bruce parallels (in many ways) information given to me (in confidence) by Skyjack71 years ago.” That’s the statement (no more, no less).
There could be a million reasons for the parallel aspects of her story and Don Burnworth’s story. His story has some “material false statements in it.QuoteDon says that every aspect of his involvement in the case had the feel of being orchestrated by powerful interests. He also says that J Edgar Hoover's replacement, Clarence Kelly, was on the Bruno payroll while a G-man in Kansas City, and was investigated for corruption at one point. Don says Kelley was placed at the head of the FBI directly from his post as Chief of Police of Kansas City, a job he had after having to leave the FBI earlier due to the corruption probe.
QuoteIn 1961 the Kansas City, Mo., police department was badly shaken by a scandal that involved its chief and two of his high-ranking officers. To put the department back together again, the state hired FBI Agent Clarence M. Kelley.
Read More Here
He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW!
I have distanced myself from Skyjack71 because I felt like she ruined her credibility and could potentially ruin mine (by association). I have been quick to criticize her for her “leaps of logic,” none of that has changed.
If she wants to present (formerly withheld) information, I think we owe it to her to listen. If she makes her “typical illogical and circumstantial associations,” that’s her prerogative, we (I) don’t have to give any weight to her conclusions. But, I hope she chooses to weigh in with her information.
Now, all of you piranhas, take a big bite of Sluggo, it’s flavorful, tender, satisfying, and filling… but most of all… honest.
No bites. No reason for bites. It is what it is.
I think the linkage is very simple. You
have company in this.
Jo is not part of the story, if I am correct, but only
the holder of part of the story she picked up from ... at an earlier date. That is my explanation for this coincidence.
I am not going to name here.
It is my speculation that Jo believes when all of this
passes Duane will then emerge as a more serious cnadidate. He won't, but I'm speculating that is Jo's viewpoint.
That is how I see this.
I will NEVER-EVER! release "Charlie Daniels" name!
... or his dog "The General"'s name either! People
are free to speculate what their names might be.
(more "useless crap" from Georger)
Orange1 0
Wow.
I have to say... sounds pretty far-fetched... some corroboration of a good number of those thinsg would be interesting...
in other words the same thing we say to Jo: where's the evidence? would be interesting to note if anything can back it up.
The angle that "Cooper never jumped" has been raised here before.
I have to say... sounds pretty far-fetched... some corroboration of a good number of those thinsg would be interesting...
in other words the same thing we say to Jo: where's the evidence? would be interesting to note if anything can back it up.
The angle that "Cooper never jumped" has been raised here before.
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.
377 22
Quote377,
I think you have the manuals for the plane? Does it show this compartment, and if so how big is it? Will a man fit in it?
My manual does not give details on this space, sorry.
Occam's razor says the simplest explanation is that Burnworth's wife had nothing to do with Norjack but thought the drawing looked like her husband and decided to drop a dime on a call to the FBI.
If Cooper hid in the stairwell behind some removable covers, how would he escape from the plane after landing without being detected by the FBI who was waiting and watched every move?
I've always wondered if the Tena Bar money was tossed long before Cooper exited. You could do a pressure bump by jumping up and down on the stairs while holding on. How do we know that Cooper didnt exit hundreds of miles from where the FBI thinks he jumped?
I don't think he landed inside the plane, but I am keeping an open mind.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
SStewart 13
I think he may have landed near Orchards Washington, at his own dropzone.
Onward and Upward!
377 22
First of all Sluggo found DB the UAL pilot, not me. I just used Sluggo's leads to find more precise info. DB sure as hell knows the 727 inside out.
As a 727 check pilot, 727 FE and the inventor of a major improvement to the 727 electrical load management system, I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a suspect who knows more about 727s.
I think if he were Cooper thge FBI would have figured it out. He must have had an airtight alibi.
377
As a 727 check pilot, 727 FE and the inventor of a major improvement to the 727 electrical load management system, I'd say you'd be hard pressed to find a suspect who knows more about 727s.
I think if he were Cooper thge FBI would have figured it out. He must have had an airtight alibi.
377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.
Quote
Burnworth describes his ex-wife, Bernice, pronounced Burn-iss, as having a Jekyll and Hyde persona, and he calls her a “hysterical personality.”
This is how Duane's ex-wife was described by me and others.
===================
QuoteDon says he has court transcripts that indicate that Bernice had prior knowledge of the skyjacking before it took place. He says the records read:
"I was sitting in the living room and watching TV with my cousin Mary, waiting for it (the skyjacking) to happen. When it came over the news, I then called the FBI and told them DB Cooper was my ex-husband." (or words to that effect, from my notes of today's phone conversation.)
"With my cousin Mary in Kansas". Mary, the wife of Duane Weber claimed she was in Kansas when the skyjacking happened.
=====================
QuoteThe skyjacking was designed to ferret-out Don from his hiding place in Europe. Apparently he was still flying for UAL from Germany, and the FBI found him and took him into custody, bringing him and the kids back to the United States.
Mary the wife of Duane had also lost custody of her children during the early yrs with Duane.
=================
QuoteDon did not say if he knows DB Cooper’s identity.
Of course, Not.
======================
QuoteHe has been following the case intently since his incarceration, and has conducted a lot of research.
Why his story pararells so much of what I have told since 1996.
===================
QuoteHe says that the actual Cooper forgot the alias he was supposed to use in purchasing the ticket in Portland, and actually signed the ticket Dan X. Cooper, and had erased the last name so many times as he made mistakes that he almost wore out the ticket paper.
The ticket agent wrote the name Dan Cooper - not Cooper himself as this was discussed in detail when Ckret was here.
==================
QuoteHe says the FBI fostered the name “DB Cooper” onto the media and world to reflect his connection with his own initials of “DB,” for Don Burnworth.
We all know the TRUE story of how D.B. Cooper came to be the given title for the Skyjacker.
=======================
QuoteDon has extensive knowledge of 727s. He was a check pilot for UAL and a flight engineer for 727s
We need to see a picture of Don Burnworth - and does he look anything like the picture I took in SLC and the story that Duane told me about knowing a man who worked the Alaska/SLC routes...while we were in SLC.
The Alaska/SLC story by X is what got my attention - and Himmelsbach knows I discussed this with him and it is in my early writings and tapes...before my computer days.
====================
QuoteDon claims that DB Cooper got out at Sea-Tac and that a car was waiting for him at the end of the runway, and he drove away. Again, he hasn’t said how he knows this.
I have told the story about the SEA TAC parking stub and Duane taking me to the back of the Airport to the location the plane was parked...his only comment was that it had not changed much and he did not remember the fence. This was supposedly a short cut to where ever we were supposed to be on that day in Seattle.
=====================
All I have to say for now.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
[reply
He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW!
He may have been in contact with her recently and felt like by making his story parallel to her's he could gain traction. I JUST DON’T KNOW!
If she wants to present (formerly withheld) information, I think we owe it to her to listen. If she makes her “typical illogical and circumstantial associations,” that’s her prerogative, we (I) don’t have to give any weight to her conclusions. But, I hope she chooses to weigh in with her information.Quote
I have never spoke to Don Burnworth - I left that up to Bruce and you guys. He did maintain in his interview with Bruce he had been following the case for yrs.
===================
Quote
I just did that with the prior post, but this man I believe is the man I have been looking for - because Duane said in SLC that he used to know a pilot who did the Alaska/SLC run. I often wondered if the pilot was who he had me take a picture of in 1979.
======================
Mr. X's story about this SLC pilot was why I contacted him - and I have never spoke to Don Burnworth.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
Will let you know the results.
377
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