DB Cooper

[mrshutter45 21]

"Maybe one or two, at most three important questions should be asked. If the letter is done well, that might be all you would need. Flying both routes, if they differ, makes perfect sense."

I think something like this would interest him a lot. once I have his attention, I can start asking questions. I already have information about how the plane was flown to certain extents that are not publicly known. this would help confirm them. I hope you are now understanding the importance of where the plane was in order to help find the actual dropzone. or sadly the point of impact I don't know if anything can be found, but it's worth a shot.


this is for Robert99. could you repeat again where Ralph said he was with the helicopter? I would like to fly around that area.

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[mrshutter45 21]

"Yet, Jo says that Rataczak told her that 305 was closer to V-23 and saw the lights of Portland and Vancouver coming up as he approached the WA-OR border."

this is plausible in my opinion. that is if he could see thru the clouds. the best spot for him to see Portland & Vancouver would be the 8:15 spot on the map. this would be from the co-pilots seat looking out the side window. was it an opening in the clouds, a glow thru the clouds?

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[skyjack71 0]

RobertMBlevins

Yes, Rataczak's wife has been ill. Rataczak also got hit by a gravel truck a few years ago while riding his bike. (True) Doesn't mean he ignores the telephone.

He has a way to filter unwanted calls. There is a lot going on in their lives and the last thing they needs is an intrusions. I do have some brief communications we made by email & and we have spoke by phone - only a handful of times in all of these yrs.

There is ONLY one person on this thread he might talk to and I expect this person has communicated with him already - Robert99. Not knowing Robert99 personally, but having spoke to the co-pilot by phone and by email it is my opinion out of all the personalities on this thread since 2006 that Robert 99 is the most likely but at this date - even that is slim to none.

I know that the co-pilot wanted to come see me and the last time we spoke - we both shared that thought one more time, but life is an unexpected challenge for some us in our 70's.

My last contact with him was after the Jefferson pic of Duane was posted.
I sent that to him, using it as the background - it was impressive and he was impressed. I do NOT remember right now his response, but do remember - he did NOT see the skyjacker.

He was impressed with the picture and the comparisons - but, I do not know if he shared them with the rest of the crew or if they keep in contact.

I keep my distance because I have been in his shoes. Remember he is a cancer survior himself. If and When he is ready to speak he will - and he may not know the forum is still active or the lenght of it....nor does he care at this stage of his life. He did his job and that is all anyone can expect of him.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

RobertMBlevins

******It would be interesting to check missing-person reports on white males between 11/24/1971 and say, 1/15/1972, limiting it to residents of Oregon and Washington to start. A tough job, though. But if Cooper is dead, that's probably where you would find him.

Robert, this was checked out by the FBI and there have been posts on it. Tom Kaye posted several months ago about a Canadian who disappeared about that time. And -- Vicki please correct me on this if I'm wrong -- Mel Wilson is only talked about as a potential suspect because he disappeared shortly before the hijacking.

This is completely subjective, but I don't believe Cooper was Canadian for a couple of reasons.

First reason is because the stews said he had 'no discernable accent' (on the wanted poster) along with 'possibly from the Midwest'. (same thing)

I have spent literally months at a time in Canada, and not just in BC, either. Canadians speak English all right (yes, there are French Canadians, of course) but I never mistook one of them as an American. Maybe that's because I'm from Washington and the stews were not. I don't know. But they certainly have a unique way with the English language, eh? I love Canadians, whom I consider America's first line of defense, but I never spoke to one where I ever mistook him as coming from the good old USA. From A to Zed.

I have also spent considerable time in Canada all over Can'ada.
Eh? Part of my family is Canadian. It sort of depends where you
go in Canada as to the type and thickness of accent; Canada is
a big country with all kinds of cultural groups, not unlike the US
itself.

There also are Americans living in Canada who come and go
freely, especially in prior times before visas were required.
These people have/had dual citizensip. And many with the
socalled "Midwestern no accent".

It might have been more productive to look at which type
of "no accent" Cooper's "no accent was" ... as much depends on
the hearer in these matters.

Listen to Tina on the CBS News report. What type of accent
does she have? The same for Rzk and Scott.

[georger 247]

mrshutter45

what Robert Blevins doesn't seem to understand is fact of the path being put together in a rush. this is where mistakes can and will happen. I can't tell you if the FP is 100% accurate, or 100% inaccurate. we have a gap between the flight path and the FBI. we have bits a pieces of how it was put together. the computer cards are either missing, or no longer around. we have reports from different key people telling different stories.

the radio transcripts do not tell all. lots of gaps in them where transmissions surely took place. 8:10 to 8:20 and only one transmission? they had to have been talking up a storm from 8:10 to 9:00 in my opinion.

people make mistakes. we have a guy who jumped out of a plane. they originally thought it was close to Merwin Lake. this has now changed. that should be proof right there that even smart guys make mistakes. by not understanding the facts surrounding how the path was made, the sage radar issues, time frames not matching. you have to start thinking something is wrong. the times frames are incorrect and impossible right out of the gate with getting 14 miles DME in the time frame they report.

I was always wondering about the flight path, but, didn't have enough knowledge about it. I feel I have a stronger grip now more than others after studying the path, radar etc. I have uncovered the start time I believe the plane took off at, and can make the time frame given to the Toledo area. the only thing that doesn't match is the 14 miles DME. the second part of the leg I am having trouble matching. this is due to the weather system functioning improperly which is probably giving inaccurate times between Toledo and Merwin. if the winds aloft are incorrect, you get a different ending time. this is where I came to the conclusion the system was not up to par for this course.

any cop will tell you when they pick up a cold case they must go through all the evidence making sure no mistakes were made. there seems to be clues pointing to faults in the path. by simply stating that it couldn't be wrong based on the backgrounds of who made the path is failing to see the real picture, or the possibility of something going wrong. this is a good starting point from where the crime started. right after it took off. that's where you start looking. IMO the same goes for who Cooper is. you start with the description. if it doesn't match, you must start looking elsewhere.

I realize the start of the crime took place just after taking off from Portland, but, the plane could have done 14 loops and stopped at Denny's and got a hamburger for Cooper before it landed at SEA. the actual crime started once they were back in the air after meeting his demands. IMO this is where the crime started.

I get teased that I am only on a game, but, this system is not a game. the dynamics a very close to the real thing. I'm flying a plane designed for three. I'm all alone up there lol. the new system will have two people running it. it has whats called a ISO Instructors Operating Station. this person will be able to act as the co-pilot and control the weather. this can be done with someone here, or someone over the internet. it has a black box that will record the data put into it and can be printed out. I also have a normal life just as many other people have. I can't put this together over night. there have been many bumps along the road with computers, software and spare time learning how to fly. I enjoy ever second of this project and have a really cool simulator that easily transforms into a race car if I feel the need for speed

I believe I'm done now (applause) ...Hey, I heard some Boo's in there

By 1976 Himmelsbach was telling the news media "12 miles north
of Portland". He didnt state a longitude.

From about the end of 1972 to 1976 the news media was
regularly asking if the FBI had made a mistake on where Cooper bailed.

[georger 247]

RobertMBlevins

No boos from me on your current work regarding the flight path. I know you've invested both your own money and a lot of time working on that project.

Why doesn't someone call Rataczak and ASK about the flight path? People wanted me to do it. But, I don't feel good about doing that because I am the one who has accused a former NWA employee of being a crook. I'm not sure if Rataczak cares about that...I mean he did talk to Porteous and KC was discussed...but I just don't feel comfortable doing it.

This question needs to be asked of Rataczak by a pilot. Rataczak is in the phone book. However...be warned. He screens the calls heavily. If he doesn't recognize your name on that Caller ID, he's not going to pick up. So you should be prepared with a short message when you call. I would just go for the obvious, which is to say you have a quick question about the flight path of 305. Rataczak told Porteous that he has been doing his own research on the hijacking for years, which means he is still interested in the case.

I'm also going to suggest someone NEUTRAL make the call. That means not Robert99, not Bruce Smith, and not me. An outside pilot with little or no interest in the Cooper case. Robert99 or Shutter probably know someone. I don't even care if Shutter makes the call, since I consider him the most neutral of anyone here who is actively working on this problem with the flight path.

What is the One Big Question for Rataczak?

Was Flight 305 WEST of the path shown on the FBI's official map? Especially north of Portland or in the Woodland/Vancouver area.

Shutter: If you make the call and he calls you back, take notes. And if you say Rataczak says this or that...I will believe that is what he said. Believe it or not, I do trust your word that anything you quote from Rataczak would be accurate.

Read the thread!

[georger 247]

mrshutter45

"It's almost like you're afriad of what he might say."

let's be a little realistic here Robert. I'm not afraid of anything he would say. I just told you a letter would be the best result. I would like this option. not anyone else. I would touch base with him first of all. I would then explain my project to him. I wouldn't jump right into asking a million things from him.

the main goal here is to see if the path can match the time frames. if we find other options such as Rataczak stating a different version. two different paths will be plotted out. we could possibly find answers between the two. thats if his reply differs greatly with the known path. I'm not going to send him a quiz. I think this would interest him enough to call me. I know you are trying to help,but, do not do anything without consulting me if it has anything to do with my project.

any outside information dealing with the original flight path will be skewed. as mentioned above. if we find out later the path is different according to the guy who flew the plane. we will then no longer have the original flight path. so, once again we fly the path the way the FBI believes it to be, and has been this way for 40+ years. then compare it to what Rataczak and possibly other sources tell us and make a separate path. this way both are verified.

Let's be clear about one thing: a number of people say the
reason Blev's promised interview never happned is because Rzk
refused to talk to him. Period.

Rzk stil has a life in spite of his personal problems. He's a very
rational guy by all accounts (from rational people).

Who are my sources in this? People who have talked to Rzk
dozens of times who could call him tomorrow.

Rataczak has aready given interviows on all of thse points! I
doubt his information is going to change. The FBI has talked to
Rataczak countless times.

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Yet, Jo says that Rataczak told her that 305 was closer to V-23 and saw the lights of Portland and Vancouver coming up as he approached the WA-OR border.

Well, for starters get it STRAIGHT what was said between myself and Bill in 2004. Portland was not mentioned.
but VANCOUVER was. He could see the lights (haze) of Vancouver to his right! I am not a pilot so you figure out what that meant.


Our conversations was about the places Duane took me and what I saw and they were on target with what he said. Now I am NOT going there again - as I have discussed this before and when I do I am misquoted as above. There was a written accounting of our conversation and i am not going to try to remember it at this point in time. It contradicts what you guys have claimed - I do remember one thing - Trout Airport.

Authorities and others know where that plane crossed the river....and why!

But I was reamed up one side and down the other over that by JT - so I just do NOT say anything about if any more.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

We have the Canadians here in our area for 3 to 4 months every yr. as they like this area since it is not as populated as other areas. This particular part of the gulf get a lot seniors and they own most of the condo. When they come I feel like I belong - do not know why - just that the beach is cooler and yet for us seniors it is just right. The only time I go to the beach is when our neighbor from Canada come down.

They SOUND just like us. One can spot a New Yorker in a heart beat, but not a Canadian. I keep some of my family Dr.s business card so they have a local senior Dr. the can use and we have two urgent centers. Last yr I even gave someone the name of a dentist they needed to see. Every yr there is a large welcoming party for them - they pic up lots of coupons and maps and other information they
might need if this is their 1s trip.

It gets so hot here in the summer I wish I could go to Canada with them at least for July August and Sept. If I was younger and healthier - I would love to do a trade off those 3 months in Canada - I have a large spare bedroom with it's own bath and I live in a very good area 1 1/2 miles from the bay and then another mile to the beach over the bridge to the most beach - 13 miles of reserve land that cannot be built on but there are some great places to go to the beach in privacy along those 13 miles. Before Ivan in 2004 - there were lots of Dunes and the beach was complelely unspoiled - things are changing.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[Robert99 50]

mrshutter45

this is for Robert99. could you repeat again where Ralph said he was with the helicopter? I would like to fly around that area.

Shutter, the following is on pages 46, 47, and 48 of Himmelsbach's book.

The first chase aircraft for the airliner was a USAF T-33 on a night training mission out of Portland International. It took off to the west and was shortly afterwards directed toward Lake Oswego where it ended up about three miles behind the hijacked airliner. But the two pilots on board never had visual contact with the airliner.

The book states that two F-102s were dispatched from the Idaho Air National Guard in Boise but did not make contact with the airliner.

The book also states that two F-106s took off from Hamilton AFB in California but did not see the airliner.

Only the C-130, which was also from Hamilton AFB, was able to make contact and it stayed with the airliner until it landed in Reno.

On page 47, Himmelsbach states that the National Guard helicopter, with him onboard, took off from Portland International and flew south.

On page 42, Himmelsbach describes the helicopter lift-off from Portland International as follows:

"We lifted off, did a sharp climbing turn to the right, and headed for the position where we thought the jet might be. I looked down just as we passed over southwest Portland and my home in West Linn."

So both the T-33 and Himmelsbach's helicopter were headed to the southwest side of Portland and the Lake Oswego and West Linn areas. No one went to the east or north.

Shutter, a PM is enroute to you.

Robert99

[skyjack71 0]

BruceSmith

Lastly, why do you think Bill Rataczak doesn't return any of my phone calls or emails? Because he doesn't like me? Or, are my questions simply too challenging?

When did "being nice" become a prerequisite for truth telling?

WEll, Bruce you KNOW the answer so why did you ask it. The co-Pilot is a very low keyed soft spoken man - he talks to people he does NOT have to worry about being confrontal. He knows the story of how you approached Tina - and I can assure you nothing like that will be allowed to happen again. If and when they decide to speak to anyone - it will be all together or not at all. The only one who might speak on his own is the Co-pilot - but not is he knows who you are.

Could be there are 10 minutes they will NEVER talked about to anyone and never will! They did NOT know what kind of Bomb Cooper had - if he was going to leave it on the plane or throw it out or take it with him. DO ANY OF YOU think they ACTUALLY took the PLANE over very populated areas if they thought the BOMB was still on the plane. Once they knew Cooper was gone surely someone went back to make sure the bomb was not still on board. YOu guy will speculate about this till the end of time.

Maybe Cooper chickened out and they gave him a little help getting out the door - you think!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

RobertMBlevins

Jo says in part:

Quote

'Well, for starters get it STRAIGHT what was said between myself and Bill in 2004. Portland was not mentioned.
but VANCOUVER was. He could see the lights (haze) of Vancouver to his right! I am not a pilot so you figure out what that meant...'

I would say this means Flight 305 was on a path EAST of the Interstate 5 freeway. If you believe this to be not true, than I suggest going to the source and asking.

Point of Order: Mr Rataczak never refused to speak to me, as Georger has said. I just haven't made serious efforts to contact him. I'm sure he's seen the KC report, the book, and whatever else. If he wanted to talk about those things, he would have contacted me long ago. I'm sure he is a nice guy and I have no problem here. This job (talking to him about the flight map) I leave to someone else.

Blevins get real!

Why would he have seen the "KC Report" and/or your book?
Why would he waste time on it ... and you?

He may very well have heard of you from several people.

I would put it in the freezer waiting before it turns rank!

[georger 247]

Robert99

***

this is for Robert99. could you repeat again where Ralph said he was with the helicopter? I would like to fly around that area.

Shutter, the following is on pages 46, 47, and 48 of Himmelsbach's book.

The first chase aircraft for the airliner was a USAF T-33 on a night training mission out of Portland International. It took off to the west and was shortly afterwards directed toward Lake Oswego where it ended up about three miles behind the hijacked airliner. But the two pilots on board never had visual contact with the airliner.

The book states that two F-102s were dispatched from the Idaho Air National Guard in Boise but did not make contact with the airliner.

The book also states that two F-106s took off from Hamilton AFB in California but did not see the airliner.

Only the C-130, which was also from Hamilton AFB, was able to make contact and it stayed with the airliner until it landed in Reno.

On page 47, Himmelsbach states that the National Guard helicopter, with him onboard, took off from Portland International and flew south.

On page 42, Himmelsbach describes the helicopter lift-off from Portland International as follows:

"We lifted off, did a sharp climbing turn to the right, and headed for the position where we thought the jet might be. I looked down just as we passed over southwest Portland and my home in West Linn."

So both the T-33 and Himmelsbach's helicopter were headed to the southwest side of Portland and the Lake Oswego and West Linn areas. No one went to the east or north.

Shutter, a PM is enroute to you.

Robert99

Interesting. I had forgot about H's book.

So there are two H-in-helicopter accounts? (Maybe three)

Book: H flies south to intercept but too slow, too late, goes back
to PDX.

JT: H flies north east to intercept 305 somewhere east of V23,
hopes to see a fire or some sign of Cooper on the ground. Helo
lights off. See nothing return to base.

Newspaper & other accounts: H flies north perhaps as far north
to Woodland, not hoping to intercept 305 (which by now is miles
south of PDX, but hoping to see some sign of Cooper, fire
or something. Conditions terrible, sees nothing, returns to PDX.

Which account is correct or are they all correct? Snowmman
puzzled over this also - has a whole string of posts trying to dig
it out - Snowmman could never get to the bottom of it...

Maybe there were two flights (as per Snowmman). One chasing
305 the night of the hijackling. Second flight next night north or
nor-east looking for Cooper? Apparently a NY Times article refers
to H looking for Cooper on the ground, from a helo.

As I say, Snowmman tried to unravel and confirm some of this
but apparently was unable to.

Then Sluggo did a followup interview, called H, and asked him
some questions. Unfortunately the helo part was not in his
interview that Sluggo reported here.

But, from Sluggo's previous posted interview with H the following
is below:

"I described the “Flight-path” on the SEA Sectional that was
released by the FBI in November of 2007 and made sure he knew
which one I was talking about. (There could be others that he
would know about, but have not yet been released.) I then
asked him how that chart was produced and who produced it. He
replied (somewhat bluntly) I just don’t know. He speculated that
it was the product of some ARTC engineers and some Northwest
Airlines engineers, using radar and flight recorder information. [I
got the sense that he had no faith in that document at all.].

I ask how far off of V-23 the plane might have been after they
got down around Battle Ground or Orchards. He told me that
“the pilots” were not under very much restriction at all and were
“hand-flying” the plane because large jets aren’t happy on
autopilot at low speeds and low altitude. We had a short
discussion about the clearance language and how they were told
they could bust altitude by as much as 4,000 feet without notice
from ARTC. Neither of us knew what they would have needed to
have done as far a horizontal deviation from V-23. He said
(without commenting on how he knew this) that as they
approached PDX they could have been as much as 20 miles East
of V-23. I asked for clarification, was he saying statute miles or
nautical miles. His response was “statute miles.”

I commented about, in light of that statement, Jerry Thomas’s
search in and NE of Dugan Falls would not be so far-fetched. He
said Jerry was definitely on target. " (Mar 5, 2009, 6:13 PM
Post #8462 of 47039)

[mrshutter45 21]

wow, Dougan Falls if I'm correct is around 17 east of the flight path. the area R99 speaks of is in the flight path area. what I find strange is Ralph H. was that far down the path looking for Cooper. this brings us back to Rataczak's time frame. if H was at PDX and was listening to the chatter with the only POSSIBLE publicly known jump announcement at 8:10/8:12 (transcripts) why was he down there? West Linn is 15 miles directly south of PDX, or 13 NM. if the chopper was facing east, they would climb and turn to the south or to the right heading to west linn?


the next question is from what point is 12 miles north of Portland. does he mean from PDX. that puts it around BTG. just by reading all of these accounts on where they thought the jet was they are literally all over the map. the smart guys are not looking to smart right now. we have reports of the Woodland area, La Center, Dougan Falls, Orchards, West Linn. the C-130 dudes seem to be the only actual contact with the plane. what was there conclusion? where they taken into account while making the path?

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 247]

RobertMBlevins

I also have a quote from a 2009 interview by Rataczak, posted below. But I did see a key element back there, and it is the mention by Himmelsbach that the engineers may have used flight recorder info in part to create the map. Makes sense they would do that, if there was confusion for a while on 305's position along the flight path. Meanwhile, Rataczak says in part:

Quote

'Paul (Soderlind) and many others did a lot of work trying to determine the exact area in general, and then tried to narrow down where the hijacker could have landed after he jumped from the airplane. They finally determined the likely spot. Well, our crew on board was 99% sure they were correct...'

This is one good reason why someone should go to the source and ask a few questions. And if Himmelsbach had so little faith in the map, then why did the FBI and the US Army end up mounting a big search in the Ariel area?

They could have used airplane data too! And super glue!

Do you know of they were given food and water?

[Robert99 50]

georger

***I also have a quote from a 2009 interview by Rataczak, posted below. But I did see a key element back there, and it is the mention by Himmelsbach that the engineers may have used flight recorder info in part to create the map. Makes sense they would do that, if there was confusion for a while on 305's position along the flight path. Meanwhile, Rataczak says in part:

Quote

'Paul (Soderlind) and many others did a lot of work trying to determine the exact area in general, and then tried to narrow down where the hijacker could have landed after he jumped from the airplane. They finally determined the likely spot. Well, our crew on board was 99% sure they were correct...'

This is one good reason why someone should go to the source and ask a few questions. And if Himmelsbach had so little faith in the map, then why did the FBI and the US Army end up mounting a big search in the Ariel area?

They could have used airplane data too!

Do you know of they were given food and water?

The flight recorder data was recorded on a looping tape that recorded over the old data about every hour or so. So the crew would have to pull the circuit breaker on the flight recorder to stop it within that hour or so if they intended to preserve that data. If the jump was at about 8:15 PM, then they would need to pull that circuit breaker by no later than about 9:00 PM to preserve any meaningful data. The plane landed in Reno a few minutes after 11:00 PM.

Another big question is did the 1971 flight data recorders record flight navigational information? If not, the data wouldn't mean much.

Robert99

[BobKnoss 0]

georger

***"It's almost like you're afriad of what he might say."

let's be a little realistic here Robert. I'm not afraid of anything he would say. I just told you a letter would be the best result. I would like this option. not anyone else. I would touch base with him first of all. I would then explain my project to him. I wouldn't jump right into asking a million things from him.

the main goal here is to see if the path can match the time frames. if we find other options such as Rataczak stating a different version. two different paths will be plotted out. we could possibly find answers between the two. thats if his reply differs greatly with the known path. I'm not going to send him a quiz. I think this would interest him enough to call me. I know you are trying to help,but, do not do anything without consulting me if it has anything to do with my project.

any outside information dealing with the original flight path will be skewed. as mentioned above. if we find out later the path is different according to the guy who flew the plane. we will then no longer have the original flight path. so, once again we fly the path the way the FBI believes it to be, and has been this way for 40+ years. then compare it to what Rataczak and possibly other sources tell us and make a separate path. this way both are verified.

Let's be clear about one thing: a number of people say the
reason Blev's promised interview never happned is because Rzk
refused to talk to him. Period.

Rzk stil has a life in spite of his personal problems. He's a very
rational guy by all accounts (from rational people).

Who are my sources in this? People who have talked to Rzk
dozens of times who could call him tomorrow.

Rataczak has aready given interviows on all of thse points! I
doubt his information is going to change. The FBI has talked to
Rataczak countless times.

ROTFLMAO

You wanna ask the Fox who ate the chickens? What you will get is the official baloney that whitewashes the truth exposed by "Janet".

There is only one person in the attached photo who has released anything truthful. That is me in the lower left. The others could, but will not, at least not at this time. One book is scheduled post-mortum, but that is not entirely true in content. People alter their stories to make their perspective look better. Right, Jo? Especially this group of double-talkers. Don't waste your time getting the same old hogwash thrown at you. The truth lies outside this circle. Cossey would have been a good source for tidbits. Ralph let a few slide, too. Nick gave a hint with his "keeping a secret" comment. Duane opened his mouth and blabbed to his wife. Mac loves to tell trinkets and even made training films and historic documents of his exploits. INCLUDING Cooper!!! It is almost a game with these people (mostly ALL pilots). They laugh like crazy when reliving their stories. Sick. Really sick.

[mrshutter45 21]

Bob, the truth doesn't lie within you. you claimed Janet could see a man on the stairs. then you place Cooper on the west side of the Columbia a mile and half before Janet would have seen a man on the stairs. when one talks too much, one makes many mistakes. when one doesn't supply any proof. that person is not reliable.....you are not fooling anyone here. you can shift the blame all day long onto me. it won't work.....

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[mrshutter45 21]

this should be directed at Blevins, but, I wanted your opinion on this.


" Well, our crew on board was 99% sure they were correct...'"

and yet Rataczak, a member of the crew who was part of the 99% says the Cooper jumped 10-15 minutes after the 8:05 mark. this puts Cooper 10+ miles south of the original position. I wonder what percentage he gives on this claim? certainly doesn't match the 99% rate?

"It is surprising how aggressive people get, once they latch onto their suspect and say, 'Hey, he's our guy.' No matter what you tell them, they refuse to believe you" Agent Carr FBI

[georger 247]

mrshutter45

" Well, our crew on board was 99% sure they were correct...'"

and yet Rataczak, a member of the crew who was part of the 99% says the Cooper jumped 10-15 minutes after the 8:05 mark. this puts Cooper 10+ miles south of the original position. I wonder what percentage he gives on this claim? certainly doesn't match the 99% rate?

If I hear "a lot of smart guys" one more time - I think I will throw
up!

It has to do with who had what data when and the accuracy of that data.

Now if Sluggo had been able to interview Pringle or Solderlind or
others vs. Himmelsbach, there might be a totally different
understanding which does not rely on " a lot of smart guys".

A lot of smart guys could have been right or wrong, or
somewhere in between. A lot of smart guys were flying the
plane!

Why are these people talking to Himmelsbach!? He isnt even in
charge of the case!?? He isnt even the only pilot! By 1976
Himmelsbach is running around telling newspaper men the original
flight path was wrong! Himmelsbach isnt even speaking for the
people in charge of the case, or is he!?

They cant all be right all of these smart guys!

How can Solderlind and the engineers have something that
nobody else says they had!? And to this very day don't have
or know!? And, the contention that only Ralph Himmelsbach had
"the data" whatever "it" is, is pure utter nonsense. Himmelsbach
wasn't even in charge of the case and the guys in Seattle that
might have known something aren't talking. Himmelsbach is
running around chasing a jet in a helicopter - does anyone else
see something a little weird about that? Giddy up Ole Paint!
Faster! Take that, Pilgrim! Ya know ya know ya know. Yepper.
Himmeslbach and JT has "lots of stories".

The WWII Ace Fighter Pilot? Sorry. All he had was a little
training. Never saw action. The closet H ever was to "action"
in a flying machine was in the Ntl Guard Helo trying to chase
down Cooper flying in a jet! "Slo down there Pilgrim".

A lot of smart guys!

Blevins says Rataczak woud have no reason to lie. Blevins
would say the same thing about the Pope and Judas Iscariot.

[skyjack71 0]

RobertMBlevins

Jo says in part:

Quote

'Well, for starters get it STRAIGHT what was said between myself and Bill in 2004. Portland was not mentioned.
but VANCOUVER was. He could see the lights (haze) of Vancouver to his right! I am not a pilot so you figure out what that meant...'

I would say this means Flight 305 was on a path EAST of the Interstate 5 freeway. If you believe this to be not true, than I suggest going to the source and asking.

BULL! How the H do you get that out of what I said? NO PLEASE DO NOT ANSWER that Question! DO you know where the CO-Pilots seat is? Guys, just keep QUIET and lets see what he uses for LOGIC on this!

Maybe U need to sit this one out Blevins!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

***Point of Order: I'm sure he's seen the KC report, the book, and whatever else. If he wanted to talk about those things, he would have contacted me long ago.
***

That statement is the most pathetic excuse I have ever heard out of you!
He hasn't contacted you....so what conclusions would you draw from that. Obviously Kenny is NOT even a viable suspect!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

I may regret this post. but give me the yr that photo was taken in and how old where you in the photo.

No Garbage and NO going off into never never land. PROVE that photo in the lower left corner is you.

Rarely if ever do I engage U so this is an exception. ONE answer straight forward WITHOUT any of the stories you create.

Also LIST the places you lived from the time you turned 25 until you turned 62. NO GAMES and NO STORIES!

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

RobertMBlevins

Quote

Point of Order: I'm sure he's seen the KC report, the book, and whatever else. If he wanted to talk about those things, he would have contacted me long ago.

Skyjack 71 says in part:

***That statement is the most pathetic excuse I have ever heard out of you!He hasn't contacted you....so what conclusions would you draw from that. Obviously Kenny is NOT even a viable suspect!

Well...I'm pretty sure he's seen the book. Porteous promised him a copy, and I know Rataczak doesn't post on the internet, but he does do research on the Cooper case. He talks about 'his notes' on the case during the Porteous interview in Blast. As far as the Christiansen Report, he will get that soon along with a letter to him with questions on the flight path. I only asked him three questions on that.

Kenny's death certificate arrived today. I'm going to attach it. There's nothing on it about Kaposi's, or AIDS, or any underlying causes besides the Big C.

This just goes to prove that 'trusted researchers' should get their facts straight before rattling off whatever comes to mind. For example, dancing around the idea that just because someone is gay auto-makes them a pedophile, or that they have AIDS. I think most gay people would take offense at that.

Kenny may have taken in runaways and helped them out once in a while. Unfortunately, some people...when viewing a behavior that most folks might consider decent...sometimes try to twist it into an ugly thing. Too bad. Cooperland, and the bickering and jealousy involved within in...often brings out the worst in people. You can quote that from the book.

During her phone interviews, Carolyn Tyner told me any hints regarding pedophilia and Christiansen in the same sentence were ridiculous. She described him as simply a nice guy with a lot of friends, and that the 'runaway' thing is overrated. In reality, he only took in a very few and over a term of almost twenty years. Most didn't stay long, only McWilliams. When Kenny died, he left Tyner and her then-husband Robin Powell the house, plus a few sheets from the stamp collection. They lived with him for years. If Kenny was engaging in inappropriate behavior with juveniles, they would have known.

I found out where Kenny's former doctor is practicing now. And although he probably won't be able to tell me much, I'm going to take up the death certificate and a copy of the release from Lyle Christiansen and give it a try. I'll be honest here. I'm going to take up a copy of the Christiansen report as well, leave it with him, see what he says. It's probably a fruitless gesture, but I have to try. The release from Lyle might help. Might. I can't help thinking that whatever the big secret was that Kenny couldn't tell his brother...maybe he told his doctor. Like I said, probably a waste of time.

We can read Blevins! Says nothing about "BIG C".

What it says is "carcinoma of the colon".

Not one word about "Jay Leno sees UFO!".

When do we get to see the pathology report?

I guess its another Golden Moment by RobertMBlevins!

What is this bullcrap about: Removed by Adventire Books of Seattle Last 4#'s: 3599 ?

[skyjack71 0]

RobertMBlevins

He talks about 'his notes' on the case during the Porteous interview in Blast. As far as the Christiansen Report, he will get that soon along with a letter to him with questions on the flight path. I only asked him three questions on that.

Do NOT send the certificate - Too much information. .

Quote

This just goes to prove that 'trusted researchers' should get their facts straight before rattling off whatever comes to mind. For example, dancing around the idea that just because someone is gay auto-makes them a pedophile, or that they have AIDS. I think most gay people would take offense at that.

That is JUST how it is - remember you GOT your facts wrong & you rattled off things about Kenny to write a book. You & Lyle are the ones who EXPOSED kenny. Did you ever think that perhaps Lyle just thought it was a GOOD idea - like all of his other ideas to make money.

Do not criticize what you yourself are quilty of....remember you are accusing Kenny of being a skyjacker and / or supported a brother who just thought it would make a good story.

You wrote the book, Lyle didn't!
If you feel wronged well take a GOOD look in the mirror. You did NOT do your research - how much did this thread have to correct for U.

I agree individuals should NOT attempt to label KC or to say bad thing about him, but U made KC's
private life public. You never met & did not know this man nor did he ever declare he was Cooper.
U are the one who created the story.


The Ghost of Cooper has haunted too many people and destroyed too many lives over the yrs. The media attraction of the case, the convoluted FBI files and multiple claims regarding Cooper should have been resolved yrs ago.....ALL because our government has a closed door policy!

Picture Uncle SAM in heaven and he is the one on Trial - The Ghost of the REAL Cooper will haunt the FBI till the end of time....too many $'s spent on keeping secrets!

Time to OPEN the Doors - No MORE Secrets! The Cooper Case has become an embarrassment for the FBI & Uncle Sam created the circumstances that caused this case to go unsolve for 42 yrs. Uncle SAM is on trial & Kenny is the prosecuting attorney - his key witness is The Ghost of Cooper.

Who wrote Ha Ha Ha by D.B. Cooper?

I would sure like to find photos of the real individuals caricatured and portrayed by the writer & artist in the book. I thought about this at the time I read it, but the only character I had pictures of was the ex who looked very much like the woman. The squirrelly looking guy and the big Boss looked just like 2 of the guys I met from Duane's past. The book was sent to me by someone unknown to me.

Why does an artist by the name of Joan Garrity come to mind! Oh, I remember she was the common denominator in the 2 coveted books Duane had....2 books that showed up with the 'other' stuff in 1990. One of them had a picture of the little girl in it.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber