skyjack71 0 #33526 August 12, 2012 Quotemy understanding is Duane was in Wa the 555 was in Oregon I'm sure they went there on calls" but they trained in Pendelton Oregon. Like BK's story why would they feel the need to use convicts in training exercises, my guess is they would use there own guys sort of like a job by starting from the bottom and moving up, or if they did use them it would have been something that was larger than they could handle themselves. There was a WAR - Our guys were overseas and weary. Only when our guys started coming home in 1946 - did the man power improve. There were women doing jobs men usually did. There was still a shortage of manpower in the states even in 1948 as it took time to wind down the war efforts. When they did come home there were few jobs as the war effort had provided jobs no longer needed. I know this history - my father and my family lived it and in 1945 penicillin was hard to find in the states - it was all going to save the lives of injured soldiers. The aftermath of WW11 was a matter of recovery and discovery!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #33527 August 12, 2012 Ever wonder why I ask for a particular page in its entirety? Because I have it! The sites, are the books in digital format, the sites are correct, just as correct as the book they happened to be written from! It is memory and understanding that is incorrect. IMO, if you just wanted to know about Duane's sordid past and not wanting to be married to the "one that got away", then you would not be here focused on that. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #33528 August 12, 2012 QuoteQuote Well, since May of 1945 is a fact, adjust and retell, then. I am ignoring all the PA's, they aren't really a reflection of me any way. I taught and lived Paratrooper History for 21 years. I sat with the members of the ABN Test Platoon, Original Triple Nickles, Easy Company and others numerous times. I take all their stories the same, memories from a proud bunch, glowing over time. Just like mine. Then I look up the official documentation and lay out the facts, their stories are the emotional meat to it. Matt WHAT IS A PA? I need to see documentation other than what is on a SITE - for the date the 555 went to WA. I had always been told it was in Late 1944 or that could be when they got the orders to go and then went to WA in January of 1945. Snow was still on the ground - they were in training mode in the mountains! Look at the pictures. Look at the attire they are wearing. Was this a training session or a tape of an actual fire fight? What you happened to be told was wrong. They got orders to go from the 555th "Triple Nickle" all black Parachute Company, to the 555th "Triple Nickle" all black Parachute Battalion, this was on November of 1944, this is not only on their site (which you ignore) but in their numerous books and Army Documents. In May 1945 when the whole of the reinforced Company (see not the whole battalion went) arrived it was late spring. Blevins, Amazon and the other NWer's will tell ya it is not uncommon for snow to still fall and or be on the ground. Go into the mountains and the possibility increases. Happened to me as a young troop in Washington and as a Kid in NorCal. But if your equating the "sheepskins" to meaning winter you would be misunderstanding. They wore the sheepskins since there was no other item in the Army Airborne inventory they could wear for the protection they needed when landing in rough terrain, Dreery even commended this! So they wore the Bomber Crews High Altitude Apparel, "Sheepskins". But enough with the history lessons. How does this apply to Duane? Lay it out, month by month year by year, from his birth to his death. One line entries. If it connects, it connects, so far there is not a "Ah hah" connection. MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33529 August 12, 2012 Quotemy understanding is Duane was in Wa the 555 was in Oregon I'm sure they went there on calls" but they trained in Pendelton Oregon. Like BK's story why would they feel the need to use convicts in training exercises, my guess is they would use there own guys sort of like a job by starting from the bottom and moving up, or if they did use them it would have been something that was larger than they could handle themselves. Duane was in Id, Wa and Or. I have already placed him at the Dalles - and right now I forget the name of bar. I have NEVER tried to place Duane just in WA. because the things he showed me and told me indicated he was all over the 3 state area. Why he mentioned flying in and out of several airports - I thought maybe it was with family, but was assured by his survivors it was not family. The only time I asked about this was when we were going to NV and Duane mentioned towns over toward the East. Prineville and Redmond. Talked about flying in and out of Redmond. I asked who the guys were he referred to - his answer was just some guys we did business with. I believe I did ask What Business and he was astute at changing the subject. This when I knew it was a part of his life he would tell me about when he was ready. Remember Ed Hurand had slipped up and I kept my promise to this man as I kept every promise I made if it was in my power to do so.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33530 August 12, 2012 Quote Quote once you turn 18 you go to the big boys prison, Duane was 19 so off he went, since it was a Federal crime this makes sense on him being able to leave CA. What was the Federal Law on the age in 1945? I have been told it was 21...in 1945. 377: You are a CA attorney - find the correct answer to this problem. I'm pretty sure it's always been 18, Clarence Carnes was 18 when he was sent to Alcatraz in 1945 born 1927 (Alcatraz was a Federal Prison) Carnes arrived on Alcatraz on July 6, 1945. On May 2, 1946, Carnes and five other inmates participated in a failed attempt to escape from Alcatraz which turned into the bloody "Battle of Alcatraz", so-called because three inmates and two prison officers died. After the escape failed, he was tried for murder along with the two other survivors, Sam Shockley and Miran Edgar Thompson, and was found guilty of participating in the plot. Shockley and Thompson were sentenced to death, while Carnes was given a 99-year sentence instead of death, because he had not directly participated in the murder of the officers.[citation needed] Carnes remained on Alcatraz until its closure in 1963, spending most of the time there in the segregation unit. ATTENTION BK, the escape from Alcatraz in 1962 is also a unsolved mystery, is it possible this was a failed attempt to tighten security in the prison system started by the President to the Pentagon down to the prison guards union?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33531 August 12, 2012 Georger stated: "What people do question is the relevance of any of this to Jo Weber's fables, and conjectures of fables. There has never been anything regarding the name Duane Weber, that interfaces with any of this in known reality in the known world." Georger: I just LOVE the way you play with WORDS. Like "We" - you mess up on that one sometimes don't you? Again the name "Duane Weber", YOU know Duane used many AKA's and the nickname "Dusty". I have NO idea what name he was using in the area. When a man is confesses to a MAJOR crime - I would thing the FBI could have done better on CHECKING his where-abouts over the yrs. The FBI claimed in 2000 Duane was never in the Army or in McNeil. We proved them WRONG on both counts. Someone has gone to a lot of trouble to COVER the tracks of Duane Weber aka who-ever during a crucial period of time - time he spent with the Guys in WA, OR, ID and probably NV, but only 2 comments maded regarding NV. Coure'd Alene and Duane's connections to Missoula have never been explained - yet, he was there...and he could never GO BACK. WHY? East of WA and near ID on the upper range of mountains - I forget the name of this - but, there was a road u could travel only in the summer months that could get you from Seattle and to ID. Duane talked about the GUYS going over the US border North of Seattle named little towns which I found are actually there. Duane Weber knew the area - all of it without a map. NO WAY a man knows these things the way he did unless he lived and worked there for an extended period of time. Since we know WHERE he was until he die with the exception of the yrs. 1945 to 1948. The 1962 to 1968 is sketchy but mostly filled in. SO WHEN AND WHERE DID DUANE WEBER OBTAIN ALL OF THIS KNOWLEDGE OF THE N.W.? You do not get it out of a book. Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33532 August 12, 2012 READ this carefully: Take NOTE of dates and how it is worded. On 5 May 1945, the battalion left Camp Mackall for Oregon. The move was made in about six days. Ninety-eight percent of it by rail the rest by battalion motor vehicle or private auto - including Graphite. Sergeant Lowry and two other NCO’s brought the faithful old Ford cross-country. SOME of THESE GUYS were ALREADY training in the WA area and housed at a place where locals noted strange thing had been going on. The Government did NOT want the knowledge of the Balloons to become public until the actual forces were ON the ground...as the feared a mass panic re-action. Some of the guys (the 555's) had already arrived in WA and were being trained by Derry and his guys - prior to the whole battalion going. How do I know this? Well, if I told you it wouldn't be a secret would it? Why the GOVERNMENT would want to keep the Balloons and any actions Secret is OBVIOUS!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33533 August 12, 2012 QuoteI taught and lived Paratrooper History for 21 years. I sat with the members of the ABN Test Platoon, Original Triple Nickles, Easy Company and others numerous times. Matt Well, the entire battalion was NOT sent until the early summer, but a group had already been to WA to be trained by Derry in the VERY early spring - snow was still on the ground. If they waited until May - many lives could have been lost to what they feared was CHEMICAL WARFARE. Perhaps you need to talk to your superiors about getting a higher clearance level. So you can TEACH the HISTORY of the 555's Operation Firefly! Use your noggin!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33534 August 12, 2012 yes, now explain why they would allow convicts in on a secret operation? without Duane being a part of this I don't understand why this is so relevant?????? this all sounds so bizarre that I don't understand the connection of ww2 Jap balloons and DB Cooper????? as Matt explained the fact of a person needing very good experience just to jump out of the plane into the nite and possibly landing in rough terrain, this can not be done by over looking what someone has taken years to achieve! I'm trying to make sense of this but I'm coming up short....sorry! KC had parachute training Gossett had training Mayfield had training it still doesn't put them on the plane!"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33535 August 12, 2012 Quote I don't think they are going to be wrong on there own site? Because the first part is still classified and should not be. Do a little investigation: WHAT WAS THE DATE THE MOTHER AND CHILDREN GOT KILLED BY THE BALLOON? Contact The Dalles, OR and Washouga, WA and find out about the STRANGE goings on at Camp Bonneville before the 555's OFFICIALLY went WEST. Why do I even bother. I thought a couple of yrs ago when certain documents were released - the US Government would finally AIR out the Secret Closet. Right NOW I am fed up with Government Secrets - kept for how many yrs? This one is WELL over due for Public acknowledgment. 41 yrs is 3 yrs too late and I am tired of sitting still with them waiting for me to die. Because an ex-con obtained enough knowledge to pull off a SkyJacking in 1971 from a "secret operation" from the 40's and they can't reveal his involvement. Absolutely NO ONE is that stupid and this is the kind of garbage in an election yr the government continuely wants us to swallow. Secrets aren't secret anymore and this one I have known for 2 yrs. It did NOT take a rocket scientist to figure it out after Sluggo's visit, JT's odd behaviour and the way Himmelsbach always kept his answers fine tuned, the strange stories I heard in WA in 2010, which coincided with the things Duane had told me on that trip,...Old people talk and I spent my time going to Senior Centers in the N.W. The reactions of the FBI - HANDS OFF! The DL Cooper thing - the FBI did NOT expect Marla to get out of hand. I thought they would let go with information last yr and NOW with all of the CRAP being thrown out here on the thread (I realize they are still trying to hide the past) - I am tired of waiting! The government is still trying to hide the past - parts of it are just that the past and NO reason for these things to remain secret anymore. So what - a con-man used his government gained knowledge to skyjack a plane - what is worst are the tactics the government has use to silence his widow.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
georger 244 #33536 August 12, 2012 Quote Georger stated: "What people do question is the relevance of any of this to Jo Weber's fables, and conjectures of fables. There has never been anything regarding the name Duane Weber, that interfaces with any of this in known reality in the known world." Georger: I just LOVE the way you play with WORDS. Like "We" - you mess up on that one sometimes don't you? Again the name "Duane Weber", YOU know Duane used many AKA's and the nickname "Dusty". I have NO idea what name he was using in the area. When a man is confesses to a MAJOR crime - I would thing the FBI could have done better on CHECKING his where-abouts over the yrs. Well there is a huge distinction! It was DUANE USING FAKE NAMES, not some GOVT forcing him to use fake names in a cover up operation! The cover up was Duanes! He was using aliases even before the arrest record and alleged military-parachuting-special ops period you keep talking about. That is documented by his early arrest records prior to the period you are talking about... Thi is cited in his early Florida arrest record and the newspaper article about it. Moreover, you arent stupid. You know this. But you ignore the inconveninent truth, just as Blevins ignors inconvenient truths. Now here you are again (just like Blevins) trying to blame you fraud on me via my use of language? The one has nothing to do with the other. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BobKnoss 0 #33537 August 12, 2012 I'm trying to make sense of this but I'm coming up short....sorry! KC had parachute training Gossett had training Mayfield had training _____________________________ Figures. Weber had lots of first class training. I watched it summer of 1968. 3 guys. DW, a trainer and a spotter. Spotter and trainer would trade off jobs each week. Flying Cloud Airport, Shakopee, Mn. Now Burnsville, MN. Age old jumping center in Minnesota. Pilot Training School, parachute jumps. Plane for rent. Lindstrom Owner. Records not available. POOF! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33538 August 12, 2012 Jo it will take me about 20 seconds to get the date, I have seen and read about the balloons, it has no relation to the DB Cooper case. ok, Daune has knowledge of parachuting with 555....now what?"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33539 August 12, 2012 Bob, shut up and go away!!!"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #33540 August 12, 2012 QuoteQuoteI taught and lived Paratrooper History for 21 years. I sat with the members of the ABN Test Platoon, Original Triple Nickles, Easy Company and others numerous times. Matt Well, the entire battalion was NOT sent until the early summer, but a group had already been to WA to be trained by Derry in the VERY early spring - snow was still on the ground. If they waited until May - many lives could have been lost to what they feared was CHEMICAL WARFARE. Perhaps you need to talk to your superiors about getting a higher clearance level. So you can TEACH the HISTORY of the 555's Operation Firefly! Use your noggin! "They" actually went to the N.W. before May of 1945. It was only the OFFICIAL move of the battalion in May this is referencing. SOME of THESE GUYS were ALREADY training in the WA area and housed at a place where locals noted strange thing had been going on." Any proof? even the Officers of the unit dispute this, the Army Records, USFS, as does Derry's notes, and the book "The History of Smoke Jumpers". Again it means nothing until you can prove it has anything to do with Duane. Plus you still have to get him ALL the skills he needs to make the complete jump. Just observing won't cut it. I have been on the bridge of numerous A/C Carriers, I am not capable of driving one! I have flown IN numerous Cargo A/C and been on the flight deck on them all, I can't land 'em! I watched every episode of McGyver, but I can make a bomb from a paperclip, pizza roll, and a spark plug! MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33541 August 12, 2012 Quote Quote Quote I taught and lived Paratrooper History for 21 years. I sat with the members of the ABN Test Platoon, Original Triple Nickles, Easy Company and others numerous times. Matt Well, the entire battalion was NOT sent until the early summer, but a group had already been to WA to be trained by Derry in the VERY early spring - snow was still on the ground. If they waited until May - many lives could have been lost to what they feared was CHEMICAL WARFARE. Perhaps you need to talk to your superiors about getting a higher clearance level. So you can TEACH the HISTORY of the 555's Operation Firefly! Use your noggin! "They" actually went to the N.W. before May of 1945. It was only the OFFICIAL move of the battalion in May this is referencing. SOME of THESE GUYS were ALREADY training in the WA area and housed at a place where locals noted strange thing had been going on." Any proof? even the Officers of the unit dispute this, the Army Records, USFS, as does Dreery's notes, and the book "The History of Smoke Jumpers". Again it means nothing until you can prove it has anything to do with Duane. Plus you still have to get him ALL the skills he needs to make the complete jump. Just observing won't cut it. I have been on the bridge of numerous A/C Carriers, I am not capable of driving one! I have flown IN numerous Cargo A/C and been on the flight deck on them all, I can't land 'em! I watched every episode of McGyver, but I can make a bomb from a paperclip, pizza roll, and a spark plug! Matt that all sounds about right, but the question I want to ask you is....how many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop? "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
matthewcline 0 #33542 August 12, 2012 MattAn Instructors first concern is student safety. So, start being safe, first!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 50 #33543 August 12, 2012 Quote The Government did NOT want the knowledge of the Balloons to become public until the actual forces were ON the ground...as the feared a mass panic re-action. Why the GOVERNMENT would want to keep the Balloons and any actions Secret is OBVIOUS! Jo, Where do you come up with this nonsense? Do you get it from one of your famous books? While it was certainly a good idea to keep the information about the balloon bombs out of the media, so the Japanese couldn't benefit from the information, said information did appear even in national magazines as has been mentioned in this thread previously. The balloon bombs were common knowledge in my area of WA state in WW2. I saw one of them. They did not strike fear in my young heart or the hearts of anyone else that I knew. There was no "public panic". Your continued and deliberate mistatements of the actual facts only demonstrate how far you will twist the truth in a last ditch effort to link Duane in any manner possible to the Cooper hijacking. You have never been able to come up with any evidence to suggest that Duane was anything but an inept small time crook who had a big mouth and was good at conning people such as yourself. Robert99 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33544 August 12, 2012 Georger stated: Quote "What people do question is the relevance of any of this to Jo Weber's fables, and conjectures of fables. There has never been anything regarding the name Duane Weber, that interfaces with any of this in known reality in the known world." I just LOVE the way you play with WORDS. Like "We" - you mess up on that one sometimes don't you? Again the name "Duane Weber", YOU know Duane used many AKA's and the nickname "Dusty". I have NO idea what name he was using in the area. When a man confesses to a MAJOR crime - I would thing the FBI could have done better on CHECKING his where-abouts over the yrs and his AKA's. Georger states: Quote Well there is a huge distinction! Georger states: Quote It was DUANE USING FAKE NAMES, not some GOVT forcing him to use fake names in a cover up operation! The cover up was Duanes! Georger states: Quote He was using aliases even before the arrest record and alleged military-parachuting-special ops period you keep talking about. That is documented by his early arrest records prior to the period you are talking about... Oh Really just when was that. So you aren't privey to confidential information? You old GOAT! You just hung yourself on that one! Georger states: Quote Moreover, you arent stupid. You know this. But you ignore the inconveninent truth, just as Blevins ignorers inconvenient truths. Now here you are again (just like Blevins) trying to blame your fraud on me via my use of language? Oh Really, How my dear would I do that? Perhaps it is only your guilty conscience in having to contribute to the concealments required by your employer.Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33545 August 12, 2012 Jo, don't you think you are spinning a little out of control? you are sounding like Knoss by lashing out on people providing some facts that they feel are the actual ones! when someone provides evidence on here the first thing done is to check it, if it has a snag people will then show the problem, understand that this is what has been done "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skyjack71 0 #33546 August 12, 2012 Quote Jo, don't you think you are spinning a little out of control? you are sounding like Knoss by lashing out on people providing some facts that they feel are the actual ones! when someone provides evidence on here the first thing done is to check it, if it has a snag people will then show the problem, understand that this is what has been done Sorry, You are right. Guess I need to get off the computer and check out my ego. Just I have sat on so much for so long and then - BANG here comes this supposed expert who really doesn't know anything but what he reads on the sites. It is a fact that they were WORKING on this BEFORE the entire Unit was sent out! No way they let an entire UNIT know what might be happening as they didn't have security clearances. Even today - that is how it is!Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33547 August 12, 2012 "It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
airtwardo 7 #33548 August 12, 2012 that all sounds about right, but the question I want to ask you is....how many licks does it take to get to the center of a Tootsie Pop? ~ 343 Unless you're Chuck Norris. Then the center of the Tootsie Pop just kind of presents itself of it's own accord. ~ If you choke a Smurf, what color does it turn? ~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Robert99 50 #33549 August 12, 2012 Quote Quote Jo, don't you think you are spinning a little out of control? you are sounding like Knoss by lashing out on people providing some facts that they feel are the actual ones! when someone provides evidence on here the first thing done is to check it, if it has a snag people will then show the problem, understand that this is what has been done Sorry, You are right. Guess I need to get off the computer and check out my ego. Just I have sat on so much for so long and then - BANG here comes this supposed expert who really doesn't know anything but what he reads on the sites. It is a fact that they were WORKING on this BEFORE the entire Unit was sent out! No way they let an entire UNIT know what might be happening as they didn't have security clearances. Even today - that is how it is! Jo, You didn't need a security clearance. All you needed to do was open your eyes and look up. I and other people I know did exactly that and what we saw didn't send us running for a bomb shelter (we didn't have one in the first place) nor did it cause us to panic. You should start calling yourself Mrs. Knoss. Robert99 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mrshutter45 21 #33550 August 12, 2012 Quote Quote Quote Jo, don't you think you are spinning a little out of control? you are sounding like Knoss by lashing out on people providing some facts that they feel are the actual ones! when someone provides evidence on here the first thing done is to check it, if it has a snag people will then show the problem, understand that this is what has been done Sorry, You are right. Guess I need to get off the computer and check out my ego. Just I have sat on so much for so long and then - BANG here comes this supposed expert who really doesn't know anything but what he reads on the sites. It is a fact that they were WORKING on this BEFORE the entire Unit was sent out! No way they let an entire UNIT know what might be happening as they didn't have security clearances. Even today - that is how it is! Jo, You didn't need a security clearance. All you needed to do was open your eyes and look up. I and other people I know did exactly that and what we saw didn't send us running for a bomb shelter (we didn't have one in the first place) nor did it cause us to panic. You should start calling yourself Mrs. Knoss. Robert99 here is a nice pic of the balloon bomb and where they were spotted and exploded."It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
