DB Cooper

[Farflung 0]

RobertMBlevins says without reading any of the four previous comments:

“I pointed out to Gray (and on this forum, where I was ridiculed about it) that it was possible KC got those matches….”

And will no doubt be ridiculed more since you did not notice smokin99’s comments…. Twice.

“The Matchbook: Could have come from the Portland SkyChef, if one was there in 71.”

IF there was one in 1971???? How ever could we figure that out??? Another mystery like a left handed tie clasp!

About the tie clasp…… the comment was about it being ‘LEFT’ (THAT’S LEFT HANDED) and not who saw the thing.

[smokin99 0]

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Here’s a little supplement to your original post smokin99.

I hope you could see that I was being sarcastic with that comment about the ‘new’ clue. Any search in the news archives will answer that question and I found some matches on of all places - eBay which have Portland listed in the cover.

But there is NO explaining that left handed tie clasp. One more mystery to add with the statuary of Easter Island, the Pyramids of Giza and the Hanging Gardens of Babylon; but better than all that stuff.

Yeah I kinda figured there was a touch of the famous FF humor. Several posts later..while trying to fix my attachment...I crossed posted the ad showing the dinner special in 1971...where?? you guessed it.....that ol sky chef restaurant in none other than, yep, Portland Oregon. I'm just wondering if they had an all you can eat buffet.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[Farflung 0]

RobertMBlevins appears to be utterly confused about this neckwear accessory as he keeps calling it a tie tack. Strange since this silly trivia was once one of the top reasons Kenny was DB. Oh well, just claim it is a fluid case, like the direction the Columbia River flows and act like no one notices and just keep going.

Which living witness said there were Cooper comics on Shemya or that Scott talked to Cooper? Or have they all died so it’s OK now to be wrong? I dunno.

I’ve attached a graphic for the fashion challenged to better understand all that involves a tie. You’re welcome.

[georger 247]

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Ole Blevins reminisces again, stat:
To be fair,

BTW: There is no evidence, not a scrap, that the
hijacker came into Portland on another flight.
The FBI questioned a lot of people around that
airport, and by the time they did, they had a
description. No one saw the hijacker prior to his
buying the ticket to Seattle from the ticket agent
Williams. In addition, in the forty years since the
hijacking, not a single witness has ever come
forward and identified a passenger on ANOTHER
flight as possibly being Cooper.

“Are you sure?” I said.

“Oh, yes. He had one just like it.”

I could hardly believe my ears. No one had ever
linked the xxx before, and Dawn had just dropped
an ID on it as casually as anything.

The Matchbook: Could have come

SkyChef served the meals for multiple airlines, and
still does so today.

Without anyone in the airport being able to ID
Cooper, except maybe the ticket agent, the idea of
Cooper having lunch before he boarded is narrowed
a bit.

the FBI questioned employees at the restaurant. If
they did, they came up with nothing.

As I said, there are a lot of possibilities.

Well Marla said all of this too, and more!

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[smokin99 0]

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I know about the left-handed thing, and I did read 99's comments. Ken Christiansen was left-handed, but you probably knew that already. No worries. I know how it is at Dropzone. People here like to argue over silly points and ignore the testimony of actual, living witnesses.

They might be silly little things, but, when someone puts something out there - like a statement or picture that "appears" to give basis to correlation speculation - it should be addressed/corrected with sourced references.
In other words...The matchbook cover didn't list Portland so let's speculate that this might (just might) correlate with DB coming in on another flight. Well, alls good until one realizes that the matchbook cover is not an accurate representation of whether Portland had a Sky chef or not.

My point...even though it is speculation, it shouldn't be supported with inaccurate information. Hey..nothing against Geoff - I don't know him personally ...he seems like a pretty good guy -- but a little homework never hurt anyone.
Oops strike that last sentence. I hate homework almost as much as I hate housework.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[georger 247]

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RobertMBlevins says without reading any of the four previous comments:

“I pointed out to Gray (and on this forum, where I was ridiculed about it) that it was possible KC got those matches….”

And will no doubt be ridiculed more since you did not notice smokin99’s comments…. Twice.

“The Matchbook: Could have come from the Portland SkyChef, if one was there in 71.”

IF there was one in 1971???? How ever could we figure that out??? Another mystery like a left handed tie clasp!

About the tie clasp…… the comment was about it being ‘LEFT’ (THAT’S LEFT HANDED) and not who saw the thing.

I know about the left-handed thing, and I did read 99's comments. Ken Christiansen was left-handed, but you probably knew that already. No worries. I know how it is at Dropzone. People here like to argue over silly points and ignore the testimony of actual, living witnesses.

Bernie Geestman's sister Dawn identified the tie tac as one belonging to Ken Christiansen. Whether you accept her testimony or not, she is on record about it. She was absolutely SURE on it, and at the time she made the identification, she had no clue why I was really sitting there in her kitchen. There is a third witness to her statements: Her grandson Jonathan was right there listening to everything. Plus her interview was sound recorded. Wait until the Seattle FBI gets an earful of her entire interview, which they will very soon. I'm sure they will find it interesting.

Yeah...I know. You don't NEED witnesses to solve a criminal case. (*laughs*) Common sense is also an asset sadly lacking on this thread sometimes.

People generally lie when they have a reason. I found absolutely no reason to doubt Dawn's word. When she found out we were checking out KC for the Cooper case, she wasn't even surprised about it.

Ah - Eureka! I know about the left-handed thing.

Thing | Define Thing at Dictionary.com
a material object without life or consequence or
animacy; an inanimate object, concept, or personna
2. some entity, object, or creature of casual
significance that is not or cannot be restore to
significance, 3. something held in derision, eg a bad
idea voited on by by members of the board.... etc.
reflecting the underlying belief something better is
possible or exists ...

That pretty much sums up the Blevins-thing.

[skyjack71 0]

The SkyChef match book I told Himmelsbach about during the first few months of communications with him. In the drawer Duane kept Mickey, the piece of plexiglass and the gold chain with the medallion - was a book of matches....also with these items was the items I played with while on the phone which I now know are parts to a parachute.

I have told this for yrs and yrs.
The book of matches I asked Duane about one time - he told me not to throw them away. I didn't know the meaning of them.

The book of matches in the drawer were a lighter blue than the ones pictured. Probably faded from yrs of storage - in the place he kept them before putting them in that drawer.

After he died I didn't know what all this stuff was. I don't recall what I did with the matches - probably threw them away.

Sold the chute parts at a garage sale and that is when I was told what they were.

I still have Mickey and the plexiglass (a souvenier piece I guess - a cut piece of an airplane window).

I have taken my pill, so this is all I will do. Remember this I have told for many yrs that Duane and his ex worked at an airport for 2 wks - they delivered meals for a catering service to the plane. They entered the plane from the aft stair way.

This connection was in Denver or Phoenix or Tulsa or Tuson since they spent time in all of those place along with Atlanta. My gut says Denver because that is where he took me to a place and where we could see the airport and told me the names of all of the planes and never told me how he knew that much about commercial planes. All so remember that I met him at the Hilton at the Atlanta Airport.

I do not know under what names they had this employment. The ex told me that they did work for a company in CA., but that was not mentioned in the list given for SkyChef.

You see guys I never lied - and now you know where Mickey Mouse comes from. Mickey Mouse has a name and that name is Billy.

I know I am not making much sense to any of you, but I had to make this post.

Goodnight!

P.S. Will try to post a pic - remember this pic - I thought it was just a mark on the pic - it is NOT it is the tie tac and it was Duane's birthday present to Duane.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Farflung 0]

I agree…. to the Nth degree…… smokin99.

A quick search of the newspaper archives and eBay confirmed that Sky Chefs indeed had a restaurant, bar and numerous other concessions at Portland airport with a matchbook cover to boot.

I wonder (code for, no I don’t) how hard these factoids are verified and vetted. I see how the phrase confirmed and verified is used by some, but as soon as I ask for the name of the certifying body it is cricket chirps. Almost as if these people have never done a research project before in their lives. Too hard for me to figure out that’s for sure.

Oh well, back to interviewing DEAD witnesses for me (gawd that cracks me up- live witnesses). Did anyone see what happened here? Yes officer, that corpse over there saw the whole thing….. you should interview him. He may know which way the Columbia River flows and other trivial stuff!

[georger 247]

The matchbook cover didn't list Portland so let's speculate that this might (just might) correlate with DB coming in on another flight. Well, alls good until one realizes that the matchbook cover is not an accurate representation of whether Portland had a Sky chef or not.

Or, maybe it is accurate but accurate in a different
way -

Maybe there is a reason this cover thing does not
include PDX? Maybe not all Skychef match books
were made/printed by the same source, but
regionally? Maybe this has nothng to do with time
per se but distance, region, and multiple makers
each with different instructions, even during the
same time period? Is there a printer's logo on this
matchbook cover?

Some expert collector would know all about that.
This matchbook has a history.

Here are two examples both from the 70s - the
Universal Match Co NY cover does list PDX. So far
I havent found a photo of the inside of the Ohio
cover.

[BobKnoss 0]

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Here’s a little supplement to your original post smokin99.

I hope you could see that I was being sarcastic with that comment about the ‘new’ clue. Any search in the news archives will answer that question and I found some matches on of all places - eBay which have Portland listed in the cover.

But there is NO explaining that left handed tie clasp. One more mystery to add with the statuary of Easter Island, the Pyramids of Giza and the Hanging Gardens of Babylon; but better than all that stuff.

Well, I will explain the tie clasp for all of you. Richard McCoy chose that tie clasp after much searching for just the right clip. He asked me for one but passed on what I had. He was real picky about it. Never understood why. I believe it was handed to Nick O'Hara to exchange in the evidence room for Mac's BYU pin with RFMjr initials on the back. THAT's actually REALLY what happened and is withheld information to help verify my factual information. You will find the information about the Brigham Young medallion, if you do your homework, in early reports. Of course, later publications will include the altered information with the simple tie clip with the pearl, no initials. Part of an inside personal pissing contest between Duane and Mac which is better left unsaid. Worse than retarded kid pictures.

[BobKnoss 0]

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..... it is the tie tac and it was Duane's birthday present to Duane.

Yah, EVERYBODY had a pearl tie clasp. Me too. It was the standard, "fruitcake for Christmas," what do I get him, gift. I think I got two of them for HS graduation. Never wore them. Worthless evidence anyway. Planted post-op.

[airtwardo 7]

Worthless evidence anyway. Planted post-op.

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NOT the ole 'Pristine Tie Clip on the Grassy Knoll' theory again?

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[matthewcline 0]

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.....Just sayin

So many posts in here now, I am not even sure where each mini conversation is going or came from!

Matt

An Instructors first concern is student safety.
So, start being safe, first!!!

[smokin99 0]

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EDIT: On Georger's matchbook pictures in his previous post above, the one listing the airports might be possible to date. Airports sometimes change their names. You could narrow down a date range by running the airport names and seeing if any were changed, and when this was done. I did the easy one. Picture enhanced and attached below.

On the airport listed as General Lyman Field in Hilo, HI there is this:

***'Act 59, SLH 1989, changed the name of the airport to Hilo International Airport effective July 1, 1989...'

This means the date range of the matchbook falls between late 1963 and July 1, 1989. You could probably narrow it down further if you wished. What? Like I should do all the work for you?


The question is not What? It's more like Why? As in - Why would you need to date this or that matchbook cover? It's just a blue sky chef(s) matchbook cover that is similar in appearance to other Sky Chef(s) matchbook covers - one of which might have been used to light DB's fag (Note - that is not a reference to KC).
No one knows if this is a replica of "THE" matchbook cover, right? So I'm still saying, unless I'm missing something here or matchbook covers are being sold on eBay by DB himself, the matchbooks in question mean diddly squat as it pertains to Cooper's hometown or Portland having a Sky Chef or where he got them from. That said, however, if I had some disposable income I would probably bid - strictly for the coolness factor.

And btw....I've known more than a few smokers that couldn't hold on to a lighter or matches to save their lives. The "Hey, gotta light?" gang. Back in the day I would call them non-professional smokers.
And then there are the folks that would rather use up a free book of matches found lying around "anywhere" in the airport then the lighter in their pocket. And then there are the collectors - those folks that pick up matchbooks and have a closet full of hotel shampoos and those little plastic shower caps.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[smokin99 0]

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.....Just sayin

So many posts in here now, I am not even sure where each mini conversation is going or came from!

Matt

LOL...welcome to the Hotel DB Cooper. Like I used to tell my guitar player after the drummer came back from his "smoke" break......just jump in when you can and hang on.

but....A lie gets halfway around the world before the truth has a chance to get its pants on.....Winston Churchill

[Robert99 50]

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RobertMBlevins says without reading any of the four previous comments:

“I pointed out to Gray (and on this forum, where I was ridiculed about it) that it was possible KC got those matches….”

And will no doubt be ridiculed more since you did not notice smokin99’s comments…. Twice.

“The Matchbook: Could have come from the Portland SkyChef, if one was there in 71.”

IF there was one in 1971???? How ever could we figure that out??? Another mystery like a left handed tie clasp!

About the tie clasp…… the comment was about it being ‘LEFT’ (THAT’S LEFT HANDED) and not who saw the thing.

Forget about the matches. Until about the late 1960s, airline meal service usually included a small packet of four cigarettes and a book of matches. Sky Chef probably still has a warehouse full of matches from that time frame.

But if you can come up with a genuine "left-hand" tie clasp, then you need to continue and look for a shirt that can be buttoned with the left hand. Is there a place on the planet where such shirts are customary?

[airtwardo 7]

But if you can come up with a genuine "left-hand" tie clasp, then you need to continue and look for a shirt that can be buttoned with the left hand. Is there a place on the planet where such shirts are customary?

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Any women's shirt and some men's shirts from Europe button up 'backwards...

It's a holdover from the Victorian days when women & kings didn't 'dress' themselves, the buttons were reversed to make it easy for the servent type person putting the garment on..or taking it OFF (hubba hubba )

I've seen some high end shirts across the pond with the buttons on the left side, I asked if they weren't 'women's blouses'...ummm wrong question!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[airtwardo 7]

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To ALL:

I was using this photo a moment ago to send to someone when I noticed something. I am not going to tell you what it is, but want to see if ANYONE else sees what I see.

Study the photo carefully and remember photos that have been identified per the FBI or perhaps othera pointing a finger at a specific subject.

Not reversed is it...wedding ring looks right...?


edited to add: Thanks for the PM...it's all so 'clear' to me now!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Farflung 0]

Oh….. mah….. gawd!!! How could we be so stupid?

It wasn’t a left handed tie clasp, it was a left handed shirt OR a woman’s blouse!!! Why didn’t I see this before? It’s all so clear now.

DB Cooper’s shirt was never, never I say, described by any witness (at least the living ones) for an insanely obvious reason. Prepare to be stunned.

The closest witnesses to Cooper were Flo and gentle, sweet, angelic Tina. Neither of them made a statement about Cooper’s shirt and I have this recorded and certified that nothing was said. Why?

Because of the utter banality the garment represented. That’s right, you got it, Flo and she who haunts me in my dreams, Tina filtered out Cooper’s shirt from their descriptions because it was just like their shirts. Why would they take note of a left handed shirt? They wouldn’t because they are chicks and chick’s shirts button on the other side.

So the tie clasp was put on by a right handed person (eliminating Duane and Kenny) who was wearing a left handed shirt. The only ‘major suspect’ (not sure who maintains that list) who fits this 100%, without qualification or apology nor leap of logic is none other than…… Barb Dayton.

Yes, thanks to the previously, misidentified tie clasp, which was attributed (falsely) to a left handed man in fact would be clearly used by a right handed, transsexual wearing a woman’s blouse.

I think Skyjack71 and RobertMBlevins deserve the credit for identifying Barb Dayton since they made such repeated calls towards the left handed tie clasp. They reflect great credit upon citizen sleuthery, the pursuit of ‘The Truth’ and wholesome family entertainment and humility.

[georger 247]

Forget about the matches. Until about the late 1960s, airline meal service usually included a small packet of four cigarettes and a book of matches. Sky Chef probably still has a warehouse full of matches from that time frame.

[airtwardo 7]

It wasn’t a left handed tie clasp, it was a left handed shirt OR a woman’s blouse!!! Why didn’t I see this before? It’s all so clear now.

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OR....somebody put the shirt on inside-out!

I bet it CAN happen... getting dressed in hung-over-hurry, leaving a steamy airstream after having a real wild 'knight'!

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[georger 247]

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It wasn’t a left handed tie clasp, it was a left handed shirt OR a woman’s blouse!!! Why didn’t I see this before? It’s all so clear now.

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OR....somebody put the shirt on inside-out![Reply]

Instructions to putting a tie clip on THE Reich WAY
UBER ALLES!

http://www.ehow.com/way_6169443_tie-clip-
instructions.html

We will cover opening left handed match books in the
next chapter. (under Military vs Civilian rights & ceremonies & tells of the aforementioned.).

[airtwardo 7]

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It wasn’t a left handed tie clasp, it was a left handed shirt OR a woman’s blouse!!! Why didn’t I see this before? It’s all so clear now.

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OR....somebody put the shirt on inside-out![Reply]

Instructions to putting a tie clip on THE Reich WAY
UBER ALLES!

http://www.ehow.com/way_6169443_tie-clip-
instructions.html

We will cover opening left handed match books in the
next chapter. (under Military vs Civilian rights & ceremonies & tells of the aforementioned.).

Ahhh Haaa

Most tie clips are designed to be attached from right to left, and you should be careful in applying your tie clip from this direction...

~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~

[Robert99 50]

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It wasn’t a left handed tie clasp, it was a left handed shirt OR a woman’s blouse!!! Why didn’t I see this before? It’s all so clear now.

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OR....somebody put the shirt on inside-out!

I bet it CAN happen... getting dressed in hung-over-hurry, leaving a steamy airstream after having a real wild 'knight'!

Airtwardo and Farflung, I think you have solved the case. Cooper was either Barb Dayton or a fairy (or maybe both).

[Farflung 0]

Even with the article posted by smokin99, which clearly states that Sky Chef was awarded the contract for the flight kitchen, restaurant, bar and concessions at Portland in 1966; confusion still rages like a party in an Airstream. This is hard to believe. Is that ‘teaser’ on Gray’s website truly this baffling and confounding, as to cause what appears to be early onset Alzheimer’s?

Gray goes so far as to ask (I presume he is asking because he does not know) if there was a Sky Chef in Portland by 1971. What must the reading comprehension be? Yes Virginia, Portland had a Sky Chef restaurant in 1971 and this was pointed out by smokin99, five months ago. Of course five months is more than ample time for a myth to become re-animated and begin stomping out of the castle’s laboratory once again.

First there will be the claims of who identified this gem first, as has already happened. Then some butthurt will be applied to ‘Mr Short-term-memory’ in a desperate ploy to extinguish going through this again (now scheduled for 1 Aug 2012) while acting ignorant about the last act or two.

Some clever assclown offers some Sky Chef matches and a cheesy TIE CLASP (I see there is still confusion on what the thing is called) which is modeled after some DB Cooper trivia as a way to make a few bucks. Why not? Good for him. But, and this is a Hometown Buffet/Wal Mart, BIG but…… analysis is done on this matchbook (in Gray’s website) as if it was the one Cooper carried on the plane, when this was NEVER even obliquely suggested by Gray or the eBay seller. Astonishing! Yet they want to be taken seriously on other research items?

So this leads to the patently obvious item to investigate next. Did DB Cooper wear an ‘emergency moustache’ to compliment his toupee and glasses? This would explain why no one noticed him in the waiting area or on another inbound flight since he was still sporting a press-on, cookie duster. Did the FBI ask the living witnesses if they noticed any mustachioed individuals in the bars, restaurants, incoming flights, neighboring towns and cities or restrooms? No and it was careless on their part.

As it stands….. Cooper was from North Pierce County, right handed, never worked for an airline, was not gay (but transsexual), wore a woman’s shirt, a man’s toupee, had Sky Chef matches (may not have had Portland listed in cover) and an ‘as of yet to be identified’ moustache (just a strong possibility). Did I miss anything? This is way better than discussing Cooper’s seat, good call.