Hand Cam Video: Do you do it? What's the arrangement?

[efs4ever 3]

Hand Cam is certainly going to become more prevalent over the next few years. I don't know how many times tandem loads had to be shorted because of a lack of video staff.

Do you do Hand Cam video on tandems? What's the arrangement with DZO on pay?

Tell me everything!

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Attorney at Law
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[flyfree2day 0]

Hey, I've got about five or eight hundred jumps with the hand cam. The dropzone I worked at only does the hand cam. I made about ten dollars extra for doing the video, and five for the editing. It worked good. I had two mals. with it on, and it didn't get in the way at all. I thought it made tandems fun again, more work but fun. Jim

[rhys 0]

I have only started doing hand cams and I think they are allright. not as good as outside camera but a good handcam is better than a shit outside camera. the best advantage is the reaction of the customer when the parachute opens. there are some priceless looks.

you have to use a .25 to get any scenery in, .3 is not quite wide enough. i get paid $50 extra for the video and the camera and glove are supplied.

for a small cessna dropzone it is far more eficcient, we are using a 185 so it climbs well with 2 tandems and we can gety 2 videos done as well. if we had 100% camera with outside camera we would have to do single loads and would only be able to half the amount of people.

I have never had a mal on a tandem so fuck knows how it affects that situation but from what others have told me, It makes no difference. and you get mean footage from it.

i do get more line twists though and It has actually made me fly with my legs only so i can film with one hand and play silly buggers with the other.

if there is a problem.... fuck the footage and get it sorted. there is nothing wrong with hand cam except it will never be better that good outside camera. period.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[bob.dino 1]

Most of Oz does hand-cam now. I don't have a rating, but if you PM DanglesOzQld he can tell you about conditions, pay, etc.

[diablopilot 2]

IMO it ain't worth it for $10.


$30 maybe.

----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[riggerrob 643]

Pacific Skydivers pays me $30 per tandem, $70 if I do Handy-Mount video, $60 if someone else dubbs it to DVD.
So I get paid the same as an outside videographer, but I have to work twice as hard.
I had 2600 tandems before starting to do Handy-Mount video and have made another 400 since then with a camera strapped to my left hand.
I supply the camera and sew my own Handy-Mounts.

[DAMO 0]

We do HC and get $40 extra, we dont have to do any editing and we only shoot freefall footage, ground footage(gearing up, walking to plane, landings etc.) is shot by ground camera staff. I personally don't think you should do it for any less then what you get paid to do the tandem, ie: $40 for tandem $80 for tandem with HC, therfore doubling your income. Especially if you have to use your own camera. I think $10 is no where near enough.

I Have had a couple of mals with the glove on and it has not caused any problems. Although I have seen experienced tandem masters make some bad decisions.

As mentioned the best thing about HC is the first reaction after the canopy opens, can be very entertaining! Is outside video better then HC? That is definitely a matter of opinion, they both have there good and bad points. From my experience if given the choice the media will choose HC over outside, they seam to prefer the it. I personaly don't have a preference, I think they are both a good product. We do both and occasionally a passenger will actually get both HC and outside.

As a tandem master if I am doing a tandem I would prefer to be doing a HC as it doubles my income, as a cameraman I don't wont to see the end of outside video either, witch is what has happened to pretty much all the DZ's in OZ with a lot of camera only people not to happy about it. You can see why DZO's go to HC only, especially when they charge the same as outside, its a smart business decision.

Interested to hear others opinions.

Later.

[flyfree2day 0]

I was using my own camera. I agree that 10 dollars is not enough, But i liked the owner and the people I was working with. It was a new DZ, just getting started.

[NSEMN8R 0]

I love my handcam, but it's caused me a lot of problems.

When I first got it the dzo said to charge whatever I wanted, but he made $10 profit off of outside video and he wanted the same from the handcam videos. So, out of fairness to the vidiots, I decided to charge the same price as for OS video thinking I wouldn't take as much work from them. After seeing examples of both, most of the people wanted the handcam video anyways. So I ended up busy as hell making like $90/jump. The dzo got pissed when he found out how much $ I was pulling out of there and the vidiots were pissed because I was taking all the work.

In the end I made a whole bunch of money, but I pissed off some people. I ended up having to find a new dz.

The only other dz around here that is handcam friendly is a Skyride dz and I've decided to stay out of that so I don't really have anyplace to use it anymore.

[flyfree2day 0]

I don't know if you know Ed. But he's starting a small 182 tandem op. in Plainwell. If your still in Michigan? I don't think he's going to be using skyride. He's a fair guy, so he would be good to work for. If you want to contact him let me know.

[riggerrob 643]

Getting paid more money ... to deliver a better product ... that keeps the customers happier .... in a manner that turns airplanes quicker ...
Jez!
You have my sympathies.

Brighter DZOs would welcome you with open arms.

[riggerrob 643]

The dzo got pissed when he found out how much $ I was pulling out of there ...

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

The DZO should grow up and accept that the busiest employees deserve the biggest pay checks.
Pay checks are part of the cost of doing business.

[NSEMN8R 0]

Quote

You have my sympathies.

Thanks Rob. I appreciate it. Especially since you're the one who got me into that mess.

I really do like the handcam glove though. It's a lot of fun for other stuff besides tandems too.

[skydived19006 4]

I run a small DZ in Kansas (In the States, Kansas is OZ, it’s a Wizard of OZ thing), “small” as in one 182, myself and my partner doing all the tandems, and video (we trade off). Right now for us to do two tandems with outside video is two loads and four pack jobs. We’re gearing up for handy cam, which will reduce the same scenario to one load, and just the tandem rigs to pack (we did decide to start using a packer this year; we did 400 tandems last year also packing for ourselves).

I currently charge $75 for outside video with 35mm stills, and plan to offer HC for $40. I pay $30 to run outside video, and plan to pay either $20 or $30 for HC (I personally do half of all tandems and video).

Wichita had formally had two active DZs, my competition just recently closed, so my one airplane is really not enough lift (outside video REALLY bogs us down) so it’ll help with the lift capacity as well. 12 tandems with outside video is 12 loads, with HC it’s 6 loads which frees up the AC for 6 more Loads for the fun jumper, students, etc! Not only that but for Mark and I, we do 6 jumps a day as opposed to 12. I’m not as young as I used to be!

In our situation, it’s a case of “everybody goes home in a limo!”

I’d say it’s coming, get used to it.
“Things are more like they are now than they ever were before.”
Dwight D. Eisenhower

Martin
Air Capital Drop Zone

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

I think you are positively making the right decision for your dropzone, Martin.

Chuck

[skydiveoc 0]

I think you're underpricing your hand cam price and de-valuing it. $65 and paying out $30 more seems more suitable in the hand cam market.

[SkymonkeyONE 4]

Quote

I think you're underpricing your hand cam price and de-valuing it. $65 and paying out $30 more seems more suitable in the hand cam market.

If you are not going to do anymore outside video, then I totally agree.

[skydived19006 4]

Quote

I think you're underpricing your hand cam price and de-valuing it. $65 and paying out $30 more seems more suitable in the hand cam market.

I won’t really disagree with that opinion. Here are my thoughts, a large part of the justification for the price of outside video is that it requires another person on the skydive (yes, and a dedicated professional video person can have $10,000 in his equipment). For inside video, the third skydiver and slot isn’t required, granted the TM will have $1000 or so in camera, glove, lens, etc.

I want to “push” inside video in order to lighten the work load, and to free up the airplane. If I were running a turbine (with a need to sell as many slots as possible), and had a couple of dedicated video professionals standing around my motivation would be just the opposite. Also my opinion, inside video is a cool product, but it does not justify the price that outside video does. My opinion of outside video and stills is that the real value is in the stills. The customer will show the video around as much as they can for a few days, then it goes away (unless it’s a naked chick tandem, we play those every once in a while after a long day, and with a few beers!). The stills can be blown up, framed, loaded and ran as a screen saver, back ground, emailed around the world, made into a colander, printed in the newspaper, tattooed on your ass, etc. etc.

Martin

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[friday999 0]

I just heard a TM bragging today that on his last cutaway he didn't even pull the reserve handle, because 'the RSL will do it anyway', and that this way he got better footage on his handy.

THAT'S SO WRONG! consider that when you're doing handy.

[riggerrob 643]

Naughty tandem master.

During all (15) of my tandem reserve rides, the RSL pulle dthe reserve ripcord long befor eI di, but I still pulle dthe reserve ripcord, just out of habit.
I have a fine collection of kinked (pulled by RSL) tandem reserve ripcords in the back of my loft.

I have also lost count of how many times the RSL mysteriously dis-connected itself at opening time. One time I remember it slapping/snagging on the side of my Pro-Tec helmet.

[flyfree2day 0]

How much do they charge for a tandem?

Quote

Pacific Skydivers pays me $30 per tandem, $70 if I do Handy-Mount video, $60 if someone else dubbs it to DVD.
So I get paid the same as an outside videographer, but I have to work twice as hard.
I had 2600 tandems before starting to do Handy-Mount video and have made another 400 since then with a camera strapped to my left hand.
I supply the camera and sew my own Handy-Mounts.

[flyfree2day 0]

When I had to cutaway with the hc.. I pulled the reserve and still had pretty cool footage. I think the passenger would rather have us do our job, and put their saftey first.

[skydived19006 4]

Since I now offer more than one video option, I put up a page specifically for "Tandem Video" (need to replace the current pictures, some of them are a bit dark). Also added in pricing on the "Prices" page, with links pointing to the video page everywhere video is mentioned.

We offer tandem and IAD training, there's no confusion with AFF video.

Check it out.
AC/DZ Tandem Video page

AC/DZ Prices page

Experience is what you get when you thought you were going to get something else.

AC DZ

[Trae 1]

in reply to "Tell me everything! "
.................

One issue with the increasing popularity of the economic benefits of hand cam is the demise of the outside camera person.

These endangered pro camera people get fewer on the ground through the week but outnumber everyone on the weekend.

Personally I like the provision for a delux video service that has the options of , outside video or handcam, or a combination of the two .
This allows room to retain the highly skilled and dedicated outside camera person.

Having that highly experienced and dedicated outside camera dude along for the jump is something not quite ready for the bin... in my opinion.

[clint 1]

Martin,

We were/are in the same situation. I just did the change over 2 months ago. You will NEVER go back to outside video.

We are a cessna 182 dz. We did 500 tdms last year and we are set to do 800 this year. My wife did the outside video this year. But you save so much money because your plane doesn't have to fly 1/2 as much, making your cost per load cheaper.

Suggestion, I would get the upright positioned camera glove. I have both up and down and I don't like the angle of the video. For me, I have not noticed any difference between the two when it comes to the snag factor or getting the door opened or anything else.

Martin, PM me if you want more info. We are about 70% video sales.

-

Clint MacBeth
Skydive Moab 435 259 JUMP
M.O.A.B. Mother Of All Boogies Sept 19 - 23, 2012