DB Cooper

[Hominid 0]

Jo,

Don't blame me on Georger. He didn't bring me to the thread. Pay attention.

[377 22]

In March 2012 issue of AIRWAYS magazine, an aviation publication. Good writeup on the symposium. Has a nicely done sub article on Donna and her Ariel Store DB Cooper party.

It's copyrighted and currently on sale so I can't post it here.

It's well written and entertaining. Has a great photo of Marla next to the winner of the tavern's DB Cooper look alike contest. Nice photo of Donna too.

http://www.airwaysmag.com/

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[skyjack71 0]

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Jo,

Don't blame me on Georger. He didn't bring me to the thread. Pay attention.

I MISSED it! How did someone with your knowledge end up on this crazy thread? Guess I wasn't paying attention. Sorry!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[BobKnoss 0]

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BK, Could you restate the above in some manner so that people can understand what in the hell you are talking about?

OK. If my object was to fly an airplane on a special path, but make the record read differently, how could I do it? The method would have to be hidden in plain (plane (;#)) sight.

Could I claim a really non-existent West to East wind that I had to compensate for by faking a crab and actually flying West? Then, with the wind supposedly blowing me back East, my fake flight record would show me 15 miles East of my now covert real flight path over the pipeline where I want to be. (Winds blow differently at different altitudes as I understand it, like the jet stream which pilots often use to their advantage. Not a wind expert.) When they search for the jumper they will be looking in the wrong place and he can escape easily. Hence, the big to-do thing to silence Janet. Plug the leak!!

How's that? Don't want to lose this point, as it is extremely critical to how things were done, and it exposes involvement by others. (By definition that makes a conspiracy) That alarm term alone makes the story a, "Don't Touch This One, Story!"

Now Mr. Blevins will probably scream idiot at me again, as we are getting down to basic building blocks of the real story. You'd think he would grab hold of this enlightening information and tie it to KC somehow. He knows I'm for real and he's supposed to to silence me, rather than help seek out information. THAT is a FACT and he proves it himself, day after day. Nothing personal. I understand. It's business.

[Robert99 50]

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BK, Could you restate the above in some manner so that people can understand what in the hell you are talking about?

OK. If my object was to fly an airplane on a special path, but make the record read differently, how could I do it? The method would have to be hidden in plain (plane (;#)) sight.

Could I claim a really non-existent West to East wind that I had to compensate for by faking a crab and actually flying West? Then, with the wind supposedly blowing me back East, my fake flight record would show me 15 miles East of my now covert real flight path over the pipeline where I want to be. (Winds blow differently at different altitudes as I understand it, like the jet stream which pilots often use to their advantage. Not a wind expert.) When they search for the jumper they will be looking in the wrong place and he can escape easily. Hence, the big to-do thing to silence Janet. Plug the leak!!

How's that? Don't want to lose this point, as it is extremely critical to how things were done, and it exposes involvement by others. (By definition that makes a conspiracy) That alarm term alone makes the story a, "Don't Touch This One, Story!"

Now Mr. Blevins will probably scream idiot at me again, as we are getting down to basic building blocks of the real story. You'd think he would grab hold of this enlightening information and tie it to KC somehow. He knows I'm for real and he's supposed to to silence me, rather than help seek out information. THAT is a FACT and he proves it himself, day after day. Nothing personal. I understand. It's business.

BK, Just take the rest of the day off and get plenty of sleep tonight. Maybe the world will look differently tomorrow.

[matthewcline 0]

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BK, Could you restate the above in some manner so that people can understand what in the hell you are talking about?

OK. If my object was to fly an airplane on a special path, but make the record read differently, how could I do it? The method would have to be hidden in plain (plane (;#)) sight.

Could I claim a really non-existent West to East wind that I had to compensate for by faking a crab and actually flying West?Sure, but it would not hold up to Pi-Reps. Then, with the wind supposedly blowing me back East, my fake flight record would show me 15 miles East of my now covert real flight path over the pipeline where I want to be. If you could get ALL the Radars that cover that area and all the receivers to read "improperly" (Winds blow differently at different altitudes as I understand it, like the jet stream which pilots often use to their advantage. Not a wind expert.) When they search for the jumper they will be looking in the wrong place and he can escape easily. Hence, the big to-do thing to silence Janet. Plug the leak!!

How's that? Don't want to lose this point, as it is extremely critical to how things were done, and it exposes involvement by others. (By definition that makes a conspiracy) That alarm term alone makes the story a, "Don't Touch This One, Story!"

Now Mr. Blevins will probably scream idiot at me again, as we are getting down to basic building blocks of the real story. You'd think he would grab hold of this enlightening information and tie it to KC somehow. He knows I'm for real and he's supposed to to silence me, rather than help seek out information. THAT is a FACT and he proves it himself, day after day. Nothing personal. I understand. It's business.

Will he scream idiot? no, he hasn't yet I believe.
But will he ask for actual proof instead of your hearsay? Yes, we all do.

It is nice to see progress, since your personal involvement has been debunked and you have let that go. So now we can get some proof from you on your "facts".

And FB has a link to this thread now so they can see who is actually harassing who.

Matt

TLSWASU,DFFI.

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[Orange1 0]

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Dumb question here (for once):

Dumb question is always far better than ludicrous unsubstantiated statement. Good direction, keep it up!

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[matthewcline 0]

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Dumb question here (for once):

Dumb question is always far better than ludicrous unsubstantiated statement. Good direction, keep it up!

+1

Bravo.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[Amazon 7]

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Dumb question here (for once):

Dumb question is always far better than ludicrous unsubstantiated statement. Good direction, keep it up!

[BobKnoss 0]

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It is nice to see progress, since your personal involvement has been debunked and you have let that go. So now we can get some proof from you on your "facts".
.

DEBUNKED???? Not on your life! My information is factual, true and what really happened. You don't HAVE to accept it, but I WILL present it. It will make a few people really mad because THEY want to control history with fairy tales instead of the underhanded way our Government used to operate under past leadership, and maybe continues today. The Cooper Crew is not the controlling force of public opinion, they only ATTEMPT to sway opinion and cover up facts. There are still a few stalwart believers in Apple Pie. People see right through it. Read other forums, you guys are ridiculed for your biases. I don't care because I know better. When you're right, you're right. I'm right, so whine away.

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[BobKnoss 0]

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Sure, but it would not hold up to Pi-Reps. If you could get ALL the Radars that cover that area and all the receivers to read "improperly"
Matt

You see why he was worried that someone would cry "Wolf" that the flight path and the reported flight path were not the same?? And we are discussing that here. It didn't just happen by mistake, it happened as an intended cover story that he though would fold up. Ralph sent him home. There is a reason why facts don't match up. Facts were altered for a purpose. Compare the facts, verify the truth and ask why the falsifications? What's the source? What's the purpose? This is the crux of the story on how things transpired. I'm not making anything up. The facts are what you guys are talking about. Just analyze the summary of what you are finding. I know it fits together as I suggest because THAT's what happened and it can be reconstructed. You just can't be so damned negative. Try it, you'll not like it.

[mrshutter45 21]

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BK, Could you restate the above in some manner so that people can understand what in the hell you are talking about?

OK. If my object was to fly an airplane on a special path, but make the record read differently, how could I do it? The method would have to be hidden in plain (plane (;#)) sight.

Could I claim a really non-existent West to East wind that I had to compensate for by faking a crab and actually flying West?Sure, but it would not hold up to Pi-Reps. Then, with the wind supposedly blowing me back East, my fake flight record would show me 15 miles East of my now covert real flight path over the pipeline where I want to be. If you could get ALL the Radars that cover that area and all the receivers to read "improperly" (Winds blow differently at different altitudes as I understand it, like the jet stream which pilots often use to their advantage. Not a wind expert.) When they search for the jumper they will be looking in the wrong place and he can escape easily. Hence, the big to-do thing to silence Janet. Plug the leak!!

How's that? Don't want to lose this point, as it is extremely critical to how things were done, and it exposes involvement by others. (By definition that makes a conspiracy) That alarm term alone makes the story a, "Don't Touch This One, Story!"

Now Mr. Blevins will probably scream idiot at me again, as we are getting down to basic building blocks of the real story. You'd think he would grab hold of this enlightening information and tie it to KC somehow. He knows I'm for real and he's supposed to to silence me, rather than help seek out information. THAT is a FACT and he proves it himself, day after day. Nothing personal. I understand. It's business.

Will he scream idiot? no, he hasn't yet I believe.
But will he ask for actual proof instead of your hearsay? Yes, we all do.

It is nice to see progress, since your personal involvement has been debunked and you have let that go. So now we can get some proof from you on your "facts".

And FB has a link to this thread now so they can see who is actually harassing who.

Matt

TLSWASU,DFFI.

If this was a Government cover up, why not just catch him the next day and be done with it? why leave all of these problems of who he was?
seems to me that the Government would of had a simple plan put into place, bad guy takes over plane, bad guy gets caught the next day? end of story!
airline safety is no longer a problem? (1971)

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 247]

If this was a Government cover up, why not just catch him the next day and be done with it? why leave all of these problems of who he was?

Well now you have touched on Knoss's hidden
premise: "Governments are stupid". Never mind
that governments are people, like members of your
own family! Joe, Ed, Mike, Mary . . . with kids of
their own and a mortgage to pay off.

Knoss has a Fox Valley grudge against somebody
for something, just as their favorite son Joe
McCarthy did. That is all there is to this made up
boiled fish. Yep ; life in the Valley is hard!

Plus it's cheap! All you need is a blank sheet
of paper held up for the public to see. It could be
anything ..... could even say nothing. Just make it
up as you go along and claim you are speaking for
Gawd, and love cheeses.

Bring on the boiled fish heads - and fish stories.

[skyjack71 0]

[JerryThomas 0]

You Kids are having to much fun. We all know that Duane wasn't Cooper ,Nor was Blevins candidate.Still no one can place the hijaker surviving the jump other than a simple fact money was found years latter. That could only prove he died after his jump. Nothing would seperate a thief from his money except death. This is true in this case. The money was not burried or discarded. This has been proven by the condition of the small amount of money found on Tina Bar and its condition,the Army corps of engineers determined that it washed down from the Washougal watershed. Still this fact is ignored by many.The main fact is all candidates have been illiminated by the FBI. Poor Marla and her claims was quickly discarded due to time frame issues and her constant changing story not to mention her name change. Bottom line Marla was simply trying to make money off her maiden name. She even changed her name back to Cooper in order to make money, She lied about what Curtis said , the Media quickly caught on to her scam. The same happened to many other's . The Case goes on into it's 41st year unsolved only because few peoplel will not actually get out in the area an search for a Parachute. Simple fact find the chute . It is worth over a Million dollars. So lets sponsor a large search in the area this summer prior to the symposim in Auburn Wa. Just maybe some one will hit the Cooper Lottery. Jerry

[georger 247]

The Case goes on into it's 41st year unsolved only because few peoplel will not actually get out in the area an search for a Parachute.

Simple fact find the chute . It is worth over a Million dollars.

Very few people would pay $1million for that chute.
Its not exactly a national treasure! $10-20 thousand
maybe, on a good day

Likewise hundreds (if not tens of hundreds) have
ground searched all the effected areas for any trace
of Cooper, in addition to the thousands (if not
tens of thousands) who have passed through the
areas affected for various reasons, in the last forty
years.

The last thing this case needs is more Ad Men,
in the Cooper Industrial Cult Complex.

[BobKnoss 0]

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I don't know. They were getting a lot of money for the Tena Bar bills. I think I heard a total of $48,000?

I think the parachute would fetch more money if it were sold in pieces. Or if you wanted to try and sell it whole, you could try it at an auction, and set a minimum bid and see if anyone bites.

However, I believe that if Cooper and Chute were still out there, they would have been found long ago. There are just so many thousands of people who hit the forests of Western Washington for all kinds of reasons. They are heavily used.

Not to flog a dead horse, but I'm still not completely satisfied with the Seattle FBI's explanation on the Amboy Chute.

The FBI claims they think it came from a pilot who bailed out in the area just after WW2, spent a cold winter night wrapped in it, and then walked out in the morning to rescue.

Fine. If that's true, and the pilot spent a miserable night, why would he bother to bury the chute in the morning so well it wouldn't be found for 62 years? Articles of the time, and more recent ones about Lt. Floyd Walling say he left it behind. But there is nothing about if he buried it. And if he buried it, where is the harness and container? They were not found. There is also the matter of the date stamp on the chute, which is AFTER Walling jumped. So unless you believe in time travel, this fact alone puts the lie to their whole explanation.

In addition, the FBI has admitted it is 'similar' to one that would be found in an NB6 container. But they haven't allowed anyone to examine it closely, except Earl Cossey. The Seattle FBI has also NOT done a comprehensive exam of the chute, that is, analysis by scientific means as well as a civilian parachute group. This would be helpful.

Do you see why I sometimes don't trust the Seattle FBI in this investigation? There is the chute question, and lately...the fact they went national with Marla Cooper as a 'viable witness' without any real evidence. It erodes my confidence in their ability to get to the truth.

Wonderful post. Robert. Does it tell you anything?????

That chute is so far under volcano rubble, water? and God knows what, that anyone's chances of finding it are less than one over Goo-goo-plex.

[sailshaw 0]

BobKoss: You are falling for the FBI story that DB did not survive. They say that as that gives them relief from having to solve the crime. Ralph H. especially spins that story as he wanted to put an end to the case before he retired. Jerry goes along with Ralph H. because they are great friends and Jerry believes anything Ralph says.

The real story is that DB did survive and has confused the FBI smart guys at each encounter. I believe he was at least ten years in the planning of the most perfect crime of how to "design the system to beat the system". That hint is in the third letter sent to the Portland news papers after the caper. That shows that he made it and survived and is healthy. The jump was so easy for him with his skills that I call it a cake walk. The jump took less than five minutes of his time to get safely to the ground. The big surprise to DB was when he actually got and had the money in his hands. He was said to get a little giddy when he received the money. He is getting old now and hopefully will release his book of how he did it before he passes on to skydiving heaven. He is the folk hero who has out smarted the FBI's smartest guys.

Bob

[georger 247]

He is the folk hero who has out smarted the FBI's smartest guys.

Bob

I am not allowed to say anything of substance here.
So, I have an edge and a ploy here too ... like all
the rest of you. That was the agreement I made
way back when . . .

That said however, tell us what Geoffrey Gray is
currently up to, and why?

Is Gray on his way to Tibet to rub elbows with the
llama in the red hat, and ringing bells and riding
donkies, and drinking goat blood? Evaluating a new
best suspect? Symposium in a Franco-Tibetan mud
hut ... just like the comic on page 54.

A big "eh" to my pals in Franco-Katmandoo.

Could it get any sillier? Well 'yes it can'!
Nam myo hoh ringe kyo... hmmm hmmmm.

[mrshutter45 21]

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BobKoss: You are falling for the FBI story that DB did not survive. They say that as that gives them relief from having to solve the crime. Ralph H. especially spins that story as he wanted to put an end to the case before he retired. Jerry goes along with Ralph H. because they are great friends and Jerry believes anything Ralph says.

The real story is that DB did survive and has confused the FBI smart guys at each encounter. I believe he was at least ten years in the planning of the most perfect crime of how to "design the system to beat the system". That hint is in the third letter sent to the Portland news papers after the caper. That shows that he made it and survived and is healthy. The jump was so easy for him with his skills that I call it a cake walk. The jump took less than five minutes of his time to get safely to the ground. The big surprise to DB was when he actually got and had the money in his hands. He was said to get a little giddy when he received the money. He is getting old now and hopefully will release his book of how he did it before he passes on to skydiving heaven. He is the folk hero who has out smarted the FBI's smartest guys.

Bob

I strongly disagree with planning this for ten years, he didn't know how to open the aft door, he didn't notice the reserve chute was a demonstration chute? I kind of think after 10 years of planning he would know the 727 from front to back and would have more experience with chutes! just to mention a few problems he had.

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 247]

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BobKoss: You are falling for the FBI story that DB did not survive. They say that as that gives them relief from having to solve the crime. Ralph H. especially spins that story as he wanted to put an end to the case before he retired. Jerry goes along with Ralph H. because they are great friends and Jerry believes anything Ralph says.

The real story is that DB did survive and has confused the FBI smart guys at each encounter. I believe he was at least ten years in the planning of the most perfect crime of how to "design the system to beat the system". That hint is in the third letter sent to the Portland news papers after the caper. That shows that he made it and survived and is healthy. The jump was so easy for him with his skills that I call it a cake walk. The jump took less than five minutes of his time to get safely to the ground. The big surprise to DB was when he actually got and had the money in his hands. He was said to get a little giddy when he received the money. He is getting old now and hopefully will release his book of how he did it before he passes on to skydiving heaven. He is the folk hero who has out smarted the FBI's smartest guys.

Bob

I strongly disagree with planning this for ten years, he didn't know how to open the aft door, he didn't notice the reserve chute was a demonstration chute? I kind of think after 10 years of planning he would know the 727 from front to back and would have more experience with chutes! just to mention a few problems he had.

The telling thing about Knoss is he misses so many
details someone in the position he claims would
know. Little details like the orders for the chutes!

Make something up about that now, Chia Knoss.

Something involving ships ...

Something involving trucking . . .

Something involving Joe McCarthy . . .

Something involving ant farms . . . !

[matthewcline 0]

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It is nice to see progress, since your personal involvement has been debunked and you have let that go. So now we can get some proof from you on your "facts".
.

DEBUNKED???? Not on your life! My information is factual, true and what really happened. You don't HAVE to accept it, but I WILL present it. It will make a few people really mad because THEY want to control history with fairy tales instead of the underhanded way our Government used to operate under past leadership, and maybe continues today. The Cooper Crew is not the controlling force of public opinion, they only ATTEMPT to sway opinion and cover up facts. There are still a few stalwart believers in Apple Pie. People see right through it. Read other forums, you guys are ridiculed for your biases. I don't care because I know better. When you're right, you're right. I'm right, so whine away.

No whining, just pointing out that your story has huge holes in it.

You claimed to be part of a program due to your superior memory, but that program didn't use folks for "memory", heroin addicts sure.

You claimed that the same program had no records, that they happened to all be destroyed, that is false, to continue to say other wise is a lie.

And you have no "proof"of any of your claims. Why? because none of them are true. You're just regurgitating info you read on the web, or an e-mail or here or any of the other numerous Cooper sites (several of which think you're an asshat for your conduct there).

At least the KC theory has some evidence. The Daune Weber theory? None.

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

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[BobKnoss 0]

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BobKoss: You are falling for the FBI story that DB did not survive. They say that as that gives them relief from having to solve the crime. Ralph H. especially spins that story as he wanted to put an end to the case before he retired. Jerry goes along with Ralph H. because they are great friends and Jerry believes anything Ralph says.

The real story is that DB did survive and has confused the FBI smart guys at each encounter. I believe he was at least ten years in the planning of the most perfect crime of how to "design the system to beat the system". That hint is in the third letter sent to the Portland news papers after the caper. That shows that he made it and survived and is healthy. The jump was so easy for him with his skills that I call it a cake walk. The jump took less than five minutes of his time to get safely to the ground. The big surprise to DB was when he actually got and had the money in his hands. He was said to get a little giddy when he received the money. He is getting old now and hopefully will release his book of how he did it before he passes on to skydiving heaven. He is the folk hero who has out smarted the FBI's smartest guys.

Bob

You have mis-understood my position. It was only about three years of planning and he died in 1995. His wife wanted to write a book, not "Cooper". You have the jest of the thing, though. Keep investigating.

[BobKnoss 0]

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Make something up about that now, Chia Knoss.

!

WHO THE HELL IS THAT???? Not me!! You confused.

Ask any question you want and I'll tell you what I know. There isn't enough bandwidth on here to cover everything. If I don't know, then Jerry can answer for me.

Something about wadded wire? Something about a college pin? Something about Kool-Aide? Something about JE Ray? Something about Dog Pile? It's all dust in the wind, my friend. Minutia. Unimportant. No proof left. Cleaners been there. They look at Maria? No way. Where is your sense of humor. That is DROP DEAD FUNNY!!! Take a nap, oldtimer.

[BobKnoss 0]

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At least the KC theory has some evidence. The Daune Weber theory? None.

Matt

Ha Ha! EVIDENCE?? KC has less proof than Maria! Farf likes her. We thank you for your opinion, however. You may be on to something important. I'm sure the FBI can't wait to hear your thoughts, too. Why don't you contact your local authorities and explain your evidence to them. They are there to help you with such matters.