DB Cooper

[snowmman 3]

But georger, you agree it's b.s. right? (edit: I didn't make up the posts. The urls are there so you can source check for accuracy)

Note how it doesn't align with the story told by the guy that phoned Jo. And what are the odds that this night clerk magically appears to a sitcomsonline forum after Jo beseeches? Also: it was a single sole post. No more after that. (I believe he emailed Jo with that email she posted here, which smelled bogus too)

Even Jo in that forum raised questions about "niteclerk"'s post, saying that mugshots and stuff wouldn't have been available that quickly.

I should post the crap that "caretaker Al" posted, to show another guy that was yanking Jo.

Yes it's specific, and somehow Jo merged it into the info she had before.

The phoned information didn't say anything about John Collins. The post did. But the post is b.s.

Even Jo questioned it at the time.

The original phoned-in info was much more vague...and unclear about dates. Evidently the guy reacted to seeing the Duane story. It's unclear when he's talking about the FBI grabbing a registration card with plastic.

It's all bogus.

Jo won't straighten it out because she knows it's all bogus.

I can't believe guys like Safe get sucked into believing facts exist when they don't.

It's like that myth about the meeting between Scott and Himmelsbach, saying they actually flew west of I-5. It's absolute B.S. It was attributed to the Norjak book, but I can't find it in the Norjak book. There's the Bohan meeting, which I believe got myth-morphed into a Scott meeting.

The problem is: Jo lets all this confusion reign and no one wants to bother to check it out. I checked it out and it's total B.S.

[snowmman 3]

I guess what I'm missing, is that maybe all of us need to have our chain yanked at some point.

So the Snowmman who wants to be like 377, will try to oblige.

On the same day I'm posting about the night clerk, who we are told is currently in China, I went to my mailbox, and behold, a package from China.

I scanned it, front and back. Attached (redacted red)

You can look at the postmark to see the date, which is near enough to today that it's unlikely I somehow "found" this image on the net. I really did receive this package today.

Hey Jo, it's obvious what's in the package, right?

The only problem with this yank, is that it doesn't mean anything when people want the yank.

[georger 247]

Quote

But georger, you agree it's b.s. right?

REPLY> I about died when I read this above...
what I want to know is who is the schmuck they got to
post it!

• Quote

[georger 247]

Quote

I guess what I'm missing, is that maybe all of us need to have our chain yanked at some point.

So the Snowmman who wants to be like 377, will try to oblige.

On the same day I'm posting about the night clerk, who we are told is currently in China, I went to my mailbox, and behold, a package from China.

I scanned it, front and back. Attached (redacted red)

You can look at the postmark to see the date, which is near enough to today that it's unlikely I somehow "found" this image on the net. I really did receive this package today.

Hey Jo, it's obvious what's in the package, right?

The only problem with this yank, is that it doesn't mean anything when people want the yank.

Was reading Jeremiah once and when I hit "it is good
....to wait for the salvation of the Lord Adonai" the
phone rang. My mother calling. Went back picked up the Torah and read the same line and phone
rang... my brother. This went on seven times.
Same line, read it, and phone rings (all to see if Im ok). I go back after call #7 and pick up the book
and read very slowly the same line, but I stop at
the Lord Adonai. I wait. Phone doesnt ring. I wait
some more. No phone ring, so what the heck and I
shout out the last word ADONAI! and the damned phone rang ... eight times in succession... was the
same Chinese girl as with the first call and she says: "ooooooooo me have wrong number".

I went out and bought John Poulos "Innumeracy" the next day. Solved that problem.

[snowmman 3]

Jo throws out little things not worth investigating, but then the problem is it creates this "aura" that there's enough shit that surely something sticks, and it must be a story, since surely no one could be that insane and use a computer.

Like she goes on about when Duane grew facial hair, supposedly to elude detection when Norjak was published. Her problem is that she didn't check the publish date (1986). I called her on this before, but here's a post she made at sitcomsonline (she first started espousing all her conspiracy theories there too)
saying facial hair started in 84-85..so she modified the story later to say Duane "knew" the stories were going to come out "soon"

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/boards/showthread.php?p=3222905&highlight=norjax#post3222905

MsCooper wrote on Jun 14, 2006:
"The picture with the mustach and white hair was taken in Virginia Beach around 1987 -- this was how he appeared after NORJAX was put on the racks in 1984 --- Why did he suddenly grow facial hair in 1984 or 85."

[snowmman 3]

Funny phone story georger!

Quote

I went out and bought John Poulos "Innumeracy" the next day. Solved that problem.

John Allen Paulos. I've seen his articles at www.marketwatch.com
good stuff.
http://www.math.temple.edu/~paulos/

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

On 7-16-2006 10:31 PM at the sitcomsonline
thread, MsCooper beseeched night clerk to arrive and post. (see bottom) Note first time poster niteclerk magically appeared after this. (about a month later).

There was some legpulling (fake claims) by some others on that thread. So there was precedent for yanking Jo's chain? (e.g. "caretaker Al" I believe?)

If you read my 3 posts on this matter, you'll see why I concluded that the "niteclerk" posting was bogus. Jo's first post on a "night clerk" phoning in information about stuff that happened, is debatable, though.

(edit) FUNNY: I just reread Jo's post about the phoned-in info. she said: "He didn't know what name was the one that was used."...i.e. the bullshit about John Collins didn't come from him? it came from the fake poster niteclerk????? Jo straighten all this out for me..it's too funny what you're calling "evidence" (actually you never really describe your evidence..amazing that Safe believed it?)

MsCooper said:
"When I am speaking of this crime - I always think Seattle so I apologize for any confusion. The night clerk worked at the Rodeway or Airway just outside of the Portland Airport gates. I have been trying to reach him but his number has changed and he has moved. I do have a contact I hope will reach him . It has been sometime since I spoke to him but I am hoping she will know how to reach him and let him know about this site and that I would like to talk to him again.... P.S. Chuck - I still have the same telephone number. If you post here give me a clue so I will know it is you."

Let me establish something right NOW - I recieved a call from this night clerk in 2001 after the Oregonian did an article - this was the first time the night clerk had seen a picture of Duane. .



What I said in the forum was WHAT I remembered from the few phone conversations we had. He did remember the name on the registration - and told me why. He had to correct me.

This man did not want to go public because it would jeopardize his teaching position. If you idiots cannot understand that then go put your head in a barrel of water and try to talk and breath at the same time. All of you hide behind your avatars - he nor I can do that.

You have seen and I have experienced first hand what going public does to your life - it destroys your career. NOTE: that I had an FBI agent to whom I had shown a house and we had a signed contact who REFUSED to complete the transaction because an article came out in the media in 2000. I had to forfeit 50% of my commission for another agent to finish up with the closing.

NOTE: Carr do you see my mistrust in the FBI.

Hopefully this will explain what going public means - and how harmful it can be if you are in the position of trust. I would not wish this on any human being. Had I known what it would do to my life and my career - perhaps I too would have not gone public.

Had I used a writer such as Galen Cook, who by the way badgered me from approx 1997 until recently for information and who in his many long distance calls using a CALLING (an attorney using a calling card - I should have wised up at that time) extracted from me things that I did not go public with until much later. Note, how much of HIS story takes off of the things I have said and what I have told the FBI since 1996 and continued to do so.

What Cook does not know is - this Simple Simon (me-Jo Weber), made a hard copy of every email and I sent to a third party - details of my conversations with him and they were also discussed by phone with another party. He was not happy with me because I refused to acknowledge Tina's address or phone number and shortly after that he was on TV and he received a phone call from Gossetts son - he got someone to buy into what he was doing.

I have emails that pre-date the phone call from Gossett's son and I
have written material that pre-dates my computer records. I was told by a very wise man to keep detailed records of all phone calls.

Some phone calls I recorded when it was convenient. I was warned that others did not have my best interest in mind nor did they care - all they wanted was a "Story".

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Like she goes on about when Duane grew facial hair, supposedly to elude detection when Norjak was published. Her problem is that she didn't check the publish date (1986). I called her on this before, but here's a post she made at sitcomsonline (she first started espousing all her conspiracy theories there too)
saying facial hair started in 84-85..so she modified the story later to say Duane "knew" the stories were going to come out "soon"

MsCooper wrote on Jun 14, 2006:
"The picture with the mustach and white hair was taken in Virginia Beach around 1987 -- this was how he appeared after NORJAX was put on the racks in 1984 --- Why did he suddenly grow facial hair in 1984 or 85."

==================

I think you are trying to pick bones - you must work for Galen Cook. but then I said that before.

I would have to go to the pictures and check dates - I was never trying to be 100% accurate - as I didn't know I would be held to dates - all I was trying to do was tell what I knew. I am not a detective and at that time I was working many hours a day.

If it is that important I will produce pictures and dates - I can assure you that he hair growth was after we moved to Virginia...as to the exact dates I would not know with out looking at the album.

Remember that there was not only the books but a re-assurgence of articles on Cooper in the early 80's. He also had taken a job that required consistent contact with individuals on a daily and weekly basis. I used my memory not digging thru the files before making a post - posting is responding - I didn't know I needed to qualify every post by going back for the dates.

I had only used a computer in the office for real estate prior to 2000
and was not computer savy nor never dreamt that every word I said would be hashed over and over.

You and others try to pick what I say apart - why don't you pick apart Galen Cook? Guess I know the answer to that - maybe you are related or on his payroll.

Regarding Cook - note that there are several different versions of what the Attorney supposedly told Cook about what Gossett said to him - this is over a few months period of time.

His "story" doesn't cover 13 yrs the way I have. Look at his record of errors in just a few months?????
Plus he is an attorney - he is supposed to be smart - now I will use your word - "Bulls--t".

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

Quote

Quote

On 7-16-2006 10:31 PM at the sitcomsonline
thread, MsCooper beseeched night clerk to arrive and post. (see bottom) Note first time poster niteclerk magically appeared after this. (about a month later).

There was some legpulling (fake claims) by some others on that thread. So there was precedent for yanking Jo's chain? (e.g. "caretaker Al" I believe?)

If you read my 3 posts on this matter, you'll see why I concluded that the "niteclerk" posting was bogus. Jo's first post on a "night clerk" phoning in information about stuff that happened, is debatable, though.

(edit) FUNNY: I just reread Jo's post about the phoned-in info. she said: "He didn't know what name was the one that was used."...i.e. the bullshit about John Collins didn't come from him? it came from the fake poster niteclerk????? Jo straighten all this out for me..it's too funny what you're calling "evidence" (actually you never really describe your evidence..amazing that Safe believed it?)

MsCooper said:
"When I am speaking of this crime - I always think Seattle so I apologize for any confusion. The night clerk worked at the Rodeway or Airway just outside of the Portland Airport gates. I have been trying to reach him but his number has changed and he has moved. I do have a contact I hope will reach him . It has been sometime since I spoke to him but I am hoping she will know how to reach him and let him know about this site and that I would like to talk to him again.... P.S. Chuck - I still have the same telephone number. If you post here give me a clue so I will know it is you."

Let me establish something right NOW - I recieved a call from this night clerk in 2001 after the Oregonian did an article - this was the first time the night clerk had seen a picture of Duane. .



What I said in the forum was WHAT I remembered from the few phone conversations we had. He did remember the name on the registration - and told me why. He had to correct me.

This man did not want to go public because it would jeopardize his teaching position. If you idiots cannot understand that then go put your head in a barrel of water and try to talk and breath at the same time. All of you hide behind your avatars - he nor I can do that.

You have seen and I have experienced first hand what going public does to your life - it destroys your career. NOTE: that I had an FBI agent to whom I had shown a house and we had a signed contact who REFUSED to complete the transaction because an article came out in the media in 2000. I had to forfeit 50% of my commission for another agent to finish up with the closing.

NOTE: Carr do you see my mistrust in the FBI.

Hopefully this will explain what going public means - and how harmful it can be if you are in the position of trust. I would not wish this on any human being. Had I known what it would do to my life and my career - perhaps I too would have not gone public.

Had I used a writer such as Galen Cook, who by the way badgered me from approx 1997 until recently for information and who in his many long distance calls using a CALLING (an attorney using a calling card - I should have wised up at that time) extracted from me things that I did not go public with until much later. Note, how much of HIS story takes off of the things I have said and what I have told the FBI since 1996 and continued to do so.

What Cook does not know is - this Simple Simon (me-Jo Weber), made a hard copy of every email and I sent to a third party - details of my conversations with him and they were also discussed by phone with another party. He was not happy with me because I refused to acknowledge Tina's address or phone number and shortly after that he was on TV and he received a phone call from Gossetts son - he got someone to buy into what he was doing.

I have emails that pre-date the phone call from Gossett's son and I
have written material that pre-dates my computer records. I was told by a very wise man to keep detailed records of all phone calls.

Some phone calls I recorded when it was convenient. I was warned that others did not have my best interest in mind nor did they care - all they wanted was a "Story".

Reply> So? Maybe he is a credible witness after all
that was overlooked or mishandled. That was then. Now is now. That still doesnt automatically mean it is Duane.

If what you have contended all these years is true,
he did in fact see and met Duane in 1971, which
is completely independent of you . . . you and Duane
would not even meet until many years later. You have no status in the matter.

Let him furnish the FBI or whoever with a signed
statement and an interview under oathe.

You stay out of it for a change and stop trying to
manage everyone and everything.

Display some courage for a change!

[snowmman 3]

I scanned Jo's posts, but there was no new evidence in them, right?

I may be wrong, but there was no point-by-point denial of what I said about the history of posting to sitcomsonline either. (I mean I provided the urls, so its hard to deny)

There was a comment that the posts are just memory based, and maybe shouldn't be accorded a disciplined review. I think that translates to "Ignore me!". Ok.

(edit) Safe: I'm still wondering why you believe the night clerk story. There may be a future story, but you seem to believe a story based on past info of dubious origin. I'm still wondering where you got the "late wake up call" piece of info. Was that from Jo? I can't find it anywhere. I hate missing part of a story.

(edit) Jo: If alleged China-boy was named Chuck when he called you, then he changed his phone number and you lost track of him, how did you find him in China? Is China-boy the same guy (thru email) that posted as "niteclerk" and then exchanged email with you?
I know this is a fact question, and may be difficult to answer in a post.

(edit) My best guess for Cook's AK address is in Fairbanks. Is that right? Apparently I've got billable hours! yahoo!

(edit) Avatars: I really want to be "Master Splynter" now, but I guess it's too late.

(edit) I have more posts than skyjack71 now. So I got that goin' for me, which is nice.

[377 22]

Quote

I have more posts than skyjack71 now. So I got that goin' for me, which is nice.

Snowmman takes the lead and the crowd roars on lap three of the Cooper 500.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 247]

Quote

I scanned Jo's posts, but there was no new evidence in them, right?


(edit) Safe: I'm still wondering why you believe the night clerk story. There may be a future story, but you seem to believe a story based on past info of dubious origin. I'm still wondering where you got the "late wake up call" piece of info. Was that from Jo? I can't find it anywhere. I hate missing part of a story.

REPLY> Following 11-24-71 there was a massive search. Many stories/anecdotes flowed from this.
For months following 11-24-71 you would have been
hard-pressed not to hear a story, be told a story,
et cetera, especially if you lived in Washington or
the area around Portland, or you had some direct contact with the people and events transpiring then. My guess is Safe's account may come from one of those original stories and/or an original witness?

Except for her relationship to Duane later, Jo Weber has no direct relationship with that place or period. Jo was living on the east coast far removed and totally unaware. And, Safecracking may not have even been born yet.

Neither Jo nor Safecracking was directly impacted by
the events then. That would come later, by their own accounts.

I also wonder if any of the other Cooper candidates
has ever taken to the Internet to prove their case?
Why do these people seek out publicity? Dont
any of them and their sponsors ever shun publicity and attention? Why havent any of these people ever
been proscecuted for giving false testimony?

Guess Im just old-fashioned.

One of my concerns all along, expressed by others very early (in 1971), has been that the large number of cranks and kooks and false confessors
"coming out of the woodwork", would actually drive away credible informants and helpers, who might otherwise get involved and be helpful. We were all
young then - that was the opinion of another young
person working for the FBI back then, addressed to
me directly. And I can back that up!

Georger

• Quote

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

So? Maybe he is a credible witness after all that was overlooked or mishandled. That was then. Now is now. That still doesnt automatically mean it is Duane.

If what you have contended all these years is true, he did in fact see and met Duane in 1971, which
is completely independent of you . . . you and Duane
would not even meet until many years later. You have no status in the matter.

Let him furnish the FBI or whoever with a signed statement and an interview under oathe.

You stay out of it for a change and stop trying to manage everyone and everything.

Display some courage for a change!

Exactly what I am trying to do - but Cook makes me furious like a wet hen. I am not trying to manage everyone just defend what I have maintained. I have a strong feeling about right and wrong...even with my own family.

When I found out who Dan Cooper was - I had mixed emotions. I didn't think twice about calling the FBI to let them know he was Cooper...that is how strongly I felt.
There was NOT ONE thought of books, movies or what my going public would do to my life...or how it would affect my career. I was just doing what I thought was the right thing. It would be a few months later I would be approached by these things and feel the results.

I have told the FBI from the beginning about certain connections, but have been ignored.

Coffelt, Lawrence Kansas, Ross, the man in Portland (would someone help me find that information again and that man's name - he worked for Boeing and was looked at as a suspect very early on).

Duane's strange disappearances during his union with a prior wife - saying he was going to Ca and then up the West Coast - he leaves her in AZ...this was in the 60's. What business did he have in Wa in those yrs? Who was he going to see?

Our strange stop in Salt Lake - and the man in the photo - a photo Duane requested I take. I can't find the photo so I will have to find the negative. I got rid of the photos when I redid the album yrs ago, but I kept ALL of my negatives. (this was before I knew about Cooper)...50 yrs of negatives to view!

The man was wearing a black (dress) suit and had a large black case ( the kind that pilots used back in those days - it was rectangular with a handle on top). Much much larger than a brief case...as long or longer and as high or higher and much much thicker - maybe 8 inches or more wide...note this is from my memory of the photo (I am NOT being specific).

I do not see where anything Duane did prior to our marriage or during our marriage can be separated from his life and our life.
Therefore I did not understand your comment "You have no status in the matter." What exactly are you referring to? Basically sounds like legal Mumbo Jumbo to defend someone such as Cook and his right to use people for his own benefit.

Snowwman please stop - I never posted in a forum to be exact - I did not research everything I wrote - I was just this dim witted woman trying to tell what she remembered and at one time there was more information coming at me than I could digest...I WILL ASSURE you that the photo albums and the work records will substanciate the dates when they need to be done or if they ever need to be done. I have something more valuable to do with my time than to wade thru around 12 feet of research with most of that in written format and emails.

Most of it has been put on disks
thru a costly process but, I can't find anything unless I know the approximate date of a specific exchange. I also don't know how to do the things you do to find things like you do.

My log books in those yrs (recording who I spoke with and what the subject was about)have also been copied and the orginals stored with tapes of some conversations in a safe deposit box. Remember I said enough to some individuals to get my life threathened and I documented many things others might not have...because of this.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

Quote

One of my concerns all along, expressed by others very early (in 1971), has been that the large number of cranks and kooks and false confessors
"coming out of the woodwork", would actually drive away credible informants and helpers, who might otherwise get involved and be helpful. We were all
young then - that was the opinion of another young
person working for the FBI back then, addressed to
me directly. And I can back that up!

Georger

one of the problems with a large centralized law enforcement agency, in a big country, is that they are constrained with how they react to "kooks"..i.e. kooks take bandwidth out of the system, much like Joe McCain's 911 call. And bandwidth is fixed, cause us taxpayers only want to pony up so much for certain things.

People get adamant the "system" is supposed to react to them in a certain way, and then the thing shifts to how the "system" interacts with people, as opposed to solving the initial problem.

Look at poor Larry having to deal with Jo. And all the poor agents before him with the same problem.

The one nice thing about an anonymous open forum, is that while we have fewer investigative powers, we can tell each other to f* off, with no repercussions.

Here, we can encourage kooks of all ages and sizes, and vet them fairly rapidly...it would be worth a bunch of false positives, to get just one clue.

On anything hard, it's all about building a process that can tolerate a bunch of false positives and false negatives, and yet still get the right answer.

An instance of scaling up a process: The technology is easily available, database wise, to file and cross reference 100,000 tips, and maybe 100,000 suspects, with maybe just 1-3 humans supporting. It doesn't sound like Seattle FBI does this, since 1000 suspects is really nothing to brag about. In fact by admitting just to investigating 1000, you can see why Cooper wasn't found.

I was doing rough estimates based on the population of Or and Wa back then, and I figured there needed to be at least an order of magnitude more suspects in the net, to be reasonably certain of finding Cooper, if he was in OR and WA...i.e. 10,000 suspects.

So, in short, I don't think kooks are the problem. I think people use that as an excuse for poor process management.

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Except for her relationship to Duane later, Jo Weber has no direct relationship with that place or period. Jo was living on the east coast far removed and totally unaware. And, Safecracking may not have even been born yet.

You may feel that way, but I feel very connected.
===================

Quote

I also wonder if any of the other Cooper candidates has ever taken to the Internet to prove their case?

I didn't know what to do - but I knew that the FBI wasn't doing anything and I did what I had to do.
========================

Quote

Why do these people seek out publicity? Don't any of them and their sponsors ever shun publicity and attention? Why haven't any of these people ever been proscecuted for giving false testimony?

I didn't seek out publicity - remember I did not go public until 2000 - I sat on the information sharing it with the FBI who sat on it. The FBI did not do anything with the information I gave them until I made the case on the computer and infront of a camera.

Ralph Hope the agent of record in 1997 is recorded as saying Duane was NEVER in McNeil - along with other information that was not correct. It was not until the first TV program which happened after I went public that this agent acknowledge anything regarding Duane (I expect he had done little or nothing from our conversations prior to that TV program).

It was the TV programs and the internet that caused the active FBI to take agressive investigative action.
===================

Quote

One of my concerns all along, expressed by others very early (in 1971), has been that the large number of cranks and kooks and false confessors "coming out of the woodwork", would actually drive away credible informants and helpers, who might otherwise get involved and be helpful. We were all young then - that was the opinion of another young
person working for the FBI back then, addressed to me directly. And I can back that up!

I know who you are now and you know that I did not go public until I was forced to do so because the FBI ignored me. You also know that I spoke with many of these so called cranks, kooks and false confessors. That some of them went away after I got hold of them - such as a taxi driver claiming he helped Cooper spend and gamble his money away.

Another who claimed to have known Weber/Cooper and shared a jail cell with him. There were others, but I don't remember them all right now.

such as the night clerk. Hence why he sought me out in 2001 rather than the FBI.

Think how this man must feel if he is reading this forum - he is entitled to his way of life and to be able to make a living and that should not be jeopardized when he comes forward with information - but, unfortunately that is how it happens...I have defended his privacy and hopefully the FBI will do that also. Note that Carr and a prior agent were aware of this man and did NOT once attempt to interview him while he was in the states. They have had almost 8 yrs to talk to him and have not done so??????????

Want to explain that to me?

So you should be able to see why no one wants to come forward. Think about what I have been through - I have been drilled, third degreed, threatened, badgered by posters, lied to by the FBI, dismissed by the FBI, ignored by the FBI, made to appear to be a liar or kook or crank by the FBI and the public...plus I have been exploited by those who wanted a story or had monetary motives. Most of you on this forum are quilty of some of these things - some have been kinder than others.

Why did I do it and Why do I continue - at my age and with my health? There is ONLY ONE motive and you all know what that is even if you deny it - the TRUTH.

Had I not had strong convictions I would have never have gone public. If I had been one of these cranks, kooks or false confessor I would have faded away yrs ago. This has tested the very core of my upbringing - regarding the truth and doing the right thing.

Would I advise others to do it - No, I would not - but for me it was the right thing to do. Would I do it if I had known what was in store for me yrs down the road or that I would still be fighting the uphill battle for the truth? I don't know, but it is my thinking I would never have walked away from what my father taught me about right and wrong.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

she's at 888 already.
No worries...
ok, now it's all coming back to me..

The winter the money was found...1980.
Where was I? In mexico with 3 other guys.
Two were brothers from Oregon. Their father was a dentist. We rode a train back home to the US. Cheap. First Class. We had a sleeper room to ourselves. Forget how long: 40 hrs or so? Stopped at every little small town to load people with chickens etc.

When we got close to the US border, the Mexican authorities tried to shake down one of the brothers because his papers weren't in order. We decided not to pay and jumped off the train and ran for the border. We made it.

When I review everything about that sentimental journey, I can only come to one conclusion. The two brothers had been told by Cooper where the money was hidden in Mexico. We must have taken the train to avoid detection at the airport. When we got to the border, it wasn't that his papers weren't in order, he wanted no record of his passage. I believe the two brothers had Cooper's Money and threw some of it in the Columbia when they returned to Oregon.

It's the only thing that makes sense.

[skyjack71 0]

I have no idea what 888 means or what your post means.

I came back here tonight to post -this. Cook claims to have mailed photos of his suspect to Tina and Florence. I have never done that.
The only photo Florence has seen was one shown to her on a cell phone in a restuarant - no explanation of his age was given to her by Geoffry the man in N.Y who claimed that Christainsen was Cooper. She stated Duane was too old - the photo she was viewing was 8 or 9 yrs after the crime...she was not told this.

I have a photo of Weber that strongly resembles Christainsen except that he is gray haired and much older in the picture and the hair line is different. Florence stated in regards to the photo of Christiansen "I think you are on to something". She is also quoted as identifying a snapshot of Coffelt as being Cooper. We are all aware that Coffelt was to old and not physically able to do the jump.

Wonder how she would do with a photo line-up of all the suspects with many different pics of each individual at different ages and with age explanations?

To my knowledge the stewardesses have not seen proper photos of Duane with explanations of the age and that there were NO pictures of Duane from that time span other than a polaroid and an old distance snapshot.

I refused to give Tina's address to Cook or to Grey - out of respect and I have NOT inflicted photos on either of the stewardesses.

I have and still maintain that the only way to find out if any of the suspects fit is for the FBI to obtain photos that have been submitted to the media and also include photos of the individuals that have NOT been in the media. Doing what is called a photo line-up with multiple pics and multiple suspects.

These photos CANNOT be morphed or alter photos such as the one Cook has used. Both the picture of Gossett and the composite have been altered - if you down load them and enlarge them you will find the alterations.
Take them to your photo program where you can enlarge small areas and see what I am talking about.

Since the media does not have one of the original composites the FBI used, the public has NO idea they are looking at an altered composite. This is what I mean about perception and myth existing and being intermingled ---to the viewer or reader becomes an accepted truth. FBI composites should be protected against alteration and HEAVY fines imposed on those doing so...to incriminate another person by altering that person's picture to more closely resemble the composite. NOT ONE photo of Duane has been altered - NOT ONE.

I believe it is time the FBI finally stepped in and did this properly with all the suspects (a picture line-up). I do not want to hurt Tina or bring back bad memories to her, but many of us out here need answers...it is time to put this long story to bed.

How many of you think I should impose photos on Tina and Florence?

I have thought about it many times, but then reason with myself - would I do that to my kids who are about their ages...without their expressed permission to do so? If I did so without photos of all the suspects it would not be a line-up.

I seriously doubt I would be able to identify someone after all of these yrs....,,with multiple pics I might do better especially if it was a very serious episode in my life.
Pictures of one individual - I would question my own or anyones ability of recall 37 yrs later.

It would mean that Cooper was quiet extraodinary in appearance - which obviously he was not...or someone would have ID ed yrs ago...

Read the posts from individuals who worked with Gossett - they do not believe he was Cooper. Perhaps it would serve the legend better to wait until they are all deceased

Outside of individuals who posts on various forums to discredit Duane Weber (I will be kind enough not to call them the names they called me) - in over 8 yrs NOT one person who KNEW Weber has come forward to say he was NOT Cooper. Those who knew him state he was secretive and the one person who knew him the best was aware Duane had a past he did not talk about.

I have not discussed in this forum or anywhere else things I have been told about Duane Weber - terrible things that there is NO need to ever disclose. Duane Weber was NOT a nice man in his past and he left many lives in ruins during his life time.

None of you have ever heard me say this - because during our marriage he was different. We had our moments, but the man I have been told about is not the man I was married to for 17yrs.

Duane had a lot of secrets - most of which will never be revealed. I do not like nor could I have loved the man that has been revealed to me by others who knew Duane. It was the man he became that I loved - and the little boy who was lost but found in the later yrs of his life.

The stories from his past - make him sound like a Jekyll and Hyde. Inside was this little boy who was reborn - maybe this is what he meant by his last few words to me.

"Take the baby down stairs
Bring the baby back up
I can't go till the baby gets here."

"I love you. " and then he went into the death gurgles. A few moments later he was dead.

I thought what he was saying very unusual and I was writing a letter and scribbled down what he said.

I don't think I understood it until this very moment - and now I believe I understand what he was talking about...what was going through his mind as he left this world. November 24, 1971...was the first day of the rest of his life.

I believe that Tina knows what I am talking about...I believe there was more discussed than what was revealed in the FBI records...that he could be reborn and that he could be a good man...it makes sense now...why she thought he was such a sad man - she gave him his life with her words - and he made his life right by living up to expectation (he believed he was going to die that night)...he died in 1995 clutching a statue of Mary...he was not Catholic.

When Tina was interviewed after the Hijacking she was clutching her Bible.....

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

Quote

Quote

One of my concerns all along, expressed by others very early (in 1971), has been that the large number of cranks and kooks and false confessors
"coming out of the woodwork", would actually drive away credible informants and helpers, who might otherwise get involved and be helpful. We were all
young then - that was the opinion of another young
person working for the FBI back then, addressed to
me directly. And I can back that up!

Georger

one of the problems with a large centralized law enforcement agency, in a big country, is that they are constrained with how they react to "kooks"..i.e. kooks take bandwidth out of the system, much like Joe McCain's 911 call. And bandwidth is fixed, cause us taxpayers only want to pony up so much for certain things.

People get adamant the "system" is supposed to react to them in a certain way, and then the thing shifts to how the "system" interacts with people, as opposed to solving the initial problem.

Look at poor Larry having to deal with Jo. And all the poor agents before him with the same problem.

The one nice thing about an anonymous open forum, is that while we have fewer investigative powers, we can tell each other to f* off, with no repercussions.

Here, we can encourage kooks of all ages and sizes, and vet them fairly rapidly...it would be worth a bunch of false positives, to get just one clue.

On anything hard, it's all about building a process that can tolerate a bunch of false positives and false negatives, and yet still get the right answer.

An instance of scaling up a process: The technology is easily available, database wise, to file and cross reference 100,000 tips, and maybe 100,000 suspects, with maybe just 1-3 humans supporting. It doesn't sound like Seattle FBI does this, since 1000 suspects is really nothing to brag about. In fact by admitting just to investigating 1000, you can see why Cooper wasn't found.

I was doing rough estimates based on the population of Or and Wa back then, and I figured there needed to be at least an order of magnitude more suspects in the net, to be reasonably certain of finding Cooper, if he was in OR and WA...i.e. 10,000 suspects.

So, in short, I don't think kooks are the problem. I think people use that as an excuse for poor process management.

reply - In 71 one could never have built that kind of data base, with the data processing environment available then. Imagine the manpower (shoe
leather) required! That was where my friend was
coming from.

Today is an entirely different story. Data bases are
expanding exponentially. Retrieval and cross referencing algorythms are becoming sophisticated.
Long gone are the days when a single person solves
a riddle - things are done by committee today. One
person's expertise feeds into the next person's, and
so on. Systems and network builders reign supreme.
Once data is assembled it doesnt take very long to
generate a list of weighted correlations to explore.

As long as the basic evidence is kept intact and
well-preserved, technology and people will catch up to it.

I am very optimistic.

Georger

[377 22]

Snowmman wrote:

"When I review everything about that sentimental journey, I can only come to one conclusion. The two brothers had been told by Cooper where the money was hidden in Mexico. We must have taken the train to avoid detection at the airport. When we got to the border, it wasn't that his papers weren't in order, he wanted no record of his passage. I believe the two brothers had Cooper's Money and threw some of it in the Columbia when they returned to Oregon.

It's the only thing that makes sense."

Agreed. Can you find a hotel clerk in Oregon who can positively ID the bros as having been in the area? Do that and we can shut down the forum.

I have stayed at the Red Lion. I was in Seattle in 71. I know how to jump from a jet airliner and proved it publicly years later at WFFC 2006. I'm tired of Duane getting the Cooper spotlight. I'm safe though, thanks to face putty, a wig and the lost cigarette butts.

377

377***

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Quote

I have stayed at the Red Lion. I was in Seattle in 71. I know how to jump from a jet airliner and proved it publicly years later at WFFC 2006. I'm tired of Duane getting the Cooper spotlight. I'm safe though, thanks to face putty, a wig and the lost cigarette butts.

What was your last conversationn with Tina?

Below is excerpts and modified quotes from a prior post made by me - at this time I feel it is appropriate to repeat them.

Quote

Read the posts from individuals who worked with Gossett - they do not believe he was Cooper. Perhaps it would serve the legend better to wait until they are all deceased.

Quote

Outside of individuals who posts on various forums to discredit Duane Weber - in over 8 yrs NOT one person who KNEW Weber has come forward to say he was NOT Cooper. Those who knew him state he was secretive and one who knew him best was aware Duane had a past he did not talk about.

Quote

I have not discussed in this forum or anywhere else things I have been told about Duane Weber - terrible things that there is NO need to ever disclose. Duane Weber was NOT a nice man in his past and he left many lives in ruins during his life-time.

Quote

None of you have ever heard me say this - because during our marriage he was different. We had our moments, but the man I have been told about is not the man I was married to for 17yrs.

Quote

Duane had a lot of secrets - most of which will never be revealed. I do not like nor could I have loved the man that has been revealed to me by others who knew Duane. It was the man he became that I loved - and the little boy who was lost, but found in the later yrs of his life.

Quote

The stories from his past - make him sound like a Jekyll and Hyde. Inside was this little boy who was reborn - maybe this is what he meant by his last few words to me.

Quote

"Take the baby down stairs
Bring the baby back up
I can't go till the baby gets here."

Quote

"I love you. " and then he went into the death gurgles. A few moments later he was dead.

Quote

I thought what he was saying very unusual and wrote it down on the pad I was using to write a letter.

I did not understand this it until a few post ago as I wrote it in a reply.
" now I believe I understand what he was talking about...what was going through his mind as he left this world. November 24, 1971...was the first day of the rest of his life."

Quote

I believe that Tina knows what I am talking about...I believe there was more discussed than what was revealed in the FBI records...that he could be reborn and that he could be a good man...it makes sense now...why she thought he was such a sad man - she gave him his life with her words - and he made his life right by living up to expectation (he believed he was going to die that night)...he died in 1995 clutching a statue of Mary...he was not Catholic.

Quote

When Tina was interviewed after the Hijacking she was clutching her Bible.....

Did I strike a NERVE with someone when I revealed this - something I have held close to my heart?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[georger 247]

I know who you are now and you know that I did not go public until I was forced to do so because the FBI ignored me.

Reply> well. . . you finally have me. I knew in time
you would. As I see this, Jo, you brought some of
this on yourself. You became a magnet for people
seeking publicity and fouling up the works. You know what (our) original advice was: "Keep it close to your vest. Remain silent. Be patient". But you went ahead on your own and nobody appreciated that - because the process was in motion, whether you knew it or not. There was always more involved, and other people to consider.

a prior agent were aware of this man and did NOT once attempt to interview him while he was in the states. They have had almost 8 yrs to talk to him and have not done so??????????

Reply> ... so far as you know or ever knew. Just because he contacted you does not mean he fully trusted you, or anyone else for that matter. He had
his own life. Nobody can force people to testify if
they dont want to. And there were other facts that surfaced which you aren't even aware of.

You wanted my perspective and now you have it.

Have a good day.

Georger

[skyjack71 0]

From Georger:

Quote

But you went ahead on your own and nobody appreciated that - because the process was in motion, whether you knew it or not. There was always more involved, and other people to consider.

Quote

There was always more involved, and other people to consider

.

If there was

Quote

MORE involved and OTHER PEOPLE TO CONSIDER

the investigation of Duane Weber was COMPROMISED from the beginning.

This - is something that should have been said to me FACE TO FACE 11 yrs ago by someone with the authority to do so.

That advise was never gave to me in-person by someone of authority to do so. With 13 yrs of my life invested in this - I deserve to know the truth and 11 yrs ago prior to going public I would gladly have listened and signed any confidential document required.

As for the night clerk - the FBI never MADE an attempt to interview him after he came forward, so it was then between he and I. Even AGENT Carr denies the existence of this registration card - shredded along with other evidence such as the cigarrette butts and the paper bag?

Common sense tells everyone why the FBI did not let the paper bag story linger in the media just as the story about the lost cigarrette butts doesn't make any sense. How or why would have Cooper been so meticulous about certain items and leave an item such as a tie?

Truth and trust goes a long long way - and it could have avoided this long battle I have endured for over 12 yrs......

Your statement about "more involved and other people to consider" is very extraordinary coming from someone with your high degree of intellect. I am not mocking you - but it high time others realize there is to more this case than meets the eye and the veil of secrecy is far from being pulled away.

IN FACT: The information that has been released and maybe released in the future was brought about by my keeping this in-front of the public and refusing to let it just fade away as the FBI and OTHERS would have it do. That statement by you opens up the conspiracy theory - and does not lead one to believe that new evidence exists...just more of the same old thing - more secrets.

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[skyjack71 0]

Quote

Jo Weber stated: agents were aware of this man and did NOT once attempt to interview him while he was in the states. They have had almost 8 yrs to talk to him and have not done so??????????

Georger states: so far as you know or ever knew. Just because he contacted you does not mean he fully trusted you, or anyone else for that matter. He had
his own life. Nobody can force people to testify if they dont want to. And there were other facts that surfaced which you aren't even aware of.

"And there were other facts that surfaced which you aren't even aware of".

Georger: If these facts pertained to the witness - I knew before the FBI knew. ALL of that has since been cleared up - and taken care of...if you or the FBI choose to use that as an excuse that is really petty - not just petty but pathetic on the part of the FBI. These facts that surfaced - came about long after I told the FBI about this witness and yrs after I was contacted and told his story...use that and go to jail...shall we play monoploy?

Copyright 2006, 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012 2013, 2014, 2015 by Jo Weber

[snowmman 3]

Okay, I'll give up anonynomity and give a clue that anyone with half a brain could use to find me.

- I created the initial entry for "dick joke" on Wikipedia. I've got that going for me, too. (want to call bullshit on that? go check the history for it in wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dick_joke&dir=prev&action=history

[cabbage 0]

Quote

Okay, I'll give up anonynomity and give a clue that anyone with half a brain could use to find me.

- I created the initial entry for "dick joke" on Wikipedia. I've got that going for me, too. (want to call bullshit on that? go check the history for it in wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dick_joke&dir=prev&action=history

Yip! DICK, true enough - no links to wikipedia required for confirmation.

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We're a' just machines for makin' shite.