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georger 247
QuoteJo Said:
I DON'T KNOW HOW TO GET THE PHOTO FROM THAT SITE TO SHOW ON HERE EXCEPT TO DIRECT YOU TO THE SITE.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Public_Service
Is this the photo you're talking about?
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/60/CPS31firecrew.jpg
1969912 to the RESCUE:
Yes Yes that is one the photos
the other one is entitled Snow Line
And you actually expect anyone to see a tattoo
saying DUSTY in these photos?
How is it you are seeing it?
Or more fundamentally, how is it I am even here
asking!
Here are two dusties. Take your pick
snowmman 3
found a nice site with old 727 history stuff I hadn't seen before.
Some cool stuff.
1) The first rollout of a 727 was E1, [N7001U] on Nov. 27, 1962
The first picture is interesting because it shows the mixture of topcoats that the men were wearing outside (I'm assuming drizzle?) in 1962, at Boeing. Note the predominance of sand/tan. Some are black. All seem to be the same length, mid thigh. Some wore no topcoat. Oliver Stone will notice there is just one guy staring at the camera. Lower right. He wears a black topcoat.
If you thought 11/24/71 was picked in relation to some "special" day, it's interestingly close to 9 years after the first 727 rollout 11/27/62.
2) and 3) are pictures of the first takeoff and landing of a 727. (E1 1963)
4-6) some actual 727 schematics. These arelikely the schematics that Jo has said Duane had access to.
7) is a nice ground tail shot, from the 727 first flight day (1963).
Another interesting factoid: from the nwa.com site, apparently Northwest was the most profitable airline for almost 3 years? around the '68-'70 era.
http://www.nwa.com/corpinfo/upclose/1970.shtml
1970: "For third year in a row, Northwest leads the U.S. airline industry in net profitability."
8) Dorky died 8/24/00. His wife Arlene did not give me any safe deposit box keys.
9) Andrew Moonen currently lives in the South Park section of Seattle, near Boeing Field, WA. Boeing field has been used for first flights of 737s, 757s and 777s, and notably the B-52 Stratofortress. The "Chewbacca" defense, I have noted before, was presented on the animated TV show, "South Park"
Some cool stuff.
1) The first rollout of a 727 was E1, [N7001U] on Nov. 27, 1962
The first picture is interesting because it shows the mixture of topcoats that the men were wearing outside (I'm assuming drizzle?) in 1962, at Boeing. Note the predominance of sand/tan. Some are black. All seem to be the same length, mid thigh. Some wore no topcoat. Oliver Stone will notice there is just one guy staring at the camera. Lower right. He wears a black topcoat.
If you thought 11/24/71 was picked in relation to some "special" day, it's interestingly close to 9 years after the first 727 rollout 11/27/62.
2) and 3) are pictures of the first takeoff and landing of a 727. (E1 1963)
4-6) some actual 727 schematics. These are
7) is a nice ground tail shot, from the 727 first flight day (1963).
Another interesting factoid: from the nwa.com site, apparently Northwest was the most profitable airline for almost 3 years? around the '68-'70 era.
http://www.nwa.com/corpinfo/upclose/1970.shtml
1970: "For third year in a row, Northwest leads the U.S. airline industry in net profitability."
8) Dorky died 8/24/00. His wife Arlene did not give me any safe deposit box keys.
9) Andrew Moonen currently lives in the South Park section of Seattle, near Boeing Field, WA. Boeing field has been used for first flights of 737s, 757s and 777s, and notably the B-52 Stratofortress. The "Chewbacca" defense, I have noted before, was presented on the animated TV show, "South Park"
QuoteAnd you actually expect anyone to see a tattoo
saying DUSTY in these photos?
How is it you are seeing it?
Or more fundamentally, how is it I am even here
asking!
This statement is made for information purposes in the event anyone knows the man in the photo or has a better photo.
Duane had a tattoo that had the name "Dusty" in it.
I see a shadow on the upperleft arm in the place that Duane had a tattoo. I have never said I saw a tattoo in the photo. I mentioned the shadow to CKRET and another who is not currently posting here.
CKRET must be sharing my private emails with you. Or you are spying on my emails.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
Quotethere was a very large investigative effort around PDX; hotels, motels, cabs, buses and so on. Nothing from that effort developed leads that went anywhere.
That statement was true in the 70's but if they didn't make or keep the records for future referrence it was in vain.
===================
QuoteAlso, I did not write that a clerk was never contacted or that a register was not taken.
Obviously they had to have talked to the clerks and registrations where taken. Why didn't they make copies of ALL the hotel registrations. Well, we didn't have copy machines all over in 1971.
===================
QuoteI have not found an interview of a clerk claiming a register was signed by a person of interest.
Tired over worked agents -no computers or cell phones. They made notes and did reports at the end of the day. Because it has not been found does not mean it didn't exist...or we could say because the cigarrette butts have not been found they didn't exist.
========================
QuoteI can tell you that there is no register in evidence and I have not found where one was taken and returned.
Read all of the words.
There was no register in evidence.
Note the cigarette butts are not in evidence either. The clerk only said that it was taken. Taken and returned was a statement made by Agent Hope.
========================
Same back at you CKRET and by the way I decide to reveal what I called you about the other day - maybe the efforts of the forum collectively can actually do more in locating this man - what the forum does not have access to are the government payroll and the SS records. Such as - was more than one location being reported as income for that name and SS number that the FBI should have access to.
The identity theft of the 40's - young men using ID's too get into the war efforts or to escape the war efforts. It might be interesting to know where this man's records take him up until 1949. Some kind of record has to exist...someplace or maybe the forum or the FBI will get lucky and find the guy alive - very unlikely.
That Max Miller in the photo - I can find no record of him, but that is a common name. Hopefully the FBI can come up with more. I have a reason for this. It's all in way the name sounds to me.
This is something I know the intelligent people in this forum and with some of them living in these areas - there might be some access to old records. Be interesting to talk to the relatives of Leo Harder or Melvin Flickenger.
Now just to find the relatives and any old photos or records of any of these guys.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
Quotehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Public_Service
Attached photos:
Dyed Hair - note the hand on hip
Age 24 - note the Howdy Doody smile.
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
I expected to get some real feed back from that post and the pics compared to the snowline and firecrew pics, (not Snowmman or Georger's off-handed flippant remarks). I am taking the lack of response to mean "Good God - She's really flipped out now".
Any assistance I can get in finding these men (rather their relatives) I will appreciate. It seems I am the only one who sees anything with this and you are tying to be kind by NOT saying anything at all.
That's OK, I understand and I am sorry - I am looking for answers where there are NONE. This is where my search ends and the myth continues - there is no ending - like the song he always sang. "You'll Never Know if You Don't Know Now".
Any information sent to my PM I will appreciate.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
georger 247
Quote
Quotehttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Civilian_Public_Service
Attached photos:
Dyed Hair - note the hand on hip
Age 24 - note the Howdy Doody smile.I expected to get some real feed back from that post and the pics compared to the snowline and firecrew pics, (not Snowmman or Georger's off-handed flippant remarks). I am taking the lack of response to mean "Good God - She's really flipped out now".
Any assistance I can get in finding these men (rather their relatives) I will appreciate. It seems I am the only one who sees anything with this and you are tying to be kind by NOT saying anything at all.
Any information sent to my PM I will appreciate.
You might want to try a Genealogy Forum, of which
there are many. This forum was for DB Cooper.
Georger
Do you NOT read my emails? I mentioned that I had been to Ancestor.com and others like it.
This IS about Cooper - exploring Duane as suspect just as you would anyone else...
This IS about Cooper - exploring Duane as suspect just as you would anyone else...
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
georger 247
QuoteDo you NOT read my emails?
I tend to fog over and think Im on another planet
.... and wish I was.
georger 247
QuoteDo you NOT read my emails? I mentioned that I had been to Ancestor.com and others like it.
This IS about Cooper - exploring Duane as suspect just as you would anyone else...
________________________________________
[edit] Suspects
FBI sketch of Cooper, with age progressionAt various points, several people have been suggested as possible candidates for Cooper, although the case remains unsolved. Over the years, the suspect list has exceeded 1,000 people.[40]
The FBI believed that Cooper was familiar with the Seattle area, as he was able to recognize Tacoma from the air while the jet was circling over the Puget Sound. He also remarked to flight attendant Mucklow that McChord Air Force Base was approximately 20 minutes from the Seattle-Tacoma Airport. Although the FBI initially believed that Cooper might have been an active or retired member of the United States Air Force, based on his apparent knowledge of jet aerodynamics and skydiving,[17] it later changed this assessment, deciding that no experienced parachutist would have attempted such a risky jump.[6]
[edit] John List
In 1971, mass-murderer John List was considered a suspect in the Cooper hijacking, which occurred only fifteen days after he had killed his family in Westfield, New Jersey. List's age, facial features, and build were similar to those described for the mysterious skyjacker.[41] FBI agent Ralph Himmelsbach stated that List was a "viable suspect" in the case.[34] Cooper parachuted from the hijacked airliner with $200,000, the same amount List had used up from his mother's bank account in the days before the killing.[42] After his capture and imprisonment in 1989, List strenuously denied being Cooper, and the FBI no longer considered him a suspect.[34] List died in prison custody on March 21, 2008.[43]
[edit] Richard McCoy, Jr.
Main article: Richard McCoy, Jr.
The Salt Lake Tribune's article about the 1972 capture of Richard McCoyOn April 7, 1972, four months after Cooper's hijacking, Richard McCoy, Jr., under the alias "James Johnson," boarded United Airlines Flight 855 during a stopover in Denver, Colorado, and gave the flight steward an envelope labeled "Hijack Instructions," in which he demanded four parachutes and $500,000.[34] He also instructed the pilot to land at San Francisco International Airport and order a refueling truck for the plane.[44] The airplane was a Boeing 727 with aft stairs, which McCoy used in his escape. He was carrying a paper weight grenade and an empty pistol. He left his handwritten message on the plane, along with his fingerprints on a magazine he had been reading, which the FBI later used to establish positive identification.
Police began investigating McCoy following a tip from Utah Highway Patrolman Robert Van Ieperen, who was a friend of McCoy's.[45] Apparently, after the Cooper hijacking, McCoy had made a reference that Cooper should have asked for $500,000, instead of $200,000. Van Ieperen thought that was an odd coincidence, so he alerted the FBI. Married and with two young children, McCoy was a Mormon Sunday school teacher studying law enforcement at Brigham Young University. He had a record as a Vietnam veteran and was a former helicopter pilot, and an avid skydiver.[46]
On April 9, following the fingerprint and handwriting match, McCoy was arrested for the United 855 hijacking.[44] Coincidentally, McCoy had been on National Guard duty flying one of the helicopters involved in the search for the hijacker. Inside his house FBI agents found a jumpsuit and a duffel bag filled with $499,970 in cash.[46] McCoy claimed innocence, but was convicted and received a 45-year sentence. Once incarcerated, using his access to the prison's dental office, McCoy fashioned a fake handgun out of dental paste. He and a crew of convicts escaped in August 1974 by stealing a garbage truck and crashing it through the prison's main gate. It took three months before the FBI located McCoy in Virginia. McCoy shot at the FBI agents, and agent Nicholas O'Hara fired back with a shotgun, killing him.[44]
In 1991, Bernie Rhodes and former FBI agent Russell Calame coauthored D.B. Cooper: The Real McCoy, in which they claimed that Cooper and McCoy were really the same person, citing similar methods of hijacking and a tie and mother-of-pearl tie clip, left on the plane by Cooper. Neither Rhodes nor Calame were involved in the original Cooper investigation, but Calame was the head of the Utah FBI office that investigated McCoy, and eventually arrested him for the copycat hijacking that occurred in April 1972. The author said that McCoy "never admitted nor denied he was Cooper."[47] And when McCoy was directly asked whether he was Cooper he replied, "I don't want to talk to you about it."[44] The agent who killed McCoy is quoted as supposedly saying, "When I shot Richard McCoy, I shot D. B. Cooper at the same time."[44] The widow of Richard McCoy, Karen Burns McCoy, reached a $120,000 legal settlement with the book's co-authors and its publisher,[44] after claiming they misrepresented her involvement in the hijacking and later events from interviews done with her attorney in the 1970s.[48]
[edit] Duane Weber
A photo of Duane Weber next to the sketch of CooperIn July 2000, U.S. News & World Report ran an article about a widow in Pace, Florida, named Jo Weber and her claim that her late husband, Duane L. Weber (born 1924 in Ohio), had told her "I'm Dan Cooper" before his death on March 28, 1995.[40] She became suspicious and began checking into his background. Weber had served in the Army during World War II and had later served time in a prison near the Portland airport. Weber recalled that her husband had once had a nightmare where he talked in his sleep about jumping from a plane and said something about leaving his fingerprints on the aft stairs.[49] Jo recalled that shortly before Duane's death, he had revealed to her that an old knee injury of his had been incurred by "jumping out of a plane."[40]
Weber also recounts a 1979 vacation the couple took to Seattle, "a sentimental journey," Duane told Jo, with a visit to the Columbia River.[40] She remembers how Duane walked down to the banks of the Columbia by himself just four months before the portion of Cooper's cash was found in the same area. Weber related that she had checked out a book on the Cooper case from the local library and saw notations in it that matched her husband's handwriting. She began corresponding with Himmelsbach, the former chief investigator of the case, who subsequently agreed that much of the circumstantial evidence surrounding Weber fit the hijacker's profile. However, the FBI stopped investigating Weber in July 1998 because of a lack of hard evidence.[40]
The FBI compared Weber's prints with those processed from the hijacked plane and found no matches.[49] In October 2007, the FBI stated that a partial DNA sample taken from the tie that Cooper had left on the plane did not belong to Weber.[6]
[edit] Kenneth Christiansen
The October 29, 2007 issue of New York magazine revealed a new suspect, Kenneth P. Christiansen, identified by Sherlock Investigations. The article noted that Christiansen is a former army paratrooper, a former airline employee, had settled in Washington near the site of the hijacking, was familiar with the local terrain, had purchased property with cash a year after the hijacking, drank bourbon and smoked (as did Cooper during the flight) and resembled the eyewitness sketches of Cooper.[10] However, the FBI ruled out Christiansen because his complexion, height, weight and eye color did not match the descriptions given by the passengers or the crew of Flight 305.[50]
[edit] William Gossett
On August 4, 2008, Canadian Press reported that a Spokane, Washington, lawyer believes that the ransom money is stored in a Vancouver, British Columbia, safety deposit box under the name of William Gossett, a college instructor from Ogden, Utah, who died in 2003. Lawyer Galen Cook says that Gossett matches the sketches circulated by the FBI. Also, Gossett is alleged to have bragged to his sons about the hijacking and shown them a key to the safety deposit box.[51]
georger 247
Any information sent to my PM I will appreciate.
You have contended Duane threw a paper bag (money) into the Columbia off a bridge - you were with him on a trip.
Please identify the location of the bridge from the
maps attached -
Thanks,
Georger
Quote
Any information sent to my PM I will appreciate.
You have contended Duane threw a paper bag (money) into the Columbia off a bridge - you were with him on a trip.
Please identify the location of the bridge from the
maps attached
Just before I 5 goes acrass the river was a Red Lion Inn on the river. We went to the bakc of the river - I heard there is lost of construcion there now. It was park like in 1971 and you could walk way out. on the ground West of the bridge about a food ball fields lenght. The area was raised above the water. That is where he thru the package into the water.
It was floating down the river by the time I got out to there (I made a necessary trip before going out for R&R before we left.)
Was a brown paper bag - medium weight bout 6 to 8 inches long and maybe 12 inched deep - the top was rolled over and it had a band around it. This was Sept. and at the lastes mid Oct. and the money was found in Jan or Feb of 1980.
Hope that helps.
Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/11/CPS31snow.jpg
"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG
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