Paige 0 #26 October 12, 2005 Nice, I know you'll love it out there! I can't wait to get out to Eloy. Doesn't look like this holiday will happen, family stuff came up but oh well. Before hurricanes there was talk of a PMS & TPM sky/tunnel boogie at Eloy between Brooke and I. It was mentioned in passing and not discussed in length but I think it would be something very fun that I'd love to help make happen if any of us are up for planning such an event.Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #27 October 12, 2005 Ft Bragg is not on your list...But it wins so far."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steven1981 0 #28 October 12, 2005 how do i delet a post i mean the whole thingThe blue sky is pretty but the blue sky with fast air is better gotty love wind tunnels Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #29 October 12, 2005 Quote Ft Bragg is not on your list...But it wins so far. Thats cus youve not tried the better ones Ron Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #30 October 12, 2005 from what I understand.. we'd all be hard pressed to find a tunnel better than Bragg... of course the cost was through the roof.. but still... added: some are close I suspect.. each of the 'finer' tunnels have their own endearing qualities which make them the 'best' to each of us Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #31 October 12, 2005 Quote Ft Bragg is not on your list This is only for jumpers that are in the military, correct? I mean I love wind tunnels and all, but I don't think I would do boot camp to get into one.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bowen 0 #32 October 13, 2005 the size and power of a tunnel is important but don’t forget about the experience and knowledge of the staff. -BowenRetired Tunnel Instructor, Sky/Tunnel Coach Former dealer for 2k Composites, Skysystems, Alti-2, Wings Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #33 October 13, 2005 Quotefrom what I understand.. we'd all be hard pressed to find a tunnel better than Bragg... of course the cost was through the roof.. but still Not sure what features you would be comparing to say that its hard to be 'better' I know alot of people that have trained in Bragg - and also with us.... and they all without exception no longer see Bragg as 'meca'! Appologies for the shameless boasting - but I am obviously a little proud of our baby Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stevehamiltonxl 0 #34 October 13, 2005 Ft. Bragg is, indeed, a great tunnel. We were fortunate enough to get the chance to train there for 3 days a few years ago. However, Bedford has the same air quality....and is 2 ft bigger Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #35 October 13, 2005 Paul.. to have that kinda airspeed & quality without wall to wall air... is truly an accomplishement over other tunnels. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #36 October 13, 2005 QuoteNot sure what features you would be comparing to say that its hard to be 'better' For one, I like not having walls. It allows you to train blocks with catches by staging people outside the cone. Now walls are better for people who might fly out by accident, but not having them allows for some very good training opportunities. QuoteI know alot of people that have trained in Bragg - and also with us.... and they all without exception no longer see Bragg as 'meca'! And while I have not been to Bedford, you have not been to Bragg. Any comparison by either of us is suspect. I can say this, Ft. Bragg makes the two SkyVenture tunnels I have been in seem like they are powered by box fans. Bragg is 12+ years old. The fact it is still at or even near the top of any list is quite amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #37 October 13, 2005 Dawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. Ron - Walls or no walls is a criteria that I can follow for preference.... hopefully we can get you here one day so that you can check us out as much as I would love to.... I dont hold much hope of me getting into Ft. Bragg One thing I will say is that our tunnel like Bragg was built at a time where some of the best minds had alot of resources to create tunnels. We cant really take credit from the scientists that built our facility in 1950. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #38 October 13, 2005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #39 October 13, 2005 QuoteDawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality I think her point was that the fact Bragg has solid air from one side of the cone to the other without walls is pretty amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #40 October 13, 2005 QuoteWalls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. it's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'... Ft. Bragg is much more amazing to me, maintaining that quality, dealing with expansion but no loss... much more like the first vwt's ever built... like the 5ft Durand tunnel... from when was it.. the 1800's? added: I was also just thinking that Wright Patt was the MOST amazing VWT... of all... acccomplishing the same thing and with such a WONDERFULLY soft net!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steven1981 0 #41 October 13, 2005 Thank u very much The blue sky is pretty but the blue sky with fast air is better gotty love wind tunnels Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #42 October 13, 2005 Quoteit's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'.. Easier to maintain? - this all makes not alot of sense to me. If the air is laminar it is laminar at the start of the test section (flight chamber whatever) Are you guys suggesting they do something mystical to the air properties that makes having no wall there possible?! cus that really is bizarre. If you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet... not too noticable in a few meters for sure. There is no magic going on at Ft Bragg.... so like I said - walls or no walls much the same. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paige 0 #43 October 13, 2005 Quotethe size and power of a tunnel is important but don’t forget about the experience and knowledge of the staff. -Bowen I can't say this enough, esp. about you guys at SVO! I'm always bragging about how good the instructors are and how fast your students learn. You guys bust ass and deserve to be recognized Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #44 October 13, 2005 QuoteIf you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet the amazing part occurs when this doesn't happen! when all the calculations are all correct and the airflow is precicely as it should be... the holy grail of open air vwt engineering!!! magic? maybe a very rare and precious thing, still un-duplicated? Definitely!(is un-duplicated a word?) still.. unaffordable for almost anyone... and that is a sad sad thing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #45 October 13, 2005 Dawn - dont get me at all wrong here... I am starting to love you dearly.... but you are way off base with some of the physics principles involved here. Air is Air... the way it behaves is the same for people the world over.... there is nothing special that can be done to it... There is no way to stop the air quality degrading once the walls are gone. Without the walls in any tunnel the air quality reduces the higher from the jet you go... it just comes down to ability to measure it (which a human body is not so good at) The air quality is as good as it has been conditioned to be regardless of walls etc. Fort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #46 October 13, 2005 On my way now.... have fun online while Im gone everyone! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DeepThought 0 #47 October 13, 2005 You have forgotten to add Aerokart in Paris. Having said that Bedford is a lot better. (they are the only two I have been in) The bedford tunnel really rocks. -------------------------------------------------- You only have one life, make the most of it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #48 October 13, 2005 QuoteFort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Yes, and that is where Bragg shines. I have flown in other open tunnels and I can tell you that they "degrade" much more than Bragg. Magic? Nope, but a really good design. My only gripe of the Bragg tunnel is the noise. There is nowhere to go and talk. You have to use hand signals and white boards. Look, I understand you own/work at Bedford. But unless you have been to Bragg you really can't say about the quality if the air. You don't see anyone slamming your tunnel at all. You do see people not proclaiming unbiased love of it. Nothing wrong at being proud of your toy...But not everyone has to agree with you."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #49 October 13, 2005 particularly if they havent been to Eloy's yet ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #50 October 14, 2005 Hey Ron, This is the thing I hate about forum posts - so hard to make people understand what you mean in a concise way! I was not in any way trying to put down Bragg - in fact I looked at it alot while planning our project because I know it sets a high standard technically.... I just wanted to explain that the walls are not the thing that makes the airflow good or bad... this kind of misconception makes people judge things unfairly. I dont believe at any point to have claimed superiority (although I may teasingly hint at it) - and I have not personally measured flow quality in Bragg or any other tunnel than ours! We are happy for the flyers to decide where they like. I know technically we have delevered all we can so am happy that time will tell. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 2 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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Bodyflight.Net 0 #35 October 13, 2005 Paul.. to have that kinda airspeed & quality without wall to wall air... is truly an accomplishement over other tunnels. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #36 October 13, 2005 QuoteNot sure what features you would be comparing to say that its hard to be 'better' For one, I like not having walls. It allows you to train blocks with catches by staging people outside the cone. Now walls are better for people who might fly out by accident, but not having them allows for some very good training opportunities. QuoteI know alot of people that have trained in Bragg - and also with us.... and they all without exception no longer see Bragg as 'meca'! And while I have not been to Bedford, you have not been to Bragg. Any comparison by either of us is suspect. I can say this, Ft. Bragg makes the two SkyVenture tunnels I have been in seem like they are powered by box fans. Bragg is 12+ years old. The fact it is still at or even near the top of any list is quite amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #37 October 13, 2005 Dawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. Ron - Walls or no walls is a criteria that I can follow for preference.... hopefully we can get you here one day so that you can check us out as much as I would love to.... I dont hold much hope of me getting into Ft. Bragg One thing I will say is that our tunnel like Bragg was built at a time where some of the best minds had alot of resources to create tunnels. We cant really take credit from the scientists that built our facility in 1950. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #38 October 13, 2005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #39 October 13, 2005 QuoteDawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality I think her point was that the fact Bragg has solid air from one side of the cone to the other without walls is pretty amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #40 October 13, 2005 QuoteWalls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. it's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'... Ft. Bragg is much more amazing to me, maintaining that quality, dealing with expansion but no loss... much more like the first vwt's ever built... like the 5ft Durand tunnel... from when was it.. the 1800's? added: I was also just thinking that Wright Patt was the MOST amazing VWT... of all... acccomplishing the same thing and with such a WONDERFULLY soft net!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steven1981 0 #41 October 13, 2005 Thank u very much The blue sky is pretty but the blue sky with fast air is better gotty love wind tunnels Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #42 October 13, 2005 Quoteit's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'.. Easier to maintain? - this all makes not alot of sense to me. If the air is laminar it is laminar at the start of the test section (flight chamber whatever) Are you guys suggesting they do something mystical to the air properties that makes having no wall there possible?! cus that really is bizarre. If you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet... not too noticable in a few meters for sure. There is no magic going on at Ft Bragg.... so like I said - walls or no walls much the same. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paige 0 #43 October 13, 2005 Quotethe size and power of a tunnel is important but don’t forget about the experience and knowledge of the staff. -Bowen I can't say this enough, esp. about you guys at SVO! I'm always bragging about how good the instructors are and how fast your students learn. You guys bust ass and deserve to be recognized Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #44 October 13, 2005 QuoteIf you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet the amazing part occurs when this doesn't happen! when all the calculations are all correct and the airflow is precicely as it should be... the holy grail of open air vwt engineering!!! magic? maybe a very rare and precious thing, still un-duplicated? Definitely!(is un-duplicated a word?) still.. unaffordable for almost anyone... and that is a sad sad thing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #45 October 13, 2005 Dawn - dont get me at all wrong here... I am starting to love you dearly.... but you are way off base with some of the physics principles involved here. Air is Air... the way it behaves is the same for people the world over.... there is nothing special that can be done to it... There is no way to stop the air quality degrading once the walls are gone. Without the walls in any tunnel the air quality reduces the higher from the jet you go... it just comes down to ability to measure it (which a human body is not so good at) The air quality is as good as it has been conditioned to be regardless of walls etc. Fort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #46 October 13, 2005 On my way now.... have fun online while Im gone everyone! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DeepThought 0 #47 October 13, 2005 You have forgotten to add Aerokart in Paris. Having said that Bedford is a lot better. (they are the only two I have been in) The bedford tunnel really rocks. -------------------------------------------------- You only have one life, make the most of it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #48 October 13, 2005 QuoteFort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Yes, and that is where Bragg shines. I have flown in other open tunnels and I can tell you that they "degrade" much more than Bragg. Magic? Nope, but a really good design. My only gripe of the Bragg tunnel is the noise. There is nowhere to go and talk. You have to use hand signals and white boards. Look, I understand you own/work at Bedford. But unless you have been to Bragg you really can't say about the quality if the air. You don't see anyone slamming your tunnel at all. You do see people not proclaiming unbiased love of it. Nothing wrong at being proud of your toy...But not everyone has to agree with you."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #49 October 13, 2005 particularly if they havent been to Eloy's yet ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #50 October 14, 2005 Hey Ron, This is the thing I hate about forum posts - so hard to make people understand what you mean in a concise way! I was not in any way trying to put down Bragg - in fact I looked at it alot while planning our project because I know it sets a high standard technically.... I just wanted to explain that the walls are not the thing that makes the airflow good or bad... this kind of misconception makes people judge things unfairly. I dont believe at any point to have claimed superiority (although I may teasingly hint at it) - and I have not personally measured flow quality in Bragg or any other tunnel than ours! We are happy for the flyers to decide where they like. I know technically we have delevered all we can so am happy that time will tell. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 2 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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Ron 10 #36 October 13, 2005 QuoteNot sure what features you would be comparing to say that its hard to be 'better' For one, I like not having walls. It allows you to train blocks with catches by staging people outside the cone. Now walls are better for people who might fly out by accident, but not having them allows for some very good training opportunities. QuoteI know alot of people that have trained in Bragg - and also with us.... and they all without exception no longer see Bragg as 'meca'! And while I have not been to Bedford, you have not been to Bragg. Any comparison by either of us is suspect. I can say this, Ft. Bragg makes the two SkyVenture tunnels I have been in seem like they are powered by box fans. Bragg is 12+ years old. The fact it is still at or even near the top of any list is quite amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #37 October 13, 2005 Dawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. Ron - Walls or no walls is a criteria that I can follow for preference.... hopefully we can get you here one day so that you can check us out as much as I would love to.... I dont hold much hope of me getting into Ft. Bragg One thing I will say is that our tunnel like Bragg was built at a time where some of the best minds had alot of resources to create tunnels. We cant really take credit from the scientists that built our facility in 1950. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #38 October 13, 2005 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #39 October 13, 2005 QuoteDawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality I think her point was that the fact Bragg has solid air from one side of the cone to the other without walls is pretty amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #40 October 13, 2005 QuoteWalls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. it's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'... Ft. Bragg is much more amazing to me, maintaining that quality, dealing with expansion but no loss... much more like the first vwt's ever built... like the 5ft Durand tunnel... from when was it.. the 1800's? added: I was also just thinking that Wright Patt was the MOST amazing VWT... of all... acccomplishing the same thing and with such a WONDERFULLY soft net!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites steven1981 0 #41 October 13, 2005 Thank u very much The blue sky is pretty but the blue sky with fast air is better gotty love wind tunnels Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #42 October 13, 2005 Quoteit's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'.. Easier to maintain? - this all makes not alot of sense to me. If the air is laminar it is laminar at the start of the test section (flight chamber whatever) Are you guys suggesting they do something mystical to the air properties that makes having no wall there possible?! cus that really is bizarre. If you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet... not too noticable in a few meters for sure. There is no magic going on at Ft Bragg.... so like I said - walls or no walls much the same. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paige 0 #43 October 13, 2005 Quotethe size and power of a tunnel is important but don’t forget about the experience and knowledge of the staff. -Bowen I can't say this enough, esp. about you guys at SVO! I'm always bragging about how good the instructors are and how fast your students learn. You guys bust ass and deserve to be recognized Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #44 October 13, 2005 QuoteIf you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet the amazing part occurs when this doesn't happen! when all the calculations are all correct and the airflow is precicely as it should be... the holy grail of open air vwt engineering!!! magic? maybe a very rare and precious thing, still un-duplicated? Definitely!(is un-duplicated a word?) still.. unaffordable for almost anyone... and that is a sad sad thing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #45 October 13, 2005 Dawn - dont get me at all wrong here... I am starting to love you dearly.... but you are way off base with some of the physics principles involved here. Air is Air... the way it behaves is the same for people the world over.... there is nothing special that can be done to it... There is no way to stop the air quality degrading once the walls are gone. Without the walls in any tunnel the air quality reduces the higher from the jet you go... it just comes down to ability to measure it (which a human body is not so good at) The air quality is as good as it has been conditioned to be regardless of walls etc. Fort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bodyflight.Net 0 #46 October 13, 2005 On my way now.... have fun online while Im gone everyone! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DeepThought 0 #47 October 13, 2005 You have forgotten to add Aerokart in Paris. Having said that Bedford is a lot better. (they are the only two I have been in) The bedford tunnel really rocks. -------------------------------------------------- You only have one life, make the most of it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Ron 10 #48 October 13, 2005 QuoteFort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Yes, and that is where Bragg shines. I have flown in other open tunnels and I can tell you that they "degrade" much more than Bragg. Magic? Nope, but a really good design. My only gripe of the Bragg tunnel is the noise. There is nowhere to go and talk. You have to use hand signals and white boards. Look, I understand you own/work at Bedford. But unless you have been to Bragg you really can't say about the quality if the air. You don't see anyone slamming your tunnel at all. You do see people not proclaiming unbiased love of it. Nothing wrong at being proud of your toy...But not everyone has to agree with you."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #49 October 13, 2005 particularly if they havent been to Eloy's yet ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Paulipod 0 #50 October 14, 2005 Hey Ron, This is the thing I hate about forum posts - so hard to make people understand what you mean in a concise way! I was not in any way trying to put down Bragg - in fact I looked at it alot while planning our project because I know it sets a high standard technically.... I just wanted to explain that the walls are not the thing that makes the airflow good or bad... this kind of misconception makes people judge things unfairly. I dont believe at any point to have claimed superiority (although I may teasingly hint at it) - and I have not personally measured flow quality in Bragg or any other tunnel than ours! We are happy for the flyers to decide where they like. I know technically we have delevered all we can so am happy that time will tell. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 Next Page 2 of 4 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. 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Ron 10 #39 October 13, 2005 QuoteDawn - I dont really get your point. Walls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality I think her point was that the fact Bragg has solid air from one side of the cone to the other without walls is pretty amazing."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #40 October 13, 2005 QuoteWalls or no walls - makes no difference whatsoever regards airspeed or quality. it's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'... Ft. Bragg is much more amazing to me, maintaining that quality, dealing with expansion but no loss... much more like the first vwt's ever built... like the 5ft Durand tunnel... from when was it.. the 1800's? added: I was also just thinking that Wright Patt was the MOST amazing VWT... of all... acccomplishing the same thing and with such a WONDERFULLY soft net!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
steven1981 0 #41 October 13, 2005 Thank u very much The blue sky is pretty but the blue sky with fast air is better gotty love wind tunnels Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #42 October 13, 2005 Quoteit's easier to maintain an air column that is enclosed within walls.. the walls help to 'keep it together'.. Easier to maintain? - this all makes not alot of sense to me. If the air is laminar it is laminar at the start of the test section (flight chamber whatever) Are you guys suggesting they do something mystical to the air properties that makes having no wall there possible?! cus that really is bizarre. If you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet... not too noticable in a few meters for sure. There is no magic going on at Ft Bragg.... so like I said - walls or no walls much the same. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paige 0 #43 October 13, 2005 Quotethe size and power of a tunnel is important but don’t forget about the experience and knowledge of the staff. -Bowen I can't say this enough, esp. about you guys at SVO! I'm always bragging about how good the instructors are and how fast your students learn. You guys bust ass and deserve to be recognized Tunnel Pink Mafia Delegate www.TunnelPinkMafia.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #44 October 13, 2005 QuoteIf you take a straight column of air (of good quality) and remove the walls after a while you will get lost pressure further away from the jet the amazing part occurs when this doesn't happen! when all the calculations are all correct and the airflow is precicely as it should be... the holy grail of open air vwt engineering!!! magic? maybe a very rare and precious thing, still un-duplicated? Definitely!(is un-duplicated a word?) still.. unaffordable for almost anyone... and that is a sad sad thing Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #45 October 13, 2005 Dawn - dont get me at all wrong here... I am starting to love you dearly.... but you are way off base with some of the physics principles involved here. Air is Air... the way it behaves is the same for people the world over.... there is nothing special that can be done to it... There is no way to stop the air quality degrading once the walls are gone. Without the walls in any tunnel the air quality reduces the higher from the jet you go... it just comes down to ability to measure it (which a human body is not so good at) The air quality is as good as it has been conditioned to be regardless of walls etc. Fort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bodyflight.Net 0 #46 October 13, 2005 On my way now.... have fun online while Im gone everyone! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DeepThought 0 #47 October 13, 2005 You have forgotten to add Aerokart in Paris. Having said that Bedford is a lot better. (they are the only two I have been in) The bedford tunnel really rocks. -------------------------------------------------- You only have one life, make the most of it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 10 #48 October 13, 2005 QuoteFort Bragg may well have good quality air at the jet (just like alot of other VWTs also) The fact that is doesnt have walls is nothing special - no clever science - just a design feature of the chamber. Yes, and that is where Bragg shines. I have flown in other open tunnels and I can tell you that they "degrade" much more than Bragg. Magic? Nope, but a really good design. My only gripe of the Bragg tunnel is the noise. There is nowhere to go and talk. You have to use hand signals and white boards. Look, I understand you own/work at Bedford. But unless you have been to Bragg you really can't say about the quality if the air. You don't see anyone slamming your tunnel at all. You do see people not proclaiming unbiased love of it. Nothing wrong at being proud of your toy...But not everyone has to agree with you."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #49 October 13, 2005 particularly if they havent been to Eloy's yet ____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Paulipod 0 #50 October 14, 2005 Hey Ron, This is the thing I hate about forum posts - so hard to make people understand what you mean in a concise way! I was not in any way trying to put down Bragg - in fact I looked at it alot while planning our project because I know it sets a high standard technically.... I just wanted to explain that the walls are not the thing that makes the airflow good or bad... this kind of misconception makes people judge things unfairly. I dont believe at any point to have claimed superiority (although I may teasingly hint at it) - and I have not personally measured flow quality in Bragg or any other tunnel than ours! We are happy for the flyers to decide where they like. I know technically we have delevered all we can so am happy that time will tell. Bodyflight Bedford www.bodyflight.co.uk Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
