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quade

DB Cooper

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one that makes me believe



In an early statement you made you were
somewhat critical of the Citizens Science Group.
Could you expand on this? What would you have
liked the CSG to do, results you expected or wanted,
etc ? This is a serious question if you care to
elaborate your previous comments - this isnt a
trick question and you will not be graded. Im
looking for input ...

G



Need input



funny. true.

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one that makes me believe



In an early statement you made you were
somewhat critical of the Citizens Science Group.
Could you expand on this? What would you have
liked the CSG to do, results you expected or wanted,
etc ? This is a serious question if you care to
elaborate your previous comments - this isnt a
trick question and you will not be graded. Im
looking for input ...

G



Need input



there are some nice old rail maps at
http://www.sos.wa.gov/history/maps_list.aspx

Download the viewer on the website; it instals
easily and works seamlessly ... enjoy.

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Off-topic though marginally connected in a round about way :).... but I came across an interesting story today about Carl Gugasian aka the friday night bank Robber. You guys probably already know all about him but I'd not heard of him before.
His profile and background, plus the fact that the FBI SA on his case was named Ray CARR got me intrigued. Thought some of you might like an interesting read..This is just one site I skimmed but it had a pretty good synopsis of his story and touches on the subsequent bond he developed with SA Ray Carr.

http://forum.hyeclub.com/archive/index.php/t-4359.html
but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

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Skyjack71 says in part:

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'I felt you were another animal altogether - you did not enter this subject with the objective to find Who Cooper Really Was. Your motive was clearly to write a book and make money....and that made you a predator...'



Blevins states:
This is the second time I've addressed this type of comment:
:)1) The book had been out for five months and was already available both at Amazon and in bookstores by the first time I posted here.

:)You just miss the point all together - who cares if the book was already in print - it was inaccurate.

2) Adventure Books of Seattle is a wholesale trade publisher, not a retailer. This means all our books are entered in the Ingram catalog at wholesale rates. 95% of sales are through the catalog, which is only available to bookstores, libraries, retailers, Amazon jobbers, and wholesalers. You need an account and special software from Ingram even to order.

:) Sorry, Hogwash! You had done the book to make money - you were not doing it for your health.

3) If I were trying to push book sales on this thread, it would be a poor choice. My column at Newsvine/MSNBC receives between 10,000-25,000 unique visitors a month and you can do pictures. Nothing against Dropzone, but I would post to my column if I wanted to hawk books. I'm the managing editor and the co-founder, not a salesman. We have a rep who does that.

:)Do you REALLY expect us to believe that - get real! Everyone here has been nice to you and welcomed you - so why do you keep defending your position on the book. Face it you are an Official Cooper Hooked Junkie.

4) Mostly I came here to test the waters with armchair experts regarding the possible DB Cooper/Christiansen connection, and to find out some details on smaller items, such as the Amboy parachute. IMHO the FBI has not convinced me that the chute was not Cooper's. Maybe it wasn't...but their story has a few holes.

:| Give everyone here a break! You were several pages in to your posts when you realized you needed this thread and you needed to win the confidence of this thread if you were going to have a successful production.

5) AB of Seattle suspended all marketing on the book back in July because we're working on a newer, updated edition. I stopped all wholesale orders as well, that is, our 90-day sale-or-return option, until the new edition comes out and that isn't until January.

:)Of course, you did. Anyone spending 2 or 3 months on this thread knows the case is far more convoluted than you were making it out to be. You realized you had some serious flaws and if you didn't fix them you were going to be a laughing stock.

:):D:ph34r::o:|
Face some reality here - I was labeled as delusional , a liar, a fantasy story teller - and some other titles to boot. Probably 75% of this thread still believes this. I am not whining about that - because what I learn here is usually productive. Have you actually gone back to the beginning of the 2 threads and read the attacks and criticisms made against me (you could not and would not have tolerated it).

You are an intelligent man who wrote a book for profit - so why are you so defensive when the old woman with blond roots tells it like it is? No one here cares if you make money off your book - most of us would just like to see accurate accountings regarding the crime all in one book just one time.

Why spend valuable time arguing and defending your position? You claim to be editing the book for accuracy - so what is your problem and why do you keep defending your position regarding the "for profit" agenda.
Quilt maybe?

Answer questions and ask question! After all you are now an Official Cooper Junkie - like it or not. Think about how many times you have said - you were out of here. I believe you have done that more times in the short time you have been here than I have in the yrs I have been here. So quit snibbling and get the book done. There is not one person here who will not try to give you their opinion about any question you ask. You don't have to like the answers or agree with them.


"I didn't do it." That sounds like a 5 yr old who know he broke the lamp and afraid to admit it.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Skyjack71 says in part:

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'I felt you were another animal altogether - you did not enter this subject with the objective to find Who Cooper Really Was. Your motive was clearly to write a book and make money....and that made you a predator...'




Newsflash: wanting to write books to make money isn't illegal! Hey, it isn't even unethical! (most of the time anyway - unauthorised tabloid type biographies possible exceptions)
Jo seems to have a "thing" about authors. There was a stage when she would accuse every new poster who didn't buy her story of being an author ... as though it was some kind of dirty label. All rather confusing.

Robert, I really don't think you need to waste your energy trying to deflect "accusations". Especially as Jo will never accept that anyone wants to find out "who Cooper really was" unless they think it was Duane. (Of course, if it could be proven conclusively that someone was Cooper, that would be the best way to actually make money out of a book :D)

Now talking of books and suspects... aren't we something like a year past the original expected date for Galen Cook's book?
Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

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I’m coming to the conclusion that this ultimately has to do with perceptions and life (long and short) experiences.

Just as Bernie Madoff was discovered as a fraud, right after he confessed; so goes other activities. Bernie was universally described as a nice guy, people approached him to invest, he said he had a super secret formula that returns 11 percent on average and proceeded to do just that. Where’s the crime? Was Bernie a bully? How did he gain such entre to the funds of so many?

The attached image is one such example. My life experience (bias) instantly has my skin blanching as my mind tries to perceive what is going on. The average citizen would see a pretty airplane. The jump crowd would probably start to salivate at the thought of another load being prepped. Good luck reconciling anything into something representing a consensus. Instant conflict veiled with vapid validation.

Death penalty opponents use these to their total disservice in the US. They claim that it is more expensive to execute than jail for life. How would they respond to making executions less expensive? Oops, they have never supported that solution, me so confused. At least have the stones to admit you screwed the pooch.

You bought the ticket, take the ride.

Pick the perception that matches your curve the best and use it exclusively. After all, this appears to represent reality more than any other avenue I have explored.

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CCC's ended in 1942. Some of the camps took longer to close but then they became CPS's and other conservation group.

Since the period for Duane Weber was 1944 to 1949 - the people I have spoke to seem to think he was with the Forestry division and that the CPS's also had groups of wayward young men and those this trying to get their bearings in life involved.

Some of the CCC camps where used for this purpose after the disbandment of the CCC's - like a reform school - taking young men who seemed to stay in trouble and give them guidance and direction and to teach them a trade. I knew Duane had pointed out a log cabin on the Washougal - mention he had worked on it. Jerry said this cabin didn't exist, but one of the men who took these young men in - was a contractor and he did lots of log cabins in that area and other areas.

Since I had so much ground to cover - I didn't go up on the Washougal to see if that Cabin was still there - nor did I make it to the Coffin or Coffee Road and the old Cemetary on that road. I had other priorities after I found the "hill" Jerry claimed didn't exist...and that there was a golf course and some fancy homes there now...not so that hill is still there and has a signal tower on it now. The power lines still run thru at that point and how I found it. ASK Bruce!

I don't know what Jerry considers a fancy home, but those homes were not as nice as some in my own neighborhood...and I do not live in a ritzy neighborhood. There is a considerable cost difference between Florida and WA. I viewed some of the Real Estate books out there and was flabbergasted at the prices. A home like mine is around 400K plus in WA. but that same home in this area would go for about 179K...if I could even get that in this market. The repo next door goes to auction next wk. and that will absolutely kill the sales in our small neighborhood.

I took a break and didn't work on Cooper today.

By the way Georger, I tried to open that RAILROAD site and was unable to do so.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

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Hi, I have been reading the posts on this forum and find everything to be very interesting.

Since 2006, I have felt my father, Melvin Luther Wilson, could also be a viable D. B. Cooper suspect. I do not have years of background on my father, but feel he is a physical match to the original descriptions of the witnesses on the night of the hi-jacking.

A little background.....My father was born in September 1927 in the San Francisco/Oakland area. He joined the Navy at the age of 14 and then discharged when they found out his age. He spent time in California prisons before and during his first marriage. Our family was profiled on an Unsolved Mysteries video that aired on March 27, 1997. It was taped two days prior to Thanksgiving in Hawaii in 1996.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpE1oyHWpG0

In 2006, the St. Paul Newspaper, Pioneer Press, ran a story on the hi-jacking and D. B. Cooper. At that time, my coworker asked if I had seen the paper. It was laying on my desk. I looked at the sketch and simultaneously, she asked me "did you ever think D.B Cooper could be your dad"? as I thought "that sketch looks like my dad". I never really gave it much thought prior to that day. Honestly I never really knew much of D.B. Cooper before that day.

Our father left our family in 1971, a few months prior to the hi-jacking. He was on bail for counterfeiting charges out of the Central Branch of the Wisconsin U.S. Marshal's office. He has not been heard from since.

A few items from the video.

He matches the physical description
- 6' 180 lbs
- dark hair parted on the left
- olive complexion
smoked and drank. ( I cannot tell you what brands or type of alcohol as I was 7 when he left, but I do remember my Mom saving the stamps from his cigarette packs)
- He wore sunglasses, but never prescription glasses. My Mom said it was because he was vain)
- He spent 5 years in the Midwest before he left us.
- He wore suits, ties and loafers.
- The counterfeit money thrown over the bridge totaled $200,000.00.
- Earlier I read statements from the FBI site, that the man known as D. B. Cooper was a desperate man, with no family that may have missed him. At this point my father was already gone and not coming home.

He has never been heard from since (to the best of our knowledge)

Look real close at the still pictures we submitted to the Unsolved Mysteries show and compare them to the sketch.

Vicki


Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Hello Vicki,

Welcome to the national reading comprehension forum and DB Cooper chat line.

The video you posted is here:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hpE1oyHWpG0

This makes it easier for the less ambitious to click and avoid the arduous copy and paste function which is so taxing on the index finger.

Below are some times I noticed the pictures of your father featured in the video:

1:05 to 1:13
1:34 to 1:37
1:43 to 2:00
4:21 to 4:40
5:24 to 5:44
You (Vicki) 5:48 to 5:57 (very brave)
6:01 to 6:10 (your dad again)
7:57 to 8:04
8:11 to 8:30
9:21 to end of video.

Thanks for your comment, interesting segment on Unsolved Mysteries.

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My Mom is very private and I only know what I remember from the age of 7.

He was an avid scuba diver, he made friends easily, and he worked at Mayflower Moving and Storage.

I was speaking to a friend the other day about his "new toy" a remote controlled hobby truck with gas engine. I remembered my Dad had those remote controlled airplanes he would fly when we were young. He seemed a little obsessed with them. :)

My Mom told me that Mel was not a violent person, but insisted she keep a lead pipe in our car for protection purposes. He did not like having his picture taken.

I do not have more pictures available to me. What I had was sent to UM for the show, other pictures were given by his first wife.
Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Hi Vicki,

Very interesting story. Thanks for sharing this. I can guarantee that many are looking at the video trying to see if he's wearing a pearl tie clasp in any of the pictures :)
Just curious....do you know if the FBI is aware of your suspicions, and if so, what was their response? Sure sounds like someone that would warrant a thorough background check at the very least.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

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I am not sure if the FBI will acknowledge if they have any received information about Melvin. It was in the hands of the U.S. Marshal until 2001. Shortly later was dropped after September 11th and is no longer an active case.

I sent the Unsolved Mystery video to FBIdotGov's YouTube account last week along with this video I found on YouTube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mWzgoVQLG7k

It is about a pet skunk with an animal cam. The skunk went into a tree trunk and there are pictures of bundled $20's. One of the comments on the video says it looks like it is at Horsetail Creek, which is East of Portland on the Columbia River. (I saw a post on this thread that the money was possible in a stump)

I look occasionally on the web for tidbits on D.B. Cooper and also watch the FaceBook D.B. Cooper fan page. I was told by Bob Knoss that I am another wannabe. ;)

Vicki

Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Vicki, It is very unlikely that your father is/was D. B. Cooper. Cooper had knowledge of some very closely held information on the Boeing 727 airliner and he almost certainly would not have had access to that information with a long standing prison record. The same goes for Duane Weber.

And unless the FBI is kicking your door in, there is no reason for throwing any money in the river or burying it somewhere.

Robert Nicholson

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No reason for the FBI to kick our door in. That happened back in the Spring of 1971 by the U.S. Marshal's.

We have not heard or seen Melvin since he skipped bail. We used to get the yearly phone calls from U.S. Marshal's agents every year with the last call November of 2001 to tell us the case is closed.

I don't think he is alive. Just a coincidence that he fits the description and hasn't been heard from since 1971. On the FBI page, Agent Carr was calling out for information such as this. That being said, I thought I would throw it out there. There was such a time lapse between information our families have of him, I am not sure what training or jobs he had. Remember, I WAS SEVEN and have a Mom that keeps her history with him very private.

If the money is in a tree stump by Portland. Could a storm have taken a $5880.00 of the money down the river and deposited it at Tena Bar?

Just a thought.
Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

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Looks like Vicki’s list is actually very compelling AND longer than most. I think it is only fair to say that Melvin Wilson is a ‘long list’ suspect now.

1. Age mid forties (time of the crime)
2. Out on bail (Sept 1971) on Federal charges
3. Counterfeiter of over $200,000 (affinity)
4. Vanished and has not been seen since 1971 (this is a new one)
5. Last resided near the HQ town of Northwest Orient
6. Known smoker and drinker (unknown cigarette brand and alcohol type)
7. Height and weight are correct
8. Did not need a toupee
9. Olive complexion (did not need a winter tan)
10. Familiar with Federal law enforcement and definitely had a grudge
11. Unknown whereabouts as the US Marshals Office was after him
12. Knew how to change identity and blend into new surroundings
13. Known to abandon money or at least counterfeit money into navigable waterways and have it discovered
14. On the run and likely had no vehicle
15. On the run and did not have a permanent residence
16. Photo in video shows him wearing sunglasses similar to the pair described on Cooper
17. Was able to successfully pass counterfeit money making passing ransom money child’s play
18. Was known to be in possession of large sums of cash, albeit counterfeit
19. Was in the military
20. Described as polite (by his wife!)
21. Comfortable working complex larcenies alone

That is an impressive list to be sure. The running from the Feds in September, 71 and the familiarity with hundreds of thousands of dollars is an amazing coincidence.

I have no idea if Melvin Wilson was Cooper, but found the exercise of scribing the similarities enlightening. At least there may be some more perspective about others, but I doubt it.

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Vicki, If your father was born in September 1927, he would be 83 years old now if still alive and you indicate that he disappeared in 1971.

I don't know how the police process people who die without any known relatives, whether naturally or otherwise. But the fact that the California authorities, as well as the US Marshalls, have processed your father through their system means that they have his fingerprints on file. So there is a possibility that his fingerprints would be sent to some state or federal police agency for their information and assistance.

Consequently, depending on how far back the various police agencies went in their records when the new automated fingerprint files were established, there is a possibility that your father is still alive and has stayed out of trouble. Presumably, the US Marshalls would have the capability to search every automated file in the USA.

If you want to pull out all the stops on finding your father, I would suggest that you get back in touch with the US Marshalls and ask that they do a new fingerprint search using all the new data bases that have come online since November 2001.

People who have been sought by law enforcement agencies for more than 50 years have been found using these new data bases. If you do find him, and he has stayed out of trouble since disappearing in 1971, then after the initial adverse publicity it may be possible to get his legal problems resolved fairly simply.

The decision on what to do about this is yours and you should consider all the possibilities, including the one that he might be found. Again, how you proceed on this is your personal decision and you should consider all possible outcomes.

Good luck.

Robert Nicholson

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No reflection on Vicki but I think the skunk video is fake. It would be dirt simple to retrace the skunks steps in the video and go right to the alleged money site.

Interesting that the turtle camera shown is a type now very widely used by skdivers to shoot freefall videos.

http://pointofviewcameras.com/gopro-hd-hero-960.html

It isn't especially well suited for small animal POV video because of it's large size compared to pen cams.

Not sure what the skunk cam was or if there even was one.

377
2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

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