DB Cooper

[skyjack71 0]

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This has to stop Guru. but not before I say one more thing.

Maized and Cornfused, You know the Led Zeppelin song, right?

377

377 it is a good thing that you were lost in the 'maize' and didn't get 'creamed'.

Leave it to VICKI to get the last word in. I read the response you made above - and I OUT Loud.

What a witty gal you are!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 244]

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I didn't compare it to today. However, in a way you can because this case is well known and lingering and people are still claiming Cooper as a relative. Where's the one's coming forward that actually went missing if Cooper died?
Certainly, a person can go missing from outside the juristiction and not be missed but I would bet that the great majority of people that do go missing ARE MISSED.
.

Mel Ward went missing. He was already a wanted
felon and has never been found.

In Mel's case he had a reason to go missing and
stay missing. I dont know what stats are for missing
in 1971 (however you define missing) but I'll bet it
is large. People 'missing' and not being sought for
one reason or another after WWII - is large. It
was common for men to lose their war brides and
babies to continue another life. Mothers didnt even
demand child support back in those days but turned
to families for support instead. The economic base
of families had not been totally destroyed yet in
1971, but was under attack especially in urban and
rural poor areas, again. The history of the US is a
history of one economic Depression after another
with millions of missing people,for one reason or
another. I think Cooper was an economic casualty ...
and already lost and missing, so whose to miss him?

So I really think this 'missing' talk is just that -
empty talk which tells us nothing. Im willing to bet
the FBi didnt spent one minute looking into missing
persons for Cooper, unless it was something specific
brought to their attention.

In 1971 there werent even records of all the 'missing'
just as there is no record of all of those killed in
WWI and WWII - just estimates.

Cooper may in fact have been one of the few
hijackers who was a genuine nonperson to begin
with, and that makes him almost impossible to
trace unless something very specific comes up.
You might trace migrant worker arrest reports for
CA 1950-71? The number of pretenders demanding
attention only complicates the problem. This case
has generated those, like flies!

[Orange1 0]

Georger, point taken about people wanting to go missing, but this is someone that the marshalls were actively looking for as well apparently.

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[georger 244]

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Georger, point taken about people wanting to go missing, but this is someone that the marshalls were actively looking for as well apparently.

Sorry, Iwas talking about the Cooper case. I didnt
know this thread had become the Mel thread - will
butt out.

But before I do let me say this - so Blev can reject it
and 377 can make an independent discovery two
weeks from tonight.

'Big crimes are solved by little ones'. I heard that
once. Its my perception its often true, and when old
crimes go stale LE sometimes relies on this
principle, based on experience?

For example a serial murderer may turn up at a
traffic stop months or years later, or at a minor auto
accident, or in an arguement at the Quick Stop - in
some trivial context. Even in another State. Subject
gets processed and, viola. Or subject runs and .....
but the wanted person has to be wanted and be in
the system for it to happen, generally speaking.

That never happened in the Cooper case.

I wonder why? Because he was dead or because they
said he was dead and people stopped looking, or
something else?

Was Cooper ever posted as one of the Ten Most
Wanted so that real national attention from a
law enforcement perspective was focused on him?
I dont know. Maybe someone else does.

But, from a public perspective, I now see this case
as formally undecidable. The information is simply
not available to the public to do anything that
matters. It can only be one speculation after
another. Why anyone would do that for very long
is totally beyond me.

Good luck -

[georger 244]

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Georger, point taken about people wanting to go missing, but this is someone that the marshalls were actively looking for as well apparently.

To point out the obvious, going missing doesn't mean you went to Portland, Oregon on Thanksgiving weekend 1971 to hijack a plane. Tens of thousands of people go missing each year for any number or reasons. There has to be more here to consider this person a viable suspect.

Five-star review I posted up at Amazon on Gray's book:

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'Skyjack' does the best job yet of putting readers aboard Flight 305, Northwest Airlines, on November 24, 1971. Not only does Gray relate the known facts about the hijacking, but he also explores the personal angle. Things like stewardess Tina Mucklow kneeling in the aisle and lighting cigarettes for both she and the hijacker, or her effort to drag the money bag and four parachutes into the plane while the rain is pouring on the tarmac. Gray puts you into these scenes with his concise writing, and this is what makes 'Hijack' the most entertaining book to date about D.B. Cooper.

Gray also delves into the famous 'Cooper Curse,' a psychological entry that should be recognized for what it is: A disorder caused by chasing the answers to the only unsolved hijacking in U.S. history. The 'Curse', as Gray shows, can bring bankruptcy, depression, and a destroyed life to those who cannot stop looking for the answers that elude them. Although he leans toward Kenny Christiansen as the hijacker, (he was the first to propose this in his now-famous New York Magazine article) Gray also says he still has doubts about Christiansen. He goes on to cover all of the major suspects very well.

'Skyjack' is an exploration of the crime, its aftermath, the people involved, and most of all - a personal testament of his journey along the way.

Highly recommended.

Uh thats what I just said.

Your review of Gray's book is shit.

From a nobody.

[Mr.Green 0]

I just found Skyjack on eBay and Amazon. Now all I need to do is sell $21.00 worth of shit so I can buy it.

[Mr.Green 0]

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I just found Skyjack on eBay and Amazon. Now all I need to do is sell $21.00 worth of shit so I can buy it.

Maybe I should read Blast first. It's going for $7:81

[EVickiW 0]

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To point out the obvious, going missing doesn't mean you went to Portland, Oregon on Thanksgiving weekend 1971 to hijack a plane. Tens of thousands of people go missing each year for any number or reasons. There has to be more here to consider this person a viable suspect.

It was said to me recently that if something was said or pointed out on a previous page of this forum it didn't happen, was never asked, and/or it was forgotten (either on accident or on purpose).

That being said, I am not going to reiterate anything more that has already been said in past posts about my father's disappearance. Blevins has his beliefs about Kenny. Jo has her beliefs about Duane. Others here have there 'facts' also.

I, as well as a few others, have always been open to everyone's comments and suggestions about their theories. However, I just experienced a time warp. I am staring at this computer screen and the comments have full circled back to square one, I have to believe this thread is nothing more than a conversation in the lunch room at the Alzheimer's Memory Care center and half of the members here are the patients. Lunch is over and you do not even remember what you ate.

It is obvious who the doctor's and the visitors are in this 'room'. Take the metaphor anyway you want.........I have complete faith this, in addition to all previous posts, will be forgotten once the page turns to 1044.

Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

[377 22]

Vicki,

If your father were alive after Norjack occurred is it your opinion that he would have let his family know, even if he had to stay on the run and never see them again? What I am asking is does his disappearance mean death to you or could he have lived and had no further contact with his family? I know it calls for speculation, but the answer depends on an assessment of his character and family knows it best.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[EVickiW 0]

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Vicki,

If your father were alive after Norjack occurred is it your opinion that he would have let his family know, even if he had to stay on the run and never see them again? What I am asking is does his disappearance mean death to you or could he have lived and had no further contact with his family? I know it calls for speculation, but the answer depends on an assessment of his character and family knows it best.

377

I was seven....I do not remember other than picking bits and pieces from family conversations.

When I spoke to his first wife a few months ago, she said never heard from him again, until she received divorce papers in the mail from an attorney in Las Vegas in 1963. Mel's mother died in 1994 and he never attempted to see her after he left his first family in 1956. She stayed close to her grandchildren, unfortunately she never knew about this of her family.

I assume (believe) since he is wanted by the US Marshal's, was on their Wisconsin's top ten wanted list until 2001 and the show Unsolved Mysteries brought no credible leads, that he is DEAD.

I also believe he would have been diagnosed with Anti-Social Personality Disorder with a emphasis on Psychopathy. As we all know (or don't care) having this disorder gives a person certain traits that are ingrained in their personality.

Hares PLC-R checklist can be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hare_Psychopathy_Checklist

Edited to add another good insight:
http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopath.htm

Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

[Farflung 0]

There certainly has been a wealth of information on how Dan Cooper got his name and written with such authority. Although no one appeared to know the handles selected by the copy-cat Coopers, I’m sure it was modesty which drove the silence and not a lack of information (cough..yeah right..cough…cough).

Here’s a list of players and their ‘nom de hi- jacques’ used during their skydiving dalliances.

????? - Dan Cooper (source: Wildly popular French language comic book)

Charles LaPoint - John Shane (unknown anxiously awaiting resolution)

Richard McCoy - James Johnson (unknown resolution pending DBC thread comment)

Martin McNally – Robert Wilson (unknown answer lurking in moist recess)

Robb Heady – Wore a pillow case with eyeholes (Halloween or Klan inspired with possible Elephant Man fetish)

With these ‘known facts’ (I love this phrase, it makes me feel smart) dumped into the laps of expert investigators I know the theories will flow freely on the source and selection criteria of these names. Please limit your attributions to no more than ten, that will make things go much quicker. It does take a while to read through all the well sourced data points in order to follow a linear logic path to the truth.

Take remove your time and share divvy all your ‘known facts’ in public openness about how the phony name aliases were picked chosen by the illegal criminals for use on an airborne flying jet that was in the air up in the sky.

[377 22]

I see a pattern Farflung. Should I notify TSA?

Charles LaPoint
Richard McCoy
Martin McNally

Robb Heady (a nut case, toss him out of the sample).

All these Mc's and an La. Anyone with a two letter prefix on their last name should be on a do not fly list. The stats clearly support this.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[377 22]

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Vicki,

If your father were alive after Norjack occurred is it your opinion that he would have let his family know, even if he had to stay on the run and never see them again? What I am asking is does his disappearance mean death to you or could he have lived and had no further contact with his family? I know it calls for speculation, but the answer depends on an assessment of his character and family knows it best.

377

I was seven....I do not remember other than picking bits and pieces from family conversations.

When I spoke to his first wife a few months ago, she said never heard from him again, until she received divorce papers in the mail from an attorney in Las Vegas in 1963. Mel's mother died in 1994 and he never attempted to see her after he left his first family in 1956. She stayed close to her grandchildren, unfortunately she never knew about this of her family.

I assume (believe) since he is wanted by the US Marshal's, was on their Wisconsin's top ten wanted list until 2001 and the show Unsolved Mysteries brought no credible leads, that he is DEAD.

I also believe he would have been diagnosed with Anti-Social Personality Disorder with a emphasis on Psychopathy. As we all know (or don't care) having this disorder gives a person certain traits that are ingrained in their personality.

Hares PLC-R checklist can be found here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hare_Psychopathy_Checklist

Edited to add another good insight:
http://www.cassiopaea.com/cassiopaea/psychopath.htm

Yikes Vicki. These diagnostic matrices are scary.

How did you turn out?

I probably qualify for SSI mental disability. Maybe I can stop working, get benefits and just jump and fish all the time. Hmmm...

Can you post some that will make me look more normal?

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[Farflung 0]

Vicki observes and sparks some memories:

“It was said to me recently that if something was said or pointed out on a previous page of this forum it didn't happen, was never asked, and/or it was forgotten.”

“.........I have complete faith this, in addition to all previous posts, will be forgotten once the page turns to 1044.”

There has been an evolution of sorts in the field of written communications. Remember those ‘Magic Slates’ which featured a sheet of opaque plastic which lay on a black rubber mat? It came with a plastic stylus and you could write and doodle then pull the sheet up and start over with a clean slate.

The next entry was the ‘Etch A Sketch’ which raised the bar with a pair of control knobs and some sort of unidentified silvery powder which may have been a mild carcinogen. Heck this was the 60’s and what does not mutate you makes you stronger.

Technology continued to march on with the addition of electricity in a product called the ‘Bizzy Buzz Buzz’. This was a battery operated pen with a spinning point that would serve as a training ground for tattoo artists while offering a glimpse into the penmanship one can expect with Parkinson’s disease. Unlike the Magic Slate and the Etch A Sketch the Bizzy Buzz Buzz could use virtually any surface as a media for writing or drawing. I know that I learned about consequences after using the Bizzy Buzz Buzz to enhance the living room wall. I can’t imagine how my father managed to cope through all this.

The ‘Lite Brite’ would inspire future dot matrix printer programmers with a light cabinet where one could push colored plastic pegs through a piece of black paper while only slightly increasing the risk of starting a fire.

As you can see all these forms of communicating have the ability to be reset or forgotten quickly and easily. Except for the Bizzy Buzz Buzz which required a gallon of Dutch Boy and several Tallboys to erase according to my father’s retelling every Thanksgiving for life. Yet murderers get paroled.

So I feel the entire state of technology has gone full circle with the thread pages acting like lifting the sheet on the ‘Magic Slate’. For as much as technology has advanced the creatures behind it are still pretty much the same and…. I forgot what my point was now.

[EVickiW 0]

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Yikes Vicki. These diagnostic matrices are scary.

How did you turn out?

Shhhhhhhhh. You will scare Farflung away!

Fortunately we are now on page 1044, soooooo......... no-one will remember anyway!

Huh.....what?

Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

[BruceSmith 3]

Greetings everyone,

The Seattle FBI PIO, who started the world-wide flap over LD Cooper with her comment that he is the Bureau's "most promising" lead, is back from vacation.

I interviewed her yesterday, and you can read the report on the Mountain News:

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/08/18/db-cooper-report-interview-with-ayn-dietrich-seattle-fbi-spokesperson/

[Guru312 0]

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With that article I'd say you are doing better.

With that comment I'd say you are a pompous ass.

Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

[georger 244]

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With that article I'd say you are doing better.

With that comment I'd say you are a pompous ass.

[georger 244]

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Greetings everyone,

The Seattle FBI PIO, who started the world-wide flap over LD Cooper with her comment that he is the Bureau's "most promising" lead, is back from vacation.

I interviewed her yesterday, and you can read the report on the Mountain News:

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/08/18/db-cooper-report-interview-with-ayn-dietrich-seattle-fbi-spokesperson/

Nice article. Thanks for posting.

[BruceSmith 3]

Thanks to Guru 312, here is a clickable link to the Ayn Sandalo Dietrich interview on the Mountain News:

http://themountainnewswa.net/...le-fbi-spokesperson/


Hmmmm... it's not clicking. Ahem, Guru, could you help us out, a bit? Thanks.

2nd try, where I cut and paste the whole thing:

Copy and paste the following into another post and you'll have a clickable link:

http://themountainnewswa.net/...le-fbi-spokesperson/


Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

******************

Drats!

oh, well.

[CooperScooper 0]

"It is far more likely that instead of a car parked in the woods, there was an accomplice waiting at a spot both of them knew about. If he worked alone, he would probably park any vehicle not in the woods, but in a safe area near the freeway or in any civilized area. "


As the classic "In Search Of" TV show reported in the mid to late 70's, there were reports, within days/weeks of the skyjacking, of a low flying plane going back and forth in the same general area where Cooper was thought to have jumped. Perhaps, in an irony, Cooper WAS FLOWN out of the forest. The low flying plane that residents reported could have been doing "dry runs" for the coming skyjacking

Many think that Cooper had help. It's certainly possible.
The theory that the recent D.B. Cooper-related episode of the TV show "Decoded" put forth, was pretty plausible to me, also.

http://www.nokilladvocacycenter.org/nokillequation.html,
http://www.nathanwinograd.com,
http://www.rescue50.org/capa.htm

[skyjack71 0]

I agree - Your article sounded very profession - it was news worthy.

I have learned to hate the types of articles you did on Tina and her family. I avoid those kind like the plague.

At least you are redeeming yourself to the thread. Perhaps you might be able to redeem yourself to Tina and her family in time.

Too late to do anything about the pictures you posted and note I also did NOT go to your site to view the photo's of Tina.

This is how strong I feel about that kind or reporting. Of course it is my personal opinion - others might "DIG" it . IF an article reflects the actions of the writer and those actions are aggressive and offensive.....I choose to pass on it.

This same feeling extends to the court room. It is time to outlaw cameras and the public from a courtroom. A controversial example is the Anthony Casey trial - quilty or innocent - she will never have a future. Her life is over. She was tried infront of the cameras and in front of the world. The jury could not convict, but she has been judged by the media - her life is over.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

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"It is far more likely that instead of a car parked in the woods, there was an accomplice waiting at a spot both of them knew about. If he worked alone, he would probably park any vehicle not in the woods, but in a safe area near the freeway or in any civilized area. "
.

Kootenai County, Idaho.

I expect if you have read back in the postings and I strongly suggest you do so. You will find out I have repeatedly talked about a woman who lived in OR and her nephew. I begged the FBI to check them out yrs and yrs ago. I found in 2010 who they were and that they did exist...I also found a connection between these indivdual and the airstrip you are referring to. The FBI has NEVER responded to this.

I told the FBI the same story for 15 yrs - only my trip to WA in 2010 put names to the individuals. I repeatedly requested from the FBI the names of the company and individuals flying out of that area.
I also requested repeatedly the name and business involved regarding a car left in Portland near the airport at a storage area. Why? Because Duane talked about these and showed them to me.

In 1979 when Duane and went to WA and OR, I expect little had been published in the South about these things accessible to Duane Weber. How did he know the area and how did he know WHERE these places where?

Someone recently said the discovery of a small unrelated crime often can lead to solving a much larger crime.

I have begged for yrs for the FBI to look closer at Duane Weber's background - I have said the secret lies in Coeur d'alene, ID and along the state line. Recently someone contacted me with information that may be trivial, but this information did cause me to revisit that day in the fall of !979 when Duane Weber told me about Coeur d'alene. After Duane told me about the area in 1st person which was very rare for him, he stated he could NEVER go back there and when I asked why - he just vaguely repeated it and changed the subject which with me was NOT hard to do.

What he told me about the area:
He told me about Missoula and then an Indian reservation near Coeur d'alene. It was during this time he mentioned Bitter Creek (I think that was what it was called - he also told me about other places in the same area of Idaho).

The Indian reservation and about his knowing a young man there about his age - that stuck with me. He talked about a family there and children. He told me he could never go back there. It seemed to make him sad.

Because I knew he had a daughter born during the mid 40's - I invisioned a young man getting a girl pregnant and that was why he couldn't go back, but now I realize if must have been something very very serious. As some of you will recall Duane's daughter was named Zona and why I might have thought that.

I have never been able to get out of my head "why he could NEVER go back there". IT still bugs me to this day - and I really can't afford to go back again. I tried to find a PI to do this for me, but I couldn't afford him. How would he know what he was looking for? I didn't know what I was looking for?

Since my trip in Oct of 2010 - I have a been driven, but neither my health nor my finances will allow me to venture further -I have begged the FBI...but they never acknowledge me.

Kootenai County, Idaho.

All of the places Duane told me about:

Cascade Locks, Camino - All under the US Forest Service.
Ft. Collins under the US Soil Conservation Servie.
LaPine OR under the US Bureau of Reclamation.
Cave Junction, Moose Creek and McCall - under Forestry Service out of Portland.

Even Sluggo harped on me about this - he sent me some information I have not been able to uncover in all of the 'crap" because now that is what it is. My eyes nor health nor my time left on this earth will endure my looking back at all of those 1000's and 1000's of pages.

Is there NOT someone who read this thread who could do some Court House research for me in Kootenai county and in Coeur'd Alene, Hayden and perhaps Spokane?

Corps of Engineers is still there.
U.S. Army Corps is still there

For some reason I wrote Pappy Boyinton on this page - I don't remember why.

Can anyone tell me how to find the names of people living in that area in 1945 - 1949 and also perhaps in 1959 and 1962- 1964. Regarding the Incian population there - did they count in the 1930 Census and do they get SS or some other form of compensation...especially those born prior to 1930. I have NO idea how any of this works - can anyone help me?

Was there in the late 40's an incident on the Kootenai Reservation. I don't remember if the reservation was Kootenai or not. Duane told me about other Indian Reservations - one in Oregon...it was a place he worked.

Kootenai County, Idaho.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[EVickiW 0]

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Thanks to Guru 312, here is a clickable link to the Ayn Sandalo Dietrich interview on the Mountain News:

http://themountainnewswa.net/...le-fbi-spokesperson/


Hmmmm... it's not clicking. Ahem, Guru, could you help us out, a bit? Thanks.

2nd try, where I cut and paste the whole thing:

Copy and paste the following into another post and you'll have a clickable link:

http://themountainnewswa.net/...le-fbi-spokesperson/


Guru312

I am not DB Cooper

******************

Drats!

oh, well.

Hey......Here ya go! Not one, but two clicky's!

Melvin Luther Wilson - Missing Person since September 1971:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=03QLnFvk8Fs

[Farflung 0]

Mr Trouble never hangs around…..

http://themountainnewswa.net/2011/08/18/db-cooper-report-interview-with-ayn-dietrich-seattle-fbi-spokesperson/

Anytime a URL won’t clicky or technology decides to act like HAL 9000 you know who to call…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pR17x04T8lU

You’re welcome.