DB Cooper

[snowmman 3]

this is an amazing find here:
at
http://www.sfahq.com/reg/comments.htm

It's from William L. Kendall. His email address is at that site, from 2005.

Bruce: maybe Kendall would remember Braden. His email address is there so you can contact him???

William Horner was my replacement in MACVSOG at what was called "House 10 or Villa 10" which was located just outside the Airbase in Saigon.

His primary job was that of packing the chutes that were used for the indig that were being inserted and also rigging all of the buddles for those teams. In addition to that he was to help with the jump training at Camp Long Thanh. Bill was working with some of the indig with their training at the camp when he was killed.

He was firing the 60mm mortor at the time. The mortor round exploded just as it left the tube killing him instantly.

I was notified of this since I had spent a year from 64-65 doing the same job. "I can not say that is exactly what happened" but it does appear to be true according to other sourses.

I had taken over the job of working with parachute packing, bundle rigging and training of the indig at Camp Long Thanh from CSD.

COL Clyde Russell was our first SOG Commander, MAJ Hanz Manz was the logistical officer, MSG Linwood E. Pate was the logistic NCOIC, SSG James McGlon was the Intel and OP Sgt at SOG Headquarters on Pasture street in Saigon.

I could give you the names of most of the teams that were inserted during 64-65 and according to other sourses most of them were either killed or captured as soon as the hit the ground. You probably already know most of this anyway. Have a good day. I will get my eyes checked again.

Bill Kendall
William L Kendall
Jefferson, IA USA - Monday, May 23, 2005 at 20:37:43 (PDT)

[snowmman 3]

(edit) Note in the above post, when the guy is saying he heard "most" teams inserted were killed or captured, he's talking about indigeneous inserts, early on ('64-'65)...probably Leaping Lena operations.. In "The Blood Road", there were descriptions of Leaping Lena and what happened for some teams. I'm not sure the guy's info above is accurate, but who knows..


now to SF KIA:

This guy has spent a lot of hours gathering info on all Special Forces KIA in Vietnam

Table with details at
http://www.sfahq.com/reg/reg_sfqual.htm

home page is
http://www.sfahq.com

Sobering reading the list. You can see consecutive cases where teams were lost. And then there's the cases of just accidents or weird things.

[snowmman 3]

Looking thru that list

I wasn't aware of any US on HALO in Thailand post 1971
I thought there were two ARVN only HALO jumps post 1971.

But this says an American died on a HALO operation in Thailand in 1972

1972 09 16 E-9 CSM Carlos E. Leal, Jr. 00Z5S DNH, HALO accident Thailand; 46th SF Co, near Lopburi, HALO accident

Carlos Leal is listed in this book also
http://books.google.com/books?ei=gs2GSvj-C4TSsQOSzKyWBw&ct=result&id=Bgv6nas1X4oC&dq=%22Carlos+Leal%22+thailand&ots=RR-_quR54T&q=carlos+leal#v=snippet&q=carlos%20leal&f=false

He was Command Sergeant Major of the 46th Special Forces Company (Airborne)

It doesn't mention how he died there, but talks about the Thailand operation.
I wonder if that had been kept secret.


(edit) another big SF KIA history search is at
http://www.specialforcesroh.com/browse.php?mode=search
not just Vietnam, there.
Leal is there
http://www.specialforcesroh.com/browse.php?mode=viewiroll&rollid=9542

[hangdiver 1]

Did anyone else notice the bulge in the collar from the tab of the clip-on tie in the photo of Braden? Just thought I'd point that out, not that it means anything.

"Mans got to know his limitations"
Harry Callahan

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Did anyone else notice the bulge in the collar from the tab of the clip-on tie in the photo of Braden? Just thought I'd point that out, not that it means anything.

I was thinking that the white collar cloth is very flat against his neck (the shirt is too tight in the neck)...but it seems to show that there might not be tie cloth under the collar around his neck? it lies flat?
not sure.

[BruceSmith 3]

Greetings Y'all

I've had a few conversations with Galen Cook about Ted, eye color, and Florence Schaffner.

Galen says that Florence sat next to Danny for extensive periods of time whle they circled Sea-Tac, and that it wasn't just Tina. Galen says Florence really studied Cooper's eyes, and she adamantly states that they were a deep, dark, penetrating brown.

I've asked Galen to get a pix of Braden to Florence and let her decide.

But right now, it ain't looking good for Teddy Bear. Those baby blues, greens or hazels or whatever, ain't cuttin' it in the Cooper contest.

Relatedly, Galen is putting the pedal to the metal in his Cooper investigations, and has spent a ton o'money and time at the Columbia and other spots. He has hried a cracker-jack team of scientists to study the sands, soils, water, etc - all the stuff Kaye and Ckret say they're doing - and more.

While Galen won't share any of his findings until he makes a ton o' money on his book deal and speaking tour, I have every confidence that we will receive this vital pool of information eventually.

[snowmman 3]

Bruce says "Galen says that Florence sat next to Danny for extensive periods of time whle they circled Sea-Tac, and that it wasn't just Tina. Galen says Florence really studied Cooper's eyes, and she adamantly states that they were a deep, dark, penetrating brown."


Thanks for checking that out Bruce. I guess it wasn't Ted then.
I guess I'm confused about who was sitting next to who, and when, and when Cooper wore sunglasses.

I forget what Ckret said.

I guess the strongest evidence is going to be if someone claims to be Cooper and has brown eyes.

Hmm..there's really no way we can "find" Cooper. It's not possible.

Regardless of anything Galen does, regardless of how much he spends, he can't prove anything either. I wonder who's going to give Galen money?

The cop is writing a book too, so that will cut into Galen's profits.

(edit) bruce says "While Galen won't share any of his findings until he makes a ton o' money on his book deal and speaking tour, I have every confidence that we will receive this vital pool of information eventually."

well if there's a book, it's just a matter of buying the book?

(edit) I searched for what Ckret said about brown eyes:
he said
"He had brown eyes (Schaffner saw his eyes before he put on the glasses, he looked directly at her several times urging her to read the note) "

So I don't know about this story about Schaffner sitting next to Cooper as they circled Seattle, and Cooper had the glasses off. I'm not going to look back in the posts.

[377 22]

If Galen finds even one "hot" twenty in his search through Gosset's stuff he and his suspect will have a lot of well deserved attention. It's a huge long shot but Galen is not ruling it out. He isn't looking in pet cemetaries.

I don't share Snow's pessimism. I just have a hunch that Cooper will be positively identified eventually. They'll find Amelia Earharts plane too.

We aren't chasing UFOs. Real people, real hardware. The clues are out there somewhere.

I can say with certainty that although Fred Noonan (Earhart's navigator) was probably more inebriated than Cooper, Earhart's plane will not be found in the Washougal.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[georger 247]

Quote

Greetings Y'all

I've had a few conversations with Galen Cook about Ted, eye color, and Florence Schaffner.

Galen says that Florence sat next to Danny for extensive periods of time whle they circled Sea-Tac, and that it wasn't just Tina. Galen says Florence really studied Cooper's eyes, and she adamantly states that they were a deep, dark, penetrating brown.

I've asked Galen to get a pix of Braden to Florence and let her decide.

But right now, it ain't looking good for Teddy Bear. Those baby blues, greens or hazels or whatever, ain't cuttin' it in the Cooper contest.

Relatedly, Galen is putting the pedal to the metal in his Cooper investigations, and has spent a ton o'money and time at the Columbia and other spots. He has hried a cracker-jack team of scientists to study the sands, soils, water, etc - all the stuff Kaye and Ckret say they're doing - and more.

While Galen won't share any of his findings until he makes a ton o' money on his book deal and speaking tour, I have every confidence that we will receive this vital pool of information eventually.

Cook has been full of promises, for years. What
can one say?

Ashes to ashes. Dust to dust. Coast-to-Coast.

But I wouldnt take his note. Cash only.

[377 22]

Quote

Ashes to ashes. Dust to dust. Coast-to-Coast.

Good one Georger!

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[BruceSmith 3]

I just finished speaking with Rex Jaco. Very nice guy - a gentleman.

He confirmed that he was interviewd by the FBI in the Cooper case back in the early 70s. Not sure when exactly.

He was stationed at Ft. Bragg, having come back from "Nam in 1970 sometime. He said he was selected by the feds because of his age and physical characteristics, and being "airborne qualified."

"I guess they put all the airborne guys in a computer and my name was one of those that got spit out."

Rex said the feds asked him general questions, such as where we was on the night, etc.

The feds also asked him about another guy "from 187" but Rex couldn't remember the vet's name.

Rex served with Billy Waugh, and spoke with a deep, special feeling about Billy and the SOG days. "SOG was like no other unit in the Army. That last year was pretty exciting."

Rex was eligible for HALO traiing, but decided he wanted to "take a rest," again reiterating that his last year in Vietnam was "pretty exciting."

Rex didn't know Ted, and never heard the rumor that Ted was Danny.

Rex's wife is a sweetie-pie, too. She called me honey! Awwww- shucks, ma'am..........................

[snowmman 3]

thanks Bruce.
Did you confirm Rex's age that I reported?
If Rex was selected based on a profile, then they were profiling based on under 40?

It sounds like they didn't have records of military already discharged.

Since Rex was still military, maybe he popped out..i.e. maybe they were just checking active military.

I guess it doesn't matter. Ckret has said that the events of Flight 305 showed Cooper didn't have any experience. Although I'm still not clear on whether that allows loadmasters now.

Are we back to Cooper being an engineer?

What's the current profile anyhow? Journalist? I know a guy named Bruce who has always been a bit too interested in the case. In fact he snuck into a documentary on Cooper.

(edit) did anyone else pick up on the "manicured fingers" description of Braden by Duncan? Kind of odd for a truck driver, if that's what he was. Who the hell was Braden anyhow? Man it'd be great if Bruce could find Wife version 2.

[BruceSmith 3]

Rex said he was 75.

As for Ted's manicured fingers, yes, that caught my attention, too.

So, it's hard to imagine the Ted Braden we've come to know driving a truck for very long once he was released from the Ft Dix jail.

Also, it's hard for me to imagine that the CIA didn't find a place for him somewhere.

I'm not bailing on Ted until I hear defintively from Florence Schaffner that he ain't the guy.

Plus, I'm intrigued. What was Ted Braden really like? I'm hoping for contact with P in Florida. So far, no new leads from PA.

[georger 247]

Quote

I just finished speaking with Rex Jaco. Very nice guy - a gentleman.

He confirmed that he was interviewd by the FBI in the Cooper case back in the early 70s. Not sure when exactly.

He was stationed at Ft. Bragg, having come back from "Nam in 1970 sometime. He said he was selected by the feds because of his age and physical characteristics, and being "airborne qualified."

"I guess they put all the airborne guys in a computer and my name was one of those that got spit out."

Rex said the feds asked him general questions, such as where we was on the night, etc.

The feds also asked him about another guy "from 187" but Rex couldn't remember the vet's name.
reply]

This should dispell a few myths promoted here
that the FBi wasn't on the job.

Good report Bruce -

Do you still intend to talk to Rat again?

• Quote

[snowmman 3]

Quote

This should dispell a few myths promoted here
that the FBi wasn't on the job.

??? I don't see what you mean georger.
What do you think it means about the FBI?
That they interviewed some enlisted military that were airborne qualified?

Rex even said he didn't take HALO training.

And his age was wrong.

I'm not sure what you mean about the FBI georger.
I take it as evidence that they weren't on the job???
What's your perception?

I still have no idea why they picked Rex out of a LOT of military possibles.

I wonder how many military they talked to????
Or did someone just drop a dime on Rex because they knew his SOG background?

(edit) I wonder what would have happened, if the FBI consulted the right experts for the age group, like Waugh, Braden and Duncan, in 1971, rather than Cossey.

It made no sense to talk to young sport jumpers in 1971, did it?

(edit) How come no one commented on the right-hand pull mods on the Golden Knights rigs I posted??
Or the shoes?

[377 22]

I'll comment on the right hand pulls: surprising given the greatly increased chance for snagging on something.

Don't know what to say bout the shoes. Can't see much detail on my monitor. What are your thoughts Snow?

Did my first HAHO today from about 14,000 ft. Been jumping for years but always looked at altitude as wasted if not used for freefall. Flying around high up with stowed brakes (slow and quiet) was very peaceful. You see and hear other planes, take in the beautiful CA scenery, even mingle with hawks at lower altitudes.

377

2018 marks half a century as a skydiver. Trained by the late Perry Stevens D-51 in 1968.

[JerryThomas 0]

Georger: I was supose to leave this morning for washougal. But got waylayed due to a turbo problem on my truck.Its one of those new one's with the turbo diesel's. Any way I will leave tomorrow AM.True The FBI did question many Airbourne qualified personell to include SF,Seals ,Special opp's and many other's . The research you and other's are doing is great. But please bare in mind all this has been done in the past. I don't mean to say all research is fruitless. I do believe something could have been missed. However the answer as to who Cooper was will not be found by thinking Cooper was a military man. Yes he may have Known someone in the military. But It is a better guess that he new someone that worked at Boing/or in the aircraft Industry or new some one that worked with
aircraft, It is obvious that he did not no anything about parachutes or sell insurance. Most airliner's fall out of the sky 160 Knot's . Take off speed is aproximately 160mph (th lo speed)depending on the load.Cooper must have known something to request the speed he did . Still he did not no enough to make a jump that was safe or how to dress. Jerry

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Did my first HAHO today from about 14,000 ft. Been jumping for years but always looked at altitude as wasted if not used for freefall. Flying around high up with stowed brakes (slow and quiet) was very peaceful. You see and hear other planes, take in the beautiful CA scenery, even mingle with hawks at lower altitudes.

377

Very cool 377! I know you had talked about this thing you had in mind for a while, and it's cool to see you start to plan it and execute it. Especially on a thread where we're all full of B.S. most of the time!

So did you use any radios like you were talking about?

Somehow, I think 377 is going to turn into one of those crazy guys with a bunch of balloons tied to a lawn chair, and a bb gun...just another variant :)

on the shoes: I was just thinking they showed how a quick glance, not knowing what you're looking it, with the pants over the shoes, could be misleading for saying "would you jump with these shoes?". Note that some were thinner soles.

[snowmman 3]

Jerry said "The FBI did question many Airbourne qualified personell to include SF,Seals ,Special opp's and many other's . The research you and other's are doing is great. But please bare in mind all this has been done in the past."

Ah okay. So you have information that Duncan, Waugh and Braden were questioned by the FBI? Where did you get that info? When were they interviewed?

(edit) Now I'm wondering why Sluggo lied to us about Braden being questioned???

[snowmman 3]

Jerry suggested out of the blue "But It is a better guess that he new someone that worked at Boing/or in the aircraft Industry or new some one that worked with aircraft"

What makes anyone think Cooper worked with aircraft?

I see nothing that suggests that???

can you explain???

(edit) With respect to dress, I think Cooper was perfect. If the primary goal was to disguise so as to not get caught. There's nothing that says injury or death was highly likely with his outfit, if he jumped reasonably close to Portland.

(edit) Plus: this aircraft worker theory has been around for ages...
Why am I supposed to think the FBI has played out the military angle, but not played out the aviation worker angle?

It doesn't make sense. It's all circular arguments about the FBI and their theories and behaviors.

[georger 247]

The FBI did question many Airbourne qualified personell to include SF,Seals ,Special opp's and many other's . The research you and other's are doing is great. But please bare in mind all this has been done in the past. I don't mean to say all research is fruitless. I do believe something could have been missed. However the answer as to who Cooper was will not be found by thinking Cooper was a military man. Yes he may have Known someone in the military. But It is a better guess that he new someone that worked at Boing/or in the aircraft Industry or new some one that worked with
aircraft, It is obvious that he did not no anything about parachutes or sell insurance. Most airliner's fall out of the sky 160 Knot's . Take off speed is aproximately 160mph (th lo speed)depending on the load.Cooper must have known something to request the speed he did . Still he did not no enough to make a jump that was safe or how to dress. Jerry

[georger 247]

Don't know what to say bout the shoes. Can't see much detail on my monitor. What are your thoughts Snow?

[snowmman 3]

Quote

Don't know what to say bout the shoes. Can't see much detail on my monitor. What are your thoughts Snow?

didnt see any loafers. But several 'boots' appear
to be steel belted on the sides, jumping boots?
Other than that I saw nothing unusual. Did Snow
see Yeshua in the shoes?

[georger 247]

Quote

Jerry said "The FBI did question many Airbourne qualified personell to include SF,Seals ,Special opp's and many other's . The research you and other's are doing is great. But please bare in mind all this has been done in the past."

Ah okay. So you have information that Duncan, Waugh and Braden were questioned by the FBI? Where did you get that info? When were they interviewed?

(edit) Now I'm wondering why Sluggo lied to us about Braden being questioned???

ah, you lied about Tom Kaye getting $50k.

Go figure.

[BruceSmith 3]

Yes, I intend to call Bill again. I called a couple days ago, and was only able to leave a message.