skyjack71 0 #37551 January 17, 2013 QuoteQuoteWell, who am I to talk - I lived with an ex-con for 17 yrs and didn't have a clue! No clue? Not even after you lied to the two Florida Highway Patrolmen about where Duane was? And not even after Duane's response when the Florida Highway Patrolmen then followed you to his location? Jo, get real! Robert99 EXCUSE ME ROBERT99! THIS IS TYPICAL OF YOU ALWAYS GETTING YOU INFO WRONG. IT WAS 1990 WHEN ONE PATROLMAN KNOCKED ON MY DOOR - WITH AN ID PICTURE OF MY HUSBAND. THIS WAS WHEN HE FIRST WENT ON THE KIDNEY MACHINE AND IT WAS WKS LATER I LEARNED HE HAD BEEN IN JEFFERSON UNDER THE NAME OF JOHN COLLINS. I knew NOTHING about the OTHER INCARCERATIONS until 1996 - THAT was 1 yr and 2 months after WEBER died. 1978 - Married Duane 1990 - Started kidney machine 1990 - Found out about Jefferson 1995 - Died 1996 - Contacted FBI. WILL this little reminder help you get YOUR FACT together before you MAKE DEROGATORY AND SLANDEROUS REMARKS? Now say you are SORRY!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37552 January 17, 2013 show me the deception Jo, I ask simple questions and get nothing but abuse from you. I don't see any problems with checking leads, but you try to make a lead reality! I have never called you a liar, I simply don't believe Weber is Cooper, plain and simple. you have now decided to attack me personally for some reason because I confront your evidence from what I gather. I don't think you have a clue as to what you are doing, that's how I see it, and I will speak with authority on that comment! name calling and anger in more of your style Jo, not mine, just by looking at Duane's W-2's tells me he was nowhere near Washington or Oregon, 1971 he was in Columbia S.C. if not mistaken, did Duane have a job paying under the table in the WA area? did Duane drive, fly or walk to Washington, who took care of Duane financially while in Washington, that's proof you should be looking for, not fabric shopping! what about the advice Robert99 gave you about getting Duane's records? I have yet to see anything linking Duane to the crime area other than prison. you want to blame the FBI for not checking the story out in full? what do you want from them? Blevins does the same by deciding to take over the investigation for the FBI, you guys must be keeping them busy with all of your new found evidence you guys send them. angry? hardly, how about reality for starters! I'm sorry Jo, you don't need 17 years to see things not adding up!"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37553 January 17, 2013 QuoteQuoteWell, who am I to talk - I lived with an ex-con for 17 yrs and didn't have a clue! No clue? Not even after you lied to the two Florida Highway Patrolmen about where Duane was? And not even after Duane's response when the Florida Highway Patrolmen then followed you to his location? Jo, get real! Robert99 ROBERT99 U CALLED ME LIAR ABOVE! ! THE RECORDS PROVE I DID NOT LIE. WHY DON'T YOU CONTACT THE DEPUTIES OFFICE YOURSELF. Do you not remember that when the 2 local Escambia Co.deputies and one patrolman entered the shop that Duane put both hands on the desk....this was just a short time later as they followed me to the store. Some of you guys need to research before you call someone a LIAR. Calling someone a liar - you better have your proof! I was shocked by the 1 patrol man showing up on my door and can you imagine what I must have felt in the shop when the 2 deputies and a HWY Patrolman showed up a the shop. Duane was ACCUSING me of TURNING him in and I only went there to find out WHAT the hell this was about - trying to get a drivers license under the name of John Collins. I wanted an explanation! I knew he was trying to adjust to the kidney machine - and I told the patrolman that my husband had just started the kidney machine, I even asked that patrolman if it could have anything to do with this. Evidently - because one call to the Dr. and he was not booked but then transported from Lakeview to the Pavillion. The Dr and I knew a night in Lakeview would be detrimental....that is where they sent all of the crack addicts...and they were over-run with diseases in that location. I have told this story before - WHY do I have to repeat it for a "poster" who is only looking for anything he can and to call me a LIAR! When the facts are right here in this thread! Robert99 - APOLOGIZE NOW! Some of you FBI types do not know how to cross your T's or dot your I's. You actually held the lives of other people in your hands in the cockpit of a plane? You have actually been responsible for other lives - and you can't keep your facts straight! How the hell did you pilot a plane?Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37554 January 17, 2013 Quote I am not abusing you - in no way! Looking at Duane's W-2's tells me he was nowhere near Washington or Oregon, 1971 he was in Columbia S.C. Excuse me I am the one who posted Duane's work record and I know he was a licensed agent in 1971 in S.C. and in GA. and he worked several jobs, but they were commission and NONE were salaried. You do NOT have a REAL clue about sales people. We work on our own and on commission. Did you also see the sum total of income for both Duane and his wife for that yr? Yea, I provided them with the TAX file also. He definitely was NOT working in WA in 1971 - DUH! you think? All the FBI has is what I provided them with and what was in the prison files. I provided them with all of the Tax reports from 1969 to 1971, including the W-2's not only for him, but for his wife of the day. I do not remember if I gave them the 1972 file, but I did NOT provide ALL of the info in the 72 file to the thread since it involved another wife and children she had - I saw no need to cause them grief. You my dear need to go back to school. If you cannot make heads or tails out of the fact I provide the FBI and know who provided that information and understand the nature of the employement - you are the one who needs to look at yourself in the mirror. Check and see how much Duane made in commissions with the employer - DUH! YOU SEE IF YOU HAD ACTUALLY READ ALL OF THE THREAD YOU WOULD KNOW I HAVE DONE MY HOMEWORK - the FBI did NOT provide that information - I DID!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #37555 January 17, 2013 to date there is zero evidence of any electronics used in this crime... _______________________________________________ I hereby certify that radio tower signals (unregistered) on a mountain top were used in triangulation for dropzone location in combination with lights from a pump station to zero in on the predetermined jump location chosen by Duane Weber. The flight was pre-flown and practiced to verify trajectories and accuracy. These are facts. You can't prove or disprove them, but you will rant uncontrollably at your inability to discount it as not true. Truth is what truth is, no matter how hard you try to cover it up. Bite me. You are always wrong, it seems. Jo is right. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37556 January 17, 2013 The only evidence I have been confronted with is the very evidence I provided to the FBI. The military and the criminal records provided by NOT the FBI, but Doug Pasternac - an investigative writer back in the day. The FBI found very little on Weber. AS I have said before - the files compiled by myself and others on my behalf constitute most of what the FBI claims to have.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37557 January 17, 2013 I know all to much about sales Jo, the question is, how did he get to Oregon? I don't need to go back to school, perhaps you could use a lesson in investigating? 18 years Jo? when is your education going to kick in and solve this? it's the way you approach things Jo, just like gong off on Robert99, then begging for an apology? the only thing he got wrong is the fact of one cop at your door and two cops in Pensacola.... you have so much anger in you Jo, are you at ease with yourself? I have read a lot of the thread and see the same things being brought up about you and your actions. I see to many things against Duane being Cooper. as long as you post things, people have a right to comment about them...period!"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37558 January 17, 2013 Quote to date there is zero evidence of any electronics used in this crime... _______________________________________________ I hereby certify that radio tower signals (unregistered) on a mountain top were used in triangulation for dropzone location in combination with lights from a pump station to zero in on the predetermined jump location chosen by Duane Weber. The flight was pre-flown and practiced to verify trajectories and accuracy. These are facts. You can't prove or disprove them, but you will rant uncontrollably at your inability to discount it as not true. Truth is what truth is, no matter how hard you try to cover it up. Bite me. You are always wrong, it seems. Jo is right. this coming from a guy who claims Mac is alive, then years ago states he gave you a picture before he died? which time was that? the FBI "fake death" or the death of Mac you claimed in 2006, or the resurrection of Mac in the 2000's Knoss meet Jo...... " These are facts. You can't prove or disprove them" then they are indeed not facts Bobby! facts can be proven. "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37559 January 17, 2013 Again READ what Robert99 stated and what I was replying to. Robert99 claimed I lied about having no knowledge of Duane criminal record. The only knowledge I had prior to 1997 was the Jefferson stay of 16 months in 1966 to 1968. I had NO knowledge of the other "incidents - criminal incidents" until 1997 when someone else retrived the records for me. The FBI told me little to nothing....the FBI was not who told me about Weber's extensive criminal record. The FBI provided me with NO copies of any records. NOT one IOTA! All of what I have was dug-out by Doug and myself and many others....surely I could NOT have done so by myself! I expect the FBI would never have acknowledge the McNeil and other incidents had I not have let them know the file had been found and did exist.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37560 January 17, 2013 I will admit they should have shown you what they have, but again this is a crime about a hijacking that may or may not have been linked to Duane, if this was a murder case of someone in your Family, yes they would probably provide more information. I still think you need to find a way to get a PI to contact the FBI and find some answers for you. I know the money problems, but surely there is a way...."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 50 #37561 January 17, 2013 QuoteQuoteQuoteWell, who am I to talk - I lived with an ex-con for 17 yrs and didn't have a clue! No clue? Not even after you lied to the two Florida Highway Patrolmen about where Duane was? And not even after Duane's response when the Florida Highway Patrolmen then followed you to his location? Jo, get real! Robert99 ROBERT99 U CALLED ME LIAR ABOVE! ! THE RECORDS PROVE I DID NOT LIE. WHY DON'T YOU CONTACT THE DEPUTIES OFFICE YOURSELF. Do you not remember that when the 2 local Escambia Co.deputies and one patrolman entered the shop that Duane put both hands on the desk....this was just a short time later as they followed me to the store. Some of you guys need to research before you call someone a LIAR. Calling someone a liar - you better have your proof! I was shocked by the 1 patrol man showing up on my door and can you imagine what I must have felt in the shop when the 2 deputies and a HWY Patrolman showed up a the shop. Duane was ACCUSING me of TURNING him in and I only went there to find out WHAT the hell this was about - trying to get a drivers license under the name of John Collins. I wanted an explanation! I knew he was trying to adjust to the kidney machine - and I told the patrolman that my husband had just started the kidney machine, I even asked that patrolman if it could have anything to do with this. Evidently - because one call to the Dr. and he was not booked but then transported from Lakeview to the Pavillion. The Dr and I knew a night in Lakeview would be detrimental....that is where they sent all of the crack addicts...and they were over-run with diseases in that location. I have told this story before - WHY do I have to repeat it for a "poster" who is only looking for anything he can and to call me a LIAR! When the facts are right here in this thread! Robert99 - APOLOGIZE NOW! Some of you FBI types do not know how to cross your T's or dot your I's. You actually held the lives of other people in your hands in the cockpit of a plane? You have actually been responsible for other lives - and you can't keep your facts straight! How the hell did you pilot a plane? Jo, You have previously posted and exchanged posts about the incident where two police officers (from whatever jurisdictions) came to your front door and asked to speak to Duane. By your own statement, you told them that you did not know where Duane was. The officers then left and within a few minutes you drove to Duane's shop (or whatever it was). Then the officers you had met just a few minutes earlier arrived. They had followed you, without your knowledge, to Duane's shop. And with you supposedly watching, Duane reacted as though he thought he was going to be arrested. But he wasn't to your surprise. You have related the above any number of times on this thread. You claim above that I am an "FBI type", which is something that I have repeatedly stated that I am not. Nevertheless, you continue to make that and other irresponsible allegations. You need to keep your own facts straight! Robert99 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 50 #37562 January 17, 2013 QuoteAgain READ what Robert99 stated and what I was replying to. Robert99 claimed I lied about having no knowledge of Duane criminal record. The only knowledge I had prior to 1997 was the Jefferson stay of 16 months in 1966 to 1968. I had NO knowledge of the other "incidents - criminal incidents" until 1997 when someone else retrived the records for me. The FBI told me little to nothing....the FBI was not who told me about Weber's extensive criminal record. The FBI provided me with NO copies of any records. NOT one IOTA! All of what I have was dug-out by Doug and myself and many others....surely I could NOT have done so by myself! I expect the FBI would never have acknowledge the McNeil and other incidents had I not have let them know the file had been found and did exist. Jo, If you had read my original response to your post, you would know that I was responding to your claim about not having a "clue" about Duane's background and his extra-legal activities. In addition to the above, when did you know, to use your own phrasing, that Duane liked to seduce women, rob them, and then graciously leave a twenty dollar bill on the dresser? Robert99 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37563 January 17, 2013 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteWell, who am I to talk - I lived with an ex-con for 17 yrs and didn't have a clue! No clue? Not even after you lied to the two Florida Highway Patrolmen about where Duane was? And not even after Duane's response when the Florida Highway Patrolmen then followed you to his location? Jo, get real! Robert99 ROBERT99 U CALLED ME LIAR ABOVE! ! THE RECORDS PROVE I DID NOT LIE. WHY DON'T YOU CONTACT THE DEPUTIES OFFICE YOURSELF. Do you not remember that when the 2 local Escambia Co.deputies and one patrolman entered the shop that Duane put both hands on the desk....this was just a short time later as they followed me to the store. Some of you guys need to research before you call someone a LIAR. Calling someone a liar - you better have your proof! I was shocked by the 1 patrol man showing up on my door and can you imagine what I must have felt in the shop when the 2 deputies and a HWY Patrolman showed up a the shop. Duane was ACCUSING me of TURNING him in and I only went there to find out WHAT the hell this was about - trying to get a drivers license under the name of John Collins. I wanted an explanation! I knew he was trying to adjust to the kidney machine - and I told the patrolman that my husband had just started the kidney machine, I even asked that patrolman if it could have anything to do with this. Evidently - because one call to the Dr. and he was not booked but then transported from Lakeview to the Pavillion. The Dr and I knew a night in Lakeview would be detrimental....that is where they sent all of the crack addicts...and they were over-run with diseases in that location. I have told this story before - WHY do I have to repeat it for a "poster" who is only looking for anything he can and to call me a LIAR! When the facts are right here in this thread! Robert99 - APOLOGIZE NOW! Some of you FBI types do not know how to cross your T's or dot your I's. You actually held the lives of other people in your hands in the cockpit of a plane? You have actually been responsible for other lives - and you can't keep your facts straight! How the hell did you pilot a plane? Jo, You have previously posted and exchanged posts about the incident where two police officers (from whatever jurisdictions) came to your front door and asked to speak to Duane. By your own statement, you told them that you did not know where Duane was. The officers then left and within a few minutes you drove to Duane's shop (or whatever it was). Then the officers you had met just a few minutes earlier arrived. They had followed you, without your knowledge, to Duane's shop. And with you supposedly watching, Duane reacted as though he thought he was going to be arrested. But he wasn't to your surprise. You have related the above any number of times on this thread. Robert99 Robert I will REPEAT there was ONE HwyPatrolman who knocked on my Door in the COUNTY we lived in. There could have been one in the car, but I did NOT see him. Then the next County over is where the SHOP was. Shortly after I got to the shop to confront Duane - 2 local deputies show up with the Hwy Patrolman. Even now I can't remember if there was 2 patrolman and if one came in later. I expect that might have been the case as there was a back door, but all of that happened REALLY fast. I had never seen a gun drawn by an officer in MY life! I thought the 2 guys in the dark uniform where from Pensacola, but since found the area of the shop was NOT in the jurisdiction of Pensacola and that area had its own deputies.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37564 January 17, 2013 QuoteJo, You have previously posted and exchanged posts about the incident where two police officers (from whatever jurisdictions) came to your front door and asked to speak to Duane. By your own statement, you told them that you did not know where Duane was. There was only one HwyPatrolman who came to the door - ONE. QuoteThe officers then left and within a few minutes you drove to Duane's shop (or whatever it was). Then the officers you had met just a few minutes earlier arrived. I only met ONE HwyPatrolman at my door - one! QuoteThey had followed you, without your knowledge, to Duane's shop. And with you supposedly watching, Duane reacted as though he thought he was going to be arrested. But he wasn't to your surprise. You have related the above any number of times on this thread. I have related the story but NOT the way you are stating it! Yes, I was sitting in the shop talking to Duane when the deputies and 1 patrolman came in and Duane put both hands on the desk just at the site of the officers and guns. The did arrest him and asked him to put both his hands behind him for the cuffs. I explained the fistual and asked one (now there are Two patrolmen in the room so one was outside) if they would put the cuffs in front, as pressure on the fistual could mean a life and death situation. When the officer felt the fistula they quickly obliged. Not many had the kind he had. I therefore did KEEP my facts together - I have NOT to my knowledge ever stated there were 2 patrolmen at my door and at our home. Since the shop was in a private jurisdition and not in the county it require to policemen from that jurisdition and the HwyPatrolmen - there were two, but I would not see the second one until they went to do the cuffs. So he either went to the back door or he was in the car, but was there when they went to put the cuffs on. THERE was ONLY one PATROLMAN at the door of my house when he wanted to know if I knew who the man was and explained he had used the name John Collins and had not provided sufficient ID. I identified the man as my husband and asked what this was about. They had followed the VAN which was registered in MY name - and thought it might be my father.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37565 January 17, 2013 this is from a couple months ago.... Oct 22, 2012, 7:16 PM Post #37080 of 40176 (685 views) Shortcut Registered: Nov 12, 2006 Posts: 5283 They knocked on my door the next day and I told them I didn't know were he was. I suspected he was at the SHOP and got into my car and drove directly there. BECAUSE of my name they thought he was MY FATHER. Within moments the 2 policeman and the Highway Patrol walked into the shop . Duane immediately put both hands on the desk. THESE law enforcement like myself did NOT know he had ALREADY obtained the John Collins drivers license the same day he left the Santa Rosa Office. This was NOT known to the FBI and only known to me 2 yrs AFTER I contacted them 1 yr and 2 month after Duane died."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #37566 January 17, 2013 Oct 11, 2012, 1:56 PM Post #36789 of 40177 (734 views) Shortcut Registered: Nov 12, 2006 Posts: 5283 On 3/08/90 Duane presented himself and some documents to the Santa Rosa County Drivers License Dept - He was turned away because the documents were insuffient to obtain a drivers license under the name of John C. Collins. On 3/09/90 A Hwy Patrol man knocked on my door and presented a picture of Duane on a laminated card the size of a drivers license. He wanted to know if I knew the man - I said yes, but asked what this was all about. He explained that the man had tried to obtain a drivers license under the name of John Collins but was refused because of insuffient photo identification. They became suspicious and followed him but lost him after the reach another county. They traced the tag and thought he might be my father. I explained it was NOT my father, but my husband and he was 17 yrs older than myself and had just gone on the kidney machine. They asked me if I knew where he was and I lied (not well) that I didn't know. I immediately got into my vehicle and went to Pensacola and the shop on Creighton. I told him what had happened and before he could explain - 2 local officers and s Patrolman entered the building. Duane immediately put both hands on the desk....cussing me for turning him in. I told him I knew nothing about this and I was there to find out. They must have followed me. Highway Patrol has State wide jurisdiction and would not require any other LE...."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37567 January 17, 2013 QuoteQuoteAgain READ what Robert99 stated and what I was replying to. Robert99 claimed I lied about having no knowledge of Duane criminal record. The only knowledge I had prior to 1997 was the Jefferson stay of 16 months in 1966 to 1968. I had NO knowledge of the other "incidents - criminal incidents" until 1997 when someone else retrived the records for me. The FBI told me little to nothing....the FBI was not who told me about Weber's extensive criminal record. The FBI provided me with NO copies of any records. NOT one IOTA! All of what I have was dug-out by Doug and myself and many others....surely I could NOT have done so by myself! I expect the FBI would never have acknowledge the McNeil and other incidents had I not have let them know the file had been found and did exist. Jo, If you had read my original response to your post, you would know that I was responding to your claim about not having a "clue" about Duane's background and his extra-legal activities. In addition to the above, when did you know, to use your own phrasing, that Duane liked to seduce women, rob them, and then graciously leave a twenty dollar bill on the dresser? Robert99 The seducion and robbing them came from the brother - as he called it "relieving them of their valuables" if I remember the terminology he used in his letter. Believe the 20 dollar bill came from his other wife who was always very very coy. She was the one married to him under the name John Collins and lived and run with him during that time. The FBI really screwed up that interview very early on. She was the one who told about the CB and walkie talkies in Fla and other places. I won't go into details about what she told me - the FBI didn't give a hoot and they blew the interview with her because they scared the crap out of her and her daughter. She had used multiple names during her union with Weber from 1962 until 1966. and then 1968 until 1972. There was little she would not have done for "johnnie". Don't try to tell me I did NOT investigate. I do not have any files in front of me and I use my memory.... .Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MarkBennett 5 #37568 January 17, 2013 QuoteIt's HERE, if anyone is interested. Warning: Newsvine isn't Wordpress. This means comments, if any, must be within the Code of Honor guidelines at Newsvine or your comment is deleted. If not by me, then by moderator Tyler Adams, who also puts your IP on the Santa Bad List so you can't open another account from the same computer. (This is mostly done to prevent repeat spammers, but the same goes for individuals) It's my column, and I set the rules. But don't think I do this just for Cooper Fans. That rule has been a staple of the column for six years now. I don't care what you say at DZ, but on my own column I'm ruthless as hell. I'm just curious, Robert. In the article you write: "There are three basic types of people in this cult. The first are the people who celebrate Cooper's life because he was the guy who 'stuck it to the man' for two hundred grand (just over a million in today's dollars) and never got caught..... "The second group are the unbiased civilian investigators, or writers with an interest in the case..... "The third group are the most dangerous type in this cult. They are the folks who either don't want to know who the hijacker was because they live solely for the discussion, or the people who push one suspect to the exclusion of all others." You know most of us put you in the third group. Which group do you consider yourself in? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37569 January 17, 2013 Over the yrs I was asked if anyone wrote a book or made a movie and it made lots of money what would I do with it. Number one those things have not been my goal - the truth has been my only goal, but a couple of individuals pushed for the what ifs a few yrs ago. A young man we all know is a shining example of what I would want done. He is a brilliant young man, but with corrupted links in his background. I expect his IQ is relatively high and will always struggle against the odds. A college degree and 4 yrs of supplemented and supervised work in the field of his choice would make a hell of a lot of difference as it would for anyone in that position. I do NOT mean working menial jobs - but working in fields that are NOW unable to hire misdirected young people. Some one made fun of me in the thread and said they did NOT want an ex-cons as their banker or stockbroker or real estate agent or insurance broker. These are jobs not legally allowed access by ex-cons. I know brilliant young men who are doomed to working at Winn Dixie pushing buggies or doing manual labor because they made a mistake or two while they were very young, but did not get their act together until it was too late and by then they were NO longer in the Juvie System. 21 yrs old and you can't buy your way out of something like walking out of a store with a keg...intending it as a practical joke. Now with the economy there are many many more who will fall thru the cracks....just from taking necessities to survive with. The children of today are NOT taught to see the consequences of their actions....the TV and games take the place of family functions and parenting. Moms and Dads too often do not make their children understand actions and consequences. The law stands behind that - an old fashion whipping would turn a lot of young people around at the appropriate age....and now the child can bring charges and the parents go to jail. What a warped society we have! Since there is sex education in the schools now and the parents have NO control over that - why NOT have classes to teach kids about RIGHT and WRONG. Teach them the consequences of poor judgement and what it will do to their lives and also try to salvage some of those already damaged by an out of control society and parents who both work and do not have time to parent. Rules and regulations! Why not salvage some of these young men before it is too late. Duane had a high IQ - he did NOT grow up until it was too late. He spent his life looking over his shoulder with every job he took as an insurance agent....and to think I thought it was from a couple of months in jail when he was a kid. I didn't even think in those terms. I didn't know until this thread age 21 was when you could go to jail in his day. Damn I was naive! I just thought of it as a county home of some sort and he was a kid and then yrs later find out he was in Jefferson and 6 yrs later (1 yr and 2 months after he died) find out it was multiple prisons and my husband had spent most of his adult life in prison.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37570 January 17, 2013 Quote Highway Patrol has State wide jurisdiction and would not require any other LE.... LE I would assume is Law Enforcement. Not sure if that is true or was true in 1990 or even now. The local police department and Sheriffs office handles most thing. I think to only reason the Hwy Patrol was involved is that it fell under State Law when it came to fraudulent drivers license. In fact the State was responsible for the drivers license testing and purchase until the last few yrs. My last license was issued at a Florida Highway Patrol office a few yrs ago and my next one will be issued at the local county tax collectors office. Tells me things change - and not for the better.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 244 #37571 January 17, 2013 I'm just curious, Robert. In the article you write: "There are three basic types of people in this cult. The first are the people who celebrate Cooper's life because he was the guy who 'stuck it to the man' for two hundred grand (just over a million in today's dollars) and never got caught..... "The second group are the unbiased civilian investigators, or writers with an interest in the case..... "The third group are the most dangerous type in this cult. They are the folks who either don't want to know who the hijacker was because they live solely for the discussion, or the people who push one suspect to the exclusion of all others." You know most of us put you in the third group. Which group do you consider yourself in? Well, it was tricky for me to use the word 'cult' to refer to Cooper fans and investigators in the article. The word generally has a negative connotation. But I think in some ways it's the best way to describe the core group of folks with a stronger-than-normal interest in the case. I thought the word 'groupies' was a bit too lightweight, and it is true that some people are obsessive about the case. Geoff Gray alluded to this quite a bit in his book. I don't consider folks like the Citizen Sleuths or Geoff Gray 'cultists,' but more like the Voices of Reason and Sensibility on the fringes of it. I thought the article was a pretty honest look at what Cooperland is really about. Since you are asking, no...I don't consider myself a Cooper Nut. For one thing, I don't hunt down outside articles and make phony comments using other peoples' names. I don't make ridiculously wild claims on Christiansen, (meaning: been wrong, but I don't lie to people) and most importantly, I don't claim to know that KC was the hijacker. It's hard to ignore the available evidence, but just as hard to ignore some of the negative evidence. I've always maintained it won't be DNA that solves the case, but verifiable witness testimony. Prints could do it, but no one really knows if any of the 66 prints are a match to the hijacker. So...even if they had a good suspect and got his prints, they still might not match. I figure I'm in the second group, but a few rungs down from people like Gray or the Citizen Sleuths. 'The stupid things you do, you regret if you have any sense, and if you don't regret them, maybe you're stupid...' Katherine Hepburn Hi Marilyn, I mean Kate. I guess its Kate now! Maybe you just suffer from not knowing what the word "cult" means. I mean, you really are not entitled to make up your own definition, Kate. Quoting: "The word cult in current popular usage usually refers to a new religious movement or other group whose beliefs or practices are considered abnormal or bizarre.[1] The word originally denoted a system of ritual practices. The word was first used in the early 17th century denoting homage paid to a divinity and borrowed via the French culte from Latin cultus "worship", from the adjective cultus meaning "inhabited, worshipped", derived from the verb colere "care, cultivate."[2] In the 1930s cults became the object of sociological study in the context of the study of religious behavior. They have been criticized by mainstream Christians for their unorthodox beliefs. In the 1970s the anticult movement arose, partly motivated by acts of violence and other crimes committed by members of some cults (notably the Manson Family and People's Temple). Some of the claims of the anti-cult movement have been disputed by other scholars, leading to further controversies." While most scholars no longer refer to any new religious movements as cults, some sociologists still favor retaining the word as it was used in church-sect typologies. For this value-neutral use of the word, please refer to new religious movements. Other scholars and non-academic researchers who use the word do so from explicitly critical perspectives which focus on the relationship between cult groups and the individual people who join them. These perspectives share the assumption that some form of 'coercive' persuasion or mind control is used to recruit and maintain members by suppressing their ability to reason, think critically, and make choices in their own best interest. However, most social scientists believe that mind control theories have no scientific merit in relation to religious movements ..." Now you know what the word "cult" means, or maybe you don't care what it means, which may be the salient point of your butchering the use of the word!? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 244 #37572 January 17, 2013 QuoteWho are you to provide me with pasted-over definitions? LOL you can't even get my name right. (Hint: It isn't Kate, and I'm not answering the same question twice.) Be careful Kate/Marilyn/Bill you could get labeled as a cult leader with egotistical venom like that! Here's the url ... the proof you demand! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cult Seen any more ufo's or liars on broomsticks today? Have any response yet from the major news outlets you sent your 'FBI Pdf' to ? Have they shown interest or run any news stories? ... whoever you are posting here! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
377 22 #37573 January 17, 2013 Jo, A felony committed by a young person over 18 isn't necessarily the end of the line for them. Even Florida has a youthful offender statute designed to give young people a second chance. http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/Chapter958/All The Feds have similar statutes. As I recall the max age for eligibility for the federal youthful offender program was 23. These programs don't work for most participants. But still, it's good to give kids one last chance for rehabilitation. 3772018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37574 January 17, 2013 I do not read articles outside of Newpapers, Reliable Magazines with article I can choose to read or not read. I watch little TV. I have a pretty good education. To refer to CULT when talking about Cooper is absurd. Do you actually know what a CULT is? It is a GROUP of people who follow a teaching. NO one in the DZ fits the profile of a CULT! You and your book are the most absurd part of the on going Cooper saga.... No one celebrates Cooper's life, just the fact that he beat the system. Most people look at the pros and cons with some being more analytical. They view things from scientific angle. This make them informed,but doesn't make them right and they know this. You are the only one who can't stop promoting a subject that is totally illogical - no where near the description and his image has been dredged from the grave. You use all your resources to continue to promote and preach about KC. Yet, KC did not walk down from the mountain with "I am Cooper" written on a stone tablet. Now that MIGHT be CULT. Blevins Christiansen CULT - BCC.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #37575 January 17, 2013 QuoteJo, A felony committed by a young person over 18 isn't necessarily the end of the line for them. Even Florida has a youthful offender statute designed to give young people a second chance. http://www.flsenate.gov/Laws/Statutes/2011/Chapter958/All The Feds have similar statutes. As I recall the max age for eligibility for the federal youthful offender program was 23. These programs don't work for most participants. But still, it's good to give kids one last chance for rehabilitation. 377 I will read it, but I was under the impression it does NOT expunge the file as though it never existed. Could still be pulled up by colleges to deny scholarships and admission and employment. Being a school teach is completely out.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
